Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

Soooo according to some who have read the new Golden's book, Shaw notices that there are a lot of Alliance sympathisers in Silvermoon while visiting the city.

This pleases me a lot. I do hope some will rebel against Lor'Themar, with Alleria in the background not very far.

I mean makes sense, it would have been awfully convenient that all the Alliance sympathizers had joined Umbric and became Void Elves.

I do appreciate that it feels like a continuation of previously established themes about not all Blood Elves being quite as happy with the Horde, and Alleria and Vereesa's own desire to bring their people back to the alliance being more than just their own skewed vision of their people, and I really hope this is set up for something that actually shifts the status quo.

What would be better narrative-wise tho, Quel'thalas going neutral as a place and similarly like Dalaran having Alliance and Horde districts, or a revolt attempt that ends with defeat for the Alliance forces, but ultimately bolsters them as a unified group and settle somewhere else?

Part of me kinda wants Quel'thalas to go neutral, but mostly so that the Horde Loyalist Blood Elves merge with the Nightborne and create a Second Highborne Empire. That would be neat lol.

But really, I kinda don't want Quel'thalas to go neutral, I feel the bad reasons outweigh the possibilities; I think that maybe a split of Quel'thalas would be better narratively with the Alliance Aligned Thalassians retaking the Ghostlands and settling there -specially when it feels that as of Three Sisters that area is still no-mans-land- and I just really like the idea of a persistent cold war between territories right next to each other.

[FossilFree]

For example, I saw this picture recently on the official forums. I could see these being added to Void Elves as hair color options:



They aren't the full gamut of natural hair colors, but four out of five of them fall under what most would consider "natural" (White, Black, Blonde, Brown). The blonde option shown here is also nothing like the blondes that Blood Elves have (it falls more into the beige blonde category). I could see the devs adding something like that as opposed to giving Void Elves a copy of Blood Elf blondes.

Now those are natural Void Elf hair colors done right! Except the blue one isn't natural, but it still looks good too.

[Ardenaso]

We can agree on that. It's a minority. But still. It's promising. In a Horde's capital, a good portion of its citizen favor the Alliance over the Horde.

And we know Alleria and Vereesa both want to get Silvermoon back into the Alliance.

Odds are good to expect a Battle of Silvermoon in the next expansion with Turalyon -once member of the Alliance of Lordaeron- saying he wants to take back former Alliance holdings. Ans who's his wife ? A Silvermoon citizen banished from her own homeland.

I'm super excited to see how it will unfold.

I hope it ends up badly. I still prefer Quel'thalas and especially Silvermoon to remain Horde. Whether Alleria or Vereesa has good intentions, the majority still sees them as mere human stooges. Given the anti-Alliance propaganda in just the Bazaar alone, the Silver Covenant are all wanted terrorists who betrayed their own people and the Void Elves to them are monsters whose existence are affront to their Sunwell. And Alleria is a fallen hero who joined the enemy of the state. To them at least. Especially when you have Rommath as one of the core leaders

[Traveler Voltin]

We can agree on that. It's a minority. But still. It's promising. In a Horde's capital, a good portion of its citizen favor the Alliance over the Horde.

And we know Alleria and Vereesa both want to get Silvermoon back into the Alliance.

Odds are good to expect a Battle of Silvermoon in the next expansion with Turalyon -once member of the Alliance of Lordaeron- saying he wants to take back former Alliance holdings. Ans who's his wife ? A Silvermoon citizen banished from her own homeland.

I'm super excited to see how it will unfold.

prove it then

[Mungho]

We can agree on that. It's a minority. But still. It's promising. In a Horde's capital, a good portion of its citizen favor the Alliance over the Horde.

And we know Alleria and Vereesa both want to get Silvermoon back into the Alliance.

Odds are good to expect a Battle of Silvermoon in the next expansion with Turalyon -once member of the Alliance of Lordaeron- saying he wants to take back former Alliance holdings. Ans who's his wife ? A Silvermoon citizen banished from her own homeland.

I'm super excited to see how it will unfold.

