Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Tanaria]

Honey, I just want the Alliance made whole again, and being a faction I can be excited about. I don't hate the blood elves and don't want them destroyed, I want the horde improved too. What I have proposed both factions come off better.


Blood elves may go through a tough time in the narrative, but they come off better, they're not the only ones, orcs, trolls, goblins, forsaken all see improvements. And off course so do the alliance races, high elves, night elves, draenei, dwarves, etc.


There are some major core problems with things the way they are that will be fixed quite well by my suggestions.




I still think it's better for the alliance to be the faction for the high elves and night elves. I agree blood elves on the horde has messed things up a bit, made the factions feel too similar, and the reason for the horde's loss of identity and the alliance's general unappealing character, even to the devs.


I feel putting the high elves there, and letting the night elves shine on there and not the horde will work. In order to do this the horde elves must lose those alliance aspects in them and be built into something cool but different. There is enough



It may be a lot of work, either way, but they need to do something big to fix this issue. I suspect it will only be feasible in a world revamp. then you can make huge scene of the high elves returning, and the kaldorei getting really powerful too.


San'layn features and Illidari features become available to all blood elves too - afterall, you will be able to roleplay a fel elf and a dark fallen or san'layn elf, and they can be more than Death Knights and Demon hunters. There will be other features added to blood elves.


The whole point is not to remove blood elves from the horde, but to remove high elves and night elves from the blood elf and the Nightborne. And this includes their assets, which is why they lose Quel'thalas and Suramar - because those cities and those people and their architecture, way of life, culture are very alliance themed, they are 100% High elf and 100 % night elf - that's all alliance. This is why they are losing it. The alliance are gaining this (instead of it being destroyed like Teldrassil was) because it will majorly boos the alliance, fans will get excited about the high elves returning, and the night elves rising up as a powerful group with all their racial strengths, both arcane and nature, martial and fel.

What the Alliance wants does not come at the expense of the Horde elves losing out. It's quite simple that if Alliance gets the Eastern Kingdoms & the Broken Isles, then I'm sorry, but Horde gets Kalimdor. Nelfs are removed from Kalimdor once again and the Forsaken, Sin'dorei and Shal'dorei move in.

If you want something that's a Horde asset, then Horde takes an Alliance asset and that asset will be night elf lands and Kalimdor.

Or, Nelfs and Velfs won't be getting Suramar or Silvermoon, but instead, they will be developed in ways that are different from Sin'dorei and Shal'dorei. You just have to wait for that update...but waiting you will, as we Blood Elf fans have been waiting 14 years for an updated Quel'Thalas (for Horde players) and that hasn't happened, so again - you will have just have to wait for said update. Blood Elves and Nightborne won't be going anywhere or be changed to suit alliance fans. Blizzard haven't done this and they aren't willing to start now.

Perhaps take a leaf out of Eleann's book and come up with suggestions that actually work and don't robbing from the other faction.
A phased Zin-Azshari for the Ren'dorei as they are the elves that suit that city the most. They blend Arcane and Void together and that's all Zin-Azshari saw for 10,000 years.
Restored Darkshore and Feralas for Night Elves.

The high elf stuff on the alliance will draw hordies back to the alliance, especially if blizzard make it look good. Which is why stealth high elves via void elf customisations is not going to help much.

Alliance problem is the "Humans and Pals" story writing. Alliance story writers only know how to write humans. Look at the Alliance heroes in Oribos. They are all Humans and we're going off to try and save a Human.
You don't want to admit that problem because you want to push blame onto the Horde. It's the Horde faction's fault. It's the Horde Elves that are to blame when it's the writers for the Alliance who can't think of anything beyond "Humans and their pets."

Who was it who needed lecturing on how to fight in a forest? Oh, it was Tyrande and it was Varian who lectured her.
Who aren't capable of placing magical wards down to detect rogues in Darnassus? The Shen'dralar as it was Jaina Proudmoore who did it.
Who went to ask an 18 year old Human if they could go and attack Darkshore? Tyrande asking Anduin, who only then said "to hell with you."

This is your problem. Plus the Male Human/Female Thalassian Elf...relationships.

It's stuff like that they need to do - people love that shit, look how popular Suramar was, that's night elf stuff, give that back to the alliance in style, and you will make the alliance desirable again...but how do you expect the alliance to gain numbers if it's nicest assets like it's night elven ancient city and their community are given to the horde? Well fix it in style.. the alliance can't have Nightborne, but they can have a night elf city and if the Nightborne in it turn back into night elf thanks to the Arcan'dor that is supposed to be healing them, then problem solved.

That's you not knowing Nightborne lore.
The Arcan'dor does not return Nightborne to Night Elves. It's not that powerful. The Highborne of Suramar were ingesting a Titan Artifact. That source of magical power goes way beyond what nelf druid and nightborne mages can conjure.

The Arcan'dor can heal the Nightborne, from a Nightfallen state. It cannot undo the effects of the Eye of Aman'thul. A titan artifact will always hold it's effects, regardless of what any night elf hermit tries to do.

[Eleann]

I would kill to get some really cool new vampire features. I already believe that the DK undead skins should be made available to all blood elf classes, so you can model a darkfallen, especially if they give red eyes, same with the Fel elf, take some of those DH tones, and maybe 1 or 2 of the horns, and make them available to all

That is great. We should become one voice and suggest ideas for High elven and Void features for Void Elves, and Vampiric and Dark ranger features for Blood Elves. For the devs to make a nice story to get a city for Void Elves, either in Telogrus or Allerian Stronghold I'd suggest (not too fond of the underwater setting of zin'aszhari) and either Suramar in share with Nightborne or a unique city for Night elves.

