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  1. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by therealbowser View Post
    The Nightborne are, as is in theme with their entire culture, ungrateful. In their eyes, the Alliance -- who did a lot more than the blood elves -- did so out of obligation for their own needs, not for them specifically as they feel the blood elves did (and whether or not they did primarily for the nightborne remains to be seen... it's doubtful).

    I think Tyrande's character needs work but this scene doesn't really make me feel like she's a terrible person. I thought the story had occurred in person, but in the quest, it's a comment that was made before they conquered the Nighthold. Whether or not it was for selfish reasons, they played a major role in freeing their people, and the nightborne responded with apathy since in one special case the night elves were slightly unfriendly to them.

    At first I was really upset about Tyrande, but once I saw the context, it's actually Thalyssra I'm bugged by. She is being portrayed as a rather shallow character, but perhaps this is what she always was. The only character I am bugged by is Alleria, because she portrayed the diplomatic prowess of a gnoll in that same scenario. She should know better.
    The Nightborne didnt respond badly until after Tyrande had spat in their face. If I remember right a few times.
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  2. #142
    Quote Originally Posted by Toppy View Post
    The Nightborne didnt respond badly until after Tyrande had spat in their face. If I remember right a few times.
    The scenario was looking back on a comment that Tyrande had made. Tyrande as far as I could tell was focused on stopping the Legion more than freeing the nightborne, and was correctly preturbed by their society. She stilled helped them and cared somewhat.

    Ironically she might just have been right given what the Nightborne did next. And the irony is that that probably would not have stopped her from helping them.

    The Blood elves are cunning, but whether or not they are truly as noble as they play themselves out to be remains to be seen.

  3. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by Toppy View Post
    You were trying to make Tyrande being there as some big deal. It wasn't. The path to Orgrimmar had been cleared by SI:7 and the Horde. Not by Tyrande or her own forces.
    The night elves were pushing through ashenvale in 5.3, that's why they have sentinels there. Then of course Tyrande and the night elves are attacking Org from the forest, just as Vol'jin is assaulting it from the front and the horde/alliance assault it from the beach. Tyrande being there was a big deal and allowed us to breach the walls of Org. Pretending like it wasn't important to continue is stupid.

    Quote Originally Posted by Toppy View Post
    You were trying to make Tyrande being there as some big deal. It wasn't. The path to Orgrimmar had been cleared by SI:7 and the Horde. Not by Tyrande or her own forces.
    Not really, I was giving an example of leaders who have acted far more incompetent but somehow get away with it. Vol'jin's charge was probably one of the worst tactical decisions we've ever seen, while Tyrande not acting on her idea to go into an open temple after forcing the horde there is for some reason paraded around as massive incompetence. Vol'jin's was a far worse move and he acted on it to throw the lives of his troops away for no reason.

    Quote Originally Posted by Toppy View Post
    The point is she has never done -anything-. Vol'Jin in Shadow and Battlefield Barrens at least had planned things. Tyrande, from what we've seen, never has and needs to be restrained from doing stupid stuff.

    Except when she blew up that bridge she stood on of course. Or her wholesale slaughter of other night elves and nature spirits in WC3.
    Tyrande in WC3 was pretty good, defeating most of her enemies and making smart decisions to wake the druids and free Illidan to fight the legion. It obvious you ignore WC3 entirely, she was involved in the most campaigns of any other night elf character.

    Quote Originally Posted by Toppy View Post
    Point is, her plan was incredibly stupid. Sure she backed down from it, but she needed to be called off. Her original plan was just laughably bad is the big point here that you dont seem to get.

    You're perfectly fine with mentioning Vol'Jin using troops to take down the Juggernaught, but seem to deny that Tyrande was going to do the EXACT SAME THING at the Crane Temple before someone slapped her hand away and went "Stop it, thats fucking stupid.". At least Vol'Jin had the excuse of not knowing what the thing was capable of, Tyrande knew what she was dealing with.