And just what Alliance capital would be given to the Horde for balance?

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

And just what Alliance capital would be given to the Horde for balance?

Even if a battle for Silvermoon happens, it doesn't mean it would be a success for the Alliance.

[Mungho]

Even if a battle for Silvermoon happens, it doesn't mean it would be a success for the Alliance.

The problem is the poster I replied to(as well as others) obviously wants it to be a success, ignoring all the problems it would cause.

[Varodoc]

I hope it ends up badly. I still prefer Quel'thalas and especially Silvermoon to remain Horde. Whether Alleria or Vereesa has good intentions, the majority still sees them as mere human stooges. Given the anti-Alliance propaganda in just the Bazaar alone, the Silver Covenant are all wanted terrorists who betrayed their own people and the Void Elves to them are monsters whose existence are affront to their Sunwell. And Alleria is a fallen hero who joined the enemy of the state. To them at least. Especially when you have Rommath as one of the core leaders

Alleria 100% has good intentions and she is 100% right.

The Horde has dragged the blood elves in not one but two consecutive world wars, in which countless elves were needlessly butchered. Garrosh literally sent thousands of young elves into suicide missions in Pandaria. Theron even acknowledged that Garrosh got his bell through the sheer blood of his people.

The blood elves joined the Horde to defeat the Scourge, and the Scourge has been defeated. They remain in the Horde purely for gameplay reasons. The Purge of Dalaran happened purely for gameplay reasons, and even then Theron was already negotiating with Varian to rejoin the Alliance.

And who can forget how Sylvanas Windrunner shamelessly blackmailed the Sin'dorei at the start of WotLK and completely ignored their pleas to not go to Northrend?

As Alleria is 100% right and Quel'Thalas does not belong in the Horde, it is not a surprise that many in Sin'dorei society would find her ideals inspiring. Alleria is not the first who fought to bring Quel'Thalas back into the fold, but she holds influence and recognition to a degree that Vereesa and Auric simply CANNOT compare. Alleria Windrunner is a war hero, a legend, so when a war hero says "Quel'Thalas should leave the Horde", then it's just normal that many would start to rethink their current allegiance to the Horde.

Regardless, Alleria does not wish to harm Quel'Thalas in any way. She disagrees with the current government, but she still genuinely loves her homeland and seeks to protect it her own way. Trust me, if Alleria wanted Quel'Thalas destroyed, she would've already done it in BfA.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

The problem is the poster I replied to(as well as others) obviously wants it to be a success, ignoring all the problems it would cause.

I mean sure, like you can see some people are biased to the idea of Silvermoon returning to the alliance and use the idea of a Battle for Silvermoon as a way to get there. but personally, I do think the idea of a "civil war" in Quel'thalas by itself would be awesome to explore, even if the alliance doesn't get the city.

So that's the thing, look at the merit of the idea itself and put aside others people's biases for a bit, and I truly think a Battle for Silvermoon would be a great way to finally pay off almost 15 years of set up of a divided Thalassian people that has only increased on the last few years with the Ren'dorei entering the picture.

[Kyriani]

Anyone who thinks Silvermoon will ever be an Alliance welcoming capital in the WoW MMO is delusional IMO. It's just not going to happen. Blizzard would have to give tit for tat and make an Alliance capital welcoming of the Horde, and that's just as ridiculous. Capitals being destroyed is more likely than capitals ever welcoming the opposite faction.

[Varodoc]

I don't care about Silvermoon the city, it's a stupid, decrepit left-over from 2007. Sure it might be nostalgic (it is), but it's buggy and broken. Refer to any "Silvermoon Parkour Challenge" video if you don't believe me.

However, it makes 100% sense that many within Silvermoon would reject the current government to follow Alleria's ideals. It is only natural that such a thing would happen, as I thoroughly explained.

