1. #21781
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    That's cool, but I'm here to discuss Blizzard canon, not Vagnar's headcanon, so there's not much left to talk about between us.
    I don't have headcanon. I'm just saying Blizzard's lore is illogical and contradictory, so it's worthless.

    Also Blizzard's "canon" says you can't have blonde hair on your Void Elf characters.

    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Also, if you think Void elves have nothing to offer when the main storyline is heading towards a massive cosmic conflict, you need to rethink your considerations completely.
    The fact that they are allowed to be around is making everyone an idiot. They are clearly dangerous and the powers they are meddling with are dangerous. The fact that Turalyon would allow Alleria to do such a thing makes him an absolute idiot.

    I've lost interest in Blizzard's story. They are not good storytellers. Especially the ones currently in charge.

  2. #21782
    Quote Originally Posted by vagnar View Post
    I don't have headcanon. I'm just saying Blizzard's lore is illogical and contradictory, so it's worthless.

    Also Blizzard's "canon" says you can't have blonde hair on your Void Elf characters.
    It's your headcanon to say Alleria is not a Void elf because she is pink when Blizzard literally calls her a Void elf. Considering the official canon "worthless" means stepping into headcanon.

    And No, Blizzard canon doesn't say that at all. Show me where Blizzard said that Void elves can't have blonde hair. An option not being in the game yet does not mean it's not possible, that's so asinine. It just means it hasn't been put in the game yet, and it's easy to see why. All allied races have received either 0 or very few options, so it's not a surprise that for the moment the Void elves are lacking in new options in the hair department.

    And tell me... Void elves can already have grey and silver hair, so why exactly would blonde hair be biologically impossible?

    The fact that they are allowed to be around is making everyone an idiot. They are clearly dangerous and the powers they are meddling with are dangerous.
    Like mages, warlocks, death knights, demon hunters, etc. Hell, the Visions of N'Zoth show that the people of Orgrimmar are just as susceptible to the whispers, so I guess that keeping the entire Horde around is also dangerous. Which I don't disagree with, but it's beside the point.

    The fact that Turalyon would allow Alleria to do such a thing makes him an absolute idiot.
    To do what? Use the Void? It was an incident, neither of them had a say in the matter. And besides, Turalyon is in NO position to stop Alleria from doing anything.
    Last edited by Varodoc; 2020-10-26 at 12:07 PM.
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  3. #21783
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    It's your headcanon to say Alleria is not a Void elf because she is pink when Blizzard literally calls her a Void elf.
    For all I care we can consider her a Void Elf and I'll concede the point.

    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Considering the official canon "worthless" means stepping into headcanon.
    No, it means I just don't care anymore.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    And tell me... Void elves can already have grey and silver hair, so why exactly would blonde hair be biologically impossible?
    Nothing is biologically impossible. It's not even a matter of biology, cause you can dye your hair. Gnomes have pink hair. Is that natural? Maybe. I don't even think Blizzard is thinking about this. Why doesn't every race have access to pink hair?

    It's a stylistic choice made by Blizzard. They wanted Void Elves to look a certain way and that is all there is to it.

  4. #21784
    The Insane Syegfryed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MyWholeLifeIsThunder View Post
    You say that as if would be a bad thing? Why would more hair colors for everyone be bad?
    it depends, im sure thing all colors in existence to everyone here seems reduldant but the main point here is how this also affect "equal" races.

    Like dark iron and normal dwarves still have different set of color differeence, in skin and hair, same for other allied races, if void elves don't have skin difference, at least let he hair color be different.

    "Every race is arbitrary limited by something" does not cut it when we are talking about lore here, and really doesn't either when gameplay has pretty much already made any differenciation moot.
    So, you want void elves to essentially be 2 playable races? cause that is the thing, if you give then everything they will be blood elves and void elves

    there must be a difference, and of course will be arbitrary, everything is.