    You're just blatantly denying anything being put forth before you and deflecting with terrible examples that don't hold up. Anything in Vol'Jins favor doesnt count, anything against Tyrande is clearly just Horde fans bitching.
    She pushes the horde back into a temple and surrounds them, forcing them to fortify in a temple. As I pointed out it's the exact same thing as Vol'jin actually did, except Vol'jin had no hope, Tyrande would have just lost more troops than needed because the temple was open and not nearly as fortified as Org. But for some reason you ignore the fact that she cornered the horde before the player or Varian even arrive. For some reason you don't say Vol'jin is being extremely incompetent in SoO, but say Tyrande was being incompetent after pushing the horde into a corner and then listening to Varian instead of charging into an open temple like she originally planned. It's literally just anything Tyrande does you see as the most incompetent thing ever, but when other characters you like do something far more incompetent get a pass.

    Quote Originally Posted by Toppy View Post
    The Nightborne didnt respond badly until after Tyrande had spat in their face. If I remember right a few times.
    Tyrande made a comment specifically to Thalyssra and still helped them out, she didn't spit in their face and then she helped to liberate their city. This is once again a demonstration of how you hate everything Tyrande does. She wasn't particularly diplomatic, but she wasn't spitting in the faces of the nightborne, she was wondering how we could trust the leader of the nightfallen who spent 10k years under Elisande.
    Last edited by Every Pwny; 2018-02-27 at 02:33 AM.

  4. #144
    Banned Lazuli's Avatar
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    Have you heard her voice and dialogue? Clearly Blizz do not want you to like her LOL.

  5. #145
    Elemental Lord Felfaadaern Darkterror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Imperium Romanum View Post
    Agreed. Tyrande was presented as more reckless than she should have in the MoP scenario, and that was likely to the convenience of Varian. That being said, she needs just one single scenario to turn her around into the Priestess of Elune she is.

    I must point out something about Val'Sharah. Her display throughout the questline was cringing but the ending was not. Her handling of the decision and the way she handled Ysera's assault was a step in the right direction. The lore team should head that way and show her mystical powers rather than her yells. At the end of the day, if she does have good recon skills, they should be shown at the heat of battle.

    Lest I forget. Night Elf lore is not hard to grasp. Keeping the basics is what is needed, sans the Druidic theme. As of late the Night Elven lore is only produced from a single society/class whereas the backbone (Sentinels and Huntresses) are given less focus.
    That particular MoP scenario was goofy. Tyrande was winning battles and learning caution before Varian was even born. Bottom line is, Blizz uses characters as plot devices rather than treating them as fully realized personalities. That's how we get so much inconsistency across the board.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Toppy View Post
    The Nightborne didnt respond badly until after Tyrande had spat in their face. If I remember right a few times.
    Pretty sure there was no spitting. Just a reluctance to trust. Now Thalyssra is leading a covert assault on Stormwind and is complicit in burning the city. How can we say Tyrande was wrong in hesitating to trust her?

    "I Am Vengeance. I Am The Night. I Am Felfáádaern!"

  6. #146
    Quote Originally Posted by Brewmaster Kolee View Post
    That particular MoP scenario was goofy. Tyrande was winning battles and learning caution before Varian was even born. Bottom line is, Blizz uses characters as plot devices rather than treating them as fully realized personalities. That's how we get so much inconsistency across the board.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Pretty sure there was no spitting. Just a reluctance to trust. Now Thalyssra is leading a covert assault on Stormwind and is complicit in burning the city. How can we say Tyrande was wrong in hesitating to trust her?
    Comparing someone to your races Hitler (worse really) is a pretty big slap in the face.

    And now, I would call that Thalysra being a good, trustworthy new ally.
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  7. #147
    Quote Originally Posted by Skeletov View Post
    Ever since the start of the MMO Tyrande has been nothing but a hindrance to the Alliance. She ruined relations with the Blood Elves in BC, now this, and on top of it all she's not even that great a commander as evidenced in MoP. The only positive thing that I can maybe attribute to her is that she helped bring Gilneas back into the Alliance. Too bad the only time we see her during that questline is at the tail end where she welcomes Wargen players.

    What do you guys think?
    Look at it this way; by saving the worgen, the night elves basically saved all of the Alliance as Genn would go on to shatter all of Sylvanas' plans in Stormheim, making it impossible for her to enslave Eyir and get an endless number of valkyr, which would in turn completely annihilate the Alliance.

