Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[shoc]

This thread is the worst thing to ever happen to MMO-Champ, it's cancer and I can't help but feel unsettling white supremacist sentiment from some of the posters.

[Alanar]

Well, yes, I noticed some people requesting Nathanos look, but these were not really so popular. The thing is, there will be always people demanding basically anything which is non-playable to be made playable. People asked for ogres, vrykul, tuskarr, murlocs, jinyiu, gilblin and numerous other options. It doesn't mean Blizz have to implement these only because few people want it. They better keep focused on meaningful requests.

To be honest, I don't actually like the idea of copying all color pallete from blood elves to void elves either. I'd settle with black color, since void elf NPCs already have that option and specificaly black hair should be an option for goth styled race. I also want white hair option, since that color is available on all races except void elves, so it's hardly color associated strongly with blood elves, like red or blonde. At the end of the day, if void elves won't get any new hair colors, I'd be just fine with options they have now. Grey, silver and several shades of blue are enough for me.

I'm more interested in new hairstyles though. Again, I don't think Blizz should just copy all blood elf hairstyles to void elves. There are few hairstyles blood elves are sharing with humans, night elves and draenei, so I wouldn't mind seeing these hairstyles open for void elves too.

Players want to look like their leader or want option that are not available to us is nothing new. But you cant speak for everyone that you dont find it meaningfull and focus on other stuff. I care about looks and options myself.

Nathanos was always pretty popular and the hate to him was only starting in legion. There were a couple of thread about hes looks and for him specially was linked instantly do a playable dark ranger class. Most of the discussion was about that eventually.

The point is that doesnt matter the race, their leaders always look differnt and stand out and sometimes certain looks become polular and you get requests.. only natural of you ask me.

Yea just new stuff would be the best option.. give void elves their own unique things and try to stay away from blood elves would be my suggestion. Hopefully allied races will get as much love.. lets not even start about nightborne.

[Vaedan]

I am not sure what you are trying to say realy..
Players want to look like their leader or want option that are not available to us is nothing new. But you cant speak for everyone that you dont find it meaningfull.

Nathanos was always pretty popular and the hate to him was only starting in legion. There were a couple of thread about hes looks and for him specially was linked instantly do a playable dark ranger class. Most of the discussion was about that eventually.

The point is that doesnt matter the race, their leaders always look differnt and stand out and sometimes certain looks become polular and you get requests.. only natural of you ask me.

My point was that we can't really focus on argument "but people will want this playable", because there will be always people asking for many things. The important thing is what vision Blizzard have with their game and so far, they express no interest in making any alternative models for undead players to allow them play in this dark ranger/nathanos style fantasy. On the other hand, they expressed they want to make high elf an option for players on both sides. They most likely decided to do so on behalf of long standing request of allowing high elf options.

Well, pre-Legion Nathanos looked like regular Forsaken. As he got his new appearance and his new portrayal, his popularity went downhill pretty quickly. I also don't have a problem with leaders looking different. I think it is OK they are distinctive... but there is a good question of what makes them unique compared to regular persons. I don't think hair colors in particular are as much important and defining feature for any race. When we got fair skin, having natural hair seems like a small issue now.

[Alanar]

My point was that we can't really focus on argument "but people will want this playable", because there will be always people asking for many things. The important thing is what vision Blizzard have with their game and so far, they express no interest in making any alternative models for undead players to allow them play in this dark ranger/nathanos style fantasy. On the other hand, they expressed they want to make high elf an option for players on both sides. They most likely decided to do so on behalf of long standing request of allowing high elf options.

Well, pre-Legion Nathanos looked like regular Forsaken. As he got his new appearance and his new portrayal, his popularity went downhill pretty quickly. I also don't have a problem with leaders looking different. I think it is OK they are distinctive... but there is a good question of what makes them unique compared to regular persons. I don't think hair colors in particular are as much important and defining feature for any race. When we got fair skin, having natural hair seems like a small issue now.

