1. #26021
    Quote Originally Posted by Alanar View Post
    The horde even gained Daleryn Summermoon which is a named night elf dark ranger. She is in the Lorderean keep and I think she found her home according to the text. Night elves were part of that storyline and were seen with the rest at the end of the first questline, were they were introduced to Calia.

    Void elves are just there, because they can't leave them out after high elves, a lot of dark ranger are still from the high elf time,that's the only reason lets be fair.
    There are no further mentions of void elves specifically and I am not even sure if we saw them getting risen as we did with night and blood elves.
    We didn't see any void elves get raised into the "dark ranger" thing. The only risen void elves are those who fell during the Fourth War and brought back as Void Elf Death Knights, which are just the same as Nightborne Death Knights (whom are also now part of the Darkfallen clique, but you won't hear us trying to make them bigger than what they are because they are just there and have no relevance to the lore.) I picture that the only Dark Ranger lore, moving forward will be told from the Horde perspective, in the main with Velonara and Delaryn leading that front.
    They might have Sira be the voice for the kaldorei dark ranger presence on the Alliance.

    velf dark rangers are just nobodies. @Varodoc needs to just accept that. He is completely wrong (as usual), regarding the night elven darkfallen being irrelevant, when they have characters and have story. I'm sorry, but velfs are nobodies in this case.
    Last edited by Tanaria; 2022-06-03 at 04:10 PM.

  2. #26022
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    We didn't see any void elves get raised into the "dark ranger" thing. The only risen void elves are those who fell during the Fourth War and brought back as Void Elf Death Knights, which are just the same as Nightborne Death Knights (whom are also now part of the Darkfallen clique, but you won't hear us trying to make them bigger than what they are because they are just there and have no relevance to the lore.) I picture that the only Dark Ranger lore, moving forward will be told from the Horde perspective, in the main with Velonara and Delaryn leading that front.
    They might have Sira be the voice for the kaldorei dark ranger presence on the Alliance.

    velf dark rangers are just nobodies.
    Yes, I though so.

    True and to be fair I said the high elf time, but I meant this as going as far back as saying; Void elves, who once were high elves became void elves without being blood elf, i know it's still possible, the elves who went for dalaran and the silver covenant, the handfull of actual high elves from that time and died and were risen, that or the death knight, but since death knight are not even part of it as they can't even use this costumization option, it becomes even more difficult. We have no further knowledge of actual void elves being pressent AND risen at the only time these new dark rangers were risen with both (Blood and NIGHT elves) it's hard to place them, it's also very hard to go in Varadoc headcanon, because there is just not much to go from. This story was just not about them, simple.
    Last edited by Alanar; 2022-06-03 at 04:19 PM.

  3. #26023
    Quote Originally Posted by Alanar View Post
    Yes, I though so.

    True and to be fair I said the high elf time, this is going as far back as saying; Void elves, who once were high elves became void elves (without being blood elf, i know it's still possible, the elves who went for dalaran and the silver covenant, the handfull of actual high elves) from that time and died and were risen. But since we have no knowledge of actual void elves were pressent AND risen at the only time these new dark rangers were risen (Blood and NIGHT elves) it's hard to place them, it's also very hard to go in Varadoc headcanon, because there is just not much to go from. This story was just not about them, simple.
    This is like trying to make a case for Lightforged Draenei Death Knights because they can be played in-game.
    At the end of the day - no, they aren't the next big "Death Knight" thing. They have nothing going for them. That just has to be accepted.

    Hell, I play a Nightborne Priest. Tell me, where are the Nightborne Priests in the lore and tell me a confirmed and current Nightborne Priest lore character. You'll be hard pressed to find one. Even if Nightborne were also given the red eyes, the same argument against them still applies in the same exact same way it does for velfs. The only small difference is Nightborne are on the Horde, where the main bulk of Dark Rangers are. (Both Blood/High Elven and Night Elven.)

  4. #26024
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    This is like trying to make a case for Lightforged Draenei Death Knights because they can be played in-game.
    At the end of the day - no, they aren't the next big "Death Knight" thing. They have nothing going for them. That just has to be accepted.

