Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Pyrophax]

Mag'har have 2 entire worlds, the AU Draenor and the Outland - but I agree they should have something their own .

Vulpera are desert nomads that travel around - Voldun is their home, I don't think they have cities or anything, but I don't think they want any.. they do have an entire proper zone and quests too .


Silverglade is fine for a High elf only hub, i mean, I can see why Silvermoon has a section that is horde only but not all of it. Anyway, Alliance can't exactly visit post legion Vindicaar, while the Nighthold or Suramar palace zone of the city is all horde, not the entire city in game.

We are talking about different things.
Lorewise Vulperas build settlement in Vol'Dun, Mag'hars settled in Arathi, Nightborne controll whole Suramar, DI have all Shadowforge city etc. And while HE are so few in numbers (those who hard-Alliance lapdogs) - Silverglade is more they ever dreamt to have, and even more than they deserve. Also ingame size is not indicator of anything lorewise.

Gameplay-wise situation is quite different. Vulpera have shit, LF Draenei have half of room in Vindicaar, DI Dwarves have anvil plus drill to Stormwind, Nightborne control small garden at entrace of Nighthold and Void Elves still sits on 2 rocks in space (well, their lore numbers are not so different from HE, so its good actually). So size of ingame Silverglade is quite good for allied race too.

I don't understand that frustration about size of allied race hub. Its on par or larger then other races have.

[Mace]

I'm more frustrated with Haranir than no-high elves in midnigt. What a waste to steal NE lore and themes, even the druid vibe, to be made into a new temu race completely undiscovered till now to be turned into a neutral AR (so, Horde now gets both druid and magic NE fantasies in their roster) which also has the most detailed and varied customization to date, while fixing the male NE model and idle animation, making NE look almost obsolete.

They are also features as a C plot after they got shafted in their own debut expansion, and will be ignored after their zone and mini raid probably. They sohuld have just canned this race forever and use actual NE for any world tree plot they needed to tell, or at least ancient dark trolls to further cement Midnight as a literall troll expansion after everyone expected it to be the BE expansion (just like TWW was expected to be a dwarf expansion but it really is a Goblin expansion).

I don't understand that.. the night elven themes are shared amongst all the elves.. the civilization side and arcane magic is shared with the Nightborne variant, the Thalassian elves, while the druidic vibe is shared with the wild elven like Haranir. Would you have preferred we got Night elf worgen instead?

The truth is the Haranir are the elven ancestors - apparently it's the Haranir that both Trolls and elves came from Whether this means that it went Haranir - troll - elf or Haranir to both Troll and elf in two separate evolutions - either way, they are just a part of the elven ancestry


Anyway, I don't think they do druidism and nature religion justice though.

Also I gave up mentioning the issues of the Night elf male model, they are clearly aware of it as it didn't quite pass on to the Nightborne, Zandalari or Haranir that are ALL based on them. The only elves they really care about are Blood elves. Did you not notice the night elves were one of the few models that came of UGLIER than their outdated classic model in 6.0? They spent the least time on them, one of the last to be done and in a massive rush, got em out of the way, while for the blood elves, they were the only ones worked on for months before we got them. Remember how they reduced night elf female boobs, and bums too, making them half as sexy and giving them abs, but increased blood elf female breast and butt/waist size, gave them higher fidelity etc


D'uh, Elves use to share the same model except for colouring ear angle differences - so the qualitative differences are very much intentional, reflecting where the love is and a clear separation in how they view the models

[allegrian]

I don't understand that.. the night elven themes are shared amongst all the elves.. the civilization side and arcane magic is shared with the Nightborne variant, the Thalassian elves, while the druidic vibe is shared with the wild elven like Haranir. Would you have preferred we got Night elf worgen instead?

The truth is the Haranir are the elven ancestors - apparently it's the Haranir that both Trolls and elves came from Whether this means that it went Haranir - troll - elf or Haranir to both Troll and elf in two separate evolutions - either way, they are just a part of the elven ancestry


Anyway, I don't think they do druidism and nature religion justice though.

Also I gave up mentioning the issues of the Night elf male model, they are clearly aware of it as it didn't quite pass on to the Nightborne, Zandalari or Haranir that are ALL based on them. The only elves they really care about are Blood elves. Did you not notice the night elves were one of the few models that came of UGLIER than their outdated classic model. They sent hte least time on them, one of hte last to be done and in a massive rush, got em out of the way, while for hte blood elves, they were the only ones worked on for months before we got them. Remember how they reduced night elf female boobs, and bums too, making them half as sexy and giving them abs, but increased blood elf female breast and butt/waist size, gave them higher fidelity etc


D'uh, Elves use to share the same model except for colouring ear angle differences - so the qualitative differences are very much intentional, reflecting where the love is and a clear separation in how they view the models

The Haranir are not the troll ancestors, they are an evolution from trolls, and the "haranir" that stayed on the surface became the night elves. You can see that when you read the alpha texts about them. It's still unknown if the haranir look exactly like they did before going underground, so it's possible that the bat features appeared during their underground era, so the "original" haranir which evolved into NE didn't look exactly like them.

