Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Kyriani]

Look the point in making is that a DH is still a belf since it was a change brought on by a class, not some other outside force, unlike a velf.

If velves get the option to be DHs in the future then we'd get voidy velves with a demonic features.

They wouldn't be 2 sub races simultaneously.

Idk, maybe I'm not explaining my self right.

Game Director Ion Haazzikostas says Void Elves are High Elves. Hard to take any arguments that "Void Elves aren't High Elves: serious after that.

[Varx]

Game Director Ion Haazzikostas says Void Elves are High Elves. Hard to take any arguments that "Void Elves aren't High Elves: serious after that.

He didn't say they're helves. He said they have helf customizations.

Again, it's like a paladin running around with dk gear.

You can't two races in one, come on now.

[shoc]

He didn't say they're helves. He said they have helf customizations.

Again, it's like a paladin running around with dk gear.

You can't two races in one, come on now.

High Elf is the race, Void Elf is the affiliation. Blood Elf isn't a race either. That is like saying Dark Irons aren't Dwarves, because they are Dark Iron Dwarves. Makes no sense. Would it be better if the names were changed to Blood High Elves and Void High Elves?

[Rhlor]

if the developers say that the customizations represent that you can play with a high elf then there is nothing more to say

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

Look the point in making is that a DH is still a belf since it was a change brought on by a class, not some other outside force, unlike a velf.

If velves get the option to be DHs in the future then we'd get voidy velves with a demonic features.

They wouldn't be 2 sub races simultaneously.

Idk, maybe I'm not explaining my self right.

Or maybe getting infused with a cosmic force DOESN'T MAGICALLY CHANGE YOUR RACE, dear lord.

You're trying to categorize what is an in universe ideological distinction, what is self identity, by gameplay mechanics.

That's what people keep trying to tell you, that "Void Elf" or "Demon Hunter" or "Blood Elf" are ideological, self identity distinctions, not a matter of "how much magic makes you qualify as a new race" because "race" is a gameplay conceit that doesn't always track with in universe distinctions.

Maghar and Orcs are the same exact race except for fel radiation, the biological difference between a Maghar and an Orc is far lesser than a Blood Elf and a BE DH.

Forsaken are Undead Humans. DK's are undead members of every race. They are closer to each other than to their respective races.

Worgen are humans with a curse, they are still humans.

It' should be self evident by this point that "races" don't follow an in universe consistent distinction, and at best, are self denominational. What if the Void Elves didn't change their name after Telogrus? they would have kept calling themselves Blood Elves. The fact that they became "Void Elves" was solely so we could differentiate them more easily on a meta level, and it's baffling how this escapes you.

IN OTHER NEWS



Okay, but Sylvanas flashback armor? That's everything I have ever wanted.

[Mace]

Okay but you keep saying that like in a way that sounds very cope-y to a helfer.

You wanna go into technicalities fine, they are void infused helves. But they are no more regular elves than maghar are corrupted orcs.

They are not traditional high elves and never will be no matter how natural their hair and skin is.

And honestly, imo, velves have no damn identity after SL. They should have stayed voidy only, or at least given the worgen treatment.

Let alleria be unique like other NPCs

What you are saying isn't incorrect of the void elves, however the elf you can play under the void elf selection screen doesn't necessarily have to be a void elf any longer. This is the same across the board.

The dwarf you pick doesn't necessarily have to be the bornzebeard dwarf group that is the race faction you are playing, nor are the trolls you pick necessarily darkspears any longer. You can play a wildhammer or a sand troll now, but selectable under the Bronzebeard dwarf and Darkspear troll race.

Danuser officially came out and said we are opening you options to many other sub-race groups ,but we neither have the resources or time to give you special starting areas etc etc... but it is now canon that you are who you imagine yourself to be so we have given you the physical options in Character creation.

i.e. if your pale haired thalassian void elf is actually a high elf ..that's what it is, racials or no. In fact racials can be altered with a glyph to sell the fantasy further if they want. But you just ignor e it, just like you ignore that wildhammer is being treated like a bronzebeard in the dwarf starting area.


This really has necessitated a need for some name changes or at least a way of identifying sub-groups and sub-races. There was a huge post done on the official boards about re-organising character creation and to have Wildhammers, High elves, Sand Troll sub races as well as sub factions like Highborne on night elves or Farstriders on Blood elves appear in CC as templates players could click on that would bring up examples of this sub-race/group by bringing to the forefront the race specific options customisable options,. they could actually highlight them or even rename them when you click the template to give you a feel you were actually making that group and these are the features that make your dwarf, your void elf or your darkspear troll a wildhammer, high elf or sand troll instead.