Blizzard will NEVER update Silvermoon, as they'd have to rebuild it from scratch in the EK world map. That doesn't mean they can't make a few instanced scenarios in there, however. They already did with the Nightborne recruitment scenario.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

Anyone who think Silvermoon will ever be an Alliance welcoming capital in the WoW MMO is delusional IMO. It's just not going to happen. Blizzard would have to give tit for tat and make an Alliance capital welcoming of the Horde, and that's just as ridiculous. Capitals being destroyed is more likely than capitals ever welcoming the opposite faction.

Yeah, I have to agree with that 100%.

Though I have to say, I would have loved a Warfront: Eversong if only for have resulted in an updated zone; felt like the perfect opportunity, alas, it has passed.

Just imagining Silvermoon updated to have Suramar's quality makes me sigh. So beautiful!

[Mungho]

I don't care about Silvermoon the city, it's a stupid, decrepit left-over from 2007. Sure it might be nostalgic (it is), but it's buggy and broken. Refer to any "Silvermoon Parkour Challenge" video if you don't believe me.

However, it makes 100% sense that many within Silvermoon would reject the current government to follow Alleria's ideals. It is only natural that such a thing would happen, as I thoroughly explained.

Blizzard will NEVER update Silvermoon, as they'd have to rebuild it from scratch in the EK world map. That doesn't mean they can't make a few instanced scenarios in there, however. They already did with the Nightborne recruitment scenario.

I might've been too harsh, I apologize. With the Horde narratively destroyed by the writers, I worry about Blizzard giving pieces of it to the Alliance, no matter how unlikely it seems. Considering the state the Horde is in now, I'd imagine many BE would like to leave the Horde.
Wait, if a Blood Elf joined the Alliance, would they automatically become a High Elf?

[Kyriani]

Yeah, I have to agree with that 100%.

Though I have to say, I would have loved a Warfront: Eversong if only for have resulted in an updated zone; felt like the perfect opportunity, alas, it has passed.

Just imagining Silvermoon updated to have Suramar's quality makes me sigh. So beautiful!

I agree. I would have loved an Eversong warfront, if only to update Silvermoon/Eversong Woods/Ghostlands into flyable areas. And by virtue of doing this, flight could be enabled in the Draenei starting zones, which need no extra work since the Exodar is self contained and all the Draenei starting areas are complete from every angle.

[Varodoc]

I might've been too harsh, I apologize. With the Horde narratively destroyed by the writers, I worry about Blizzard giving pieces of it to the Alliance, no matter how unlikely it seems. Considering the state the Horde is in now, I'd imagine many BE would like to leave the Horde.
Wait, if a Blood Elf joined the Alliance, would they automatically become a High Elf?

Oh I wasn't offended, I was just surprised you were going on a tangent on how Silvermoon will not become an Alliance capital.

I'm pretty sure that everyone realizes Silvermoon and Exodar will never be updated, and the fact they did not become fly zones in Cataclysm was the obvious red flag. Still, that doesn't mean they can't be the location of some instanced story scenarios.

[Ardenaso]

Alleria 100% has good intentions and she is 100% right.

The Horde has dragged the blood elves in not one but two consecutive world wars, in which countless elves were needlessly butchered. Garrosh literally sent thousands of young elves into suicide missions in Pandaria. Theron even acknowledged that Garrosh got his bell through the sheer blood of his people.

The blood elves joined the Horde to defeat the Scourge, and the Scourge has been defeated. They remain in the Horde purely for gameplay reasons. The Purge of Dalaran happened purely for gameplay reasons, and even then Theron was already negotiating with Varian to rejoin the Alliance.

And who can forget how Sylvanas Windrunner shamelessly blackmailed the Sin'dorei at the start of WotLK and completely ignored their pleas to not go to Northrend?

As Alleria is 100% right and Quel'Thalas does not belong in the Horde, it is not a surprise that many in Sin'dorei society would find her ideals inspiring. Alleria is not the first who fought to bring Quel'Thalas back into the fold, but she holds influence and recognition to a degree that Vereesa and Auric simply CANNOT compare. Alleria Windrunner is a war hero, a legend, so when a war hero says "Quel'Thalas should leave the Horde", then it's just normal that many would start to rethink their current allegiance to the Horde.

