1. #26061
    Quote Originally Posted by Rhlor View Post
    Dark Ranger Velonara says: Many of the kaldorei raised during the Battle for Darkshore wish to remain here with the dark rangers. But any who choose to depart and rejoin the Alliance are free to do so

    reading comprehension! velonara tells us that some darkfallen night elf stay with them, but that those who want to REJOIN THE ALLIANCE CAN DO SO

    if you stay you are a member of the horde if you leave you stop being a member of the horde and rejoin the alliance.

    lordaeron is the home of the forsaken undead horde
    The actual in game text says:

    There are those among the kaldorei raised by Sylvanas' val'kyr who wish to return to their own. If Tyrande would have them back, they are free to go. The rest will be welcome in the ranks of the dark rangers.
    Just figured I'd add this for clarification. Velonara does not specifically say "many" or give any indication as to the number of kal'dorei that wish to return to the Alliance or remain with the forsaken.
    Last edited by Kyriani; 2022-06-03 at 10:06 PM.

  2. #26062
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    My dude, she literally says the opposite.

    You would be right if she said "But any who choose to depart and rejoin the Alliance MUST do so"

    Here she is literally saying that, if you want to depart and rejoin the Alliance, aka you support the Alliance, you are *FREE* to do so, but are in no way obliged, since that's what "free" means. She is literally saying that the Alliance supporters can freely leave if they want to, but are not forced to do so and can just keep hanging around in Lordaeron.

    Compare "Any student who dislikes my classes is FREE to leave them" to "Any student who dislikes my classes MUST leave them", see the difference?
    are you saying that someone loyal to the alliance will stay to live in the horde's territory and people like commander belmont wouldn't tell them to get out of here? the fear of an attack by the alliance is still present those who leave join the alliance again those who stay are part of the horde it is not difficult to understand

  3. #26063
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rhlor View Post
    are you saying that someone loyal to the alliance will stay to live in the horde's territory and people like commander belmont wouldn't tell them to get out of here? the fear of an attack by the alliance is still present those who leave join the alliance again those who stay are part of the horde it is not difficult to understand
    Calia Menethil is literally an Alliance member inside the council
    "If you want to play alongside High and Void elves, the Alliance is waiting for you"

  4. #26064
    Quote Originally Posted by Rhlor View Post
    are you saying that someone loyal to the alliance will stay to live in the horde's territory and people like commander belmont wouldn't tell them to get out of here? the fear of an attack by the alliance is still present those who leave join the alliance again those who stay are part of the horde it is not difficult to understand
    The Velonara quote? No, it wasn't.

    As for what Belmont wants, he only comprises 1/5 of the Forsaken ruling body. And last I checked, the Alliance allowed Baine and Mayla to hang out literally in the Stormwind Throne Room, as we head into a future where faction restrictions become less and less important.

    As if they weren't already very malleable, with a rogue devoted to the House of Wrynn literally hanging out in Dazar'alor.
    Last edited by Varodoc; 2022-06-03 at 11:10 PM.

  5. #26065
    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    Calia Menethil is literally an Alliance member inside the council
    did you do the quest? she says she is not part of the alliance

  6. #26066
    Quote Originally Posted by Villager720 View Post
    Void elven darkfallen were as much of an ass-pull as the rest of the race : they came out of nowhere with zero preamble. So in a semi-laughable way, they're exceptionally thematic.
    This guy needs a trophy!

    The best explanation so far for Darkfallen Void Elves.

  7. #26067
    The Lightbringer Ardenaso's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    The issue with that is Blizzard has created an identity for those fallen Thalassian Magi Elves where they can still be Darkfallen Mages and not just be converted into Dark Rangers.