This way people become aware of the actual other groups and in time the templates can actually have some short descriptions of the sub race or group and later allowances for them added in the form of NPCs or a quest or something.

[Vaedan]

Look the point in making is that a DH is still a belf since it was a change brought on by a class, not some other outside force, unlike a velf.

If velves get the option to be DHs in the future then we'd get voidy velves with a demonic features.

They wouldn't be 2 sub races simultaneously.

Idk, maybe I'm not explaining my self right.

But DHs are indeed changed by outside force -> combination of Fel and inner demon. If you put them next to Void elves, similarities in their transformation are obvious. The difference is in the source of their transformation and physical changes.

DH being a class and void elves a race are gameplay thing. Lorewise, both groups are elves transformed by a cosmic Force.

[Kyriani]

He didn't say they're helves. He said they have helf customizations.

Again, it's like a paladin running around with dk gear.

You can't two races in one, come on now.

You're wrong.

Here's the quote in it's entirety, complete with video of him actually saying it.

According to game director Ion Hazzikostas:

Blood Elves are pretty much High Elves... Void Elves are also pretty much another flavor of High Elves

https://youtu.be/4BsxB4NJIBs?t=19

If you wanna make up some BS on why he didn't mean what he said, be my guest, but I won't be taking such nonsense seriously, and I see no reason why anyone else should either.

[shoc]

Blizzard just found it fitting to contrast Lightforged Draenei with Void High Elves when adding Allied Races, everything else is just headcanon and speculation.

[KOUNTERPARTS]

Okay, but Sylvanas flashback armor? That's everything I have ever wanted.

Living Sylvanas is hot. I am suddenly a pro-High Elf supporter.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

And of course, someone already reverse-engineered the HE look from her new armor (LINK TO SOURCE)

You know what? This as a Thalassian Heritage Armor shared, with Purple/Gold and Blue/Silver (this) recolors for Void Elves, and Red/Golden and Black/Silver for Blood Elves, would be pretty awesome.

[Kyriani]

You know what? This as a Thalassian Heritage Armor shared, with Purple/Gold and Blue/Silver (this) recolors for Void Elves, and Red/Golden and Black/Silver for Blood Elves, would be pretty awesome.

I'd love to see that happen!

[Thalassian Bob]

[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FGGdiJFXoAIjyXO?format=jpg&name=4096x4096[/IG]

[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FGGdiQCXoAAyMfJ?format=jpg&name=4096x4096[/IG]

And of course, someone already reverse-engineered the HE look from her new armor (LINK TO SOURCE)

You know what? This as a Thalassian Heritage Armor shared, with Purple/Gold and Blue/Silver (this) recolors for Void Elves, and Red/Golden and Black/Silver for Blood Elves, would be pretty awesome.

Beautiful! I'd love for a set like that to become available for Thalassians to use but I'd settle for a good looking hood or two that we blood/void elven hunters can use to complete a Farstrider look! Hunters haven't had a good/natural looking hood since WotLK and that one was more of a mail coif than a hood you'd see attached to a cloak.

Also, the Sylvanas developments are such a frustrating ret con.

Edge of Night established over 10 years ago that Sylvanas has always had a callous streak:

"We have only two dozen rangers up there," he said, his voice now a whisper. "They cannot survive that!" Sylvanas didn't turn her gaze away from the dark mass of shambling corpses crushing its way closer to the river ford. It was the height of the Third War, and hours away from Silvermoon's fall at the hands of Arthas's army.

"They merely need to delay them as we fortify the Sunwell's defense," she answered, her tone measured.

"They will die!"

"They are arrows in the quiver," Sylvanas said. "They must be spent if we are to win this."

She was brash. Empty? No—a fighter. She had a warrior's heart.

It's so invalidating for years of story!

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

Beautiful! I'd love for a set like that to become available for Thalassians to use but I'd settle for a good looking hood or two that we blood/void elven hunters can use to complete a Farstrider look! Hunters haven't had a good/natural looking hood since WotLK and that one was more of a mail coif than a hood you'd see attached to a cloak.

Also, the Sylvanas developments are such a frustrating ret con.

Edge of Night established over 10 years ago that Sylvanas has always had a callous streak:

"We have only two dozen rangers up there," he said, his voice now a whisper. "They cannot survive that!" Sylvanas didn't turn her gaze away from the dark mass of shambling corpses crushing its way closer to the river ford. It was the height of the Third War, and hours away from Silvermoon's fall at the hands of Arthas's army.

"They merely need to delay them as we fortify the Sunwell's defense," she answered, her tone measured.

"They will die!"

"They are arrows in the quiver," Sylvanas said. "They must be spent if we are to win this."

