Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

she herself recognizes that the dark ranger are loyal to the forsaken in that line.

COME ON DUDE

Both the sin'dorei and Forsaken are my kin. I stand with them, and with the Horde

You are unbelievable.

if calia is going to be the new leader forsaken that is a no-brainer now he is one of the leaders and clearly the dark rangers are under the command of calia now.

That's literally speculation on your part. But dismissing literal lore and making up your own is like, your MO.

[Rhlor]

I think the part where warlocks were introduced as one of the BE classes in contrast to every other HE depiction before them, and are you know, still a class and thus part of BE identity, is kinda obvious.

warlocks are part of the human identity?

high elf warlock

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

warlocks are part of the human identity?

high elf warlock

Nah man, I'm done with you, If all you keep doing is jumping to the next point when you get called out on your inaccuracies, arguing with you is pointless.

Also YES, warlocks ARE part of human identity, the difference is we get told several times how they have to be on the DL about. Thing that never is done with BE's.

And let's play the sampler game then, and let's say the number of Warlock NPC's for high elves and blood elves is proportional to their in universe numbers.

So I'm sure that one High Elf warlock is proportionally the same than all the BE warlocks.

[Tanaria]

I understood. My issue with your argument is that you keep denying its visible role by calling it stuff like "niche".

But what visible role? Shinfel may have been part of the Sanctum before joining the Black Harvest, but we don't know. As far as we can see, she's just a powerful Blood Elf Warlock of the Black Harvest.

Please don't confuse the Sunfury actions to the general practices within Silvermoon. What was going on, on Outland - the Silvermoon Blood Elves had no true idea about, until the Felblood Elves and Kael'thas attacked the Silvermoon Blood Knights and stole back M'uru. It was the Magisters of Quel'thalas who put the Fel-Crystals in place around the land, but as far as I know, the Magisters were all Mages of varying degrees. (Blood Magi, Sunreaver Mages, Leykeepers.)

Unless I missed something, ever since their introduction, Silvermoon Blood Elf Warlocks have never been used nor seen, for anything, other than seeing them for the Sin'dorei heritage armor questline and that was at the very end.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

But what visible role? Shinfel may have been part of the Sanctum before joining the Black Harvest, but we don't know. As far as we can see, she's just a powerful Blood Elf Warlock of the Black Harvest.

Please don't confuse the Sunfury actions to the general practices within Silvermoon. What was going on, on Outland - the Silvermoon Blood Elves had no idea about, until the Felblood Elves and Kael'thas attacked the Silvermoon Blood Knights and stole back M'uru.

Unless I missed something, ever since their introduction, Silvermoon Blood Elf Warlocks have never been used nor seen, for anything, other than seeing them for the Sin'dorei heritage armor questline and that was at the very end.

I'm not even talking about the Sunfury, I'm talking about the like 5 Warlock BE followers we had in WoD, specifically Aeda Brightdawn, a BE Warlock that literally was on route to helping Lady Liadrin in Auchindoun before joining our garrison.

https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Aeda_Brightdawn

[Rhlor]

Nah man, I'm done with you, If all you keep doing is jumping to the next point when you get called out on your inaccuracies, arguing with you is pointless.

Also YES, warlocks ARE part of human identity, the difference is we get told several times how they have to be on the DL about. Thing that never is done with BE's.

And let's play the sampler game then, and let's say the number of Warlock NPC's for high elves and blood elves is proportional to their in universe numbers.

So I'm sure that one High Elf warlock is proportionally the same than all the BE warlocks.

I see more void elves warlocks helping the void elves cause in BFA than blood elves warlocks because I literally don't see any.

about the dark ranger yes she names the blood elves and the forsaken but once again the dark ranger are always at the service of the forsaken never at any time did anything for quelthalas, instead they were sylvanas loyalists.

[Tanaria]

I'm not even talking about the Sunfury, I'm talking about the like 5 Warlock BE followers we had in WoD, specifically Aeda Brightdawn, a BE Warlock that literally was on route to helping Lady Liadrin in Auchindoun before joining our garrison.

https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Aeda_Brightdawn

I know about Aeda, but I'm unsure about the others - unless they were just random named NPCs from the Inn. I don't truly count them as they would race swap, if you race swapped your character. So those other blood elf warlocks would become Human, dwarf, gnome or Worgen if you race swapped to the Alliance.