    Hell, I play a Nightborne Priest. Tell me, where are the Nightborne Priests in the lore and tell me a confirmed and current Nightborne Priest lore character. You'll be hard pressed to find one. Even if Nightborne were also given the red eyes, the same argument against them still applies in the same exact same way it does for velfs. The only small difference is Nightborne are on the Horde, where the main bulk of Dark Rangers are. (Both Blood/High Elven and Night Elven.)
    Sorry, edited my post, but ye my point was that there is just no void elf story here and this also shouldn't be about them. There is no claim and no reason for it either.
    Nightborne altho I like them, would also have absolutely no reason to be visible here unless we had a story there, I am not pushing my agenda here, because I want red eyes. No thank you. It is case of lf death knight and we just have to accept it. it's gameplay/lore here I guess, which is expected and a very blizz way.

  5. #26025
    Quote Originally Posted by Highlord Hanibuhl View Post
    You're now just debating semantics.

    Just because you were once in Lordaeron or fought for them, doesn't mean you own the lands. The Forsaken, under Sylvanas conquered the Undercity. They claimed the land when no-one else did.

    As I said before, with the help of the Horde and Alliance, it's back in the hands of the Forsaken Horde (and anyone who's undead and wants to join)
    Oh shit! My forsaken warlock fought for Pandaria. Do I have claim to the Vale of Eternal Blossoms? Suck it Golden Lotus! You too druids of Val'sharah! Ditto for that time I defended the Exodar against the Legion!
    OT : Don't bother arguing with Varodoc - they just RP as a void elf zealot, not as a rational person.
    Last edited by Villager720; 2022-06-03 at 04:31 PM.

  6. #26026
    Quote Originally Posted by Alanar View Post
    Sorry, edited my post, but ye my point was that there is just no void elf story here and this also shouldn't be about them. There is no claim and no reason for it either.
    Nightborne altho I like them, would also have absolutely no reason to be visible here unless we had a story there, I am not pushing my agenda here, because I want red eyes. No thank you. It is case of lf death knight and we just have to accept it. it's gameplay/lore here I guess, which is expected and a very blizz way.
    But to be fair to Blizzard, they don't have the time to give attention to every single race/class combo. Ever since the start, they have selected areas where they push the narrative of those races and that's always been the case.

    So for Blood Elves, it's the Farstriders, Magisters and Blood Knights.
    For Night Elves, it's the Sentinels, Priesthood and Druids
    For Humans, it's the Paladins, Rogues and Mages.

    I'm not saying that Blood Elf Warlocks, Night Elf Mages and Human Hunters don't exist, but they clearly aren't Blizzard's areas for developing the races.

    Indeed - if the rumors are true that all race/class combos will be playable then fine, but people shouldn't expect large chunks of lore to be given to every race and every class. I mean, I remember Ravenmoon made a big deal of night elf warlocks and how they should be the only ones starting with green fire and they're "Illidari Warlocks" whilst Blood Elves are "Fel Elf Warlocks" (it wasn't making much sense to be honest), but no...Blizzard don't have time to go into that level of detail.
    I'd rather they stick to the core areas and we get really juicy parts of those core sectors. I get excited when I see Night Elven Druids in the lore - I loved the female night elf druid from the Classic WoW cinematic.

  7. #26027
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    No, Sylvanas stated that the Forsaken had a claim on Lordaeron by virtue of being its original defenders, who died protecting that land.

    Void elf Darkfallen are Forsaken, thus according to Sylvanas they have the same claim to Lordaeron as the Horde Forsaken.

    It's all pretty straightforward really.

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    Aside from the fact that many elves lived and died in Lordaeron, since Anasterian sent formal aid to Lordaeron and there were certainly many elves living in other countries, so you can easily roleplay the dark ranger as an elf who lived and died in Lordaeron; Sylvanas did not exclude the Dark Rangers when she said that the Forsaken have a claim to Lordaeron. Thus, all Forsaken have a claim to Lordaeron, not just Undead Humans. And thereby, all Dark Rangers have a claim to Lordaeron, just like Undead humans.
    Forsaken is a faction not a race. the race in any case would be undead/darkfallen.
    if you are loyal to the government of lordaeron in this case the desolate council then you are a forsaken if you are loyal to another faction you are only an undead loyal to that faction an undead void elf in this case

  8. #26028
    Quote Originally Posted by Alanar View Post
    The horde even gained Daleryn Summermoon which is a named night elf dark ranger. She is in the Lorderean keep and I think she found her home according to the text. Night elves were part of that storyline and were seen with the rest at the end of the first questline, were they were introduced to Calia. It's even possible Sira will return as she is in the stockades still and will choose to leave for the Forsaken, it is speculation, but there is a very big motivation for her to go to Dalyren also the other undead.