    "It makes sense darkening the hair due to void energies" no it freaking doesn't when skin car remain utterly unchanged. FFS, think about what you are saying and realize the utter lack of consistency.

    their hair grow tentacles dude, do you see tentacles in their bodies? no, but you see in the hair, meaning the hair act different, you can hide your void energy in the skin, but it will show in the hair, so it does make sense

    "We have to stop using leaders as something so crucial" See, that's why context is a thing; Sylvanas was an elf while playable undead are humans, Calia was risen by a completely different type of magic. Alleria and the rest of the Void Elves were changed by the same cosmic force, different manner, and if you say "well that justifies hair color, but only hair color!" Then I'm going to laugh at your face.
    Alleria also is a different case, she ate a dark naaru, she didn't undergo the same ritual the other did, you are using double standarts here.

    I'm sorry, but after VE's were giving the same skin tone and eye color than Alleria, any justification that the manner of voidification impacted appearance got thrown out of the window. All we have now is arbitrary distinction, and while that is entirely discretionary of the devs, it will be a cold day in hell before it makes for a good lore argument FFS.
    Lore argument don't hold much ground anymore, so you can't keep using that as defining factory, yes it is a arbitrary distinction to set then apart, like they have done with all allied races, orcs and maghar have different haircolors and hairstyles, same for dark iron and the others, i can't fathom why void elves are better than everyone else to receive a better treatment and become 2 races in one.

    And it make totally sense in a lore and design kind of way to make lighter colors to be exclusive to blood elves, since their relationship with the light and the sunwell, and make darker colors exclusive to Void elves. due to their void mutation, this way everyone feels unique in their own game and fantasy, while sharing the same shenanigans of high elves.

    Like rly, you guys got the skin color, isn't that enough to rp HE anyway? talked so much about consensus but nothing will be ok until they got everything? a He isn't a HE until they got the legolas hair?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Except for the fact that fair-skin is part of the Void elf identity.

    This is the Void elf leader:



    So please stop saying that Void elves can ONLY have dark skin options, because that's just not true. It's like saying that Forsaken can only be rotting human zombies, look at Sylvanas and tell me with a straight face that that's true.

    There's no way around this. Alleria Windrunner is a Void elf who possesses fair skin options, and she is the Void elf leader nonetheless, she isn't some obscure character with no story relevance. I've been saying this for years, and finally Blizzard got the memo.



    and those are the forsaken leaders



    this is the current green orcs leader

    so please stop saying just because your leader look one way your race have to too.

  5. #21785
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    Quote Originally Posted by ript4 View Post
    Probably because Sylvanas is a banshee piloting an Elven corpse while Alleria is the prototype for the entire void elf race. Sylvanas does not share anything in common with the Forsaken besides being dead, Alleria and the Void Elves are biologically and supernaturally identical. Any quibbles over a minorly different orign story (which is moot now, we have to make more void elves somehow) are obtuse nitpicks.

    Sylvanas is an Elven Dark Ranger that leads the human Forsaken. Alleria is an Elven Void Elf that leads the Void Elves. A better equivalence would be orc players asking for upright bodies so they can better resemble their leaders, like Thrall. Which they got.

    Really hope we dont see any Blood Elf players asking for scars and tattoos then. We need to make sure Lor'themar and Rommath stay unique, as leaders yknow
    The cloth system lorthe mar uses and the way he hair moves is unique to him.. what am I saying hes whole armor is unique.. The scar is only a small part. We can have 1 blind eye already.

    There are many examples of racial leaders not looking like players.. its intentional.
    Last edited by Alanar; 2020-10-26 at 12:44 PM.

  6. #21786
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post

    So, you want void elves to essentially be 2 playable races? cause that is the thing, if you give then everything they will be blood elves and void elves

    there must be a difference, and of course will be arbitrary, everything is.
    I agree with you. I think the void elves should remain different from the blood elves for 2 reasons : first to not upset more Horde players, and second to add more iconic differences to this race, rather than simply make them the Alliance version of blood elves.

    That's precisely why I'm not really asking for blond hairs but white/light blue and pale pink instead.