So we have 1 true canon Blood Elf Warlock - okay...who else? I've named Shinfel Blightsworn of the Black Harvest, but unless I look at the names of those within the Sanctum of Silvermoon, I honestly can't think of any other blood elf warlocks, barring Elynara who is the Archaeology trainer in Silvermoon.

I think this is down to Blizzard wanting the Blood Elves to take on the "Blood Magi" thing, as we saw in Nazmir. Blood Magic is just more their thing than fel magic, which is fine because they are called "blood" elves. So studying "blood magic" to the nth degree does seem fitting.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

I see more void elves warlocks helping the void elves cause in BFA than blood elves warlocks because I literally don't see any.

about the dark ranger yes she names the blood elves and the forsaken but once again the dark ranger are always at the service of the forsaken never at any time did anything for quelthalas, instead they were sylvanas loyalists.

"I mean I know it's the lore that's being literally shown but I chose to believe otherwise"

[Rhlor]

I'm not even talking about the Sunfury, I'm talking about the like 5 Warlock BE followers we had in WoD, specifically Aeda Brightdawn, a BE Warlock that literally was on route to helping Lady Liadrin in Auchindoun before joining our garrison.

https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Aeda_Brightdawn

really? are we going to have to understand that some followers for the mission table in an expansion that nobody liked shows us the warlocks as a fundamental part of the blood elf identity?

blood knight, ranger, magister even deathpath (rogue) are part of the blood elf identity

[Tanaria]

really? are we going to have to understand that some followers for the mission table in an expansion that nobody liked shows us the warlocks as a fundamental part of the blood elf identity?

blood knight, ranger, magister even deathpath (rogue) are part of the blood elf identity

"Deathpath." I assume you mean "Pathstalker." That's more the "Blood Elf Rogue" thing.
To me, Pathstalkers are just more in line with the farstriders, hence why we just see more blood elf rangers than we do blood elf rogues, barring Valeera, who's more Alliance anyway and doesn't truly represent Silvermoon.

[Rhlor]

I know about Aeda, but I'm unsure about the others - unless they were just random named NPCs from the Inn. I don't truly count them as they would race swap, if you race swapped your character. So those other blood elf warlocks would become Human, dwarf, gnome or Worgen if you race swapped to the Alliance.

So we have 1 true canon Blood Elf Warlock - okay...who else? I've named Shinfel Blightsworn of the Black Harvest, but unless I look at the names of those within the Sanctum of Silvermoon, I honestly can't think of any other blood elf warlocks.

I think this is down to Blizzard wanting the Blood Elves to take on the "Blood Magi" thing, as we saw in Nazmir. Blood Magic is just more their thing than fel magic, which is fine because they are called "blood" elves. So studying "blood magic" to the nth degree does seem fitting.

they do not exist. warlocks were never anything in quelthalas society. just a few junkies in a basement.

the rogues at least have their own organization pathstalker

and I saw members of pathstalker doing things in quelthalas to protect the kingdom not like warlocks who do nothing.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

I know about Aeda, but I'm unsure about the others - unless they were just random named NPCs from the Inn. I don't truly count them as they would race swap, if you race swapped your character. So those other blood elf warlocks would become Human, dwarf, gnome or Worgen if you race swapped to the Alliance.

So we have 1 true canon Blood Elf Warlock - okay...who else? I've named Shinfel Blightsworn of the Black Harvest, but unless I look at the names of those within the Sanctum of Silvermoon, I honestly can't think of any other blood elf warlocks, barring Elynara who is the Archaeology trainer in Silvermoon.

I think this is down to Blizzard wanting the Blood Elves to take on the "Blood Magi" thing, as we saw in Nazmir. Blood Magic is just more their thing than fel magic, which is fine because they are called "blood" elves. So studying "blood magic" to the nth degree does seem fitting.

See that's what's disingenuous. "Oh I don't count them because they swap races if alliance". They are still BE warlocks, choosen because they are representative of the BE fantasy, you can just dismiss that.