[Tanaria]

That is great. We should become one voice and suggest ideas for High elven and Void features for Void Elves, and Vampiric and Dark ranger features for Blood Elves. For the devs to make a nice story to get a city for Void Elves, either in Telogrus or Allerian Stronghold I'd suggest (not too fond of the underwater setting of zin'aszhari) and either Suramar in share with Nightborne or a unique city for Night elves.

I think, if we're looking at a "void" expansion, then Alliance and Horde should come from separate locations.
I'd rather not have Suramar shared with the Night Elves, as the current native has them at Hyjal - it would better serve the story from BFA, if they remained on Kalimdor and rebuilt that which they lost.

Arathi and Darkshore should see this treatment from the Humans and Night Elves.

For the Alliance, I'd either say the Telgrous City (if it's big enough - at this stage, it's a bunch of floating rocks) or the Allerian Stronghold or Zin-Azshari. If Blizzard want everyone to leave to fight the void from Azeroth, then Zin-Azshari is perhaps, the viable option.
For the Horde, I'd suggest either Orgrimmar (although that might be too basic) or Suramar.

Or, they could do typical Blizzard fashion and have everyone leave to fight the void from Stormwind and Orgrimmar.

[Eleann]

I am currently advocating for Void Elven hairstyles, colours and tattoos on the forums on my ''Please give Updates to Allied Races for 9.1 thread on EU Forums. The thread is not limited to Void elves, it gives suggestions for Nightborne, LFD, Vulpera and HMT, as well as Blood elves. I will edit it to include the vampiric and dark ranger features for Blood elves that were suggested here.

I am facing some unnecessary attacks from blood elf players stating that Void elves should get no more customizations because other races need it more. We are really close to achieving playable high elves on Alliance, the only thing missing is hairstyles and colours, which should be easy to add. Whoever agrees for both Void elves and Blood elves receiving the above suggested customizations, I implore you to support my thread so we can start seeing some updates for the races mentioned in 9.1 or 9.2 and Void elves are not ignored.

We can also create a thread on the forums suggesting for a city for High elves and a city for Night elves as suggested on here but I am afraid I will be met with denial.

[Tanaria]

I am currently advocating for Void Elven hairstyles, colours and tattoos on the forums on my ''Please give Updates to Allied Races for 9.1 thread on EU Forums. The thread is not limited to Void elves, it gives suggestions for Nightborne, LFD, Vulpera and HMT, as well as Blood elves. I will edit it to include the vampiric and dark ranger features for Blood elves that were suggested here.

I am facing some unnecessary attacks from blood elf players stating that Void elves should get no more customizations because other races need it more. We are really close to achieving playable high elves on Alliance, the only thing missing is hairstyles and colours, which should be easy to add. Whoever agrees for both Void elves and Blood elves receiving the above suggested customizations, I implore you to support my thread so we can start seeing some updates for the races mentioned in 9.1 or 9.2 and Void elves are not ignored.

We can also create a thread on the forums suggesting for a city for High elves and a city for Night elves as suggested on here but I am afraid I will be met with denial.

In the recent weeks of elf talk revolving around a few alliance elf fans demanding Horde stuff, it has rubbed a lot of blood elf fans up, the wrong way.

I can't entirely blame them, when they are made out to be wrong or unpleasant people, when they are simply defending the race and faction they prefer playing. I'm sorry you've had a recent bad experience but with the ridiculous demands from a few alliance elf fans, it is to be expected.

[ravenmoon]

That is great. We should become one voice and suggest ideas for High elven and Void features for Void Elves, and Vampiric and Dark ranger features for Blood Elves. For the devs to make a nice story to get a city for Void Elves, either in Telogrus or Allerian Stronghold I'd suggest (not too fond of the underwater setting of zin'aszhari) and either Suramar in share with Nightborne or a unique city for Night elves.

Hmm, agreed. They could raise the Zin'Azshari part of Naz'jatar i.e. the zone called Naz'jatar to the surface, bear in mind that was only a fraction of the full Naz'jatar city which extended beyond the Eternal Palace raid.

For easy option night elves and Nightborne should share Suramar, it seems blizzard has gone out of their way not to make them hate each other or have reason for direct conflict - all their operations were secondary, as part of working with the horde or alliance rather than coming against each other.

The better option would be for the night elves to have their own home and the Nightborne keep Suramar, but it's more work, Zin'Azshari would make sense it is the race's place of origin afterall, they'd probably rename it to Elun'dis.

The way I see high elves is that they now exist on both factions, they exist with the blood elves through the blue eye options, so why not make it official right? They also exist with void elves too on the alliance high elves are officially involved anyway, adding options to void elves just makes them officially playable as high elves working with the ren'dorei and investigating the void - which is why htey have entropic embrace racial.

i think high elves are fine with settling in Dalaran, until void elves build a city, it should be dual city, having an appearance in the normal realm and a modified look in the void realm - blizzard should permanently fuse the destiny of high elves with void elves, at least ofr the rest of wow.. Maybe operate in bonded pairs, similar to Uraboku's bonded pairs or Shadowhunters parabatai bond.


I prefer new architecture for blood elves because they are a new entity, a void variation of high elf architecture, I like the idea of one version in the natural realm that looks quite Silvermoon like but another in the void realm. Night elves already have architecture, I think they should either do Zin'Azshari or Nar'thalas up properly. It's the same thing.