    Tyrande is a conservative character and almost all conservative characters get hated on in the WoW community. Perhaps it is because of the diversity within said community that leads to this. Many people then fall prey to the perpetuated hate and it keeps on rolling. Either way, these are the only characters that can make a valuable story crossroad(ie Tyrande provided the means for blood elves to become part of the Horde, Tyrande provided the means for the nightborne to be part of the Horde). I personally dislike all these elves being playable on the Horde, but my personal opinion aside, I can see how her character influences some major twists within the game.

    That being said, you shouldn't like anything you don't like or vice versa because of someone else, but every character's worth within the story is easy to evaluate.
    Last edited by Magnagarde; 2018-02-27 at 01:44 PM.

  8. #148
    The Lightbringer Clone's Avatar
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    I think with a lot of Blizzard's story concepts, you like it for what it could have been instead of what it is.

  9. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by Clone View Post
    I think with a lot of Blizzard's story concepts, you like it for what it could have been instead of what it is.
    Exactly this. People expect X, X doesn't happen, so they never ever take Y seriously and talk about how bad and stupid they are for not doing X and paint all future expectations alongside "Well they didn't do X which was so much better". Doesn't matter if Y was also built towards and they keep using Y as a basis later, how dare they not do X.
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  10. #150
    Dreadlord Hawkknight97's Avatar
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    I would only like Tyrande if She would gave us Night Elf Paladins, and High Elves. If not then see ya later in the burning pit of Teldrassil.
    High Elves and Wildhammer Dwarves are finally playable in the Alliance. XD

  11. #151
    Titan Zulkhan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Every Pwny View Post
    I wonder which it is! Either way neither makes him look good. Then he just sends his men in to die and can't siege the wall, in a show of the most idiotic charge and tactic we've ever seen. They had no hope of winning or breeching the gate and he just send them to die. Obviously here we never seen a tactic so blatantly incompetent. This was to illustrate more than every commander makes incompetent decisions, and Vol'jin's decision here was far more incompetent than Tyrande listening to Varian in MoP which you and toppy like to point to.
    Well this is gorgeous. Both of your big points on which you built your grand argument about Vol'jin's incompetence have been proved false and now all you have left is verbal diarrhea. Why I should even bother to address it?

    It's not a lie, he assaulted the gate and the iron juggernaut with ground troops. His charge was extremely stupid and useless, the only thing it did was kill his troops needlessly.
    It's a deliberate lie because the rebellion had several demolishers back in Razor Hill and Nazgrim makes a fucking comment about Vol'jin having no siege weapons left.

    And why charge the Iron Juggernaut with ground troops is now so retarded when your main reason to deem that action retarded have been proven false? Are the players literal siege weapons themselves? Because we destroyed that thing just fine. Did we use a better tactic? Or maybe it's because we're overpowered Mary Sues? I wonder.

    So Garrosh is already locked and turtling up in Org, Vol'jin was doing nothing by sacrificing his troops.
    What makes you think it was a deliberate sacrifice of troops when your own argument about them being half-naked and poorly equipped was proven false? It's not like I ever claimed it was tactical brilliance, however your reasons to deem Vol'jin incompetent in that instance have been "lul he sent half-naked morons" which is horseshit and "lul he attacked a gate with no siege weapons" which is double horseshit.

    He was fighting to get to the gate, the alliance were pushing them off the docks and the night elves are assaulting Org from the other side.
    First of all, the docks were pushed by a combined effort, unless you somehow forgot that also Lor'themar and Sylvanas were there. Secondly no, unless you deliver proof of what you claim the Night Elves didn't assault anything, since this isn't either showed or even referenced, especially since they were coming from west and Orgrimmar has a secondary entrance right on that side.

    Vol'jin wasn't keeping them occupied there was no real threat of them pouring out and overwhelming anything, they were sealing themselves in and he couldn't get passed the iron juggernaut and had no siege weapons as you said. He assualts the gate with ground troops.
    If that was the case Nazgrim would have been elsewhere, since his leadership would have been more useful for organizing a Kor'kron regiment against this hypothetical Night Elf assault on the west (one that should have realistically claimed the second gate but strange case it didn't happen).

    Yes, Tyrande waits until the iron juggernaught is down, destroys the gates and clears out the guards that attempt to defend the now destroyed door. I don't know why you think her job there was meaningless when that was the only way they were going to breech the gate.
    It wasn't meaningless, it served a purpose given the circumstances. That doesn't mean though that doing nothing while everyone else is dealing with the main threat outside of the gate is tactically brilliant or even necessarily smart.