The hate wasnt about hes looks.. no it was about people finally noticing hes arrogant attitude that they for some reason never noticed, which is funny, because Nathanos is one of the most consistent characters in wow. Hes attitude didnt change a single bit vanilla-> bfa.

I am not sure if you can link hes appearance to the hate. Quite the opposite of you think about. Without that, the thread about him wouldnt excist. Hes change only increased the interest.

[Vaedan]

The hate wasnt about hes looks.. no it was about people finally noticing hes arrogant attitude that they for some reason never noticed, which is funny, because Nathanos is one of the most consistent characters in wow. Hes attitude didnt change a single bit vanilla-> bfa.

I am not sure if you can link hes appearance to the hate. Quite the opposite of you think about. Without that, the thread about him wouldnt excist. Hes change only increased the interest.

No, I didn't actually mean that hate for this character is based on his appearance. I believe his attitude worked well when you was not exposed to it for 90% of your time. I got that he was not impressed by us when we were mere adventurers doing dirty jobs, but as of BfA, we were champions of the Horde and his queen after all.

[Ielenia]

funny, and his come to the previous arguments of how Alleria isn't a void elf, but a high elf, so, why should void elves get her look? or this argument is dropped and people finally accept she is a void elf?

So much dishonesty and misrepresentation...

Alleria is a void elf now. Just like the player void elves are void elves now. The only difference is that Alleria arrived into "void-elf-ness" through a different and controlled and safer means. So, I'll repeat the question I posed to someone else, earlier:

The OG void elves' transformation was caused by a magical trap that intended to transform them into thralls of the void lords but got interrupted in the middle. Alleria's transformation was a controlled process.

Why do people act as if new void elves are being created by using the "interrupted trap" method that transformed the OG void elves, and not the safer method used by Locus Walker and Alleria?

Forsaken was always about a faction of undead, see how it is "forsaken" and not "undead humans" in the race screen, it was not just about humans at all, we saw several other undeads being forsaken, include elves

If void elves can look like high elves, despite being void elves and not high elves, AKA, another race, why the forsaken can't pick from the different races the forsaken are made?

But as forsaken players you are an undead human, because you're a lordaeronian who died when the Scourge first attacked Lordaeron, and Lordaeron is a human kingdom. And, like I said barely ten days ago in this very thread about san'layn customization for the forsaken players:

Because if one wants to add customization options to the forsaken character creation to make them into "dark ranger or san'layn", that requires a complete change of the player model since "dark rangers" and "san'layns" are ELVES, not humans.

yeah because just because the leader look one way you don't have to look like that.

True. However, Alleria is the exact same race as the people she commands, whereas Sylvanas is not the same race as the people she commands. Or commanded.

[Swnem]

I agree with you. I think the void elves should remain different from the blood elves for 2 reasons : first to not upset more Horde players, and second to add more iconic differences to this race, rather than simply make them the Alliance version of blood elves.

That's precisely why I'm not really asking for blond hairs but white/light blue and pale pink instead.

Give us also blue tattoos like Alleria and an option to set on/off tentacules and it'll be fine.

Honestly, even if they had the same customisation options void elves would still feel different. Entropic embrace procs all the time. It's impossible to not feel it's impact.
If anything, it's blood elves that need a more distinct look. The entitlement of blood elf players is the problem as they seem to prefer denying others than ask for unique features.

I am done trying to please them.

Void elves are not just the 2 dozen ones that got changed with Umbric in the ritual. Those were the first. But, in Telogrus rift or whatever it's called, you got other ex blood elves and high elves undergoing training to become rendorei.

Alleria proves that the training does not necessarely scar your body with void. If anything, umbric's group is the exception, not the rule cause their ritual went awry.