However, none of these is as effective as what I suggested, and it appears these alternatives are being considered in an attempt tnot to hurt the feelings of people like Tanaria. T hey will be hurt, but only for a little while, like a kid who cries when his favourite toy is taken from him, not realising that it was done to make things better - solve imbalances in his play group and later he gets an even cooler version of the toy he lost, so while he was upset for a little while, that sorrow turns to joy later.

We cannot be afraid of doing necessary things because some players don't like that.. well developers shouldn't be, fans can sit down and work out compromises between themselves, a dev has to make necessary decisions, even more drastic ones that might be unpopular iwhen they are required to fix problems and imbalances but their duty to ensure in the long run, where he takes everyone would be enjoyed by all

- - - Updated - - -

In the recent weeks of elf talk revolving around a few alliance elf fans demanding Horde stuff, it has rubbed a lot of blood elf fans up, the wrong way.

I can't entirely blame them, when they are made out to be wrong or unpleasant people, when they are simply defending the race and faction they prefer playing. I'm sorry you've had a recent bad experience but with the ridiculous demands from a few alliance elf fans, it is to be expected.

It shouldn't rub you the wrong way, it wasn't meant to, if you look at it objectively it's not about trying to steal your stuff, that is not the motivation. It's aimed at creating a better future for both factions, this involves some loss, but that loss can be easily regained down the line.

The logic is lose the high elf and night elf portions amongst the horde, abut replace it with better later. Meanwhile use the stuff brought back to the alliance to make it so much better.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

i
I'm not here to stroke egos, but to state my opinions, share my thoughts. If you don't like the manner I share them and hate them for it no matter how much sense they make, then that's your problem.

I think the issue is that you think they make perfect sense and dismiss everyone who contests that supposition.

Honestly if it wasn't for the verbosity, yeah it might be easier to read your posts, but still wouldn't change the underlying issue of the nonsense of your arguments, like "elves are intrinsically alliance"

You know Tanaria, the original alliance of humans, high elves and dwarves is a very powerful fantasy a lot of people like. Just because you & @MyWholeLifeIsThunder and @Alanar don't care for it, doesn't mean it is less valid or less popular. Just because it shares that with Lotr also doesn't make it any less appealing either even if you pour scorn over that. It is a powerful trio in many fantasies a lot of people love, and is a Warcraft core. Just because you don't agree doesn't change this.

@Mace uhm, I like that too? Like just because I think the idea of removing BE identity from the Horde to force a dichotomy between the factions is bad, doesn't mean I don't enjoy some aspects of the alliance evoking a LotR like feeling.

Like, is nuance just too expensive these days or what?

All these arguments about blood elves not being alliance themed are just attempts to deny the validity of the claims and desires of these people because to acknowledge so would mean to accept this is part of a problem and would necessitate the fix you don't like.. which is removing the high elven alliance themes and aspects from the blood elves and the night elven civilization form the Nightborne to complete.

But then you fall in the same nonsense argument of "blood elves are alliance themed" when, again, that's a downright shallow assessment you and Ravenmoon keep presenting as an intrinsic fact so it requires no explanation. And that's just dumb dude. The level of shallow thinking to further the idea that a race belongs to a faction because of aesthetics rather than politics and ideology is just a blatant demand to dumb down the game.

No, it's not "necessary and a good thing", it's just your very dumb opinion that dumbing down the setting to looks will somehow fix everything.

And this being WoW, mind you, a setting not known for its depth already, so it's baffling that people like you want to deny any progression and evolution of the setting for a more cookie cutter approach where you don't even have to consider that the same race might have different politics.

Like I am sorry, but when your idea of augmenting faction identity comes at the expense of the evolution of the setting, for no other reason than your own personal appeal, that's just a bad idea rooted on shallow traditionalism who is simply dismissive of change.

- - - Updated - - -

In the recent weeks of elf talk revolving around a few alliance elf fans demanding Horde stuff, it has rubbed a lot of blood elf fans up, the wrong way.

I can't entirely blame them, when they are made out to be wrong or unpleasant people, when they are simply defending the race and faction they prefer playing. I'm sorry you've had a recent bad experience but with the ridiculous demands from a few alliance elf fans, it is to be expected.

Yeah but we can't justify nonsense with nonsense. Like I know Ravenmoon and Mace's dumb premises is something you have responded with dumb premises of your own, but that kinda devalues the whole conversation.

Just because some people have very bad takes about the Horde loosing stuff does it mean people can justify their own bad takes againt the alliance.

[Beloren]

That is great. We should become one voice and suggest ideas for High elven and Void features for Void Elves, and Vampiric and Dark ranger features for Blood Elves. For the devs to make a nice story to get a city for Void Elves, either in Telogrus or Allerian Stronghold I'd suggest (not too fond of the underwater setting of zin'aszhari) and either Suramar in share with Nightborne or a unique city for Night elves.

Indeed. To me, character customisations are far more important than who owns what city, we have no use for cities in game, it's pure vanity and bragging rights at this stge.

Truth is both factions can visit both cities. If Quel'thalas goes alliance, horde will still have access to it as starting zone for Belves or time travel, whiles everyone still has access to Suramar.

If the alliance needs a big show for the high elves returning to boost its numbers and diminish how alliance the horde feels, then it's worth doing if it would achieve that, afterall, blood elves can always get it back later on.. because these assets aren't relevant to the game in the current timeline, only in the one you met them in. So it's just a tool you can use to mind control players into moving from one faction to the other and boost your faction transfer fees or longer subscription periods.

I am happy with any and all of your options - as long as horde don't' lose blood elves, and get some cool new features, I'll enjoy the ride wherever it goes.