    He didn't really organize anything, he just had some super troops there, I believe he was also punching through their armor with his fist. Nothing there demonstrated he was competent at strategy, he and the two others with him were just overpowered.
    Except the battle was perceived by everyone as a guaranteed loss because, guess what, an army fifteen fold yours (of highly disciplined Zandalari warriors, moreover) is usually going to annihilate you no matter what. The tactical placing of those traps along the mountain paths and around the monastery have been fundamental to both diminish the Zandalari numbers and slow/undermine their march. Again, it was said to affect them on a psychological level, which is something pointless to deny since is written literally that way in the novel.

    Apart that, the whole novel is about acknowledging Vol'jin on that regard, be it when he constantly supported Taran Zhu with fighting a kind of war he was not used to or when he led with Tyrathan the sneaky operation on the Isle of Thunder. There's even the bit outright saying that Vol'jin's thing for strategy was one of the main reasons why Thrall kept him as advisor.

    In wolfheart the night elves were winning, the only thing they didn't account for were the unstoppable magnataur garrosh brought and they had no idea about, you should definitely not leave out the super weapon the horde needed to fight in Ashenvale that only the worgen were able to fight. Nothing she did there was particularly incompetent, not like throwing the lives of your troops away for no reason.
    Nah, now that I think about it I mixed the Wolfheart situation up with the one of TFT. The "worst" (so to speak) Tyrande did there was getting hit by orc archers while the Magnataur wrecked shit around. Then again, not looking particularly bad does not equate to look particularly good, since Tyrande's major feat during that battle was using a blessing of Elune to blind the Horde's army in order to steamroll them (but also exposing her to counterattack).

    Listening to good advice is not incompetence
    What? Where I ever said it's incompetence? I literally said listening to good advice is wise. It's you who tried to make it look like is somehow "strategical".

    in the MoP scenario she routes the horde and forces them into the temple, then instead of going with her plan she goes with Varian's plan. If she didn't listen to Varian though she would have sent her troops in, so trying to pretend she didn't listen is idiotic as well. Regardless of how you try to downplay it, she did indeed listen to Varian's advice, for the best result, despite her "bitching".
    Pretending she "did listen" even though she constantly complained is rich as you can get. The way she behaved displayed no strategy nor wisdom, she merely didn't look like a complete idiot by not stubbornly getting in Varian's way and limiting herself to act like Varian was the actual idiot for wasting her time.

    Striking at the opportune time is smart strategy.
    Letting others deal with the actual issue blocking the way and then show up once said issue is dealt with is opportunistic, not smart. Of course, assuming hers was an actual act of opportunism rather than Tyrande coincidentally reaching Orgrimmar right after the Iron Juggernaut was defeated.

    But look you are trying to defend Vol'jin sending in his troops to die uselessly, and without siege weapons to take out the gate, while you are simultaneously bashing Tyrande for wanting to go into the temple immediately, basically sending her troops in to suffer more causalities than needed, but then also bashing her for listening to Varian because she was bitching about it. Vol'jin shows massive incompetence here, Tyrande's initial plan wasn't the best either but she listens to Varian still for the best result.
    I didn't really try to defend anything, unless with "defending" you mean calling your fallacious claims out. But I don't see why you keep pushing an one-on-one comparison between the two situations when these are not even similar: Vol'jin didn't "rush" to siege Orgrimmar, launching that assault was the whole point of the Barrens' questline, he was simply blocked by a ginormous robot popping out of nowhere; the siege was already started by the time he had no siege weapons left and it's not like you could turn your back and leave or sit on your ass forever before Orgrimmar's very gates.

    Sending fittingly equipped warriors to deal with that thing may not have been the smartest thing ever (nor I ever claimed it) but it's not like Vol'jin acted out of "impatience", the situation was legitimately desperate and no one there offerred a better alternative whatsoever, quite different from Varian wanting to do things his way and canonically proving Tyrande wrong.

    Assaulting a gate with siege weapons is better strategy than sending in troops that have no hope of breaching a gate and getting them all killed for no gain.
    Are you trying to troll me or you're deliberately playing dumb? Because I really couldn't explain it better and slower than I did already.