    It would be the same if Shen'dralar Mages were raised into undeath. It would be unlikely that they would become Dark Rangers like Delaryn or Velonara - rather they would be Darkfallen Magi. If Sylvanas' Val'kyr were successful in raising all of those night elves at Delaryn's Demise, then most would have been Dark Rangers as they were former Sentinels; however two of them, Sarvonis and Ralara were Highborne Night Elf Mages who were almost raised. It is unclear what they would have become but as they were part of the Highborne caste, I'd put bigger bets on them being Darkfallen Mages, than actual Dark Rangers.
    yupyup I agree there; perhaps the intended use should be Darkfallen instead of just Dark Rangers

    I'd hope they give San'layn transmogs for Blood Elves too considering that it's possible that it wasn't just Dreven and his grunts
    The Alliance gets the Horde's most popular race. The Horde should get the Alliance's most popular race in return. Alteraci Humans for the Horde!

    I make Warcraft 3 Reforged HD custom models and I'm also an HD model reviewer.

  8. #26068
    Quote Originally Posted by MyWholeLifeIsThunder View Post
    I think somewhere around here it's the best explanation: IMO I think the Val'kyr continued raising any fallen Alliance Elves they could get their hands on (specially in Darkshore and Nazmir) into Darkfallen and sent them to the Dark Rangers, despite perhaps not always been Sentinels/Rangers.

    Like we know more than just Sentinels died at Darkshore, so it's likely that even if they were the majority of the risen, other "classes" were also risen, but not represented in game. We see a BE rogue, Lorash, being risen willingly, so we know the power isn't limited to the Hunter class heh, but it does seem to be limited to elves.

    So my Headcanon is that the VE Dark Rangers are in their majority VE's that died during the War of Thorns and even well into the Darkshore Warfront, with the Nazmir massacre being another prime situation where they could have been risen.
    I guess this is the best way to explain them, plus you could just RP them as a risen quel'dorei who decided to rejoin Alleria, a war hero of both Alliance and Quel'thalas, after Sylvanas abandoned Horde and left her Dark Rangers to their own fate.

    As I said before, void elf darkfallen possibly will not be huge thing in the future, they will not be in spotlight and right now, there are not even any NPCs to represent them, but since they got it, one line from Velonara would be enough. Something like:

    There are those among the kaldorei and ren'dorei raised by Sylvanas' val'kyr who wish to return to their own. If Tyrande or Alleria would have them back, they are free to go. The rest will be welcome in the ranks of the dark rangers.

    Easy as that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ardenaso View Post
    yupyup I agree there; perhaps the intended use should be Darkfallen instead of just Dark Rangers

    I'd hope they give San'layn transmogs for Blood Elves too considering that it's possible that it wasn't just Dreven and his grunts
    Icecrown t-mogs are pretty good for representing San'layn. I think you could also come a long way with some venthyr t-mogs too.
    Last edited by Vaedan; 2022-06-04 at 06:13 AM.

  9. #26069
    Quote Originally Posted by Vaedan View Post
    I guess this is the best way to explain them, plus you could just RP them as a risen quel'dorei who decided to rejoin Alleria, a war hero of both Alliance and Quel'thalas, after Sylvanas abandoned Horde and left her Dark Rangers to their own fate.

    As I said before, void elf darkfallen possibly will not be huge thing in the future, they will not be in spotlight and right now, there are not even any NPCs to represent them, but since they got it, one line from Velonara would be enough. Something like:

    There are those among the kaldorei and ren'dorei raised by Sylvanas' val'kyr who wish to return to their own. If Tyrande or Alleria would have them back, they are free to go. The rest will be welcome in the ranks of the dark rangers.

    Easy as that.
    Pretty much. Honestly overall makes me believe the decision to allow VE's to have Dark Ranger options was just a late one, but given that they also didn't gave any explanation for the natural skin and hair colors, explaining why VE's get new stuff is faaar from a priority.

    Regardless, I think it works within the lore we have so I am not bothered per se, even tho I would have liked a more solid explanation.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Vaedan View Post
    Icecrown t-mogs are pretty good for representing San'layn. I think you could also come a long way with some venthyr t-mogs too.

    Agreed tbh; between the them both I think we have a pretty solid San'layn aesthetic going on. Hell, I think right now we have more outfits that give that San'layn aesthetic than Void Elves have lol.

