The Alliance gets the Horde's most popular race. The Horde should get the Alliance's most popular race in return. Alteraci Humans for the Horde!
I make Warcraft 3 Reforged HD custom models and I'm also an HD model reviewer.
You know, now that Turalyon is High King of the Alliance, it wouldn't surprise me if he marched on Quel'Thalas at Alleria's request. She is, after all, his beloved wife, and they both want to reclaim former Alliance holdings.
This means that, even if the Alliance elves were low in numbers, they would still have the manpower to reclaim Quel'Thalas through their allies.
I mean... the Battle of Stromgarde happened precisely because Stromgarde represents an entry point into Quel'Thalas, the last Horde holding in the East.. And now it's in the hands of the Alliance.
Last edited by Varodoc; 2020-12-03 at 06:43 PM.
Like I literally said, it can still be a civil war if even both sides are backed/supplied by external forces. Proxy wars, they happen.
Sure and that's entirely all plausible, but -and I think this is the Portal Trainer NPC in Orgrimmar- might be just a Blood Elf that always had blue eyes -simply meaning that never got irradiated by Fel energies, like Darnarian seem to have-There is a blood/high elf who received the new purple eyes. These eyes were specifically stated to be a bug causing female high elf NPCs eyes to change from blue to purple. When the bug was fixed the same NPC (can't remember her name) had her eyes change from purple to blue (same as every other female high elf NPC), indicating that she is actually a high elf NPC in the game files. Now this is nothing breaking, nor is it confirmation of anything, it's just another piece of information that can be used (along with recent blizzard statements) to presume that high elves could indeed be reuniting with their kin in Silvermoon. I mean, not every high elf is a die hard alliance "fan boi", there are many high elves who are/were neutral or in some cases downright hostile toward the Alliance. It isn't unreasonable to assume that they're rejoining their kin in their native homeland. It's not a reflection of reunification under the Horde, but rather a path toward high elves being absorbed by blood/void elves storywise moving forward.
My point is that with no explicit confirmation, we can't take this as evidence that High Elves are rejoining Quel'thalas -even if it's highly likely- inasmuch a way we can't use HE skin and eye colors on VE as hard evidence of High Elves joining the Void Elves -even when it's also highly likely-
I do think we have a lot of largely very plausible speculation, about all of this, but yeah, the point is that these new eye colors don't have any confirmed origin; New options are understood as being "always there" or having a clear origin, the issue with BE is that it can have several origins so specification is rather needed.
-BE's that never got Green Eyes -Such as is likely for Lanesh and Darnarian-
-BE's that regained Blue Eyes -similarly how they gained golden eyes-
-Neutral High Elves that rejoined Quel'thalas, likely through the Sunreavers.
-Formerly Alliance High Elves that rejoined Quel'thalas -such Allerian soldiers that finally were able to return to Azeroth-
And to be honest I think the truth might be a lil bit of all options, and I kinda agree; if you also add High Elves joining with the Void Elves, I do think the path moving forward is for High Elves to being absorbed between Blood Elves and Void Elves -and maybe create Half Elves as their own thing mmm- and the only question would be how much of a split would be.
Like personal assumption; of the remaining Alliance High Elves, I think they had their time to return if so they wanted after 10 years. Of the neutral ones, I do think there could be more. But now we also have the confirmation of Pro Alliance sentiment in Silvermoon, so there's also a possible scenario where some come, some go.
The Alliance winning the first two warfronts was a pretty strong indicator that the Horde would have won the next two planned in their own territories (Mulgore/Quel'Thalas) IMO. Blizzard likes parity, particularly when it comes to player races.
More broadly, you void elf fanatics hyperfixate on what the Alliance wants way too hard. The Horde has as much reason to see Silvermoon defended as the Alliance does to see it conquered... more, probably, with meta considerations like 13 years of player investment in the place and all the Horde-only content tied to it. We might see some faction conflict in Quel'Thalas one day - the foreshadowing is there - but conflict isn't a synonym of victory.
Personally, I rather doubt we'll see the day Joe'dorei, selecting his Horde toon on the Silvermoon login screen, wearing his <of Silvermoon> title, clad in his Silvermoon tabard and striding around Silvermoon City atop his Silvermoon hawkstrider, will wake up and find the identity Blizzard gave him has been transferred to the opposite faction. Like Darnassus, Undercity, and even Theramore, they'd probably blow Silvermoon up before giving it to the other side.