[FossilFree]

Night Elves should rebuild in Val'sharah. Now that the Emerald Nightmare has been defeated, I see no reason for them not to reclaim and renew those lands. Black Rook Hold would make a fine new citadel capital, and it's right outside Shaladrassil. I don't think anywhere would top that location for Night Elves, even Suramar.

For Void Elves, they could just build a city in Telogrus, but Allerian Stronghold is also a very logical choice, especially if they are rejoining with their High Elf kin now. What I think would be cooler than either is to set up in Mac'Aree or even on the Void Ethereal homeworld somewhere.

[ravenmoon]

Night Elves should rebuild in Val'sharah. Now that the Emerald Nightmare has been defeated, I see no reason for them not to reclaim and renew those lands. Black Rook Hold would make a fine new citadel capital, and it's right outside Shaladrassil. I don't think anywhere would top that location for Night Elves, even Suramar.

For Void Elves, they could just build a city in Telogrus, but Allerian Stronghold is also a very logical choice, especially if they are rejoining with their High Elf kin now. What I think would be cooler than either is to set up in Mac'Aree or even on the Void Ethereal homeworld somewhere.

Easiest option would be for nighte lves to have Suramar as their new capital, Shlaadrassil their world tree. Highborne/Moonguard types in Suramar, Pirests in cathedral of Eternal night and the other 2 temples (1 in val'sharah, 1 in Azsuna).Farondis Highborne in Azsuna, Wardens in WArden Vault, Sentinels in Black Rook hold, night elven illidari on Broken shore.

It's got everything that bleongs to nighte lf history.

Thing is the nightborne are as ubset of that histoyr, they are a nighte lf sub-race, which is an alliance race, but on the horde, if you're okay with horde having allianec themes andand races in alliance themed cultures and civlizations, then Nightborne wcould either

Solution 1
a) share with night elves in Suramar, which means Suramar is effectively neutral, some Nightborne favour horde, others favour alliance, playable modles are horde only, while some Nightborne are healed by arcan'dor into night elves (some magically accelerating theprocess because they like their original apeparance) and thus favour them.


Solution 2:
Blizzard builds night elves a new capital, - Zin'Azshari type architecture - so basically NAr'thalas in Azsuna or zin'Azshari in Naz'jatar could make potential sites, Nightborne keep Suramar, nighte lves have new capital.

Solution 3:
Most Nightborne become night elves due to the Arcan'dor and join up with the alliance - growing disgust at the horde's War of thorns, friendships with isle kaldorei like Farodin and hteMoonguard, Highborne friendships amongst hte Darnassians, human and highe lven wizards from dalaran, gnomes and lightforged draenei, and to top it all off, when the blood elves in quel'thalas turn blue, boom. Suramar is alliance, except for a small group of Nightborne

These Nightborne consider the kaldorei a failure and despise their former appearance, they're more interested in conquering not defendig, and they view the alliance as weak, and the horde as strong. They join the other remnant blood elves who didn't turn back to their high elven ways, they remain on the horde, seeking new magics and means (which they find).


The game needs solution 3 the most as it is the only option the horde loses alliance themes form their nightborne.
The quarelling forum fans would welcome solution 2 the most - note I said forum fans, as it is the one that will have the least arguments. It is also the most expensive.
The cheapest solution is solution 1, it requires the least effort, but it won't achieve other objectives as well as solution 3 will.

[Eleann]

Anyone who knows how we can directly contact Blizzard or their artwork team to suggest the aforementioned changes?

We are all agreeing on a lot of things so far, which I'm very happy about. To summarise:

- Void elf customizations that represent High elves: Void elves get high elven features such as white, blonde (x1 light blonde and x1 blonde with two dark blue, shiny highlights on it for the voidy theme, black and pastel pink hair colours, some hairstyles, and maybe Alleria's tattoos.

- Blood elf customizations that represent Dark Rangers and Vampires: Pale, undead skin tones and red, glowing eyes for the Dark Ranger look, and fangs, vampiric makeup and wings during combat proc for the Sun'Layn look.

- A Void Elf city: Either expand and develop Telogrus into a High Elven city where Silver covenant High elves, and Void Elves, reside together (which is a beautiful but very limited creation atm) or move to Allerian Stronghold and expand and develop that into a city for the Void elves.

-A Night elf city: Either move into Suramar and share a sector of it with the Nightborne, or re-build their own, unique, modern city in Ashenvale, Feralas or Zin'Aszhari (does not matter too much where that will be). Getting their own city will not be a negative thing, since Night elves are a proud civilization who I think would rather have a glorious place of their own, re-built from scratch, rather than share with others.

[Beloren]

Anyone who knows how we can directly contact Blizzard or their artwork team to suggest the aforementioned changes?

We are all agreeing on a lot of things so far, which I'm very happy about. To summarise:

- Void elf customizations that represent High elves: Void elves get high elven features such as white, blonde (x1 light blonde and x1 blonde with two dark blue, shiny highlights on it for the voidy theme, black and pastel pink hair colours, some hairstyles, and maybe Alleria's tattoos.

- Blood elf customizations that represent Dark Rangers and Vampires: Pale, undead skin tones and red, glowing eyes for the Dark Ranger look, and fangs, vampiric makeup and wings during combat proc for the Sun'Layn look.

- A Void Elf city: Either expand and develop Telogrus into a High Elven city where Silver covenant High elves, and Void Elves, reside together (which is a beautiful but very limited creation atm) or move to Allerian Stronghold and expand and develop that into a city for the Void elves.