    The story is just not about Void elves, they are just there, because they can't leave them out after high elves, a lot of dark ranger are still from the high elf time. There are no further mentions of void elves specifically and I am not even sure if we saw them getting risen as we did with night and blood elves. This is not about them and nor should be, it would be completely out of the blue if Alleria or what ever void elf starts to lay claim with the forsaken and Lorderean. Sure there could be peacefull meetings between the races, but the place is very clear the home of the forsaken. But hey void elves came out of the blue, so they could asspull them again and claim because a windrunner should rule or or what ever and it should be for them;p I am obviously kidding.. right?
    I think Alliance Darkfallen will probably get some representation too, but mostly through night elves, who have been recognized and lore says that they are allowed to come back. With Tyrande chosing renewal for her people, I think they she might be willing to accept them back. Unfortunately, Delaryn would be the best candidate to represent kaldorei darkfallen, but I must agree that it seems more likely she will stay with the Horde. You know, the reason they stay with the Horde is the feeling they were abandoned by their leader and their Goddess. With Tyrande returning from Shadowlands with the new seed as a symbol of hope, they might change their mind. I can certainly imagine that.

    As for void elf darkfallen, I don't really expect much of them. So far, there is no single NPC to represent the group, they lack any explanation what they could be, so I assume they are included just for player RP agency (in a same way Darkspears have sand troll customizations and yet no sand troll tribe officialy joined the Horde).

    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    We didn't see any void elves get raised into the "dark ranger" thing. The only risen void elves are those who fell during the Fourth War and brought back as Void Elf Death Knights, which are just the same as Nightborne Death Knights (whom are also now part of the Darkfallen clique, but you won't hear us trying to make them bigger than what they are because they are just there and have no relevance to the lore.) I picture that the only Dark Ranger lore, moving forward will be told from the Horde perspective, in the main with Velonara and Delaryn leading that front.
    They might have Sira be the voice for the kaldorei dark ranger presence on the Alliance.

    velf dark rangers are just nobodies. @Varodoc needs to just accept that. He is completely wrong (as usual), regarding the night elven darkfallen being irrelevant, when they have characters and have story. I'm sorry, but velfs are nobodies in this case.
    I agree. Dark ranger archetype is not really a thing, and does not need to be. Void elves have their own potential, there is no need to further overlap them with blood elves. I don't actually mind these customizations, but they were not really necessary and honestly, I'd prefer something unique for void elves, but here we are.

    BTW I changed my blood elf warlock to a darkfallen and she looks great
    Last edited by Vaedan; 2022-06-03 at 04:51 PM.

  9. #26029
    Quote Originally Posted by Vaedan View Post
    I think Alliance Darkfallen will probably get some representation too, but mostly through night elves, who have been recognized and lore says that they are allowed to come back. With Tyrande chosing renewal for her people, I think they she might be willing to accept them back. Unfortunately, Delaryn would be the best candidate to represent kaldorei darkfallen, but I must agree that it seems more likely she will stay with the Horde. You know, the reason they stay with the Horde is the feeling they were abandoned by their leader and their Goddess. With Tyrande returning from Shadowlands with the new seed as a symbol of hope, they might change their mind. I can certainly imagine that.

    As for void elf darkfallen, I don't really expect much of them. So far, there is no single NPC to represent the group, they lack any explanation what they could be, so I assume they are included just for player RP agency (in a same way Darkspears have sand troll customizations and yet no sand troll tribe officialy joined the Horde).
    Sira Moonwarden is the only candidate who can vouch for the kaldorei dark rangers as she is still in Stormwind Stockades, as far as the canon goes.

