Holy gameplay

[Niwes]

agree that holy feels relatively clunky. i would be ok with that and also most of the gameplay, IF:

- they wouldnt have this horrible shitty mastery. such things are a nogo in wow imo.
- they would be fully functional as a complete range heal, like it was for years and should be.
- they give me my hammer and shield look back.

to me it feels like actual holy is better suited to pvp than pve. but maybe it feels so just for me.

in short: make holy a standard ranged heal, with melee heal only by talent options, and call it a day.

[Dmitro]

Light of martyr the must stupid spell I have seen on my paladin. I want some sort of shield/dot I can use.

very true, hate this spammable bullshit that every class uses, no-brain ability

[Taeldorian]

very true, hate this spammable bullshit that every class uses, no-brain ability

If that’s how you’re using LoTM you’re bad. Nothing else to it. It’s not something you should be spamming and you generally have to think about it when you use it even if it’s going to be used on someone whose about to die.

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agree that holy feels relatively clunky. i would be ok with that and also most of the gameplay, IF:

- they wouldnt have this horrible shitty mastery. such things are a nogo in wow imo.
- they would be fully functional as a complete range heal, like it was for years and should be.
- they give me my hammer and shield look back.

to me it feels like actual holy is better suited to pvp than pve. but maybe it feels so just for me.

in short: make holy a standard ranged heal, with melee heal only by talent options, and call it a day.

I don’t see how Holy is clunky at all. We have our toolkit, we have ways to Min/Max and manage our mastery, we have ways to heal in both Melee and ranged. Etc

[Dmitro]

If that’s how you’re using LoTM you’re bad.

ye, I guess my 2500 is 3s (1% of pvp population) show my total lack of competence

[Nuniqt]

ye, I guess my 2500 is 3s (1% of pvp population) show my total lack of competence

Ok guy, there is a fairly large difference in the healing playstyle between pvp and pve for hpal. I was actually 100% in agreement with Taeldorian until your answer indicated a pvp perspective.

No need to get defensive here. I am 99% sure most of the people who claim holy feels clunky (pve perspective, swapping gears for a sec) have yet to try the class at the crit softcap (50%). Because thats a game changer.

For pvp, yea. I admit it felt weird (only a 2k player here these days) but I attribute that mostly to being so used to pve that I wasnt converting over well.

[Larynx]

I'd love for them to introduce an atonement mechanic for Holy. I don't understand why they ever thought Discipline was the offensive healer. It's always been the shield/support spec. Holy Paladin has been offense focused since at least TBC, and it fits the class fantasy far better.

I don't want atonement to be a major healing component for Holy. More like, either it's just splash healing during trivial damage phases (kind of like disc in wod), or it could be in the form of a CD like Avenging Crusader, which is just amazingly fun to use.

[Taeldorian]

ye, I guess my 2500 is 3s (1% of pvp population) show my total lack of competence

Specify that you’re talking about pvp then. There’s a pvp section on this forum to discuss pvp, so I’m assuming the gameplay you’re talking about is pve. Be specific next time.

[Dmitro]

Specify that you’re talking about pvp then. There’s a pvp section on this forum to discuss pvp, so I’m assuming the gameplay you’re talking about is pve. Be specific next time.

and now go ahead and look that pvp section has no class designs topic cause its for pvp generally, not classes specifically,
we shall discuss classes (both pvp and pve talents) in class sections

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I'd love for them to introduce an atonement mechanic for Holy. I don't understand why they ever thought Discipline was the offensive healer. It's always been the shield/support spec..

how to spot somebody who never played wow before cataclysm in 5 secs

[makketota]

Light of martyr the must stupid spell I have seen on my paladin. I want some sort of shield/dot I can use.

Really ? You know that if they do add something like a shield or a dot, it has to be taken from somewhere right ? This means less strong single target heals etc etc. I'd rather keep my strong burst healing than maintaning a boring buff on the tank.

[Taeldorian]

and now go ahead and look that pvp section has no class designs topic cause its for pvp generally, not classes specifically,
we shall discuss classes (both pvp and pve talents) in class sections

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how to spot somebody who never played wow before cataclysm in 5 secs

Okay but if you look at this forum it’s mostly all pve. It’s not unreasonable to assume you’re discussing pve unless you specify otherwise and I’m sure you know that. Arguing for the sake of arguing is a waste of time. If you’re talking about pvp just mention that’s the type of gameplay you’re talking about in some way.

[Dmitro]

Okay but if you look at this forum it’s mostly all pve. It’s not unreasonable to assume you’re discussing pve unless you specify otherwise and I’m sure you know that. Arguing for the sake of arguing is a waste of time. If you’re talking about pvp just mention that’s the type of gameplay you’re talking about in some way.

okay, but dont react to classes in pvp like somehow its not part of the game (I am not talking about you specifically, but theres a huge portion of the visitors who do that)

[Taeldorian]

okay, but dont react to classes in pvp like somehow its not part of the game (I am not talking about you specifically, but theres a huge portion of the visitors who do that)

Didnt and wouldn’t do that. That’s why I never said anything after about you spamming LoTM because I know it’s a large part of holy pvp.