Regardless, Alleria does not wish to harm Quel'Thalas in any way. She disagrees with the current government, but she still genuinely loves her homeland and seeks to protect it her own way. Trust me, if Alleria wanted Quel'Thalas destroyed, she would've already done it in BfA.

I mean yes, but Rommath's propaganda machine wouldn't easily make it possible

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And just what Alliance capital would be given to the Horde for balance?

not an Alliance capital but to balance the Alliance victories after BFA I do wish for a complete and total reunification of the Forsaken and the Argent Lordaeronians where the Forsaken are fully accepted by them. That means all of Eastweald (Hearthglen, Stratholme, Tyr's Hand, Light's Hope) becomes Horde lands.

and of course, Alterac lands going back to their rightful owners as well as the Alterac Grasslands (Tarren Mill, Southshore, Durnholde). Alteraci Humans for the Horde

(we all know Quel'thalas and Silvermoon will never be Alliance)

I really prefer the Alliance Thalassians to do a Dath'remar and settle in Eldre'thalas, that land is waiting for them for them to restore it and make it their new homeland. With Mordent, Vereesa, and Umbric as advisors to Alleria

[Varodoc]

I mean yes, but Rommath's propaganda machine wouldn't easily make it possible

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not an Alliance capital but to balance the Alliance victories after BFA I do wish for a complete and total reunification of the Forsaken and the Argent Lordaeronians where the Forsaken are fully accepted by them. That means all of Eastweald (Hearthglen, Stratholme, Tyr's Hand, Light's Hope) becomes Horde lands.

and of course, Alterac lands going back to their rightful owners as well as the Alterac Grasslands (Tarren Mill, Southshore, Durnholde). Alteraci Humans for the Horde

(we all know Quel'thalas and Silvermoon will never be Alliance)

I really prefer the Alliance Thalassians to do a Dath'remar and settle in Eldre'thalas, that land is waiting for them for them to restore it and make it their new homeland. With Mordent, Vereesa, and Umbric as advisors to Alleria

We don't know if the Thalassian government still employs propaganda. No, the two priests in the Bazaar are not evidence, because Silvremoon in-game is still stuck in the TBC timeline.

It's been... what? 6 years? 10 years since TBC? Quel'Thalas has recovered since then, certainly they don't need dirty brainwashing methods anymore.

I also think that Kael'thas's betrayal hurt the legitimacy of Theron's regime severely. Who appointed Theron as Regent? A mad, traitor prince who went rogue and joined the Legion. Theron's regime will always be stained by Kael'thas' actions, thus it's not unreasonable to believe that many would prefer Alleria on the throne.

There's also the Void Lords telling Alleria that the throne of Quel'Thalas is rightfully hers. Even they understand that the name "Windrunner" carries authority and influence.

[Strippling]

Black is a natural hair color, and Blood Elves have black hair as an option. Does that mean Void Elves can't have black hair?

White hair is also a natural hair color, and Blood Elves also have white hair as an option, does that mean Void Elves can't have white hair?

Blue hair is not a natural hair color (at least not in the human spectrum), yet Blood Elves now have multiple blue hair options. Does that mean Void Elves can't get any new shades of blue hair?

Purple is also not a natural hair color (at least not in the human spectrum), yet Blood Elves recently got a dark purple hair option. Does that mean Void Elves can't get any new shades of purple hair?

Firstly, I think void elves should get black and pure white hair options.

Secondly, your comments about blood elves getting blue / dark purple hair options is moot. As it stands, void elves have access to ALL the blood elf skin options PLUS their own void skin options (that blood elves do not have access to). It's only fair then that blood elves have a wider range of hair color options, ranging from void elf-esque colors such as blue, to natural hair colors that they've always had. It'd be hypocritical to think void elves are entitled to natural hair colors because blood elves got blue (from their DK's, not even from void elves) hair, while at the same time void elves already have all the blood elf skins plus their own unique ones. On top of that, it'd be downright unfair to offer void elves and wider range of options (both skins and potentially hair) than their parent race.

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I mean sure, like you can see some people are biased to the idea of Silvermoon returning to the alliance and use the idea of a Battle for Silvermoon as a way to get there. but personally, I do think the idea of a "civil war" in Quel'thalas by itself would be awesome to explore, even if the alliance doesn't get the city.

So that's the thing, look at the merit of the idea itself and put aside others people's biases for a bit, and I truly think a Battle for Silvermoon would be a great way to finally pay off almost 15 years of set up of a divided Thalassian people that has only increased on the last few years with the Ren'dorei entering the picture.

Wouldn't be much of a war. The few remaining alliance aligned high elves in combination with the void elves would still be vastly outgunned and outnumbered by the blood elves. Unless of course you were to include the other races of the Alliance / Horde, in which case it wouldn't be a civil war it'd be a faction war.

[AzureMage]

I've browsed this thread on and off for while now before i made an account here and i'm curious about the general desires of the people who want High Elves as a playable race (or wanted since it seems to have shifted to giving Void Elves more natural/High Elf customization options).

I don't particularly care for Elves but from my perspective the Blood Elves already stand in for the "High Elf" fantasy archetype (haughty, graceful, typically either wizards or archers) same way Night Elves stand in for the Wood Elf archetype (in touch with nature, typically druids or archers), Void Elves and Nightborne had their own thematics and visuals that seperated them from their respective core parent race (Void elves and Nightborne both visually and thematically draw from dark elves/drow). Attempts i've seen to give them their own visual identity also seem questionable to me such as giving them a more wood elf look (which night elves already possess) or giving them farstrider stuff like tattoos given that the farstriders are still a part of Blood Elf society and aren't a uniquely silver covenant/high elf thing it seems like a stretch to make that their visual identity)

Was the "High Elves" (as an archetype) of World of Warcraft being aligned with the Horde instead of the Alliance affect your desire to play a "high elf" and so you want a race of the same archetype on the Alliance? how much Blood Elf customization would you be satisfied with being given to Void Elves and would it matter if the Blood Elf customizations would end up overshadowing the Void Elves own visual/thematic identity (I've even seen suggestions of changing Entropic Embrace to make people more able to pretend their void elves are uncorrupted High Elves which just seems ridiculous to me)

I've also seen the argument of High Elves "belonging" with the Alliance instead of the Horde, while i can understand this argument perhaps in terms of visuals but Lore-wise the High Elves were never particularly strong allies with the alliance, they only allied with the Empire of Arathor to defeat a mutual foe in the Amani Trolls, Only sent a token force to support the Alliance of Lordaeron in the Second War and only started supporting it in earnest when the Horde threatened Quel'Thalas itself, after the second war they abandoned the Alliance with only High Elves staying being more associated with Dalaran and the Light than the Kingdom of Quel'Thalas.

The only prominent group of High Elves in the game has been the Silver Covenant who seem more motivated by an opposition to the Sunreavers/Horde moreso than loyalty to the Alliance (and have also only ever been relevant when the Sunreavers are relevant), their leader Vereesa has also nearly left the joined Sylvanas and the Horde in one of the novels and only refused because of her children not any loyalty to the alliance, i'm just not seeing the supposed High Elf loyalty to the Alliance.

Apologies if any parts of this post came across as confrontational, i know this is a contentious topic. I'm just merely curious as someone who doesn't really have an investment either pro or anti High Elf (since i wouldn't make one even if they were playable either as their own race or as Void Elf customizations).

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

Wouldn't be much of a war. The few remaining alliance aligned high elves in combination with the void elves would still be vastly outgunned and outnumbered by the blood elves. Unless of course you were to include the other races of the Alliance / Horde, in which case it wouldn't be a civil war it'd be a faction war.

I mean it's entirely likely that in a war scenario, both factions would back their members, you know, like proxy wars between superpowers work.

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I've browsed this thread on and off for while now before i made an account here and i'm curious about the general desires of the people who want High Elves as a playable race (or wanted since it seems to have shifted to giving Void Elves more natural/High Elf customization options).

