Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[LowestFormOfWit]

Maybe I did not express myself correctly. What I meant to say in my observation was that the fate of the High Elves was decided, basically, by two self-inflated, selfish, and snobbish characters: Garrithos and Kael. It would be natural, in a case like this that the people be divided by the decision of their monarch, some follow their changes, like the Blood Elves, others do not accept them and they continue being what they were.

This is exactly the case of the Nightborn with the NE.
It is quite acceptable that ideological differences place people as enemies.
But this should be for everyone, if not, Blizz will be giving preference to a public of the game.

The fate of the High Elves was decided by a human. A human by the name of Arthas Menethil. While Garithos was definitely a racist and was a major factor in Kael becoming disenfranchised with the Alliance, he was not the reason they joined the Horde.

Garithos' actions made Kael accept aid from Lasy Vashj and the Naga, and eventually Illidan. This is circa Warcraft 3: TFT.

The reason they join the Horde plays out in The Burning Crusade, where the majoriy of Blood Elves fold into the Horde via relations to Sylvanas and her Forsaken, as she was ranking Ranger General at the time of the invasion, and helps them find a home with the Horde.

The scattered High Elves who either weren't in Quel'thalas at the time of the invasion, or those who didn't go along with the Blood Elves direction, were scattered to the wind, with the only 'major' group being a contingent of Dalaran High Elves in the Silver Covenant. Either way, High Elves as a greater society was eliminated.

Eventually we find in Outland that Kael has turned to power mongering and dealing directly with the Legion, and so the Blood Elves kill him as part of a joint venture with the draenei in the Shattered Sun Offensive, and remove the Legion attack on the Sunwell, eventually leading to its holy fueled reignition.

To try to boil it all down to Garithos and Kael were bad and that's why Alliance lost High Elves is a disservice to over a decade of storytelling across multiple games.

[orukam]

See, this exact quote is the problem with you guys. You want them for your faction, but you don't care how the Horde feels about it. You don't care about how anyone feels about it as long as YOU get what YOU want. Why should Blizzard care about a bunch of self-important, selfish kids that go around with pitchforks calling for staff to be fired if they don't get their playable race? How can you sit there and say, "Why should I care..." this or that and expect Blizzard to care about you? Because you pay for a sub? Well, newsflash, the Horde BE players pay for a sub, too, and I guess since they aren't a bunch of entitled whiny-babies they decided to cater to them and defend them, instead.

The hypocrisy is all too easy to see.

I agree with you.
I am in favor of the existence of HE, but never to hurt Blood Elf fanbase.
If HE were implemented, this should be done while preserving all cultural identity and differences between them. Much lore could be developed along this path.
Including the rivalry between them.

[EbaumsTipster]

I agree with you.
I am in favor of the existence of HE, but never to hurt Blood Elf fanbase.
If HE were implemented, this should be done while preserving all cultural identity and differences between them. Much lore could be developed along this path.
Including the rivalry between them.

How do you change the aesthetic of the High Elves without making them something besides a High Elf? People just want a Tolkien-archetype elf on Alliance, and Blizz has said "tough titty".

[Traycor]

High Elves with tattoos, wild hair, muscles, scratches and all those things people have suggested to differentiate from Blood Elves would still not stop them from being majestic Tolkien elves. As long as they are fair skinned and predominantly blonde, they will never, ever happen.

I do agree to a certain extent. It's moving in the right direction, but it's missing a certain something that will set it apart. Currently, my designs cannot be summed up into one word that is in sharp contrast to "Majestic".

The "Allies of the Blue Dragonflight" concept I floated around near the beginning would have been a nice, sharp contrast: "Dragon". But people didn't enjoy the idea. It might be that I should revisit that and try to explain/implement it better.

Whatever theme it is, it needs that kind of "oomph" to it.

[orukam]

only difference on your "so High elves" are their ignorance, pride, and human d**k s**king. Oh yes and Blue eyes of course wich is NOT unique to Aliance only.
No different Architecture (while with NB and NE they are VERY different), no different culture (while NB and NE again very different), only hate, only pride, only lack of skill to take magic from living. They live with humans, sleep with humans, breed with humans. even in Pandaria your "High elves" called "Kitin'tor offense". KIRIN'TOR! LEAD BY FU**ING JAINA PROUDMORE! They again came only WITH other aliance force.
Pandaria - WITH kirin'tor
Legion - WITH night elves (because by themself they don't posses enough military power for any actuall help in suramar)
They always backend of Aliance forces, because BY THE LORE aliance don't have race who can actually be "powerfull mages" (draenei posed as paladins, humans as solders, NE archers, gnomes - engineers, dwarfs gunners, worgen - savage)

His way of expressing this is only ofencivo. Not argumentative.
Culture is much more that you explained in your summary, and I know you know it.
Understand, the High Elves could be very well worked out (which, as they were never implemented as race or sub-race) did not happen.
Many of these differences would be easy to implement, preserving what is of the Blood Elves, as was done between NB and NE.
But instead Ion decides to give us Blood Elves exiles ONLY for using void magic. Make no sense.