    Void Elf Darkfallen are like Nightborne Darkfallen. They aren't part of the integral story that makes up Void Elves and Nightborne. (Nightborne Death Knights that is.)

  10. #26030
    Quote Originally Posted by Vaedan View Post
    As for void elf darkfallen, I don't really expect much of them. So far, there is no single NPC to represent the group, they lack any explanation what they could be, so I assume they are included just for player RP agency (in a same way Darkspears have sand troll customizations and yet no sand troll tribe officialy joined the Horde).
    Void elven darkfallen were as much of an ass-pull as the rest of the race : they came out of nowhere with zero preamble. So in a semi-laughable way, they're exceptionally thematic.
    Last edited by Villager720; 2022-06-03 at 04:50 PM.

  11. #26031
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    Sira Moonwarden is the only candidate who can vouch for the kaldorei dark rangers as she is still in Stormwind Stockades, as far as the canon goes.

    Void Elf Darkfallen are like Nightborne Darkfallen. They aren't part of the integral story that makes up Void Elves and Nightborne. (Nightborne Death Knights that is.)
    this is why Blizzard should implement Nightborne Darkfallen or remove Void Elf Darkfallen !!!
    The Alliance gets the Horde's most popular race. The Horde should get the Alliance's most popular race in return. Alteraci Humans for the Horde!

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  12. #26032
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    Sira Moonwarden is the only candidate who can vouch for the kaldorei dark rangers as she is still in Stormwind Stockades, as far as the canon goes.

    Void Elf Darkfallen are like Nightborne Darkfallen. They aren't part of the integral story that makes up Void Elves and Nightborne. (Nightborne Death Knights that is.)
    Sira to, had the same though about elune leaving her and how the night elves left her. Sure Tyrande walked away without killing her, but she is still there locked up by the alliance. She is tragic in the sense that she had no other place to go.. it will take her more time to let it sink in when she comes out that now suddenly they are accepted by the alliance. Meanwhile at Lorderean keep there are night elves and even Daleryn with the same condition and how they feel. She could use some help honestly. I know just the gal.

    I mean sure, she could choose to stay where she is, but what does she have there? when most of her kind clubbed together somewhere else already. Now lets be honest.. this text where they explain how the night elves may choose to leave etc, doesn't this ring any bells for you?
    Night elves and void elves(who are alliance obviously) are able to have this costumization. Again this is rp purpose as you can't roll an actual forsaken with the blood or night elf model. The whole thing is just how you want it to be rp wise, your own interpetation.
    Last edited by Alanar; 2022-06-03 at 05:04 PM.

  13. #26033
    Quote Originally Posted by Rhlor View Post
    Forsaken is a faction not a race. the race in any case would be undead/darkfallen.
    if you are loyal to the government of lordaeron in this case the desolate council then you are a forsaken if you are loyal to another faction you are only an undead loyal to that faction an undead void elf in this case
    You're completely wrong. Alonsus Faol is stated to be a Forsaken despite being neutral.

    Blizzard agrees with me and not with you.

  14. #26034
    Quote Originally Posted by Ardenaso View Post
    this is why Blizzard should implement Nightborne Darkfallen or remove Void Elf Darkfallen !!!
    Well they do exist through their Death Knights so neither Nightborne nor Void Elf Darkfallen will be going anywhere, any time soon.

    "Darkfallen" is the name for ALL undead elves. That does include the Death Knights.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vaedan View Post
    I agree. Dark ranger archetype is not really a thing, and does not need to be. Void elves have their own potential, there is no need to further overlap them with blood elves. I don't actually mind these customizations, but they were not really necessary and honestly, I'd prefer something unique for void elves, but here we are.

    BTW I changed my blood elf warlock to a darkfallen and she looks great
    Both allied elven races don't need to have such big influences when it comes to the whole "Darkfallen" thing.

    They can both be Death Knights and I reckon that will be their "major" thing, when it comes to undead void elves and undead nightborne. (Not saying it will be big either.)