It's entropic embrace that makes them void elves.
Which is exactly what the blood elves don't have, a distinct feature. They started with one in tbc. The fel and their racial had that theme of stealing magic. But, since the Sunwell, they lost it and now are wishy washy between fel and light with the racial still being about stealing magic. Their identity is diluted. That is what needs fixing. Blizz needs to go deep on either the fel or light motif. Instead of trying to quell crying by adding high elf eyes, diluting it even more.

[Ielenia]

But I dont get why that is an issue for the point that was made. You keep telling me she is a differnt race, but it doesnt matter in that people always want to look like their leader. She is forsaken.. same as what you play.. a forsaken. The request by players to look.like her was and still is polular.

And Turalyon is a "soldier of the Army of the Light", just like all the lightforged draenei. Does that mean I am justified in asking that my lightforged draenei should be able to look like a human?

Your example of a dreanei to look like a human is somewhat extreme.. and sylvanas has been their leader for 15 years and the player was never able to look like her.
So in that case your argument is true that the player was never able to get that look.

In vanilla she used a night elf model.. the request came when she got her own unqiue model in wrath I believe.

So what? Time in power doesn't mean anything. Sylvanas being in power for 15 minutes or 15 years doesn't change the fact that Sylvanas is a different race than the player's forsaken character.

About sylvanas.. well you can get a whole discussion on that she is still forsaken and most of the scourge who broke free had alot of elves. So you can even ask the question why we never had the option to be an undead elf in that sense. I mean are they called undead humans? I see your point, but I dissagree.

Forsaken is not a race. It's a group. A 'nation'.

[Vaedan]

Forsaken is not a race. It's a group. A 'nation'.

Indeed. I wouldn't call Undead a race either. Undeath is a condition, not a race. They can't procreate naturally, they require magic to raise them. Forsaken are also not the only group which is made of free willed undead. As you said, it's more of ideological or political group.

[Syegfryed]

So much dishonesty and misrepresentation...

ah yes, cute.

Alleria is a void elf now. Just like the player void elves are void elves now. The only difference is that Alleria arrived into "void-elf-ness" through a different and controlled and safer means.

you can roll back to this very thread and see people saying alleria is not a void elf, even common faces here saying that same thing, now people have dropped that since its doesn't support their argument anymore, just wanted to pointed that hypocrisy here.

But as forsaken players you are an undead human, because you're a lordaeronian who died when the Scourge first attacked Lordaeron, and Lordaeron is a human kingdom.

and you as a void elf player, you are a void elf who undergo a ritual, you do not play as alleria, stop with the double standards

And, like I said barely ten days ago in this very thread about san'layn customization for the forsaken players:

completely pointless argument since the model already exist and are completely and fully capable of doing everything they can, people would nee to toggle and chose what they like more

True. However, Alleria is the exact same race as the people she commands, whereas Sylvanas is not the same race as the people she commands. Or commanded.

Sylvanas is a forsaken nevertheless, funny that you were the one nitpicking about race, and here you are

you still have nathanos and Calia who were forsaken, and human, not elf, and we do not have their model playable, Garrosh was brown, Current orc leader Agr,a is brown and green orcs don't have the brown skin, and so on

so again, its bullshit argument, not just because npc/leaders have something the player need/should have

[shoc]

If anything Alleria is MORE Void Elf than any of the rest. She has the power of a whole Void Naaru, normie Void Elves have kitchen scraps of Void power in comparison.

[Alanar]

And Turalyon is a "soldier of the Army of the Light", just like all the lightforged draenei. Does that mean I am justified in asking that my lightforged draenei should be able to look like a human?


So what? Time in power doesn't mean anything. Sylvanas being in power for 15 minutes or 15 years doesn't change the fact that Sylvanas is a different race than the player's forsaken character.

Weird wording.. Like players would need some kinda approval of what they can ask, why wouldnt you be justified to ask for a lightforged human or w/e?

Anyway Sylvanas has always been special on that front that she is a undead elf. But like I said earlier.. you can also ask yourself the question why we cant play a forsaken elf?
They are as much as humans part of that group that you play as a race( maybe you dont qualify that as a race, but blizz does here so that counts)

Same as calia and same as garrosh.. people cant look like those characters. Asking for options like that have been a thing since vanilla.. whats new.

Forsaken have elves in their rank since the beginning, so its only natural those request happen.

[Ielenia]

you can roll back to this very thread and see people saying alleria is not a void elf, even common faces here saying that same thing, now people have dropped that since its doesn't support their argument anymore, just wanted to pointed that hypocrisy here.

What hypocrisy? All I see is you trying to pass their opinions as my own. That's very dishonest of you. And a big misrepresentation of my position.

and you as a void elf player, you are a void elf who undergo a ritual, you do not play as alleria, stop with the double standards

It's not double-standards. We don't know the process that creates the PLAYER void elf character. Either way, we have two options:
• One, is that, for some insane reason (not to say inane) Umbric and Alleria have decided to use the same process that converted Umbric and his team into void elves, and then they found out a way to help purge some of the void energies in the void elves' bodies, allowing them to regain their natural skin tone.
• Two, is that, for good reason, Umbric and Alleria have decided to use the process that converted Alleria into a void elf. A much more controlled and safer process that allows void elves to retain their natural skin tone.

Whereas with Sylvanas and the forsaken player, we have two entities that were different races BEFORE their conversion. Sylvanas and the forsaken player character were an elf and a human while living, respectively.

It's not rocket science.

completely pointless argument since the model already exist and are completely and fully capable of doing everything they can, people would nee to toggle and chose what they like more

That's not the issue. The issue is that this completely changes the character's silhouette and model. It has nothing to do with "amount of work required" and more like messing with the visual identity of the player race. That's like saying we should give player customization to the human race to make them as short and as bulky as the dwarves. Or make orcs be able to be taller and much lankier like trolls.

Sylvanas is a forsaken nevertheless, funny that you were the one nitpicking about race, and here you are

Sylvanas being a forsaken or not is irrelevant because "forsaken" is not a race, it's a group. Just like Argent Dawn, the Ebon Blade and the Cenarion Circle.

you still have nathanos and Calia who were forsaken, and human, not elf, and we do not have their model playable, Garrosh was brown, Current orc leader Agr,a is brown and green orcs don't have the brown skin, and so on

Nathanos and Calia is highly unlikely to ever happen considering that those are human models, and orcs and humans are the Warcraft's faces. I doubt we'll see human models on the Horde just like I doubt we'll ever see orc models on the Alliance.

As for Aggra, I suppose you could ask for brown skin customization to orcs, but don't you have the Mag'har orcs with brown skin in the Horde already? Wouldn't that just make the two the exact same race even more than they already are?

[Varodoc]

If anything Alleria is MORE Void Elf than any of the rest. She has the power of a whole Void Naaru, normie Void Elves have kitchen scraps of Void power in comparison.

That is definitely the case. After all, Umbric and co. were to be turned into ethereals, who are generic Void minions. Meanwhile, Alleria merged with a dark naaru, a goddess of the Void. WoD showed that one dark naaru is powerful enough to wipe out the population of an entire city.

It wouldn't surprise me if Alleria were as powerful as someone like Archimonde, who can destroy an entire city in an instant. Do not underestimate the power of the dark naaru.

[Ielenia]

Weird wording.. Like players would need some kinda approval of what they can ask, why wouldnt you be justified to ask for a lightforged human or w/e?

That was not my question. I'm talking about making my lightforged draenei to look like a human because Turalyon is a lightforged human and leader of the Army of the Light.

Anyway Sylvanas has always been special on that front that she is a undead elf. But like I said earlier.. you can also ask yourself the question why we cant play a forsaken elf?

I don't have to, because the answer to that question exists since day one: you play as a Lordaeron human, that died during the Scourge invasion. Lordaeron is a human nation, it didn't have elves living in it. At least, as far as I know, nowhere near in enough numbers to justify such customization option.

And, again, messing with the player model messes with the visual identity of the player race.

Same as calia and same as garrosh.. people cant look like those characters. Asking for options like that have been a thing since vanilla.. whats new.

Make a Mag'har and you can make a Garrosh. As for Calia, as I mentioned before, that is highly unlikely to happen since Calia looks like a bleached human, and humans are the face of the Alliance, just like orcs are the face of the Horde, and therefore I highly doubt we'll ever see orcs in the Alliance and humans in the Horde.

[Alanar]

That was not my question. I'm talking about making my lightforged draenei to look like a human because Turalyon is a lightforged human and leader of the Army of the Light.

No one realy sees Turalyon like that.. hes just there and we all know hes just a human. The only difference that players can't get is a small scar and the hairstyle I guess. It would be a weird question no one realy will ask I think. Where the forsaken players are undead and their leader is also undead and are called forsaken. I see what you trying to do, but.. i dont see anything worth of discussing.

I don't have to, because the answer to that question exists since day one: you play as a Lordaeron human, that died during the Scourge invasion. Lordaeron is a human nation, it didn't have elves living in it. At least, as far as I know, nowhere near in enough numbers to justify such customization option.

Uch.. I think you just missed a big part where 90% of the elves were slain etc etc? The Forsaken have always been a bunch of differnt undead.. lore/gameplay. Because of that I have seen people ask for playable Banshees.. undead elves, ghouls etc. And if you remember a banshee can go into any body.. Sylvanas could have also picked a female human corpse to inhabit.

Quoting this: The Forsaken are a diverse faction that include several different races at their biological core. However, they have all assumed their racial identity as "Forsaken," due to their shared goals and loyalties

It was never a question, just stating the obvious. I am not realy asking for anything, but this went somewhere else with you. I mean.. people have been asking to look like their racial leaders for years, you act as this is a new thing. But one thing is a fact and that is that they are classified as a race and sylvanas was part of that for 15 years.. not even counting warcraft 3 where ishe formed the forsaken.

And, again, messing with the player model messes with the visual identity of the player race.

Don't know what your points is, when I first started playing a forsaken there weren't any high elf models in the first place. When people wanted to look like Sylvanas the most obvious thing happend: Just roll a night elf and get arugals robe. -.-
I dont think they should, racial leader in wow always have to stand out in a way. Gallywix was a fat goblin which isn't playable, sylvanas is an undead elf and garrosh was a brown orc which you couldn't play for a very long time. They have slowely given us stuff..over time because the player or request is there as expected if something is liked by the community.

Make a Mag'har and you can make a Garrosh. As for Calia, as I mentioned before, that is highly unlikely to happen since Calia looks like a bleached human, and humans are the face of the Alliance, just like orcs are the face of the Horde, and therefore I highly doubt we'll ever see orcs in the Alliance and humans in the Horde.

Maghar orcs weren't even playable back then. The brown orc request was on the forums for 10+ years, it was highly requested by the community. Besides hes not a green orc like Draka is also not a green orc and you can't make a green orc(just orc) with brown skin, you have to roll the allied race. You are not making much sense.. and you just seem to argue just to argue.

I will repeat again.. I am not asking this myself I was stating the obvious that players or fans of Forsaken have been asking for undead elf forsaken options for years just because of Sylvanas. They never got it and probably never will be, but it's not the point.

[Ielenia]

No one realy sees Turalyon like that.. hes just there and we all know hes just a human. The only difference that players can't get is a small scar and the hairstyle I guess. It would be a weird question no one realy will ask I think. Where the forsaken players are undead and their leader is also undead and are called forsaken. I see what you trying to do, but.. i dont see anything worth of discussing.