Do you understand that it's a lazy and dumb job?

[LowestFormOfWit]

I do agree to a certain extent. It's moving in the right direction, but it's missing a certain something that will set it apart. Currently, my designs cannot be summed up into one word that is in sharp contrast to "Majestic".

The "Allies of the Blue Dragonflight" concept I floated around near the beginning would have been a nice, sharp contrast: "Dragon". But people didn't enjoy the idea. It might be that I should revisit that and try to explain/implement it better.

Whatever theme it is, it needs that kind of "oomph" to it.

I am sure Blizzard went along this same thought process and ended up with Void Elves. A unique twist on the Blood/High elf that is different enough.

Given how Alliance and High Elf fans reacted to it, and to Ion's takes on the matter since, I'm convinced nothing short of fair skinned, blonde haired, blue eyed carbon copies of Blood Elves would satisfy them.

It's concerning behavior that borders on aryan supremacy.

[Zorish]

To try to boil it all down to Garithos and Kael were bad and that's why Alliance lost High Elves is a disservice to over a decade of storytelling across multiple games.

they even cemented it with chronicles
1) anasterian took elves from the aliance, because he saw them incompetent (thanks to Black dragon machinations) after second war
2) Scourge invade QT - lead my Arthas - Ravaged land, killed king, corrupted sunwell
3) KT return - rename of the nation - sunwell destruction because of corruption
4) KT took some of people and wanted to help Aliance, during wich he tried to use leylines to sate elves addiction, not worked
5) Garithos done what we saw
6) events from WC3 till before BC - nagas, illidan, KT betrayal, etc.
7) when KT don't return from Outland - Lor'themar Theron understood that with everything happened between elves and Aliance (and probably thanks to Veressa attitude) there is no chance for them to return and seeked another ally in the horde thanks to sylvanas - hello part of the horde.

Now after so many expansions BE happy with this union and show NB that they weren't stripped of their identity, but valuable part of the faction.

[elbleuet]

I am sure Blizzard went along this same thought process and ended up with Void Elves. A unique twist on the Blood/High elf that is different enough.

Given how Alliance and High Elf fans reacted to it, and to Ion's takes on the matter since, I'm convinced nothing short of fair skinned, blonde haired, blue eyed carbon copies of Blood Elves would satisfy them.

It's concerning behavior that borders on aryan supremacy.

I sincerely hope you get banned for this. Some of you are really going too far.

[RangerDaz]

Anything is possible in the future, but no plans in the near term to add High Elves as an allied race.

Most likely, they would implement such a difference over time, like how we were slowly introduced to most of the current Allied Races.

Hey Traycor.

The anything is possible in the future, says everything. Whatever they decide, is decided. It's their franchise after all.
I just hope they won't give the community poor excuses as the one he gave yesterday.

Related to Ion's "You want to be a blue eyed elf? The Horde is there waiting for you."
I made a signature just for that... i'll be using it in the next couple of days or so just for the joke

[Zorish]

His way of expressing this is only ofencivo. Not argumentative.
Culture is much more that you explained in your summary, and I know you know it.
Understand, the High Elves could be very well worked out (which, as they were never implemented as race or sub-race) did not happen.
Many of these differences would be easy to implement, preserving what is of the Blood Elves, as was done between NB and NE.
But instead Ion decides to give us Blood Elves exiles ONLY for using void magic. Make no sense.

Do you understand that it's a lazy and dumb job?

so tell me "what actuall culture difference" of "HE" and Blood elf. i don't see any (in alliria keep) or i see that "He" merged with humans (in Dalaran or SW).

Only thing if different is that one part of population go and took what they need from the living, and other - go with pride and suffered. Skill of siphoning magic didn't change their appearance. Only font of fel magic from magisters when they rebuilded silvermoon.

oh and about "offensive". YOU people asked him this THREE F**KING TIMES! THREE! YOU NOT WAITED PATIENTLY - YOU escalated this to this point by going ape on forums and discord. You hunted anti HE group and abused report systems. Deal with what you sowed.

But instead Ion decides to give us Blood Elves exiles ONLY for using void magic. Make no sense.