    Vol'jin did nothing against the iron juggernaut it was the horde/alliance reinforcements from the beach that took out the juggernaut.
    And? It doesn't change the fact that the Horde had siege weapons too and those were obviously taken out of the picture by the Iron Juggernaut, simply because the rebellion tried to do something about it where Tyrande simply showed up when the threat was dealt with.

    Listening to advice is good, it doesn't show incompetence. She pushes the horde into the temple and instead of going with her initial plan, goes with Varian's. You try to turn it around saying it's incompetence, when it's the opposite.
    The only one turning things around here is you, specifically goalposts. I never said is idiotic listening to someone's advice, what's idiotic is pretending that's the mark of a good strategist, which is not: someone can be extremely wise and not a good strategist at all. And that indeed ignoring the fact that Tyrande hardly showed "wisdom" considered her behavior, if she would have outright ignored Varian for shit and giggles would have looked like a complete imbecile; not doing that at least saved her from that label (even though proving how damn hard she struggles to keep her usual hot-headedness and impulsiveness in check).

    But then you justify Vol'jin sending his troops in to die with no hope of breaching gate, pretty much the plan Tyrande was thinking about at the temple, except the temple was open and not fortified like Org was, and calling it competence.
    I wonder why I should even bother to keep arguing this topic with you, considered that your entire argument was based on:

    Quote Originally Posted by Every Pwny View Post
    sending poorly equipped warriors
    False.

    Quote Originally Posted by Every Pwny View Post
    didn't even bring in seige engines to assault the wall
    False. And yet you keep blabbering about "muh incompetence". While at the same time

    Quote Originally Posted by Every Pwny View Post
    Tyrande waits until the robot they've never fought before is down to assault the wall with siege weapons and kill the guards
    trying to make this look like a great strategical decision, which was mere opportunism out of convenient circumstances at best or mere coincidence at worst.

    It's obviously extreme bias that you can't really see yourself doing, I'm not claiming she is a brilliant strategist, but she is not incompetent like you are claiming.
    Extreme bias my ass. You came up with an argument that compared apples to oranges by making either factually incorrect or conveniently dishonest claims in an attempt to make Tyrande look better by making others look worse.
    Last edited by Zulkhan; 2018-02-27 at 10:33 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Keyblader View Post
    It's a general rule though that if you play horde you are a bad person irl. It's just a scientific fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by Heladys View Post
    The game didn't give me any good reason to hate the horde. Forums did that.

  12. #152
    Quote Originally Posted by Zulkhan View Post
    Well this is gorgeous. Both of your big points on which you built your grand argument about Vol'jin's incompetence have been proved false and now all you have left is verbal diarrhea. Why I should even bother to address it?
    They weren't false, Vol'jin sent his soldiers in to die against a robot for no reason and they had no hope of breaching the wall. His incompetence was on full display there, his plan was far worse than Tyrande's idea to go into an open temple. He sent poorly equipped trolls with spears to take out a giant robot, and they got destroyed instantly.

    It's a deliberate lie because the rebellion had several demolishers back in Razor Hill and Nazgrim makes a fucking comment about Vol'jin having no siege weapons left.

    And why charge the Iron Juggernaut with ground troops is now so retarded when your main reason to deem that action retarded have been proven false? Are the players literal siege weapons themselves? Because we destroyed that thing just fine. Did we use a better tactic? Or maybe it's because we're overpowered Mary Sues? I wonder.
    It's not, he wasn't sieging the wall and he was attacking the gate with troops that were unable to do anything against the robot other than die instantly. His incompetence in this charge was massive. But going straight in was a tactic Tyrande was thinking of using, and her attack would have been into an open temple, not a closed gate with a giant robot they had no hope of beating. His lack of concern for his troops lives and lack of any kind of though in his attack is massive. So when you refer to Tyrande being stupid in the MoP scenario, you need to remember Vol'jin was FAR more incompetent in a similar attack and far more negligent with the lives of his troops making him a very very poor commander.

    It wasn't meaningless, it served a purpose given the circumstances. That doesn't mean though that doing nothing while everyone else is dealing with the main threat outside of the gate is tactically brilliant or even necessarily smart.
    The death of those troops was entirely meaningless, it didn't even effect the robot. The only thing it did was show how willing Vol'jin was to throw away the lives of his troops for no reason.