[Mace]

The Haranir are not the troll ancestors, they are an evolution from trolls, and the "haranir" that stayed on the surface became the night elves. You can see that when you read the alpha texts about them. It's still unknown if the haranir look exactly like they did before going underground, so it's possible that the bat features appeared during their underground era, so the "original" haranir which evolved into NE didn't look exactly like them.

That is an assumption Allegrian, there is no official lore that this is the case, this is just people assuming it is. I haven't seen any lore that says Haranir are the missing link and evolved from trolls, so, have you? Yet I saw a YouTube video that said Midnight reveals that Haranir are the common ancestor of Elves and trolls. Both races evolved from them, they say that's in the game however. I haven't seen anyone say they found in game dialogue or lore that says Haranir evolved from trolls.

[Cheezits]

I'm more frustrated with Haranir than no-high elves in midnigt. What a waste to steal NE lore and themes, even the druid vibe, to be made into a new temu race completely undiscovered till now to be turned into a neutral AR (so, Horde now gets both druid and magic NE fantasies in their roster) which also has the most detailed and varied customization to date, while fixing the male NE model and idle animation, making NE look almost obsolete.

I kind of disagree- Night Elves since Vanilla (not WC3!) have been focused on the curated Dream, not being wild and untamed like the Haranir and their focus on primordial unconstrained Life. To the point that they literally go delve in the Rift of Aln while the Nelves very clearly do not.

Aside from that, yeah, way better model. But no, WoW Nelves have been a very specific thing since launch, and honestly Haranir are probably coming into play so that they can make a real "Wild Elf" that is what people have been requesting out of the Nelves.

[allegrian]

That is an assumption Allegrian, there is no official lore that this is the case, this is just people assuming it is. I haven't seen any lore that says so, have you?

I saw images on twitter from the alpha with ancient haranir texts refering to the other troll tribes as lesser trolls, like "children" for them, showing how haranir (or whatever they were before) considered themselves superior, Then the same or another texts says how they got divided between those that went underground and those who stayed on the surface "looking at the stars" or something like this, clearly refering to the group who became the night elves. It's unclear if they considered themselves "haranir" when they wrote those ancient texts, or they are from both the current haranir en NE ancestors (dark trolls), and if the current haranir forms (with bat ears) were there when they wrote that or they evolved undergorund in paralel to night elves.

[Alanar]

We dont get what you're trying to say. I speak for the thread.

He is trying really hard to find an opening here. Trying to make a difference what a "horde" city is and framing Silvermoon as a Thallasian city and not a blood elf city or a horde city. I already commented on this as ita completely rediculous. Typical mace seeing the world differently.

Suramar and Silvermoon are not horde, they are Nightborne and Blood elven, there is a difference. Orgrimmar is horde. But Undercity is not.

Response: They are part of the horde lorewise, just as Undercity is. I am not sure what actual difference you are talking about. But all kingdom leaders are part of the horde council and are considered horde. Ofc the city is of the nightborne or silvermoon is of the blood elves, no one is arguiing that. Use common sense here.
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He doesnt understand, the difference he is trying to make is is not a real difference. Its common sense when you say, silvermoon is from the blood elves. Being part of a faction and a city belonging to them can happen at the same time as explained. This try is really bad try.

@Mace
Just stop, its over. I already noticed you kept derailing earlier. When ever I corrected you on your weird idea of what a horde city was or that suramar and nightborne are not part of the night elves. You just start on something else and Not accepting the case earlier (hopefully people forget it lol) and instead choose for derailing. Its typical behaviour when you lost the conversation and credibility. You literally had an emotional outburst the other day, because of people saying this to you. Cmon dude, you lost your case, accept it and move on.

[Mace]

I saw images on twitter from the alpha with ancient haranir texts refering to the other troll tribes as lesser trolls, like "children" for them, showing how haranir (or whatever they were before) considered themselves superior, Then the same or another texts says how they got divided between those that went underground and those who stayed on the surface "looking at the stars" or something like this, clearly refering to the group who became the night elves. It's unclear if they considered themselves "haranir" when they wrote those ancient texts, or they are from both the current haranir en NE ancestors (dark trolls), and if the current haranir forms (with bat ears) were there when they wrote that or they evolved undergorund in paralel to night elves.

I guess this must be the source the guy from the YouTube video I saw was mentioning.

[Clone]

Just saying, what we colloquially refer to isn't actually the case.. in game, ta city belongs to the race. Orgrimmar was specifically built as a horde city, none of the others were. It isn't some horde city by some innate right, . The orcs are the horde, the rest are just allies or members that can come and go.

No, you have no proof that Orgrimmar was specifically built as a Horde city. Your logic isn't checking out.

https://wow.zamimg.com/uploads/scree...al/1237453.jpg
https://wow.zamimg.com/uploads/scree...al/1237451.jpg

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Would you feel better if I said Darnassus wasn't an Alliance city, nor is Ironforge or Boralus??

But they are Alliance cities.

[Enrif]

No, you have no proof that Orgrimmar was specifically built as a Horde city. Your logic isn't checking out.

What are you smkoing? of course Orgrimmar is a city of the Horde. It was build by the warchief of the Horde, Thrall.

But they are Alliance cities.

Ironforge and Boralus could be argued are alliance cities. Darnassus was a night elve city that was allied with the alliance. Like we have in our world some countries that are in NATO, and others are allied with NATO but not part of the alliance

[Clone]

I'm more frustrated with Haranir than no-high elves in midnigt. What a waste to steal NE lore and themes, even the druid vibe, to be made into a new temu race completely undiscovered till now to be turned into a neutral AR (so, Horde now gets both druid and magic NE fantasies in their roster) which also has the most detailed and varied customization to date, while fixing the male NE model and idle animation, making NE look almost obsolete.

They are also features as a C plot after they got shafted in their own debut expansion, and will be ignored after their zone and mini raid probably. They sohuld have just canned this race forever and use actual NE for any world tree plot they needed to tell, or at least ancient dark trolls to further cement Midnight as a literall troll expansion after everyone expected it to be the BE expansion (just like TWW was expected to be a dwarf expansion but it really is a Goblin expansion).

NEs are the new temu race now.

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What are you smkoing? of course Orgrimmar is a city of the Horde. It was build by the warchief of the Horde, Thrall.

Nobody said it wasn't.

Ironforge and Boralus could be argued are alliance cities. Darnassus was a night elve city that was allied with the alliance. Like we have in our world some countries that are in NATO, and others are allied with NATO but not part of the alliance

Do you have proof that night elves are allies of the Alliance instead of Alliance members?

[SpaceMistakes]

Yeah, I’m not happy it’s in Void Elf control but I’ll take it over High Elf control.

As far as control of Quel’thalas areas is concerned Silverglade Refuge is all they’re getting.

No offense dude, but it’s wishful thinking to imagine you’ll get more areas. We should not forget all the insane theory crafting High Elf fanatics had when the World Soul Saga was announced. Folks were yakking about how they’d be getting huge swaths of land all because Metzen said “uniting disparate elven tribes.” Now people are doing the same thing because of an off comment by Maria Hamilton during the QandA. Just give it a rest.

Maybe you should give 'being triggered by people who want something different than you want' a rest.

[Pyrophax]

What are you smkoing? of course Orgrimmar is a city of the Horde. It was build by the warchief of the Horde, Thrall.

Orgrimmar is city of orcs. Who are part of the Horde.
Same as Stormwind or Ironforge are human and dwarven cities. But that doesn't mean they are not Alliance.

I think "true Horde city", build for all the Horde is Warspear in Draenor. Same with Alliance's Stormshield. Not race defining places, but faction defining ones.

[Enrif]

Nobody said it wasn't.

you just said that "you have no proof that Orgrimmar was specifically built as a Horde city", yet it was build by THE horde. It was build after the WC3 main campaign, by the new horde let by Thrall as Warchief, and has areas for Trolls and Tauren, not just Orcs. No city is as Horde as Orgrimmar.

Do you have proof that night elves are allies of the Alliance instead of Alliance members?

sadly, no, i don't have proof. Yet, it would have not made sense to be integrated as part of the alliance(or forsaken as part of the horde), and rather allied with the Alliance. But black and white faction seperation in classic makes that distinction null and void

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Orgrimmar is city of orcs. Who are part of the Horde.
Same as Stormwind or Ironforge are human and dwarven cities. But that doesn't mean they are not Alliance.

I think "true Horde city", build for all the Horde is Warspear in Draenor. Same with Alliance's Stormshield. Not race defining places, but faction defining ones.

Orgrimmar was build with areas for trolls and tauren. It was THE horde city.

[Mace]

He is trying really hard to find an opening here. Trying to make a difference what a "horde" city is and framing Silvermoon as a Thallasian city and not a blood elf city or a horde city. I already commented on this as ita completely rediculous. Typical mace seeing the world differently.



Response: They are part of the horde lorewise, just as Undercity is. I am not sure what actual difference you are talking about. But all kingdom leaders are part of the horde council and are considered horde. Ofc the city is of the nightborne or silvermoon is of the blood elves, no one is arguiing that. Use common sense here.
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He doesnt understand, the difference he is trying to make is is not a real difference. Its common sense when you say, silvermoon is from the blood elves. Being part of a faction and a city belonging to them can happen at the same time as explained. This try is really bad try.

@Mace
Just stop, its over. I already noticed you kept derailing earlier. When ever I corrected you on your weird idea of what a horde city was or that suramar and nightborne are not part of the night elves. You just started on something else and Not accepting the case earlier (hopefully people forget it lol), but instead derailing. Its typical behaviour when you lost the conversation and credibility. You literally had an emptional outburst, because boohoo. Cmon dude, you lost your case, accept it and move on. Everyone moved on from this accept you.

I was making a point.. shift perspective.. It isn't untrue either, you just say they're horde cities because the races are in the horde, we accept that. But the horde is a faction not a race. When we say horde city , we are abbreviating horde aligned city - for that is what we mean, they do not "belong" to the horde, their ownership is the race they occupy, and tehy're horde aligned because that race is.. not the other way round.

[Clone]

you just said that "you have no proof that Orgrimmar was specifically built as a Horde city", yet it was build by THE horde. It was build after the WC3 main campaign, by the new horde let by Thrall as Warchief, and has areas for Trolls and Tauren, not just Orcs. No city is as Horde as Orgrimmar.

Orgrimmar was build with areas for trolls and tauren. It was THE horde city.

Because there is no proof. It's definitely an orc city, and it's definitely a Hrode city, but there is no proof that it's specifically the Horde city. If you were to look at it in WC3, it didn't have any areas for taurens and trolls, and didn't have a specific tauren area untill cataclysm. It's troll area was one hut in classic. Thunder Bluff has a cave for Forsaken too, doesn't make it a Forsaken city.

Until specifically stated otherwise, one can only assume that Orgrimmar follows the same convention as all other cities.

[Mace]

No, you have no proof that Orgrimmar was specifically built as a Horde city. Your logic isn't checking out.

What do you mean? The Orcs ARE the Horde, and they are the only ace that cannot "leave" the Horde, because they are it. Since WC1 -

[Enrif]

Because there is no proof. It's definitely an orc city, and it's definitely a Hrode city, but there is no proof that it's specifically the Horde city. If you were to look at it in WC3, it didn't have any areas for taurens and trolls, and didn't have a specific tauren area untill cataclysm. It's troll area was one hut in classic. Thunder Bluff has a cave for Forsaken too, doesn't make it a Forsaken city.

Until specifically stated otherwise, one can only assume that Orgrimmar follows the same convention as all other cities.

Well, compare that to any other major city in the game, or just the counterpart of Stormwind. Ogrimmar is the only city int he whole game that has by now dedicated areas for three different races. Stormwind may have a Dwarven District and Ironforge has Tinkertown, but only Orgrimmar as a city is depicting its core races (WC3 orc faction) all at once. There is no similar thing for the alliance that represents their core (WC3 human faction) as there is no high elven destrict in Stormwind (which is very odd) or any other alliance city that represents more than 2 races.

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and before someone says "there are likely less high elves in SW than dwarves to warrant a high elven district", we have one semi-official number from the old RPG. High Elves were 10% of Stormwinds Population, and Dwarves were 14%, not that big of a difference

[Clone]

Well, compare that to any other major city in the game, or just the counterpart of Stormwind. Ogrimmar is the only city int he whole game that has by now dedicated areas for three different races. Stormwind may have a Dwarven District and Ironforge has Tinkertown, but only Orgrimmar as a city is depicting its core races (WC3 orc faction) all at once. There is no similar thing for the alliance that represents their core (WC3 human faction) as there is no high elven destrict in Stormwind (which is very odd) or any other alliance city that represents more than 2 races.

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and before someone says "there are likely less high elves in SW than dwarves to warrant a high elven district", we have one semi-official number from the old RPG. High Elves were 10% of Stormwinds Population, and Dwarves were 14%, not that big of a difference

Doesn't change anything, Orgrimmar wasn't built to be the Horde city, neither was Stormwind built to be the Alliance city, despite having a dwarven district and a moon well in classic.

[Garrac]

I allways forget theres an actual troll alley in Orgrimmar... However, since the new ambassy got added, its made of like three huts