  10. #26070
    The Unstoppable Force Gaidax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MyWholeLifeIsThunder View Post
    Pretty much. Honestly overall makes me believe the decision to allow VE's to have Dark Ranger options was just a late one, but given that they also didn't gave any explanation for the natural skin and hair colors, explaining why VE's get new stuff is faaar from a priority.

    Regardless, I think it works within the lore we have so I am not bothered per se, even tho I would have liked a more solid explanation.
    Of course Void Elf Darkfallen is as stretchy as it gets and was given simply as a candy for players.

    The explanation? Practically, it's one of the time immemorial of "figure this one out for yourself" things. It is your unique character backstory, not everything has to be literally spoonfed.

    People really forgot how we did it 2-3 decades away or even now in D&D sessions. Your character got killed fighting Sylv forces in Shadowlands and got reanimated by her Val'kyr. Then you came to your senses out after last of Sylv's Val'kyr were slain. Like, whatever - what's there to stop you.

    ---

    That is also why I am pro-customizations as far as it can get nowadays. Not everything should be explicitly written and lawyered up. "How the hell is there X that is also Y?". Because *use your imagination*, that's how.
    Last edited by Gaidax; 2022-06-04 at 07:58 AM.

  11. #26071
    Quote Originally Posted by Ardenaso View Post
    yupyup I agree there; perhaps the intended use should be Darkfallen instead of just Dark Rangers

    I'd hope they give San'layn transmogs for Blood Elves too considering that it's possible that it wasn't just Dreven and his grunts
    As @Vaedan mentioned, the ICC sets already give off a San'layn vibe. Especially the 25 man heroic Mage set, which is red, black and orange.

    Then we do have others like the Warlock sets which can also work for a San'layn.

  12. #26072
    Quote Originally Posted by Ardenaso View Post
    yupyup I agree there; perhaps the intended use should be Darkfallen instead of just Dark Rangers

    I'd hope they give San'layn transmogs for Blood Elves too considering that it's possible that it wasn't just Dreven and his grunts
    Some darkfallen transmog ideas were posted on the official forums in the san'layn topic:



    Maybe those will inspire some ideas of your own!

  13. #26073
    Quote Originally Posted by Ardenaso View Post
    yupyup I agree there; perhaps the intended use should be Darkfallen instead of just Dark Rangers

    I'd hope they give San'layn transmogs for Blood Elves too considering that it's possible that it wasn't just Dreven and his grunts
    we killed vorath and his undead army in this patch. sanlayn for the void elves they use necromancy

  14. #26074
    Quote Originally Posted by Rhlor View Post
    we killed vorath and his undead army in this patch. sanlayn for the void elves they use necromancy
    Both void and blood elves just got san'layn options.

  15. #26075
    Now that the undead necromantic powers of the Dark Rangers have joined the Ren'dorei, it would be ironic and advantageous if they revived Dar'khan Drathir. So that they can make him talk and explain all of his research in thorough detail. After all, it was through Drathir's studies that Magister Umbric and his followers found Telogrus Rift. There is potential in Drathir's knowledge.

    Add this to the (already very long btw) list of potential Void elf storylines, to be reserved for future developments.

  16. #26076
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Now that the undead necromantic powers of the Dark Rangers have joined the Ren'dorei, it would be ironic and advantageous if they revived Dar'khan Drathir. So that they can make him talk and explain all of his research in thorough detail. After all, it was through Drathir's studies that Magister Umbric and his followers found Telogrus Rift. There is potential in Drathir's knowledge.

    Add this to the (already very long btw) list of potential Void elf storylines, to be reserved for future developments.
    Darkhan the original void elf

  17. #26077
    There's a solid chance one of the scourge warlords is Dar'khan. I can see the sin'dorei unable to handle him, but the ren'dorei wind up surpassing him and taking him hostage for questioning, or outright "killing" him again and figuring out his weird perma-rez that was going on pre-TBC was actually void necromancy.