    Give us also blue tattoos like Alleria and an option to set on/off tentacules and it'll be fine.
    "If you want to play alongside High and Void elves, the Alliance is waiting for you"

  7. #21787
    They'll get blonde and more hair colours anyway. Once allied races receive the same amount of customization overhauls that core races did.
    Expansion Storylines ranking:

    Legion > Cataclysm > MoP > BfA up to 8.2.5 > Wrath > TBC > WoD > Dragonflight > BfA 8.3 > Shadowlands

  8. #21788
    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    it depends, im sure thing all colors in existence to everyone here seems reduldant but the main point here is how this also affect "equal" races.

    Like dark iron and normal dwarves still have different set of color differeence, in skin and hair, same for other allied races, if void elves don't have skin difference, at least let he hair color be different.



    So, you want void elves to essentially be 2 playable races? cause that is the thing, if you give then everything they will be blood elves and void elves

    there must be a difference, and of course will be arbitrary, everything is.




    their hair grow tentacles dude, do you see tentacles in their bodies? no, but you see in the hair, meaning the hair act different, you can hide your void energy in the skin, but it will show in the hair, so it does make sense



    Alleria also is a different case, she ate a dark naaru, she didn't undergo the same ritual the other did, you are using double standarts here.



    Lore argument don't hold much ground anymore, so you can't keep using that as defining factory, yes it is a arbitrary distinction to set then apart, like they have done with all allied races, orcs and maghar have different haircolors and hairstyles, same for dark iron and the others, i can't fathom why void elves are better than everyone else to receive a better treatment and become 2 races in one.

    And it make totally sense in a lore and design kind of way to make lighter colors to be exclusive to blood elves, since their relationship with the light and the sunwell, and make darker colors exclusive to Void elves. due to their void mutation, this way everyone feels unique in their own game and fantasy, while sharing the same shenanigans of high elves.

    Like rly, you guys got the skin color, isn't that enough to rp HE anyway? talked so much about consensus but nothing will be ok until they got everything? a He isn't a HE until they got the legolas hair?

    - - - Updated - - -






    and those are the forsaken leaders



    this is the current green orcs leader

    so please stop saying just because your leader look one way your race have to too.
    Calia is actually not Forsaken leader as was stated in Shadow's Rising. She is kind of advisor for Voss who seems to be the one who will probably lead Forsaken in the future.

  9. #21789
    I wonder what the next tantrum will be about.

    Will people fight over whether a hair color is blonde or light tan or gold?

    Or maybe it’ll be about the high elf NPCs with purple eyes! “You can’t be a male high elf because your eyes are blue, not purple! Only women can be high elves!”

  10. #21790
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vaedan View Post
    Calia is actually not Forsaken leader as was stated in Shadow's Rising. She is kind of advisor for Voss who seems to be the one who will probably lead Forsaken in the future.
    She still a representive and new people who will start out as forsaken and see her..(if they like her look) will ask to look like her.. wich is the point: you cant.

    Same counts for gallywix.. sylvanas etc etc.
    Last edited by Alanar; 2020-10-26 at 01:39 PM.

  11. #21791
    The Unstoppable Force Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vagnar View Post
    man I really don't care
    Then why are you here, if you "really don't care"?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Strippling View Post
    And yet to this day forsaken (or blood elf) players cannot make their characters look like Sylvanas, who was their racial leader for 15 years or so. Void elves have been around for only 2 years and yet the entitlement level that they should look like Alleria is jaw dropping. The PC doesn't always get to look like leaders, leaders often have unique features to distinguish them from your "average joe".
    Forsaken players cannot make their characters look like Sylvanas because their leader is a different race than the players. Forsaken players are humans, Sylvanas is a blood elf.

    Blood elf players cannot make their characters look like Sylvanas because she is an undead. Blood elf players are living elves, Sylvanas is an undead elf.