[Deleted]

Sometimes I wish Blizzard, just scrolls along. And never listen to someting like this

[Dmitro]

Sometimes I wish Blizzard, just scrolls along. And never listen to someting like this

would be great during wotlk-cata transition, or mop-wod, but not now, already too late and its time to LISTEN to us (the sane part of wow community, not the cosplaying "subraces yay" clowd)

[vsb]

I don't like few things about holy paladins (mastery is the biggest one), but generally I think that they are good and I like the play style. I think that talent tree should be rebalanced, a lot of talents are very unappealing. What I want for mastery is to provide aoe healing around target and beacons. I think it worked this way in wotlk with glyph and I liked this mechanics. Or absorbs like Valanir from overhealing.

Also I don't like that paladin are incapable healers in dungeons without beacon of virtue. May be I'm just bad, I'm not sure, but I can't heal aoe without this talent. With this talent it's pretty good, but I can't stop thinking that it's not a good design to have such a necessary talent. It should be baseline CD if it's so important. Also I'd like two charges of beacon of virtue, I think that it's too punishing if I pressed it at wrong time.

[Taeldorian]

I don't like few things about holy paladins (mastery is the biggest one), but generally I think that they are good and I like the play style. I think that talent tree should be rebalanced, a lot of talents are very unappealing. What I want for mastery is to provide aoe healing around target and beacons. I think it worked this way in wotlk with glyph and I liked this mechanics. Or absorbs like Valanir from overhealing.

Also I don't like that paladin are incapable healers in dungeons without beacon of virtue. May be I'm just bad, I'm not sure, but I can't heal aoe without this talent. With this talent it's pretty good, but I can't stop thinking that it's not a good design to have such a necessary talent. It should be baseline CD if it's so important. Also I'd like two charges of beacon of virtue, I think that it's too punishing if I pressed it at wrong time.

No. It’s not punishing at all. Don’t use it at the wrong time in that case, that’s the whole point of being “good” and being “bad”. Tools shouldn’t be added to the game to compensate for being bad or not being able to press buttons at the right time.

We’re very viable in m+ without virtue. Virtue makes things a lot easier, however people still use BoF in high keys. Very doable.

[Parhelion]

Why I like the paladin class and holy paladin as well (in no particular order), compared to other healing classes:

1. The 20% increased mount movement speed. Might not think of it much, but it really adds up, as you spend 1 min doing the quest and 3 mins flying/running around. Druid travel form is just as useful, but only IF there's flying.
2. It has a tank spec. Shares this awesomeness with Druid. You can basically solo everything and can run around without daze. Useful every expansion.
3. Unparalelled self-preservation and movement toolkit. Blessing of Protection, bubble, Lay on Hands, mount, Blessing of Freedom.
4. Super-strong DPS burst for solo or 5-man content.

I actually like the melee aspect of the class, it makes sense from lore perspective and it makes it distinct from other healing classes. There are talents that make this a non-issue if you hate it.

[Deleted]

Holy is perfect. We don't need anything changed at all.

All I'd like is for Maraad to be baseline.

Besides that, some flavor I'd like:
- Seals that activate on Judgment. One could be like Ilterendi, the other could provide a mana return. Make managing mana more relevant.

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in short: make holy a standard ranged heal, with melee heal only by talent options, and call it a day.

Which is exactly what this spec is. You don't have to spec CM, BF offers plenty of value. You can optimize your Mastery by standing in the ranged pack just as well.

[Niwes]

Holy is perfect. We don't need anything changed at all.

All I'd like is for Maraad to be baseline.

Besides that, some flavor I'd like:
- Seals that activate on Judgment. One could be like Ilterendi, the other could provide a mana return. Make managing mana more relevant.

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Which is exactly what this spec is. You don't have to spec CM, BF offers plenty of value. You can optimize your Mastery by standing in the ranged pack just as well.

i strongly disagree. wether is it that easy you wanna show it here, nor you can control which talents will provide most hps throughput in patch x, y or z, if blizz thinks „this patch this is the way to go“.

besides that: if i want to play a spec were i constantly have to switch between targeting mobs and heal ppls, i can play disc. dont need that crap for paladins.

so my oppinion is still the same: bring back standard ranged healing, like holy was, without any melee or judgement/CS shit. i want to play a normal healer. ranged. heal only. and ranged dps, if nothing else is to do/heal at that moment.

and no, i dont wanna play holy priest or druid or shaman, because i have a paladin to play paladin.

[Deleted]

i strongly disagree. wether is it that easy you wanna show it here, nor you can control which talents will provide most hps throughput in patch x, y or z, if blizz thinks „this patch this is the way to go“.

besides that: if i want to play a spec were i constantly have to switch between targeting mobs and heal ppls, i can play disc. dont need that crap for paladins.

so my oppinion is still the same: bring back standard ranged healing, like holy was, without any melee or judgement/CS shit. i want to play a normal healer. ranged. heal only. and ranged dps, if nothing else is to do/heal at that moment.

Then roll a Resto Shaman, Holy Priest or Resto Druid.

We don't have to dumb down a great Healing spec because an idiot can't manage his Judgment every x seconds.