    Dar'khan was utterly wasted back in TBC, so I'm really hoping they bring him back and do him justice. He could wind up being a popular character if they translate his look from the comics into the game properly too. Dude's got style.|

    Also, out of all the pre-established undead groups, san'layn is likely the one that'd be joining up with the void elves. We already look like traditional vampires more than any other elf race in the game, and if they add any more customization options to us, vampiric stuff goes hand in hand with the gothic stuff we already have.
    Talanji didn't trust Dreven, Dreven turned on the Forsaken when things got rough, the blood elves seemed shocked to see one in general, the darkfallen in general apparently weren't welcome in blood elf society - it's pretty much foreshadowed at this point. Exiles for exiles. Also can potentially play into Dar'khan's story too.

    Would also be interesting to see how the story handles all of the thalassian exiles getting together and getting fed up with being exiled, especially with the Alliance backing them. When you have so many splinter groups of your society rallying under one banner, they could actually start getting enough of a force to strike back against who kicked them out. Rommath and Lor'themar could be in trouble if we recruit them.

  18. #26078
    Quote Originally Posted by Schwert View Post
    There's a solid chance one of the scourge warlords is Dar'khan. I can see the sin'dorei unable to handle him, but the ren'dorei wind up surpassing him and taking him hostage for questioning, or outright "killing" him again and figuring out his weird perma-rez that was going on pre-TBC was actually void necromancy.

    Dar'khan was utterly wasted back in TBC, so I'm really hoping they bring him back and do him justice. He could wind up being a popular character if they translate his look from the comics into the game properly too. Dude's got style.|

    Also, out of all the pre-established undead groups, san'layn is likely the one that'd be joining up with the void elves. We already look like traditional vampires more than any other elf race in the game, and if they add any more customization options to us, vampiric stuff goes hand in hand with the gothic stuff we already have.
    Talanji didn't trust Dreven, Dreven turned on the Forsaken when things got rough, the blood elves seemed shocked to see one in general, the darkfallen in general apparently weren't welcome in blood elf society - it's pretty much foreshadowed at this point. Exiles for exiles. Also can potentially play into Dar'khan's story too.

    Would also be interesting to see how the story handles all of the thalassian exiles getting together and getting fed up with being exiled, especially with the Alliance backing them. When you have so many splinter groups of your society rallying under one banner, they could actually start getting enough of a force to strike back against who kicked them out. Rommath and Lor'themar could be in trouble if we recruit them.
    The San'layn will never join the Horde, that's for sure.

    The situation was already dire after all the pro-Horde San'layn (Dreven and co.) were slaughtered in BfA. In Shadowlands, the last hope for Horde San'layn was shattered when this San'layn prince attacked the Sin'dorei.

    It is also worth noting that the Sylvanas novel reveals that many rangers actually wanted Allerias as Ranger-General, not Sylvanas, this is despite Alleria not wanting the job. So many Darkfallen, who are raised Quel'dorei, could simply join the Alliance out of sheer admiration for Alleria.

  19. #26079
    Quote Originally Posted by Rhlor View Post
    Darkhan the original void elf
    I'm shipping Darkhan and Xalatath now and there's nothing anyone can do to stop me

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    The San'layn will never join the Horde, that's for sure.

    The situation was already dire after all the pro-Horde San'layn (Dreven and co.) were slaughtered in BfA. In Shadowlands, the last hope for Horde San'layn was shattered when this San'layn prince attacked the Sin'dorei.

    It is also worth noting that the Sylvanas novel reveals that many rangers actually wanted Allerias as Ranger-General, not Sylvanas, this is despite Alleria not wanting the job. So many Darkfallen, who are raised Quel'dorei, could simply join the Alliance out of sheer admiration for Alleria.
    I don't think there needs to be a reason, everything is clearly moving towards factions being irrelevant in the game. So what does it matter if there's Darkfallen Elves in the Alliance if it makes no meaningful difference.

  20. #26080
    Quote Originally Posted by choom View Post
    I'm shipping Darkhan and Xalatath now and there's nothing anyone can do to stop me

    - - - Updated - - -



    I don't think there needs to be a reason, everything is clearly moving towards factions being irrelevant in the game. So what does it matter if there's Darkfallen Elves in the Alliance if it makes no meaningful difference.
    ...because the factions still exist and matter in story, for aesthetics, and for the whole focal point on Horde vs Alliance in the franchise?

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