-A Night elf city: Either move into Suramar and share a sector of it with the Nightborne, or re-build their own, unique, modern city in Ashenvale, Feralas or Zin'Aszhari (does not matter too much where that will be). Getting their own city will not be a negative thing, since Night elves are a proud civilization who I think would rather have a glorious place of their own, re-built from scratch, rather than share with others.

Easiest option: Blizzard do nothing. Why bother to improve huh, things aren't that bad anyway.

Next Easiest option? Suramar becomes new Elven central capital. Night elf, Nightborne, Highborne Void elf, High elf - all chill there Silvermoon remains unchanged. = blizz can shake things a little for the players, maybe make them a bit hopeful.

Decent thing to do, would be to make alliance void elves and night elves something special with high elves and Highborne being smaller groups involved with them. If I would do it, I' have a small pre-sundering type city for the night elves, with a huge cathedral and a huge forest. With the void elves.

Ravenmoon's option would be to flip it upside down, Silvermoon and Suramar go to the high elves and night elves, with void elves and Highborne and all things elven - that is night elven and high elven based on the alliance. New homes for Blood elves and Nightborne instead this time, new architecture, new customisations.

[Tanaria]

Yeah but we can't justify nonsense with nonsense. Like I know Ravenmoon and Mace's dumb premises is something you have responded with dumb premises of your own, but that kinda devalues the whole conversation.

Just because some people have very bad takes about the Horde loosing stuff does it mean people can justify their own bad takes againt the alliance.

For me, it's been a response. I've got my own ideas on how to make Night Elves and Void Elves shine.

For Night Elves:
Continue the story after the Battle for Darkshore. It feels quite pointless to claim Darkshore and then move to Hyjal. I think the ruins of Mathystra could be restored and that new city, combined with both old "Darnassus" like features as well as the new "Highborne" features could be included. The city can also be designed to have an Auction House, Bank, Class and Profession Trainers, Vendors, Mount Trainers for Night Elves and Worgen etc etc.

I'd go on to say that the city should be expanded to Bashal'Aran, but the further you go down, the more "Sentinel/Druidic" the city becomes. The higher points are more lavish and Highborne-like. I think Night Elf RP'ers would love something like that because they can finally walk and RP around Highborne buildings, without the constant annoyance of "For the Queen!!" or "For Queen Azshara!!"

Auberdine could be rebuilt as a the new port-town, which is also connected to Mathystra. Ameth'Aran could be in the stages of being rebuilt and perhaps this could be primarily used by the Worgen and Gilneans.
Now this would also be the time when Eldre'Thalas is rebuilt. Ravenmoon is right when he says Blizzard should do some bold things and one thing they should do is remove the Dire Maul:West dungeon and add it to the Azerothian Map. (This was where the Shen'dralar NPC's were located.)

The other two wings would still be dungeons. The East could be a fight between Highborne/Night Elf Magi and the Void. The North could continue the fight against the Ogres. Pushing them out of the city once and for all.

A portal could connect Eldre'Thalas to Mathystra.

I'd also say that the Horde are primarily removed from Feralas, but the Alliance are equally primarily removed from the Southern Barrens.
The Horde could work with a Nightborne Mage or Tauren Druid, in the two Dire Maul dungeons, to help in the fight against the Void spreading and the Ogres causing more damage.

The Void Elves:
We've got some options with this.
They could move to Outland and join with Auric Sunchaser and expand the Allerian Stronghold. This could be where we see Auric and Alleria unite and a portal is established between the Allerian Stronghold and Stormwind.
The Scryer Blood Elves could serve as a neutral party between the Void Elves and High Elves on Outland and with the Silvermoon Blood Elves in Quel'Thalas. A semi-Thalassian unification, but with the former still on the Alliance and the latter still on the Horde. Voren'thal the Seer would remain a neutral body.

The Void Elves could be helping to stop Outland from disintegrating slowly into the Void, as what we have been told before. Perhaps they could work with the Draenei and High Elves and Alliance players could see this done.

The other option, which is more about the Void Elves embracing their Void and Arcane mastery would be Zin-Azshari. The city ruins have seen nothing but the void and arcane for 10,000 years. It's possible, due to the Void Elves being the risk takers that they are, they find some comfort in the city. Plus, it being the city of their ancestors - it's quite poetic that the Highborne descendants are the ones that reclaim the city for the Alliance. To prevent them from drowning, they could weave and create their own "Ban'dinoriel" which not only protects them from the waves of the ocean, but also keeps the eyes of the void away from their practices.

Perhaps the Temple of Elune in Zin-Azshari, could be their main base of operations. It's also possible that the area of strong arcane magic where Azshara was holding the waters at bay could be where the Ren'dorei start their incantations to create a barrier.

Or the other option is they expand on the Void Rift that they've got at the moment, which is also possible.

[ravenmoon]

For me, it's been a response. I've got my own ideas on how to make Night Elves and Void Elves shine.

For Night Elves:
Continue the story after the Battle for Darkshore. It feels quite pointless to claim Darkshore and then move to Hyjal. I think the ruins of Mathystra could be restored and that new city, combined with both old "Darnassus" like features as well as the new "Highborne" features could be included. The city can also be designed to have an Auction House, Bank, Class and Profession Trainers, Vendors, Mount Trainers for Night Elves and Worgen etc etc.

I'd go on to say that the city should be expanded to Bashal'Aran, but the further you go down, the more "Sentinel/Druidic" the city becomes. The higher points are more lavish and Highborne-like. I think Night Elf RP'ers would love something like that because they can finally walk and RP around Highborne buildings, without the constant annoyance of "For the Queen!!" or "For Queen Azshara!!"