She was brash. Empty? No—a fighter. She had a warrior's heart.

It's so invalidating for years of story!

Yeah, but I think the point even if Sylvanas had always had a callous streak, her past self STILL sees the burniing of Teldrassil as an atrocity. How would she not, it's basically what happened to her people.

I totally get the narrative issues that re-introducing a past version of the character cause, it's basically just a way to walk back her more egregious characterization, but the fact that no matter how callous she was in life, seeing herself turning into a mass murderer would be a BIG shock, you know?

Ranger Sylvanas was at the start of the cinematic in denial that Banshee could ever be her, but by the end she understands they are the same person. It's a "what have I become" moment, it's not about Ranger Sylvanas "never doing that", because she literally did when faced to the darkest path.

Again, I have my issues at forcing Sylvanas into perspective by merging her with an older version of herself, but they are the same person, just in different points of existence, Ranger Sylvanas DID become the Banshee, and I don think the cinematic did portray that.

[Beloren]

[IMG]

You know what? This as a Thalassian Heritage Armor shared, with Purple/Gold and Blue/Silver (this) recolors for Void Elves, and Red/Golden and Black/Silver for Blood Elves, would be pretty awesome.

Actually, I'd prefer it to come more as a package for the Farstrider look. in additional customisations.

Both groups get tattoos (different styles entirely and colours), fuller beards (also a bit different), scars too, and with it Farstrisder based heritage armor with reclours for void and blood elves.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

Actually, I'd prefer it to come more as a package for the Farstrider look. in additional customisations.

Both groups get tattoos (different styles entirely and colours), fuller beards (also a bit different), scars too, and with it Farstrisder based heritage armor with reclours for void and blood elves.

Lol it's not like we actually have a say in the matter XD

It WOULD be cool, of course, but all the HE stuff we have gotten has been low effort stuff so I'm not really expecting much more.

[Beloren]

Lol it's not like we actually have a say in the matter XD

It WOULD be cool, of course, but all the HE stuff we have gotten has been low effort stuff so I'm not really expecting much more.

I know right, but it's fun to pretend like we do


Maybe they see what we want.

[Thalassian Bob]

Yeah, but I think the point even if Sylvanas had always had a callous streak, her past self STILL sees the burniing of Teldrassil as an atrocity. How would she not, it's basically what happened to her people.

I totally get the narrative issues that re-introducing a past version of the character cause, it's basically just a way to walk back her more egregious characterization, but the fact that no matter how callous she was in life, seeing herself turning into a mass murderer would be a BIG shock, you know?

Ranger Sylvanas was at the start of the cinematic in denial that Banshee could ever be her, but by the end she understands they are the same person. It's a "what have I become" moment, it's not about Ranger Sylvanas "never doing that", because she literally did when faced to the darkest path.

Again, I have my issues at forcing Sylvanas into perspective by merging her with an older version of herself, but they are the same person, just in different points of existence, Ranger Sylvanas DID become the Banshee, and I don think the cinematic did portray that.

I suppose so. I just think it's a disappointing route to take to make it seem as though Sylvanas, a character shaped by a burning desire for agency, has essentially not been in control of herself or the choices she's made, for the past decade. I think it's just more evidence of the writing team not understanding the characters they have control over or the universe that has been built for them by their more competent predecessors.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

I suppose so. I just think it's a disappointing route to take to make it seem as though Sylvanas, a character shaped by a burning desire for agency, has essentially not been in control of herself or the choices she's made, for the past decade. I think it's just more evidence of the writing team not understanding the characters they have control over or the universe that has been built for them by their more competent predecessors.

I have seen this read (bolded part) elsewhere but I can't say I see it myself. I don't think the story has said at any point Sylvanas has not been in control of herself, at most she was manipulated by the Jailer who totally!! was gonna bring free will back, y'all!!

IMO the cinematic was about Ranger Sylvanas being in utter denial of what she had become, but she did become that. "That Banshee is you", that's her future, that's why it's so heartbreaking from her perspective.

Again, I don't totally vibe with the necessity of bringing Past Sylvanas up to force that sense of perspective in Present Sylvanas, that does feel like a cop out, but yeah, Banshee Sylvanas, after escaping Arthas control, hasn't been controlled by anyone else.

[Kyriani]

I suppose so. I just think it's a disappointing route to take to make it seem as though Sylvanas, a character shaped by a burning desire for agency, has essentially not been in control of herself or the choices she's made, for the past decade. I think it's just more evidence of the writing team not understanding the characters they have control over or the universe that has been built for them by their more competent predecessors.

You seem to be misunderstanding what's happening in the story. She's not being absolved of her actions, but rather she's taking responsibility for them. This video explains it quite well: