Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Tanaria]

SNIP

I don't care about night elves.

I want an independent charge story just for Blood Elves, alongside Orcs and Man'ari.
Fel Magic, with Shinfel Blightsworn, Kayn Sunfury, even Kael'thas Sunstrider - it has the makings for the Blood Elves.

Night Elves have their Elune, Druidism and Arcane thing.
Blood Elves should have Arcane, Light and Fel - being the only Elves on Azeroth who are proficient enough with Fel Magic. Shinfel Blightsworn is the most top tier Elven Warlock current on Azeroth. Use her for this.

The character of Shinfel isn't influenced by some random night elf npcs. She's a Blood elf Warlock and she is one of the best Elven Warlocks - to be targeted by Kil'jaedon...Blizzard need to use her and for her to make a grand return to Quel'Thalas. Perhaps be Silvermoon's "Grand Warlock."

[Mace]

I don't care.

I don't care about them coming from night elves because they aren't important to the current blood elf story.

Give blood elves independence from the other elf races.

I see, you didn't read a word. That can't happen, Blood elves are ELVES.. let me remind you what you skipped reading above.

Remember, blood elves come from night elves, they get this from night elves. And whatever blood elves have, high elves also have, and the void elves that came from them. You cannot forget that either. They are ELVES. This comes with certain expectations. Those who expect savage creatures entirely feral in nature, moderately intelligent and only capable of managing one type of magic, but are largely magicless and war like have come to the wrong racial group. If you expecting grotesque, brutal - that's not any elf. If you expecting "not beautiful", or ugly , that's also not elf. - there are other races for all those things. And last I checked, night elves ARE elves, in act the most "elven" and purely or fully so of them all. Never forget that and never be surprised that they would excel at things other elves excel at and likely have more things to them. This is by design.. it's nothing to be jealous of, with your beautiful blood elf models and your beautiful elven forest and elven city.. and clear magical mastery in many areas too (light, arcane, void, fel- and though they haven't made use of the available knowledge, they are clearly adept at nature magic when they choose it - as the Botanica instance surely shows]. And it's not just magic they are good at, they are also great at range damage and fire power, very resourceful, intelligent and charming. Why you have to balk at, or be upset at night elves being good at similar magic fields is beyond me. Night elves are distinct from blood elves in on major way.. they are nocturnal.. blood elves are just a subset of the night elf, it's fitting they have something's but not everything.. it's how the lore is made.

You have nothing to be jealous of, it's like choosing to be a gnome fan, then being jealous that dwarves have more things going on, or that humans are taller and bigger It's irrational. If it's the case, then like dwarves, or like humans, or like all 3 of them.

You should decide whether it is worth sticking ot this need for blood elves to be some super special snowflake. THeya re just a flavour of elf. Elf is the race, and it is the snowflake. Blizzard tried to make every race group their own snowflake, with all their variations. Humans have humans, kul'tirans, Worgen, Forsaken as their won flavours, but yet when you compare humans to troolls, to elves, to orcs as a race now, and notj ust a faciton, yeh, they're pretty unique each of those.

However blodo elves are part of the elf group. ANd in warcraft the Human and elf group are the most extensive groups there.. even though the orcs also have huge lore

We play:
Humans (split in 4 factions)
Elves (splint in 4 factions)
Orcs (split in two)
Trolls (in 2 - but 3 types playable)
Draenei (2)
Pandarens
Dwarves (2 - but 3 types playable)
Gnomes (2)
Goblins & Vulpera
Dracthyr

That's 10 unique races. But if you add in the flavours you can now add blood elf, night elf, void elf, nightborne), Kul'tiran, Worgen, Undead, Human, etc.

If you want Blood elves to be on their own, they have to stop being called elves, and change to something else, like what my brother was suggesting in his "fix the alliance theme" topic. But you certainly didn't like that. This way they'll no longer be elves and can be something else. Mabye turn them into Vampires - that would be special snowflake for sure. ^^

But I actually like blood elves, i prefer them to be in the TFT form, heavy on Fel and arcane - not light. with Light, arcane and forest ranging going back to high elves. But alas, we have what we have.

[Ielenia]

Tauren are spiritual not shamanistic.

They are shamanistic.

Darkspear got forced to drop their evil ways by Thrall.

Dude, the Darkspears were basically kicked from Stranglethorn Vale because all the other troll tribes would pick on them. They were never evil.

[Tanaria]

I see, you didn't read a word. That can't happen, Blood elves are ELVES.. let me remind you what you skipped reading above.

It can happen and it should. The Alliance ones have their own thing, so Blood Elves should.

Having the most powerful Elven Warlock currently, should involve a more Warlock-infused story for the Sin'dorei, using her to spearhead it and give them some bigger and better magical prowess, which is different from the others.

This is more about your made-up headcanon and I don't buy into a night elf fan's headcanon about how the other races should be.
It's not that it can't happen. It's more about you not wanting it to happen.

[Mace]

It can happen and it should. The Alliance ones have their own thing, so Blood Elves should.

Having the most powerful Elven Warlock currently, should involve a more Warlock-infused story for the Sin'dorei, using her to spearhead it and give them some bigger and better magical prowess, which is different from the others.

This is more about your made-up headcanon and I don't buy into a night elf fan's headcanon about how the other races should be.
It's not that it can't happen. It's more about you not wanting it to happen.

I think you have gotten a bit too hung up on up on this this, especially your sense of what is fair.. which is ironically since you criticise me for pointing out Night elves are owed something back for losing Suramar, the Nightborne and Teldrassil. or void elves are owed their own zone and raid tier - remember that topic? You spend so much time convincing me they are owed nothing, because you don't want them to have anything, then go out of your way to literally demand they get something to make them more of a special snowflake.

Look.. I'm actually not opposed to blood elves getting a direction that makes them a lot fel like. It won't be Illidari - that's already a night elf thing which blood elves are a part of, but you're not going to lose night elves on that one, but it can be something similar to what the void elves got for being void. I don't think it's necessary though, you do that sort of thing for a new allied race or sub-race, you don't' really convert a main race that has multiple facets to hone in powerfully on one. What about the fans who liked the other bits you are now discarding and it was their reason for picking blood elves or even buying TBC?


But then who am I to say huh? They honed in powerfully on the light with Liadrin, the SUnwell, Naaru etc, but it wasn't at the expense of the arcane or the other skills of blood elves. They didn't make them Lightforged, although they could have that option. Perhaps fel forged for blood elves? Yet still even with that, I don't think it would be a good idea to make all the blood elves felforged. So if not felforged would then be a sub-group of it's own that's part of the blood elves, akin to an allied race. But I wonder what would happen if people start saying the felforged are not blood elves, like those that said the Nightborne were not night elves.. all because they come of distinctive to how they had perceived blood elves before.. never mind all the signs of blood elf fel mastery though the Illidari and the warlocks under Illidan. And let's face it, the Illidari are already fleforged elves essentially - felforged night elves and blood elves, so how would you distinguish them? See the problem? It's already ben done. Be thankfully blood elves were picked to join night elves in the demon hunter story -seeing how you like it so much and liek hte blood elves.

I can just see the same arguments over and over again.

[Tanaria]

I think you have gotten a bit too hung up on up on this this, especially your sense of what is fair.. which is ironically since you criticise me for pointing out Night elves are owed something back for losing Suramar, the Nightborne and Teldrassil. or void elves are owed their own zone and raid tier - remember that topic? You spend so much time convincing me they are owed nothing, because you don't want them to have anything, then go out of your way to literally demand they get something to make them more of a special snowflake.

Look.. I'm actually not opposed to blood elves getting a direction that makes them a lot fel like. It won't be Illidari - that's already a night elf thing, but i can be something similar to what the void elves got for being void. I don't think it's necessary though, you do that sort of thing for a new allied race or sub-race, you don't' really convert a main race that has multiple facets to hone in powerfully on one. What about the fans who liked the other bits you are now discarding and it was their reason for picking blood elves or even buying TBC?


But then who am I to say huh? They honed in powerfully on the light with Liadrin, the SUnwell, Naaru etc, but it wasn't at the expense of the arcane or the other skills of blood elves. They didn't make them Lightforged, although they could have that option. Perhaps fel forged for blood elves? Yet still even with that, I don't think it would be a good idea to make all the blood elves felforged. So if not felforged would then be a sub-group of it's own that's part of the blood elves, akin to an allied race. But I wonder what would happen if people start saying the felforged are not blood elves, like those that said the Nightborne were not night elves.. all because they come of distinctive to how they had perceived blood elves before.. never mind all the signs of blood elf fel mastery though the Illidari and the warlocks under Illidan. And let's face it, the Illidari are already fleforged elves essentially - felforged night elves and blood elves, so how would you distinguish them? See the problem? It's already ben done. Be thankfully blood elves were picked to join night elves in the demon hunter story -seeing how you like it so much and liek hte blood elves.

I can just see the same arguments over and over again.

Your the only one talking about the Illidari. They have nothing to do with this.

I only mention Kayn as an overall "fel" based story for the blood elves; but a Warlock overall story is better. Shinfel is the main character I'd like for this. She isn't involved with a night elf.

I do think the Illidari should go to their respective nations with Kayn and Kor'vas involved with the Blood Elves and Night Elves respectively, but as far as Warlocks go - it's the Blood Elves who have a respectable named character with a lot of power behind her. Warlock stuff should go to the three races where fel and demonic magic was most visible. Man'ari, Orcs and Blood Elves. Yes, it's shared, but it gives the Blood Elves an arc which is akin to the Night Elf Druidism. It's something specific and is only for them, but also lends itself to them being a magical / sorcery based race, as per their introduction.

The Sunwell being part Light and Arcane, doesn't stop Shinfel from being Shinfel.

In case you've forgotten - this is the character in question:
https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Shinfel_Blightsworn

EDIT:
Also - a female leading the Blood Elf Warlocks would lend itself nicely to the Warcraft 3 Sorceress units. A story where these women have taken their advanced knowledge and mastery of the arcane to new heights with their control over fel magic.

[Rhlor]

[QUOTE=Mace;54275685]

Really tanaria? i'm trying to say blodo elves are as good as night elve,s and you are not wrong in thinking they are better even if I would disagree is what I'm saying.


Tanaria, blood elves are a magical race, because night elves are a magical race, blood elves are derived from night elves and are a more humanised elven race, this is why night elves are made to appear even more magical Their arcane usage is more extreme, their nature usage more extreme, their fel usage more extreme. However this doesn't mean that blood elves aren't magical and cannot grow to match night elves. The whole point of playable characters is that the heroes can rise to the highest height regardless of what their race is either good at or believed capable. Partly because blizzard doesn't like you feeling that you're better than another player because of your race, but because of your skills [everyone has a fair chance]. Yet, they neither want every race to be the same, so while an individual can rise to any level, races can be at very different stages, states and varying strengths in multiple areas. So every race has something incredible about them, at lest one or if a bigger race, several areas about them - they want you to feel special in a race for the things about that race.. and so they give those race things, different things, or rather different combinations and then different expressions of those things within themselves. But to be honest it's more the story and aesthetics that is the biggest distinguishing factor for races, not who is better at fel or arcane. Elves do have the magic card, this is why high elves and night elves have many things in common

Humans do it all the time, just because on the whole they are less magically juiced up than elves on average hasn't stopped human sorcerers rising tot he top of the ladder. Magical greats are Azshara, Illidan, Aegewyn, Medivh - Khadgar, Jaina, other less well known greats at magic are Prince Faronids, Antonidas, Rommath, Kael'thas, Elisande, Mordant Evenshade. Aethas Sunreaver, Anasterian Sunstrider, Darth'remar, Xavius.


Fel stuff can never be primarily just blood elves, because Orcs, Night elves, Eredar were already set up quite great with them before the blood elves got into it. After all, it the night elves via Illidan who teach the blood elves Fel, and his Fel usage is a match to the legion lords themselves who are Eredar, i.e. Draenei folk. Not to mention the orcs and the likes of Gul'dan and the shadow Council who were the driving the force of the orcs that nearly conquered Azeroth (EK only at the time).

Blood elves can rise to be great at fel, but they can never be the only ones good at it , they were added to it. Night elves are no longer the only one great at nature, Tauren were added, then Worgen who have it in their stability make up, Trolls too. Because night elves are great it, when eventually Nightborne, blood elves and void elves can be druids, they will be great it because of that connection.

Blizzard do not restrict much to one race. Much of the Elune magic, while we know it's the hallmark of the kaldorei preistesses and shal'dorei ones now, is actually available to many of the races through the druid class, so while not all of it is shared, a powerful piece is.

Elune no longer sits as just the goddess of the night elves, many worlds we are told worship her which makes sense if she actually is one, and on Azeroth, the Thalassian elves may have rejected her, but do you think void elves won't be drawn to her once more? Already we know both Nightborne and some Worgen already do her thing.. but Priesthood is not unique to night elves, just that star/moon magic.

Star moon magic is the part of their magecrat, priestcraft as well as druidcraft that is unique to them only. It is the only thing that is. Nature magic isn't unique to them and it is in the night elf version of their classes . But Star/moon magic is a part of ARCANE magic. So it's not arcane magic that is unique to night elves, even though they are the ones that started the mage class, but it's the prolific use of the satrs and moon that is.

What you are asking for for Fel to be unique to blood elves is like asking for ARCANE magic to be unique to night elves, or nature magic to be, - blizzard just haven't done this Tanaria. Maybe a certain portion of fel magic can be unique to blood elves.. but star magic was given to night elves as part of their inception, and there from the start. This would be added to blood elves. but for just fel magic? you saying it should be removed from night elven demon hunters, from Draenei man'ari Eredar, form orcs? it's too late, it's already in their lore, we going to some how burn the ability out of them and say they no longer can so blood elves can be unique? This is not how blizzard makes races unique. Please note how they do it. It's only elf players, and blood elf players that seem to do this, first it was nature magic should be a night elf thing only while arcane magic a blood elf thing only - not even thinking that this would mean erasing night elf lore, and cutting off blood elves from other things, not to mention how do you account for humans, forsaken , trolls and others who can now use the magic? Blizzard stepped away from one class or magic type only available to one race. They won't go back.


It is also not universally popular, you people like @Rhlor very adamant that blood elves have no part in fel or undeath despite the lore. He likes the high elf version of them. When blizzard did give them fel and mostly walked it back - (we don't even see Rommath use it, and it only reappeared with demon hunters) there was no outcry for it.

Blood elves already got a fel infusion for them, we could have used that to claim their dominance, but it was walked back, and on the forums the blood elf fans are divided. Fans like yourself and @Ardensao are all for it, but equally there are others who entirely deny it.

Look I'm not saying blood elves shouldn't, just that they wouldn't be given this. Not at last without another "evolution" i.e. mutation like happened

I agree that in nature the night elves are the best. but the blood elves repeatedly proved to be better at using arcane magic until the nightbirne are impressed by the power of the blood elves.
As for light, without a doubt the blood elves are better than the night elves, their power comes from the sunwell and they have a culture based on light and the sun.
About void elves in forgiveness I think they are going to worship a non-evil void lord since Natalie Seline was in a place in the void that was very nice.
and I think that now the best users of fel are the manari. Fel was never an important part of Quelthalas society.

[Tanaria]

[QUOTE=Rhlor;54276255]

I agree that in nature the night elves are the best. but the blood elves repeatedly proved to be better at using arcane magic until the nightbirne are impressed by the power of the blood elves.
As for light, without a doubt the blood elves are better than the night elves, their power comes from the sunwell and they have a culture based on light and the sun.
About void elves in forgiveness I think they are going to worship a non-evil void lord since Natalie Seline was in a place in the void that was very nice.
and I think that now the best users of fel are the manari. Fel was never an important part of Quelthalas society.

Fel might not have been the most important part; however we can't simply ignore that one of the best Warlocks around currently is a Blood Elf and she is possibly the best elven Warlock on Azeroth, at present.

Blood Elves need something beyond doing everything the Humans and Night Elves do. Having the only named Warlock Guild, coupled with potentially having the best Elven Warlock alive to date, it sets up a story, where Blood Elves can have a stage set, where it feels Thalassian, but also feels their own. Fel Crystals and the Illidari could also help.

[Rhlor]

[QUOTE=Tanaria;54276274]

Fel might not have been the most important part; however we can't simply ignore that one of the best Warlocks around currently is a Blood Elf and she is possibly the best elven Warlock on Azeroth, at present.

Blood Elves need something beyond doing everything the Humans and Night Elves do. Having the only named Warlock Guild, coupled with potentially having the best Elven Warlock alive to date, it sets up a story, where Blood Elves can have a stage set, where it feels Thalassian, but also feels their own. Fel Crystals and the Illidari could also help.

I think differently in any case now the alliance has playable demons

[Ardenaso]

I'm sure it's been discussed somewhere else in the thread, but how would y'all feel about Alliance High Elves (and Horde Ogres) in a Classic+ expansion?

better if it would be Warcraft 3 purist with 4 factions instead of just 2

[Ereb]

Lol, didn't Ion basically spend an entire stream callously making fun of all the players who were asking for High Elves and ended it with something along the lines of, "we already have High Elves in WoW, they're called Blood Elves"?

And now in this thread people are posting pics of their blood elves w blue eyes posing as high elves LMAO

Guess he was right

[Lecadre]

And now in this thread people are posting pics of their blood elves w blue eyes posing as high elves LMAO

Guess he was right

Void Elves could already do that anyway, if you pick the regular skin (non-gray) and blue eyes theyre just highe lves

[Schwert]

High Elves are a sub race to both Blood and Void Elves.
Same with Darkfallen / San'layn.

People really gotta just chill out on these things already. It's exhausting.

[Thalassian Bob]

Brace yourselves... The "Vereesa"s are coming...

[Ardenaso]

not sure if I already posted this here but...

https://www.hiveworkshop.com/threads...usader.351541/


- - - Updated - - -

(because somehow a third High Elf in the Scarlet Crusade with Demon Hunter animations is gonna be good)

[allegrian]

I think Blizzard could merge VE, BE and HE in a single neutral race in midnight in a neutral Silvermoon. In a world where the horde is welcomed to the new NE home and have neutral dwarves, "reuniting the elven tribes" could very well mean something like that.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

I think Blizzard could merge VE, BE and HE in a single neutral race in midnight in a neutral Silvermoon. In a world where the horde is welcomed to the new NE home and have neutral dwarves, "reuniting the elven tribes" could very well mean something like that.

Mmm I don't think Silvermoon is gonna go neutral on Midnight; the faction divide will remain, even if it's not the focus. But could Quel'Danas become a functional neutral hub? Possibly. I don't think thalassians are going to unify politically tho, at most the playable race itself might get merged and work like a neutral race, but Silvermoon becoming neutral would be highly controversial and not something they would want to get into.

- - - Updated - - -

I'm excited to see what Midnight would hold for the Future of the Quel'dorei. hopefully we might get a New Alliance Capital in Northern Lordaeron between the borders of Quel'thalas and Stratholme.

The prophecy will be fulfilled!

But yeah, I have always liked the idea of a VE settlement either here, or Windrunner Spire (and since they are so close, they might as well be connected!) This whole area is one of the few on the EK that's not meant to be reachable, so they really could do something new with it, like finally give the VE a settlement in Azeroth proper.

[Ardenaso]

I prefer if Alliance High Elves remain exiled and just moved on and resettled in Dalaran or Quel'danil or Eldre'thalas instead

[allegrian]

Mmm I don't think Silvermoon is gonna go neutral on Midnight; the faction divide will remain, even if it's not the focus. But could Quel'Danas become a functional neutral hub? Possibly. I don't think thalassians are going to unify politically tho, at most the playable race itself might get merged and work like a neutral race, but Silvermoon becoming neutral would be highly controversial and not something they would want to get into.

- - - Updated - - -





The prophecy will be fulfilled!

But yeah, I have always liked the idea of a VE settlement either here, or Windrunner Spire (and since they are so close, they might as well be connected!) This whole area is one of the few on the EK that's not meant to be reachable, so they really could do something new with it, like finally give the VE a settlement in Azeroth proper.

From what they said in blizzcon, queldanas looks like will be overrun by void, I doubt we get the hub there. It sounds more like an endgame zone or even final patch zone.

And if Silvermoon is the capital of the expansion, you can be sure it'll be neutral. The faction conflict right now only happens between players in forums that hates each other for some reason. TWW will have neutral dwarves and a neutral dwarf zone, and the current patch is about everyone helping the NE on amirdrassil, and horde players can go to the real-world version after the raid. The two factions are at full peace now and even then we have the "uniting the elven tribes" thing, so Silvermoon being neutral will make sense for thalassian elves on both factions.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

From what they said in blizzcon, queldanas looks like will be overrun by void, I doubt we get the hub there. It sounds more like an endgame zone or even final patch zone.

And if Silvermoon is the capital of the expansion, you can be sure it'll be neutral. The faction conflict right now only happens between players in forums that hates each other for some reason. TWW will have neutral dwarves and a neutral dwarf zone, and the current patch is about everyone helping the NE on amirdrassil, and horde players can go to the real-world version after the raid. The two factions are at full peace now and even then we have the "uniting the elven tribes" thing, so Silvermoon being neutral will make sense for thalassian elves on both factions.

I just legitimately don't think they would ever walk back the alignment of any of the playable races. Let me be honest, I personally *would* like a neutral Silvermoon, it's the faction that makes the most sense being Neutral, but I don't think they would ever go for it:

Since MoP, they have been strengthening the bonds the BE have with the Horde, they even had them bring another race into the fold. I just don't think Silvermoon can stop being Horde at this point (or at least during WoW's history) The faction dichotomy might be lessened over time, but won't go away entirely. So we can't dismiss the idea of balance between factions as something relevant still. They just *can't* remove a Horde capital without crap hitting the fan.

I think it's more likely for Amirdrassil to get a proper equivalent capital to serve as the alliance hub.

IDK I Honestly think it's highly unlikely, I think people are reading way too much into Metzen's "bring together the scattered elven tribes". I don't think reunification is the goal here, I think that a resolution is, but that's far likelier to be more about each faction of elves accepting the choice of the others and respecting each other, and perhaps then by the end of Midnight have a truly neutral Quel'danas as a place of coming together beyond the factions.

I don't think total political reunification is on the cards for Thalassians. I don't think that's where the story is going.

But...

People have always thrown the idea of Blood Elves and Night Elves leaving their factions, and both have had reasons at any point. Now, as I mentioned, since the factions are so ingrained into the game design, there has to be a sense of equivalence on any choice. I don't think it's likely, but I could see both Blood Elves and Night Elves becoming Independant, thus having the Nightborne and Void Elves following suit. Suramar, Quel'Thalas, Amirdrassil all become neutral territories -perhaps aligned with the Kirin Tor in terms of independence- elvenkind as a whole deciding to remove themselves from the faction conflict.

This really wouldn't affect playable races TBH; gameplay wise they might become functionally neutral then, in universe, of course there would be groups that would never leave the factions they have come to vouch for. Huojin and Tushui, Obsidian Warders and Dark Talons.

Could be interesting, but again, VERY unlikely IMHO.