Gilneas should be alliance. i stopped caring about Dalaran awhile ago.
Seeing as Calia and Voss want to rebuild lordaeron Turalyon has no claim to anything.
be happy with what you have for once and stop trying to take horde things.
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show claims of the people of Silvermoon or else you are full of crap.
Anemo: traveler, Sucrose
Pyro: Yanfei, Amber, diluc, xiangling, thoma, Xinyan, Bennett
Geo: Noelle, Ningguang, Yun Jin, Gorou
Hydro: Barbara, Zingqiu, Ayato
Cyro: Shenhe, Kaeya, Chongyun, Diona, Ayaka, Rosaria
Electro: Fischl, Lisa, Miko, Kujou, Raiden, Razor
a way for Quel'thalas to not get conquered is to bring Alterac and Eastweald to the Horde! A renewed Alliance of Lordaeron (in the Horde) would make sure the Grand Alliance would not get their hands on Silvermoon
The Alliance gets the Horde's most popular race. The Horde should get the Alliance's most popular race in return. Alteraci Humans for the Horde!
I make Warcraft 3 Reforged HD custom models and I'm also an HD model reviewer.
I don't think giving humans more stuff, is what the alliance needs if you ask me.
Wanna bet the alliance will be far more excited with powerful and revived night elves and high/void elves. Gaining the Suramar or having it opened up, and gaining Quel'thalas or having it opened up to them and their elven groups developing as the sort of grand races their original lore echoed or shaping up to be at least, would be far more exciting to alliance fans than giving humans more stuff.
The horde doesn't need elven stuff any more - they're popular, i say strip them of it, or at the very least open them up to share.
How many times must this be said.
No one is saying that the Alliance will take Quel'Thalas in-game or in the lore. Blizzard will never even update that derelict left-over from 2007.
What we're saying is that they can carry out this conflict through instanced scenarios (which don't require the update of the in-game world), a conflict that could end with a stalemate or armistice, or even with an Alliance victory but inability to effectively take over Quel'Thalas.
I like void elves a lot. I just think "what can we poach from the blood elves" is a pretty questionable pursuit for fans of the race to focus on, one that will probably leave them disappointed. I never really agreed with the idea of playable high elves, but I did appreciate the creativity and effort Traycor and others put into crafting a vision of the race that had a bit more going on than just chasing after everything the blood elves have. And there was certainly no insult intended, I've been a blood elf and night elf fanatic for years.
I see, well then I guess misunderstood. Usually "fanatic" is used in a negative way, ESPECIALLY in this thread, so you'll have to forgive me.
Regardless I don't particularly care about Quel'Thalas. As I said, it is a place of many good memories and nostalgia, but it is also a broken mess. I mean, just look at the zone from above, it's completely unfinished. I doubt anyone would really want it, since it's still stuck in 2007.
But at the same time, foreshadowing should always have some paid-off, and it's pretty clear that Blizzard is building something up in this conflict between Thalassian elves. Recently, the Eastern Kingdoms lore book written by Golden mentioned that Shaw noticed that many elves in Silvermoon are pro-Alliance, and Alleria is interested in reclaiming that kingdom (too interested, according to Shaw, which worried him) -- not for herself, of course, but for the Alliance.
Last edited by Varodoc; 2020-12-03 at 08:49 PM.
I have to agree with this. There is an issue though that's more on Blizzard than those making requests for Alliance High Elves.
The issue I see is that, because Blood Elves and Void Elves use the same model, Blizzard may decide to take a shortcut and share assets between the two, rather than take time and resources to make unique assets for each. From a business standpoint I can understand if they decide to go that route. They might take the time to make minor variations on the assets to make them look slightly different, but it would still be obvious what the variant was based on.
What I'd rather see is for assets from all races to be proliferated around to all races like it was done years ago when several hairstyles were shared between many races, usually with minor differences. In this way, every race could get a bunch of "new" assets, and it wouldn't just be Void Elves and Blood Elves sharing all their assets between them and thus reducing the distinctiveness of both.
Last edited by Kyriani; 2020-12-04 at 01:52 AM.
My friend has the book and linked me the entire Silvermoon section, and this is never stated. Shaw notes that SI:7 sometimes inserted spies within the open forum at the Bazaar to "see who was sympathetic to the Alliance," but that's all that's said. A few amusing notes though:
The leper gnome sweatshop run by the warlock and his succubus apparently got exposed and closed down.