    Nah, now that I think about it I mixed the Wolfheart situation up with the one of TFT. The "worst" (so to speak) Tyrande did there was getting hit by orc archers while the Magnataur wrecked shit around. Then again, not looking particularly bad does not equate to look particularly good, since Tyrande's major feat during that battle was using a blessing of Elune to blind the Horde's army in order to steamroll them (but also exposing her to counterattack).
    Magnataur were throwing boulders at her which she was avoiding and then she got hit by an arrow. But at least you can see now how you warp situations in your mind to be far worse than they were because you don't like her character.

    Pretending she "did listen" even though she constantly complained is rich as you can get. The way she behaved displayed no strategy nor wisdom, she merely didn't look like a complete idiot by not stubbornly getting in Varian's way and limiting herself to act like Varian was the actual idiot for wasting her time.
    She did listen, otherwise she would have had her sentinels attack. Did she send them in? Not to mention she was the one who pushed the horde back into the temple and surrounded them, Varian just devised a plan to draw them out and kill them all with far less loss on the alliance side. The horde was cornered because of Tyrande, not because of Varian.

    I didn't really try to defend anything, unless with "defending" you mean calling your fallacious claims out. But I don't see why you keep pushing an one-on-one comparison between the two situations when these are not even similar: Vol'jin didn't "rush" to siege Orgrimmar, launching that assault was the whole point of the Barrens' questline, he was simply blocked by a ginormous robot popping out of nowhere; the siege was already started by the time he had no siege weapons left and it's not like you could turn your back and leave or sit on your ass forever before Orgrimmar's very gates.

    Sending fittingly equipped warriors to deal with that thing may not have been the smartest thing ever (nor I ever claimed it) but it's not like Vol'jin acted out of "impatience", the situation was legitimately desperate and no one there offerred a better alternative whatsoever, quite different from Varian wanting to do things his way and canonically proving Tyrande wrong.
    They weren't fittingly equipped soldiers because they couldn't deal with the robot for even a short time and did nothing to effect it. Vol'jin sent those troops to die needlessly against the robot with no hope of breaching the gate because he had no siege weapons left. Rushing straight in is extremely similar except here Vol'jin had far less of a chance than Tyrande did, Tyrande would have suffered more losses than needed by rushing straight in after cornering the horde in an open temple, Vol'jin just rushed straight in and lost his troops for no reason or gain.

    False. And yet you keep blabbering about "muh incompetence". While at the same time
    The soldiers were poorly equipped to deal with the robot, he was attacking the wall without any siege weapons left, he was just sending in ground troops with spears it was massive incompetence.

    trying to make this look like a great strategical decision, which was mere opportunism out of convenient circumstances at best or mere coincidence at worst.
    Striking at the appropriate time is good strategical thinking, pretending she did nothing there is idiotic, pretending she has been nothing but incompetent in terms of strategy is also false. The entire point of this was leaders make bad decisions, and Tyrande's decision in MoP to listen to Varian was not one of the worst. One of the worst being Vol'jin's charge which you think was a good thing, when did did absolutely nothing. This charge straight into the robot was the same as Tyrande wanting to charge straight into a temple, except Tyrande's had a much higher chance to succeed. So it's when you think about military incompetence you have to think about it in relation to literally every other character. I know you will keep defending Vol'jin sending his troops in to die because you love the character, but you need to keep in mind that it's literally the same as what Tyrande was planning to do except worse because he had no hope there.

    Extreme bias my ass. You came up with an argument that compared apples to oranges by making either factually incorrect or conveniently dishonest claims in an attempt to make Tyrande look better by making others look worse.
    They are both head on charges, one leader acted on their head on charge into a fortified position with no hope (Vol'jin), one didn't act on their head on charge into a fortified position (Tyrande). It's the same scenario except Vol'jin has less hope and his troops there were killed for no reason or gain.

  13. #153
    Elemental Lord Felfaadaern Darkterror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toppy View Post
    Comparing someone to your races Hitler (worse really) is a pretty big slap in the face.