Stop misrepresenting the issue. The forsaken player are undead humans and their leader is an undead elf. So what if they're both called "forsaken"? Forsaken is not a race. Undeath is not a race. The forsaken are a group.

Uch.. I think you just missed a big part where 90% of the elves were slain etc etc? The Forsaken have always been a bunch of differnt undead.. lore/gameplay.

And I think you forget that those "90% of the elves" that were slain died in elven lands, i.e., in Silvermoon, i.e. way outside Lordaeron borders?

Quoting this: The Forsaken are a diverse faction that include several different races at their biological core. However, they have all assumed their racial identity as "Forsaken," due to their shared goals and loyalties

Quote mining, without giving a source. How cute. How about we check the FULL quote, shall we?
"While comprised primarily of undead humans, the Forsaken are a diverse faction that include several different races at their biological core. However, they have all assumed their racial identity as "Forsaken," due to their shared goals and loyalties."

Don't know what your points is, when I first started playing a forsaken there weren't any high elf models in the first place. Back then when people wanted to look like Sylvanas the most obvious thing happend: Just roll a night elf and get arugals robe. -.-

It doesn't matter that there weren't high elf models back when you started playing as a forsaken, nor does it have any relevance to what I just said.

Maghar orcs weren't even playable back then. The brown orc request was on the forums for 10+ years, besides hes not a green orc like Draka.

So what if Mag'har orcs weren't playable back then? They're playable now. Your argument is completely nonsensical, because it implies that since Garrosh is no longer the leader that means the ship has sailed. Well, Sylvanas is no longer the forsaken leader, so the ship has sailed too, I guess. Time to put an end to the discussion, by your logic.

Once again.. not realy needed to go in detail, the fact is still she is differnt and as a repre of the Forsaken and not anything the player can go to in terms of Costumization. You are not making much sense.. and you just seem to argue just to argue.

Once again.. it doesn't matter. Sylvanas may have been the representative of the forsaken, but she is not a human like the forsaken player character. Again, that's like me wanting my lightforged draenei to look like Turalyon, because he's lightforged, and the leader of the Army of the Light, and I want my character to look like my leader.

I will repeat again.. I am not asking this myself I was stating the obvious that players or fans of Forsaken have been asking for undead elf forsaken options for years just because of Sylvanas. They never got it and probably never will be, but it's not the point.

So what? And I've detailed all the reasons why it's highly, highly unlikely to happen.

[Triceron]

Stop misrepresenting the issue. The forsaken player are undead humans and their leader is an undead elf. So what if they're both called "forsaken"? Forsaken is not a race. Undeath is not a race. The forsaken are a group.

Draenei is just a name for 'Exiles', so you could just as easily say it's a group too. Their race is Eredar, despite that name being used primarily for the demonic race within the Burning Legion. Sounds like a lot of semantics, to be honest.

Gameplay and lore are not mutually exclusive, nor are they represented equally in the lore. It's all messed up because of gameplay reasonings.

BLood Elf, High Elf and Void Elf should all techncially be one race, because they are just offshoots of 'High Elf'. Look at Demon Hunters, just because the Night Elves went total fel they didn't stop being Night Elves. Or look at how Death Knights are literally 'Forsaken' by the Lich King, but only the bony variation of Human happens to be part of the Forsaken while for some odd reason the more Human looking ones can stay loyal to the Alliance. There is no good explanation for these things, they are just gameplay mechanics overriding any sense in the lore.

If Forsaken includes Elves and Calia-type Forsaken, then Blizzard will give you the same kind of half-ass explanation in lore to explain that just like what we had in Cataclysm with Highborne Elves allowing Night Elf Mages to exist or 'Sun Druid Warriors' lore to make sense out of Tauren Paladins, which still make no sense to this day. Current lore does not limit anything.