The open forum at the Bazaar is apparently a common occurrence, and is a "usually friendly" place for shouting matches and political debates. The wording implies the court priests who, uh, influenced the flow of discussion during "dark times" are a tradition predating even TBC.
Any friends the Alliance has in Silvermoon are "higher up the ladder" than the cutthroats you might find in Murder Row and are never referred to by name, likely a nod to Narsilla Keensight/Lancer, who spies on Lor'themar for Shaw in Golden's other new book.
Quel'Danas is the "most sacred place in the world" to the blood elves. They still care for Magisters' Terrace but it has the feel of a "museum" now. They carefully tend to Kael'thas' white hawkstrider and a "rare phoenix hatchling" there, and use it to store the Sunstriders' weapons and belongings in "places of honour" too. (Shaw muses that they never really got over the Sunstrider line's ugly ending and will probably always grieve for that). Felo'melorn, Quel'Delar, and Quel'Serrar are three swords he expected to find here, but are apparently in the hands of nondescript players.
After the Sunwell was cleared, a ton of old artefacts were reclaimed, and others were donated to the blood elves anonymously. The blood elves heavily ward them to deter thieves and protect anyone stupid enough to mess around with shit that could kill them, like Apolyon. Thori'dal is in the blood elves' hands; its origins are unknown even to the sin'dorei, but its power is bound to the Sunwell. Through SI:7, the Alliance has been "secretly negotiating the return of Alleria Windrunner's headdress and the now-tattered cloak of Archmage Antonidas" because they feel these particular items should be given to the Alliance.
Last edited by Zaelsino; 2020-12-03 at 10:37 PM.
Thank you for this summary. I will admit I do not have the book, but I read earlier in this thread (and in another one in the Story forum) that there were many Alliance loyalists in Silvermoon. I guess it was just a rumor. Still, numerical disadvantage can be helped. Alleria is literally the wife of the High King, so yeah. There is also one part that intrigues me:
So the Alliance already infiltrated the higher echelons of the Thalassian government? That is very big.Any friends the Alliance has in Silvermoon are "higher up the ladder" than the cutthroats you might find in Murder Row and are never referred to by name, likely a nod to Narsilla Keensight/Lancer, who spies on Lor'themar for Shaw in Golden's other new book.
Another thing that caught my interest:
I made this claim without having read the book, and I was right. The legacy of the Sunstriders is forever tainted, and thus the legacy of Theron is tainted too. It is just inevitable. Do not forget that Theron was appointed Regent by a crazy Sunstrider. This will have an impact on public opinion for certain. Theron will forever be remembered as "that one guy who was appointed by the mad traitor Kael'thas" (who, by the way, was literally sent to the second worst hell in existence). It is a key detail that Blizzard decided to insert for a reason.(Shaw muses that they never really got over the Sunstrider line's ugly ending and will probably always grieve for that).
Finally, reclaiming Alleria's headdress by itself would be a very valid casus belli really.
Last edited by Varodoc; 2020-12-03 at 10:53 PM.
Not really. We've known for months that Shaw has spies in the retinues of the Horde leaders, and that the ones attached to Lor'themar and Gazlowe are in it for gold and parrots respectively. So far, Shaw's window into Lor'themar's affairs is a single journal entry that he can't decipher (about the high level state secret that he's getting laid). I think he needs to get better spies before this hypothetical invasion goes ahead.
... yes, I'm sure this passage was included to... somehow... besmirch and invalidate Theron's regency, and not merely commentary on how Kael's' people still grieve for him.It is a key detail that Blizzard decided to insert for a reason.
The Alliance gets the Horde's most popular race. The Horde should get the Alliance's most popular race in return. Alteraci Humans for the Horde!
I make Warcraft 3 Reforged HD custom models and I'm also an HD model reviewer.
People don't grieve him, people hate him. Kael'thas was a foolish little boy who toyed with forces he didn't comprehend.
Kael'thas was also an evil psycho, and was the one who appointed Theron. Tell me, how would the public react if the president of Germany was appointed by Hitler before he died? Exactly.
The deafeted dont get a say in what they get to keep.
Further more, the undead are now doomed, sylvanas was more than there queen, she was there only method of reproduction, without her valkyrs the undead are back to being just a temporary blight on azeroth,
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I dont think thats what shaw ment.
I think hes saying the greive for how it ended, not sunstrider him self, but the circumstance, there great downfall, there lost pride.
The reason they avoid a king and goong bavk to how they were is so a form of avoidance, you cant fall that far again if your not as high up mentality.