Auberdine could be rebuilt as a the new port-town, which is also connected to Mathystra. Ameth'Aran could be in the stages of being rebuilt and perhaps this could be primarily used by the Worgen and Gilneans.
Now this would also be the time when Eldre'Thalas is rebuilt. Ravenmoon is right when he says Blizzard should do some bold things and one thing they should do is remove the Dire Maul:West dungeon and add it to the Azerothian Map. (This was where the Shen'dralar NPC's were located.)

The other two wings would still be dungeons. The East could be a fight between Highborne/Night Elf Magi and the Void. The North could continue the fight against the Ogres. Pushing them out of the city once and for all.

A portal could connect Eldre'Thalas to Mathystra.

I'd also say that the Horde are primarily removed from Feralas, but the Alliance are equally primarily removed from the Southern Barrens.
The Horde could work with a Nightborne Mage or Tauren Druid, in the two Dire Maul dungeons, to help in the fight against the Void spreading and the Ogres causing more damage.

The Void Elves:
We've got some options with this.
They could move to Outland and join with Auric Sunchaser and expand the Allerian Stronghold. This could be where we see Auric and Alleria unite and a portal is established between the Allerian Stronghold and Stormwind.
The Scryer Blood Elves could serve as a neutral party between the Void Elves and High Elves on Outland and with the Silvermoon Blood Elves in Quel'Thalas. A semi-Thalassian unification, but with the former still on the Alliance and the latter still on the Horde. Voren'thal the Seer would remain a neutral body.

The Void Elves could be helping to stop Outland from disintegrating slowly into the Void, as what we have been told before. Perhaps they could work with the Draenei and High Elves and Alliance players could see this done.

The other option, which is more about the Void Elves embracing their Void and Arcane mastery would be Zin-Azshari. The city ruins have seen nothing but the void and arcane for 10,000 years. It's possible, due to the Void Elves being the risk takers that they are, they find some comfort in the city. Plus, it being the city of their ancestors - it's quite poetic that the Highborne descendants are the ones that reclaim the city for the Alliance. To prevent them from drowning, they could weave and create their own "Ban'dinoriel" which not only protects them from the waves of the ocean, but also keeps the eyes of the void away from their practices.

Perhaps the Temple of Elune in Zin-Azshari, could be their main base of operations. It's also possible that the area of strong arcane magic where Azshara was holding the waters at bay could be where the Ren'dorei start their incantations to create a barrier.

Or the other option is they expand on the Void Rift that they've got at the moment, which is also possible.

If you ask me, blizzard should abandon the horde elf direction. Develop the elves on the allinace purely and focus original horde races for the hordeand give the horde new unique non-alliance based races.

But failing that, they should at least stop writing the blood elves and Nightborne in that high elf and night elf civilization direction, because it's alliance themed and based.


1. Develop night elves properly, don't try to shoe horn them into just one forest sect expression, restore them to their original vision of a faction capable race, with multiple detailed aspects, their pre-sundering arcane mage/priest expression, and their long vigil druid/sentinel/demon hunter - rather than keep the Nightborne to develop as the kaldorei civilization and the kaldorei as the long vigil, convert most of the Nightborne to night elves let the kaldorei have both their pre-sundering and long vigil aspects and take the remaining Nightborne who didn't want to heal back into night elves in a new directions.

2. Develop the high elves and void elves properly. No more keeping blood elves in that high elf manner and culture/identity, restore blood elves to the original direction they were going in TFT to classic - an anti hero, bad boy, tough guy desperate elf group, willing to do anything to gain power or survive. Blood crystals, Nether arcane, fel, vampirism/undeath (think San'layn/darkfallen). Expand that for them. Meanwhile let the high elves be re-established and create a new bond between void elves and high elves - I like the idea of bonded pairs, pairing of a high elf and a void elf that increases their power because the void and light react to each other - the high elf partner serves as a tether for the void elf, greatly increasing his sanity and allowing him to use much more of the void, while in the high elf, the light reacts to the void in the partner intensifying it's power.. This is just a suggestion off course of creatively involving the two elves.

If it is kaldorei lore based or high elf lore based it should be on the alliance. Let the horde be divorced from that aspect of the elves. Let its main focus be orcs/trolls/tauren/goblins/ forsaken and pandas/vulpera - not high elves and night elves, and of its remaining blood elves and Nightborne let something cool but non-alliance, non high elf/night elf themed be developed for them.


The problem in wow is maintaining these very alliance themed elves on the horde, it's hurting the alliance by taking the shine away from them and hurting the horde by making the faction look too alliance. There are other options. Blood elves don't need to be all high elfy anymore nor do the horde need to have a high elf kingdom and city, nord o the Nightborne need to be so kaldorei Highborne/arcane like - these are alliance themes. The horde doesn't need them. Do something new and interesting, but different with the horde elves, and let the horde show case orcs/tauren, trolls/goblins, pandas/vulpera, forsaken - and blood elves that fit it, with Nightborne.

Let the Alliance Carry their High & Night Elf themes - let that Elf lore Come Home
Do this and you will see the alliance popularity and reputation/image shoot up while the horde will continue to remain an attractive destination, offering another type of unique and cool. horde keep the models. So, no blood elves don't lose their models, in fact they just get more features added to represent the fel elf influence, darkfallen/san'layn influence, nether magic and blood crystal influence. Nightborne models are unchanged, the Nightborne on the alliance are all mostly night elven now thanks to the Arcan'dor, so the alliance don't get Nightborne models, instead they get some customisations like an alternative to vines for hair (say stars and arcane glowing strands), they also get added some arcane tattoos similar to the Nightborne but different patterns (maybe star constellations) to their tattoo roster andoption to have hands and feet glowing with arcane power.