    Not a hard concept to grasp, I hope.
    "Torturing someone is not an evil thing to do if it is done for good reasons" by Varodoc
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  12. #21792
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    Then why are you here, if you "really don't care"?
    I don't care about lore justifications from a team that isn't good at telling stories

    I care about being able to play as a High Elf

    I mean quoting me you must have realized what I meant when I said "I really don't care"

    Don't just rip things out of content to attack people needlessly, it's very dishonest

  13. #21793
    Quote Originally Posted by Alanar View Post
    She still a representive and also new people who will join and see her..(if they like her look) will ask to look like her.. wich is the point: you cant.
    Same could be said for Nathanos after he got his new model in Legion, but I don't recall that much requests for this appearance from Horde community... but I agree this argument is valid.

    On the other hand, Blizz never talked about similar options for playable undead. Same can't be said for high elf options for void elves and also blood elves lately. Devs already teased us they intend to expand high elf fantasy on both factions, so odds of blonde (or any natural hair color) hair for void elves is extremely more likely then creating set of new models for undeads.

  14. #21794
    The Unstoppable Force Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vagnar View Post
    They intentionally designed her to look like a High Elf, not a Void Elf. That she says she "identifies" as a Void Elf and is their leader doesn't matter.

    Void Elves have a certain design. It's purple hair colors, purple skin tones and weirdly glowing hair. You can create a character, that looks like a High Elf and say that's a void elf because lore blabla fallen naaru etc, but that doesn't change that she is a High Elf and looks nothing like a Void Elf.

    I mean the obvious answer here is that she's an important lore character and people want to see the iconic Alleria look rather than have her look like a void elf, and when they first created her character model they didn't even have any intentions of having the void elves as a race for BFA.

    So to use her appearance and point to that and say "look Void Elves can still look like pure High Elves" is highly dishonest.
    She is a void elf because she identifies as one, and because she really is one.

    And we can point at her appearance and say "look Void Elves can still look like pure High Elves" because she is a void elf, and we witnessed her final transformation.

    The OG void elves' transformation was caused by a magical trap that intended to transform them into thralls of the void lords but got interrupted in the middle. Alleria's transformation was a controlled process.

    Why do people act as if new void elves are being created by using the "interrupted trap" method that transformed the OG void elves, and not the safer method used by Locus Walker and Alleria?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by vagnar View Post
    I don't care about lore justifications from a team that isn't good at telling stories
    If you don't care about lore justifications from the team that writes the lore when you are discussing the lore then it feels you're arguing for arguing's sake.

    Don't just rip things out of content to attack people needlessly, it's very dishonest
    "Rip things out of context'? That was your entire post. You went on a tirade on how "Alleria is a high elf not a void elf" and then you went the immature way out of "I don't care" when you were told that the official canon states she is a void elf.
    "Torturing someone is not an evil thing to do if it is done for good reasons" by Varodoc
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    "They sort of did this Dragonriding, which ushered in the Dracthyr race." by Teriz <- the BS some people reach for their narratives...

  15. #21795
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vaedan View Post
    Same could be said for Nathanos after he got his new model in Legion, but I don't recall that much requests for this appearance from Horde community... but I agree this argument is valid.

    On the other hand, Blizz never talked about similar options for playable undead. Same can't be said for high elf options for void elves and also blood elves lately. Devs already teased us they intend to expand high elf fantasy on both factions, so odds of blonde (or any natural hair color) hair for void elves is extremely more likely then creating set of new models for undeads.
    The request for a Nathanos type of undead were defo out there in threads, maybe not as popular as sylvanas back in the day, but when he received that new model the interest was there for sure.

    Yea I have to agree with sygefred here altho hes on ignore lol. If you give those colors to void elves you basically have 2 blood elves races, which is not realy fair. I would suggest some mixed colors or more pale like. Keep the void in void elves and dont make a blood elf 2.0.
    Last edited by Alanar; 2020-10-26 at 02:00 PM.

  16. #21796
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    She is a void elf because she identifies as one, and because she really is one.

    And we can point at her appearance and say "look Void Elves can still look like pure High Elves" because she is a void elf, and we witnessed her final transformation.

    The OG void elves' transformation was caused by a magical trap that intended to transform them into thralls of the void lords but got interrupted in the middle. Alleria's transformation was a controlled process.

    Why do people act as if new void elves are being created by using the "interrupted trap" method that transformed the OG void elves, and not the safer method used by Locus Walker and Alleria?