I don't particularly care for Elves but from my perspective the Blood Elves already stand in for the "High Elf" fantasy archetype (haughty, graceful, typically either wizards or archers) same way Night Elves stand in for the Wood Elf archetype (in touch with nature, typically druids or archers), Void Elves and Nightborne had their own thematics and visuals that seperated them from their respective core parent race (Void elves and Nightborne both visually and thematically draw from dark elves/drow). Attempts i've seen to give them their own visual identity also seem questionable to me such as giving them a more wood elf look (which night elves already possess) or giving them farstrider stuff like tattoos given that the farstriders are still a part of Blood Elf society and aren't a uniquely silver covenant/high elf thing it seems like a stretch to make that their visual identity)

Was the "High Elves" (as an archetype) of World of Warcraft being aligned with the Horde instead of the Alliance affect your desire to play a "high elf" and so you want a race of the same archetype on the Alliance? how much Blood Elf customization would you be satisfied with being given to Void Elves and would it matter if the Blood Elf customizations would end up overshadowing the Void Elves own visual/thematic identity (I've even seen suggestions of changing Entropic Embrace to make people more able to pretend their void elves are uncorrupted High Elves which just seems ridiculous to me)

I've also seen the argument of High Elves "belonging" with the Alliance instead of the Horde, while i can understand this argument perhaps in terms of visuals but Lore-wise the High Elves were never particularly strong allies with the alliance, they only allied with the Empire of Arathor to defeat a mutual foe in the Amani Trolls, Only sent a token force to support the Alliance of Lordaeron in the Second War and only started supporting it in earnest when the Horde threatened Quel'Thalas itself, after the second war they abandoned the Alliance with only High Elves staying being more associated with Dalaran and the Light than the Kingdom of Quel'Thalas.

The only prominent group of High Elves in the game has been the Silver Covenant who seem more motivated by an opposition to the Sunreavers/Horde moreso than loyalty to the Alliance (and have also only ever been relevant when the Sunreavers are relevant), their leader Vereesa has also nearly left the joined Sylvanas and the Horde in one of the novels and only refused because of her children not any loyalty to the alliance, i'm just not seeing the supposed High Elf loyalty to the Alliance.

Apologies if any parts of this post came across as confrontational, i know this is a contentious topic. I'm just merely curious as someone who doesn't really have an investment either pro or anti High Elf (since i wouldn't make one even if they were playable either as their own race or as Void Elf customizations).

I mean short answer I guess it's just that they are part of Warcraft's history, and remain to exist within the world.

As we all know, most High Elves renamed themselves Blood Elves and ended up in the Horde, but since the first happened, we have known a small fraction of them didn't, and is now in the Alliance, just as High Elves were when introduced into the game.

It's continuity, and appreciation of it. High Elves exist still, and although now we see them also incarnated as BE and VE, that High Elf "flavor" still exists; the conversation would be much different if High Elves had become extinct and not formed groups like the SC, the Highvale, or being a large population of Dalaran.

Pretty much every humanoid race in WoW has people that want them to be playable, and in the case of High Elves, they are the oldest race introduced in WoW that is not Playable recognizable as the group they were introduced as -mainly, Alliance aligned-

Because yeah, the same Elves are technically playable as Blood Elves, but as self evident, that's not the faction they were introduced in; Indeed, "High Elves" has been the only race that has "split" since their introduction, so by any meaningful measure, they aren't fully playable, and won't be until alliance aligned High Elves are made playable in a meaningful way that recognizes that throughline as original members of the Alliance that we still see currently through Alleria, her troops in Outland, the Highvale, and all those scattered High Elves in alliance settlements. The Silver Covenant itself is a continuation of that sentiment, created during WoW, representing those Dalarani Elves against the Sunreaver and Horde influence in their now neutral city.

Note that, it doesn't have to be as their own race, mind you, but something that addresses that history -which is why Void Elves as they are don't fulfill that niche- Maybe all it would take is for some High Elves to officially join the Void Elves, we cannot deny that the most iconic High Elf is a Void Elf now, so it's a viable path forward for thalassians as a people.