The point of classes is that they are representatives of a racial culture. For example, we literally know of Night Elven paladins, but they are not playable. They are niche, not representative of the sociocultural trends. And that happens with all races who have NPC's outside their choices.

But that's literally the point of playable classes; they are a representation of the cultural landscape of a race, and Blood Elven Warlocks have never been treated as as the "niche" you claim, no more so than any other class combo without focus like warriors and rogues.

They are still part of BE society anc culture, nothing points otherwise, so why do you single them out?

- - - Updated - - -

really? are we going to have to understand that some followers for the mission table in an expansion that nobody liked shows us the warlocks as a fundamental part of the blood elf identity?

blood knight, ranger, magister even deathpath (rogue) are part of the blood elf identity

The part where you think that "nobody liked" WoD has any incidence on the validity of its canon tells us everything we need to know about your actual respect and understanding of the lore.

Deathpath isn't even a thing FFS

[Tanaria]

See that's what's disingenuous. "Oh I don't count them because they swap races if alliance". They are still BE warlocks, choosen because they are representative of the BE fantasy, you can just dismiss that.

The point of classes is that they are representatives of a racial culture. For example, we literally know of Night Elven paladins, but they are not playable. They are niche, not representative of the sociocultural trends. And that happens with all races who have NPC's outside their choices.

But that's literally the point of playable classes; they are a representation of the cultural landscape of a race, and Blood Elven Warlocks have never been treated as as the "niche" you claim, no more so than any other class combo without focus like warriors and rogues.

They are still part of BE society anc culture, nothing points otherwise, so why do you single them out?

I single out the Inn followers of all races and classes because they are swapped so it's impossible to tell which ones are actually "canon" and which ones aren't. This isn't just for the Blood Elf Warlocks, I also do this for the Forsaken Monks, Troll Priests, Dwarf Shamans, Night Elf Rogues etc etc.

To me, they don't represent any society because they are swapped. So if all those Blood Elf Warlocks swapped to being Worgen Warlocks, does that now mean that Blood Elf Warlocks are now less again and the Worgen Warlock population has increased? I only consider Aeda because she is canon and is swapped for a Draenei Paladin follower.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

they do not exist. warlocks were never anything in quelthalas society. just a few junkies in a basement.

the rogues at least have their own organization pathstalker

and I saw members of pathstalker doing things in quelthalas to protect the kingdom not like warlocks who do nothing.

-You completelly dismiss the link between Warlocks and Blood Mages.

-Pathstalkers are a part of the Farstriders.

-Your grasp of the lore is more and more tenous every moment.

- - - Updated - - -

I single out the Inn followers of all races and classes because they are swapped so it's impossible to tell which ones are actually "canon" and which ones aren't. This isn't just for the Blood Elf Warlocks, I also do this for the Forsaken Monks, Troll Priests, Dwarf Shamans, Night Elf Rogues etc etc.

To me, they don't represent any society because they are swapped. So if all those Blood Elf Warlocks swapped to being Worgen Warlocks, does that now mean that Blood Elf Warlocks are now less again and the Worgen Warlock population has increased? I only consider Aeda because she is canon and is swapped for a Draenei Paladin follower.

That just... kinda backwards. Like do you realize that every followers is within the canonical choices for their race; the whole point is how they are canon to the immersion. They are all given names that link to their personas. Why wouldn't they be canon because the other faction gets swaps for gameplay purposes? That makes no sense.

Why would anyone of them not be canon?

[Tanaria]

-You completelly dismiss the link between Warlocks and Blood Mages.

-Pathstalkers are a part of the Farstriders.

-Your grasp of the lore is more and more tenous every moment.

That's because Warlocks and Blood Mages are two different things.

Blizzard has emphasized that Blood Magi are extensions to the Mage class, specifically to Blood Elves, but expanded, but not limited to, Humans and Zandalari Trolls.
Warlocks - they are different altogether.

We saw what Blood Mages are all about on the Isle of Thunder with the Sunreaver Mages and their infusion of Blood controlled magic, going into the new smaller constructs.
Warlocks don't do this because they don't need to.

That just... kinda backwards. Like do you realize that every followers is within the canonical choices for their race; the whole point is how they are canon to the immersion. They are all given names that link to their personas. Why wouldn't they be canon because the other faction gets swaps for gameplay purposes? That makes no sense.