    I have a Blood Elf Warlock who I changed to a San'layn and she looks really cool. For her transmog, I went with a combination of the ICC Mage gear and the HFC Warlock gear and got a perfect blend of elf, undead and "magistrix."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alanar View Post
    Sira to, had the same though about elune leaving her and how the night elves left her. Sure Tyrande walked away without killing her, but she is still there locked up by the alliance. She is tragic in the sense that she had no other place to go.. it will take her more time to let it sink in when she comes out that now suddenly they are accepted by the alliance. Meanwhile at Lorderean keep there are night elves and even Daleryn with the same condition and how they feel. She could use some help honestly. I know just the gal.

    I mean sure, she could choose to stay where she is, but what does she have there? when most of her kind clubbed together somewhere else already. Now lets be honest.. this text where they explain how the night elves may choose to leave etc, doesn't this ring any bells for you?
    It's actually an extra explanation to why night elves (who are alliance obviously) are able to have this costumization. Again this is rp purpose as you can't roll an actual forsaken with the blood or night elf model. The whole thing is just how you want it to be rp wise, your own interpetation.
    It is just an idea as we know that Delaryn isn't moving to the Alliance anytime soon.

    Sira is the only Darkfallen named elf who is currently in Alliance custody. Unless Calia, Delaryn, Belmont and Velonara request her release

  15. #26035
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    It is just an idea as we know that Delaryn isn't moving to the Alliance anytime soon.

    Sira is the only Darkfallen named elf who is currently in Alliance custody. Unless Calia, Delaryn, Belmont and Velonara request her release
    Yea I know, but still the other side seems more obvious still, with what we know already. But anything could happen, true.

  16. #26036
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Forsaken is not and has never been a "political faction".

    Even in WotLK, Putress referred to himself and his followers as "Forsaken", despite the fact that they betrayed Sylvanas to join the Legion.
    pretending to take control of the Forsken Facion. It was a civil war, the horde as a facion in the civil war was divided between rebels and loyalists but in the end they were all Horde. When Sylvanas and her most loyal followers left the horde ceased to be part of the Horda Facion. Other loyalists like Velonara remained as part of the horde when the civil war ended.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    You're completely wrong. Alonsus Faol is stated to be a Forsaken despite being neutral.

    Blizzard agrees with me and not with you.
    Do you mean the same that is in Lordaeron with the other Forsken?

  17. #26037
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    You're completely wrong. Alonsus Faol is stated to be a Forsaken despite being neutral.

    Blizzard agrees with me and not with you.
    Wrong as usual, it's both, but it's also just a general word for them as a whole, they repressent multiple undead. Including Darkfallen, abominations and now also lightforged. Didint you play the 9.2.5 questline yet? it doubles down on that.

    ps: psst Alonsus is actually in Lorderean keep.
    Last edited by Alanar; 2022-06-03 at 05:14 PM.

  18. #26038
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    the only thing I can think of rationalizing Void Elf Darkfallen is when some Void Elves died like on that suicide rush in Nazmir and got resurrected by the Val'kyr and then sought refuge and custody with Thassarian and the Alliance Death Knights
    The Alliance gets the Horde's most popular race. The Horde should get the Alliance's most popular race in return. Alteraci Humans for the Horde!

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  19. #26039
    Quote Originally Posted by Rhlor View Post
    pretending to take control of the Forsken Facion. It was a civil war, the horde as a facion in the civil war was divided between rebels and loyalists but in the end they were all Horde. When Sylvanas and her most loyal followers left the horde ceased to be part of the Horda Facion. Other loyalists like Velonara remained as part of the horde when the civil war ended.

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    Do you mean the same that is in Lordaeron with the other Forsken?
    No, I mean the one who, at the time, was part of the neutral Covenant, and not the Horde.

  20. #26040
    Quote Originally Posted by Ardenaso View Post
    the only thing I can think of rationalizing Void Elf Darkfallen is when some Void Elves died like on that suicide rush in Nazmir and got resurrected by the Val'kyr and then sought refuge and custody with Thassarian and the Alliance Death Knights
    Weren't most of them Mages and Arcanists though?

    I mean, we can obviously have Darkfallen Magi, but Dark Rangers were meant to be some sort of Elf Ranger or Elf Sentinel in life.

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