    And now, I would call that Thalysra being a good, trustworthy new ally.
    She is not Tyrande's ally, or Darnassus's, or Stormwind's, so Tyrande was right not to trust her. Maybe Tyrande was smarter than most of us. Sylvanas and Thalyssra are teaching us all never to trust them.

    "I Am Vengeance. I Am The Night. I Am Felfáádaern!"

  14. #154
    Quote Originally Posted by Brewmaster Kolee View Post
    She is not Tyrande's ally, or Darnassus's, or Stormwind's, so Tyrande was right not to trust her. Maybe Tyrande was smarter than most of us. Sylvanas and Thalyssra are teaching us all never to trust them.
    I think it's funny Thalyssra says "We will emerge from this as protectors of Azeroth, not conquerors". Then immediately after night elves die helping to liberate Thalyssra's city she becomes insanely bitter about Tyrande voicing her concerns about Thaylssra (but still helping to liberate her city after and hoping that the nightborne survive the loss of the nightwell) and goes on to try to conqueror the night elf territory while helping to exploit the dying of Azeroth. I mean people call Tyrande racist, but she never went on a genocidal campaign to kill an entire race like Thalyssra is doing.

  15. #155
    Quote Originally Posted by Every Pwny View Post
    I think it's funny Thalyssra says "We will emerge from this as protectors of Azeroth, not conquerors". Then immediately after night elves die helping to liberate Thalyssra's city she becomes insanely bitter about Tyrande voicing her concerns about Thaylssra (but still helping to liberate her city after and hoping that the nightborne survive the loss of the nightwell) and goes on to try to conqueror the night elf territory while helping to exploit the dying of Azeroth. I mean people call Tyrande racist, but she never went on a genocidal campaign to kill an entire race like Thalyssra is doing.
    So, all members of the Horde are genocidal now? All we've seen Thalysra do as part of the Horde so far is go and try to save Saurfang and instead end up saving a Princess the Alliance had kidnapped.

    For someone who tries to call people out for playing favorites, it sure is all you ever do. Gotta shift that narrative in your favor right? Any blemish or bit of flaw must be covered because everyone knows having any flaw = bad writing. Gotta back peddle constantly and make terrible comparisons and ignore anything to the contrary calling anyone who brings up facts as playing favorites.
    World needs more Goblin Warriors https://i.imgur.com/WKs8aJA.jpg

  16. #156
    Quote Originally Posted by Toppy View Post
    So, all members of the Horde are genocidal now? All we've seen Thalysra do as part of the Horde so far is go and try to save Saurfang and instead end up saving a Princess the Alliance had kidnapped.

    For someone who tries to call people out for playing favorites, it sure is all you ever do. Gotta shift that narrative in your favor right? Any blemish or bit of flaw must be covered because everyone knows having any flaw = bad writing. Gotta back peddle constantly and make terrible comparisons and ignore anything to the contrary calling anyone who brings up facts as playing favorites.
    Yes, they are trying to kill the night elves and conqueror their lands despite no night elf aggression because they stay in their lands. That is exactly what Thalyssra is doing, being a conqueror trying to kill the people who helped her take her home back. The difference between Thalyssra's character during questing and now is pretty stark, she has immediately been turned into a conqueror after saying that isn't what she wants the nightborne to be. Pretending she isn't doing the opposite of her quote though is being very stupid.

    I also didn't say it was bad writing, Thalyssra could have hidden motives and just been pretending to be something else while we helped her during her weakest moment, unless you mean Tyrande because literally all you think she does is mess up, even when she doesn't really, never said she was perfect but you don't like the character so you think everything she does is a mistake, so I have to correct you and you hate that because you don't really think much about the story or situations.
    Last edited by Every Pwny; 2018-02-28 at 06:31 PM.

  17. #157
    Blademaster Ryneon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arrashi View Post
    Sympathy for disabled. Some characters are blind. Some lack limbs. As for tyrande...she is lacking somewhere else. In space betwen ears to be more precise.
    10/10.
    Tyrande has always been rather unsympathetic from my perspective. Very judgmental. I want her to be very Sylvannas-like for the Alliance side. Moar story pls.

    I don't think the Alliance ever had intentions of recruiting them and I don't think the Nightborne ever had intentions of joining them... Especially when Tyrande gave that "How do I know you're still not a bunch of crackheads that will turn on us?" vibe.

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