Your reasonings of why it's unlikely are bogus because they're all based on fluid lore that is ever-changing, especially when it concerns races and customization. If Lore was immutable, then Wildhammers would not have been a part of the Dwarf options since Dark Irons get their own Allied Race. Wildhammers are supposed to be taller than Bronzebeards, and should have their own race options, but right now they're all effectively folded into the Ironforge Dwarf customization.

The only logical reason behind it not happening is because of the amount of work it'd take to do, and it not being a feasible compromise right now. The whole visual identity argument got thrown out the window as soon as they made Pink skin Elves playable on both factions.

[Alanar]

Stop misrepresenting the issue. The forsaken player are undead humans and their leader is an undead elf. So what if they're both called "forsaken"? Forsaken is not a race. Undeath is not a race. The forsaken are a group.

They are classified as a Race in wow, what is your point? you are making it an issue. It never was you quoted me.

And I think you forget that those "90% of the elves" that were slain died in elven lands, i.e., in Silvermoon, i.e. way outside Lordaeron borders?

Most were risen as Banshees, or straight up risen later. You played warcraft 3 by any chance? did you notice all the differnt kind of undead there were around. The forsaken dont excist just out of lorderean humans.. jesus christ man.

Quote mining, without giving a source. How cute. How about we check the FULL quote, shall we?
"While comprised primarily of undead humans, the Forsaken are a diverse faction that include several different races at their biological core. However, they have all assumed their racial identity as "Forsaken," due to their shared goals and loyalties."

Good job finding couple of extra lines, my point still stands strong and what is your point?

So what if Mag'har orcs weren't playable back then? They're playable now. Your argument is completely nonsensical, because it implies that since Garrosh is no longer the leader that means the ship has sailed. Well, Sylvanas is no longer the forsaken leader, so the ship has sailed too, I guess. Time to put an end to the discussion, by your logic.

It does matter silly, saying that now is funny to me. Makes it also clear you weren't there to see how fanatic people were on getting those options. It was just one example and still means something if you look at today characters. I am just not following you, you are 1 not making much sense and 2 making assumptions about my logic which is cute, but even if it happend in the past it's still in todays talk, but then with differnt characters. The brown skin color threads are dead now yes, because we got it..obviously.. and Dark rangers aka Sylvanas are suddenly not a thing anymore?

Once again.. it doesn't matter. Sylvanas may have been the representative of the forsaken, but she is not a human like the forsaken player character. Again, that's like me wanting my lightforged draenei to look like Turalyon, because he's lightforged, and the leader of the Army of the Light, and I want my character to look like my leader.

Once again what? may? she was for 15 years the leader of this group that broke free from the scourge that she kept together and eventually formed silly. No one cares if she is not human? that was never a question. Your comparison is just stupid man and once again what is the point you want to make here? I already replied 2 times now to this question and you don't seem the grasp it. Stop trying to grab on the Tyralyon thing.. it doesn't make it any better. I don't see why you wants to argue over the fact the players always want to look like their racial leaders, because mostly they have something unqiue going on and if the community likes it enough you will see the threads appear. Only natural.

[Ardenaso]

If anything Alleria is MORE Void Elf than any of the rest. She has the power of a whole Void Naaru, normie Void Elves have kitchen scraps of Void power in comparison.

yeap, here's how I see it:

Alleria: most perfect Void Elf because has the total control of void given she can transform back to a "high elf"

First generation Void Elves: t(a)inted by Durzaan's void juice, the imperfect void user prototype; around only 90% control because skin condition is permanent

Second generation Void Elves: (most seemingly) learned to harness the void without having to risk themselves what Umbric fell to: we ain't seen nothing yet atm but they can do what Alleria can do hopefully

- - - Updated - - -

and yes I'd like the Forsaken to extend from just Lordaeronians to Thalassians, Stromics, Orcs, Trolls, and Dalarani. Nothing wrong with putting up zombie Orc as a Forsaken IMO

also Lightforged from just Draenei to a collective umbrella which hopefully also does a model toggle for Humans and Dwarves