Both horde and alliance can come off better and cool. Alliance get their elven legacy back and focused on them, but horde get their focus back on their core races and the horde elves can develop into that cool anti hero and dangerous elf. Something not tied to the alliance elves.


Alliance Elves:

High elf stuff:
Magisters
Farstriders
Priests
Paladins

Quel'thalas, Silvermoon etc

Night elf stuff:
Druids
Mage - Highborne & Moonguard
Priest - Moon Priests
Demon Hunters
Sentinels and Wardens

Western Broken Isles incl Suramar, Western Kalimdor

Horde Elves
There is less focus on elves on the horde than on the alliance, but what is on the horde is remoulded to be different.


Blood elves:
Blood Crystal magic and addiction
Nether magic development
Fel magic development - blood elf illidari and fel elves from Outland become further developed
Vampirism and Undeath - Darkfallen and San'layn wing to the blood elves

Main themes: Anti hero, vengeful, power hungry, addiction, reckless but in a cool way.
Netherstorm, Hellfire Peninsula, Azshara and Bloodmyst isles
New architecture - darker callers, reds, Castle Nathria type.

Nightborne:
Chronomagic
Telemancy magic
Naga influence

Nightborne work hand in hand with blood elves, Nightborne that remain on the horde aren't nice guys. Thalyssra went alliance/neutral, Elisande returns (via her echoes and some time magic by those who remained Nightborne and didn't follow Suramar)

Nightborne believe they should be ruling, and the world not only needs them but should have them. The horde is their instrument to bring order - Nightborne have a naga connection that can be developed down the line. Whiles the blood elves continue to obsess on magical power mainly, the Nightborne focus more on political and global power for their group.

Not all are like that, you get some cool Nightborne and blood elf characters that show or reflect the reality that Belves were a little hard done by and unjustly treated (from their point of view) and they blame the alliance

[Tanaria]

SNIP

Ravenmoon is: Take, take, take, take, take.
My actual ideas involve alliance races actually being able to expand without a hindrance on the Horde player experience.
All your ideas are is taking from the Horde and the Alliance faction, basically dominating Azeroth - which they shouldn't be.

As Eleann has said, Blizzard are not going to take Blood Elves and Nightborne out of their cities. Focus on things that are more likely to happen. Horde Elf players won't be playing second-fiddle to Alliance players. We don't deserve it and Blizzard won't do it. Blatantly unfair requests won't pass the basics of the lore development team.

It's time you got over Suramar. It's not Alliance, by lore standards. Night Elves made pretty sure of that - all of this is about you wanting Suramar and wanting to find any and every avenue you can possibly find to make sure that happens, well it's not. Suramar belongs to the Horde and the Nightborne.

You've got the changed "Blood Elves" in the Alliance and they are called "Void Elves." They are already different from Blood Elves and Helfs aren't playable as their own separate race (Blizzard have already said that allied races were a BFA feature and the new Sin'dorei and Ren'dorei features basically make certain that High Elves are playable...but through the two Thalassian races that are playable.
Again - Ren'dorei are the difference from the Horde Sin'dorei. Sin'dorei don't need changing.

Farstriders are the ones who brought the Blood Elves into the Horde
Magisters are a blood elf thing with fire and blood magical practices
Blood Knights are a core Blood Elf thing.

Again, if you want Horde lands - you give up Night Elf lands on Western Kalimdor and they go to the Horde Elves.

And your blatantly not listening to the lore.
The Arcan'dor does not restore Nightborne to Night Elves - It's not that powerful. A night elf hermit tree cannot undo the powers of the Eye of Aman'thul. Elisande is also dead, in case you haven't noticed.

Stop making up new lore that makes no sense and hurts the Blood Elves and Nightborne fans.

I'm just counting my lucky stars that Blizzard are more likely to implement my suggestions than to ever implement yours.

[Eleann]

There will always be personal opinions that might differ to others. The fact ravenmoon suggests a different kind of lore is just that, an opinion.

We should focus on what we agree upon, and on the least harmful results for each faction.

Also, one more very important thing I would like to emphasise. Let us not mix the ''we want High elves on Alliance'' with the ''we need to make Alliance more appealing''. Frankly, the ultimate solution to the imbalance problem is not to significantly boost one faction over the other, but for devs to add a system in the game (already exists for same factions) to allow cross-faction gameplay. Dungeons and raids. They could even unite the two factions fully (which I advocate for) but it's not necessary for the two to play together.

Now, onto our topics. I think it is well evident that whatever gets added to the game, is never removed (yep those nightmarish mechagnomes have come to stay lool). So Nightborne's faction will not be changed. They went to Horde to stay there. Ofc their models and customizations will get an update because they were incredibly rushed, but their faction will not change.

I wholeheartedly support the idea of pushing blood elves towards the darker Dark ranger and Sun'Layn theme, with glowing red eyes, fangs, vampire wings, pale skin, all that. Do not worry, their high elf characteristics will not be removed. As mentioned before whatever is added, stays. It would be a frigging great idea to transform the blood elves into cool badasses.

And on their part Void elves will receive customization options for their hair to be able to look High elven. White, Blonde, Black, pastel pink, and a void blonde (two dark blue highlights running along their hair). They will also build a city in Telogrus or Allerian stronghold.

Night elves could probably share Suramar with Nightborne, or, in my opinion, even better, build their own glorious city back from scratch (they are prideful beings after all).