Why would anyone of them not be canon?

Why would they be canon if it's mainly just for gameplay purposes? Doesn't gameplay, in most cases, override lore?

I mean, I recruited as many Blood Elf followers as I could and the only 1 I interacted with was Aeda for 1 quest.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

That's because Warlocks and Blood Mages are two different things.

Blizzard has emphasized that Blood Magi are extensions to the Mage class, specifically to Blood Elves, but expanded, but not limited to, Humans and Zandalari Trolls.
Warlocks - they are different altogether.

We saw what Blood Mages are all about on the Isle of Thunder with the Sunreaver Mages and their infusion of Blood controlled magic, going into the new smaller constructs.
Warlocks don't do this because they don't need to.

That's just inaccurate. You can't claim Blood Mages are are extensions of the Mage Class, dismissing the fact they are an hybridization of the Mage+Warlock classes lorewise. Come on! Blood mages since their inception have had warlock coded spells, they literally gave them the "verdant spheres" cosmetic choice.

What's the point of this if not just further erasure of BE warlock themes?

[Paperfox]

More customization options just make for a better game experience, imho.

I doubt if I'll ever play a Worgen again, but I think that they should be able to have tails if they want them. Whether or not I can /pull them (like a /boop). That would be funny if they gave the worgen a /happy animation like the Miqo'te.

The more the merrier.

[Tanaria]

That's just inaccurate. You can't claim Blood Mages are are extensions of the Mage Class, dismissing the fact they are an hybridization of the Mage+Warlock classes lorewise. Come on! Blood mages since their inception have had warlock coded spells, they literally gave them the "verdant spheres" cosmetic choice.

What's the point of this if not just further erasure of BE warlock themes?

That was Kael'thas only.

No other Blood Mage has had those verdant spheres floating above their heads.

And if we really want to drill down into it, players were able to have fire verdant spheres over their heads, but they had to play as a Fire Mage.
Going back to Kael'thas - he mainly used Fireball and Pyroblast. In death, he also uses some Arcane spells as well as Fire spells.

So, having the spell "incinerate" or maybe "drain mana" does not take away that "blood mage" is like, 99% Mage based, what most people think as an extension to the Mages, which are core to Quel'Thalas.

Warlocks, as a main thing and what we know about them, just aren't a big thing within the Silvermoon and Quel'Thalas society, these days. It's on the same scale as the Stormwind Warlocks. They are there, but not used or do anything.

If you truly want Blood Elf Warlocks of Silvermoon to stand up and make a scene, then I'd say that Blood Elves would have to lose the Sunwell again. It's a possible route, but it's whether Blizzard wants to replay that story again.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

Why would they be canon if it's mainly just for gameplay purposes? Doesn't gameplay, in most cases, override lore?

I mean, I recruited as many Blood Elf followers as I could and the only 1 I interacted with was Aeda for 1 quest.

But why wouldn't be they canon? The whole point is that they don't contradict any lore, they were made as part of each races possible conventions; even the Pandaren Death Knight was given a canon fitting title "Gravewalker" and then later we saw the introduction of canonical DK Pandaren.

I just understand why would you assume that they aren't canon when nothing hints any contradiction to anything. The gameplay overrides lore is a thing where there's a contradiction, but there's none here whatsover so I literally don't get why you'd question these character's canonicity, when many of them show in quest chains, and later in the start of the Broken Shore.

If you deny these NPC's canonicity, you might as well do so for every NPC then.

[Tanaria]

But why wouldn't be they canon? The whole point is that they don't contradict any lore, they were made as part of each races possible conventions; even the Pandaren Death Knight was given a canon fitting title "Gravewalker" and then later we saw the introduction of canonical DK Pandaren.

I just understand why would you assume that they aren't canon when nothing hints any contradiction to anything. The gameplay overrides lore is a thing where there's a contradiction, but there's none here whatsover so I literally don't get why you'd question these character's canonicity, when many of them show in quest chains, and later in the start of the Broken Shore.

If you deny these NPC's canonicity, you might as well do so for every NPC then.

Well shoot me.
Let's agree to disagree on the WoD follower system.