    - - - Updated - - -


    If you don't care about lore justifications from the team that writes the lore when you are discussing the lore then it feels you're arguing for arguing's sake.


    "Rip things out of context'? That was your entire post. You went on a tirade on how "Alleria is a high elf not a void elf" and then you went the immature way out of "I don't care" when you were told that the official canon states she is a void elf.
    I've already conceded the point. I still disagree and still see her as a High Elf, but it's my way of saying, you're right, and I have my peace. I don't see a point in discussing this.

  17. #21797
    The Unstoppable Force Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alanar View Post
    She still a representive and new people who will start out as forsaken and see her..(if they like her look) will ask to look like her.. wich is the point: you cant.

    Same counts for gallywix.. sylvanas etc etc.
    That argument is valid for Calia and Gallywix, and even Nathanos.

    But not for Sylvanas.

    Sylvanas is a different race than the forsaken player characters, and a whole different entity altogether. The forsaken players are basically self-aware zombies, while Sylvanas is a banshee inhabiting her dead body. And on top of that, Sylvanas is an elf while the forsaken players are humans.
    "Torturing someone is not an evil thing to do if it is done for good reasons" by Varodoc
    "You sit in OG/SW waiting on a Mythic+ queue" by Altmer <- Oh, the pearls in this forum...
    "They sort of did this Dragonriding, which ushered in the Dracthyr race." by Teriz <- the BS some people reach for their narratives...

  18. #21798
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    "Rip things out of context'? That was your entire post. You went on a tirade on how "Alleria is a high elf not a void elf" and then you went the immature way out of "I don't care" when you were told that the official canon states she is a void elf.
    And again you rip things out of context.

    You asked my why I am here if I "don't care". And I answered it.

    You're doing it intentionally because you are looking for a confrontation and you want to annoy people.

  19. #21799
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    That argument is valid for Calia and Gallywix, and even Nathanos.

    But not for Sylvanas.

    Sylvanas is a different race than the forsaken player characters, and a whole different entity altogether. The forsaken players are basically self-aware zombies, while Sylvanas is a banshee inhabiting her dead body. And on top of that, Sylvanas is an elf while the forsaken players are humans.
    People still wanted to look like her... thats the point.
    So why isnt that valid? She might be a differnt race, but she was still a character many poeple looked up to and wanted her looks. Idk why it matters that she is a undead high elf. For undead its.. weird since looking at the lore many forsaken are suppose to be high elves anyway. So the question would be why isnt that option available.

  20. #21800
    Quote Originally Posted by Alanar View Post
    The request for a Nathanos type of undead were defo out there in threads, maybe not as popular as sylvanas back in the day, but when he received that new model the interest was there for sure.

    Yea I have to agree with sygefred here altho hes on ignore lol. If you give those colors to void elves you basically have 2 blood elves races, which is not realy fair. I would suggest some mixed colors or more pale like. Keep the void in void elves and dont make a blood elf 2.0.
    Well, yes, I noticed some people requesting Nathanos look, but these were not really so popular. The thing is, there will be always people demanding basically anything which is non-playable to be made playable. People asked for ogres, vrykul, tuskarr, murlocs, jinyiu, gilblin and numerous other options. It doesn't mean Blizz have to implement these only because few people want it. They better keep focused on meaningful requests.

    To be honest, I don't actually like the idea of copying all color pallete from blood elves to void elves either. I'd settle with black color, since void elf NPCs already have that option and specificaly black hair should be an option for goth styled race. I also want white hair option, since that color is available on all races except void elves, so it's hardly color associated strongly with blood elves, like red or blonde. At the end of the day, if void elves won't get any new hair colors, I'd be just fine with options they have now. Grey, silver and several shades of blue are enough for me.

    I'm more interested in new hairstyles though. Again, I don't think Blizz should just copy all blood elf hairstyles to void elves. There are few hairstyles blood elves are sharing with humans, night elves and draenei, so I wouldn't mind seeing these hairstyles open for void elves too.

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