[Tanaria]

I wholeheartedly support the idea of pushing blood elves towards the darker Dark ranger and Sun'Layn theme, with glowing red eyes, fangs, vampire wings, pale skin, all that. Do not worry, their high elf characteristics will not be removed. As mentioned before whatever is added, stays. It would be a frigging great idea to transform the blood elves into cool badasses.

Night elves could probably share Suramar with Nightborne, or, in my opinion, even better, build their own glorious city back from scratch (they are prideful beings after all).

I think adding the red eyes and showing a union in the game between the Dark Rangers and Farstriders, perhaps seeking to drive out the remnant Cult of the Damned would a very good way.
It would be a capital idea to bring these two back together.

And for Night Elves:
I think they need to build their own city on Western Kalimdor. Either Hyjal or Darkshore would work. The latter would be a follow on from the BFA storyline.
That's not to say the Battle for Darkshore instance wouldn't be playable...it would, but the region itself would be primarily belong to the Alliance with a new introduction starting in the very North of Darkshore.

[ravenmoon]

@Eleann I've just come to view it as well, "off" , that the horde should be so focused on elves or have so much of elves about it or on it.

And it's not only that it's elves, it's the alliance brand of elves. At some point I began to ask myself, hang on a sec.. why? it does kinda make the horde like the alliance, Almost like a place an alliance type player can go to and experience the alliance on the horde.

if that was the case, why were the best things about the elves going to the horde? It wasn't and isn't helping the alliance at all.

I realised, ofc, the alliance is never going to be as attractive as the horde if the horde continues to sport the best version of what the alliance is about.

Think about it, you have humans, but prettier humans on the horde
you have human like civilization type cities, arcane magic and culture but a better version on the horde.

These are the things the alliance is based on, the alliance is not going to be popular against the horde as long as these things are sitting on the horde. The horde does the alliance better than the alliance because o f the high elf stuff and night elf civilization stuff. They literally gave the best aspects of the alliance to the horde. Who needs the alliance?

Maybe this is what horde elf fans don't want to lose. If the high elf and night elf stuff goes back, they're going to need the alliance to experience that.. and they don't want to, they want it all on the horde. But this is neither good for the alliance, nor good for the horde or the game. No one wants to lose stuff they like I get that, but I fele this is necessary. It's not being destroyed like Teldrassil, it's just going to the other faction.

Besides it's not getting rid of blood elves or Nightborne, this is the compromise, the horde keeps those races, they just lose the alliance flair they have and not be so prominent until they can become something more distinct.


Not many people would dare suggest something like this because it will draw the ire of wow's most vocal group, the horde elf fan base, and they will verbally crucify you, like they are doing with me, but it's got to be said. It is the obvious solution no one wants to consider. The problem no one wants to admit (on the horde) or dares to because of retribution and backlash from said horde elf crowd (on the alliance). But this is what needs to happen.

[Vaedan]

I think adding the red eyes and showing a union in the game between the Dark Rangers and Farstriders, perhaps seeking to drive out the remnant Cult of the Damned would a very good way.
It would be a capital idea to bring these two back together.

And for Night Elves:
I think they need to build their own city on Western Kalimdor. Either Hyjal or Darkshore would work. The latter would be a follow on from the BFA storyline.
That's not to say the Battle for Darkshore instance wouldn't be playable...it would, but the region itself would be primarily belong to the Alliance with a new introduction starting in the very North of Darkshore.

I'd like to see that happen too. It's about time Horde players have their option to play Dark Rangers, it's been part of the faction from its early days. San'layn also mix well with both Forsaken and Sin'dorei. Velonara made it also clear she still considers blood elves her people and we've seen dark rangers being eager to defend Quel'thalas as well.

As for night elves, capital in Hyjal is very likely to happen, given they relocated here from Stormwind (thank gods!), but it probably means druids of Horde races were kicked out. I really missed any official note from Cenarion Circle regarding Burning of Teldrassil and the fact that Horde attempted to kill a leader of Cenarion Circle, but I guess this will be forgotten. Anyway, with Tyrande's lust for vengeance, I can't really imagine tauren and troll druids would be welcome in the place of new kaldorei capital.

[ravenmoon]

@Vaedan, @Tanaria , @Eleann

Some definitely don't like or want to hear what I'm saying, it seems far too radical for the status quo, but really it isn't that radical, but rather necessary and logical. And when you really think about it, we've had far more radical anyway.

What I'm suggesting would actually really help the alliance, and it won't destroy the horde but would help it,, especially in the long run, yes the horde loses something, but it will also gain things, including it's identity. The horde isn't losing the blood elves or Nightborne as playable, this development won't destroy the horde.

However it will make the alliance the go to place for those who want to experience that side of elven culture, want to experience all things high elf or all things night elf - that's the alliance for you. this is how it should be and this is one of the attractions of the alliance. If you give the alliance's attractions to the horde, do not be surprised that the horde remains more popular than the alliance, it really is that simple.

Whiles you could give the alliance more elf-alliance themed stuff than the horde, it is less logical and effective than removing the alliance aspects in the horde and the horde elves. People don't want to lose stuff, but the horde cannot continue to have the best alliance features and lore cultures and expect the alliance to be okay with it - the horde will constantly be ahead and more popular than the alliance if this continues. The game needs both factions equally popular, and loved for their own unique identity, this is what they should seek to re-establish, and if it means doing a move that horde elf fans wouldn't like, this shouldn't stop them, you can't please everyone, do things that need to be done for the good of your game.