They were said that using void magic near sunwell (font of arcane AND holy power) is dangerous. Alleria presence proved it. Now after everything happened - nobody will allow them to go in silvermoon. They are literaly walking fonts of Void magic (alleria most skilled of them even her presence was enough to things go ape, and they are infused and not as skilled as her). So they had little choice - either live on the borders of Silvermoon, or go Aliance. I think if they were able to dealt with transformation by their own - they probably would choose first. But Alleria ideas changed it.

maybe it's poor writing, but at least their exile was logical step of preserving Sunwell while they need it. Maybe after ally with NB they will be cured from this by Arcandor too and turn sunwell only as something like powersource and strategical weapon (and of course shrine)

[Nnyco]

just play a belf dk if u want blue eyes

[Grythletubs]

My condolences to those of you who wanted high elves. I personally didn't care much but saw no reason for them to not be playable.

[orukam]

How do you change the aesthetic of the High Elves without making them something besides a High Elf? People just want a Tolkien-archetype elf on Alliance, and Blizz has said "tough titty".

This certainly is not an easy job, and as I see it, this is one of the reasons why Ion avoids it at any cost.

I can not speak for others, I prefer not to say that people want tolkian elf.
I can only speak for myself. And to me, what I'm looking for is not necessarily tolkian elf, alias, Blood Elves has a well-deserved Tolkian Elves personality, especially in relation to architecture, dress and culture.
You see, he would also think it wrong to have High Elves Spell Breakers guarding Dalaran for examples.

But your question is exactly what the guys were trying to build together while they were criticized with the Silver Covenant post.

[LowestFormOfWit]

I sincerely hope you get banned for this. Some of you are really going too far.

"Some of you are going too far."
"I hope you get banned for this."

Did you really type those two lines in one post unironically? I would say the presence of a megathread like this is evidence a lot of people on both sides have gone too far.

The fact Ion had to address it twice on camera is also evidence of that. The fact people are still spinning their heads like they were done a disservice or convinced they were entitled to High elves is a real thing that's happening.

At least MMO-C has somewhat contained it to a couple of threads. If you look at the mess spilling into dozens of threads on the General Forums and reddit, it paints a very disturbing picture, and I feel that's worth pointing out.

[Syegfryed]

Except they've written that to not be true. They keep saying it is, but its not.

what, how

The High Elves and Void Elves are the same species as the Blood Elves (that is true)

except, void elves are not "the same specie" one is blue and suck void magic, the rest is normal and use arcane/light, its beyond just politics

and they are fighting each other just like humans fight each other in the real world. That is how Blizzard wrote it. Therefore this is a faction/political thing only they have written themselves into the corner with and refuse to acknowledge they did it.

if that is true why people bitch about void elves?

As for the other races demanding compensation and the same treatment for other races, they can try, but they don't have nearly as much lore or story backing as the Elf issue.

that just another thing, who will say what is enough? again, is bullshit doing with one and not others, just because of backtory

the backstory is that elves left the alliance and joined the horde, the exceptions don't matter

and if you count that, they already give the alliance the elves, just in blue flavor, we accept and move on

As far as I know, there is no other race in game that is on both factions where one side has them playable and the other does not, but they are prominent in lore and stories for both sides. That's the elves. Because Blizzard wrote them that way.

if you mean token appearance as fanservice to be prominent lore we have a problem

like i said, you remove then to any story they appear and they would not make difference, this is not prominent role

Because for whatever reason they couldn't let the High Elves go away

.

misconceptions between the team ( pretty much like the garrosh thing) fanservice to the tolkien cliche, people should just ask to stop, and not want more

That the game was designed for race/faction rivalry is fine, but it doesn't reflect what they did to the Elves. Not at all. What they did was make the elves very human and fight over ideology and possibly faction pride, or just personal pride for some elves,....just like humans do.

yet is not what reflect to the playable race

is not blood elves x high elves anymore, is blood vs void, 2 different races of elves with different themes and fantasies now, we dont need more

[Traycor]

How do you change the aesthetic of the High Elves without making them something besides a High Elf?

I'll use two examples from design ideas in this thread.

1. Swashbuckling Vagabonds: These High Elves live on ships as part of a wandering floatilla. They have no home, and most of their ships are broken down/repaired from the Second War. Their heritage armor would be worn down. Their hair styles would not be the "super model" designs the Blood Elves have. War paint and scars would further emphasize this look. Other races might mockingly call them "Low Elves" instead of High Elves, which would highlight how far they have fallen.

2. Allies of the Blue Dragonflight: The Blue Dragonflight has fallen and is in desperate need of allies. The High Elves are in much the same situation, and could desperately use the magic of the dragonflight. They make an alliance of convenience.
These High Elves start wearing blue scale armor with dragon motif and themes. They might wear "Dragoon" helmets (think Final Fantasy old school Dragoon). They could take up fighting with fist weapons that resemble dragon claws and have monks as their primary guard/troop that represents the race. Blue war paint would be an added extra. The proximity to the dragonflight might give them a variety of blue and white hairstyles.
If you really wanted to push it (this might be too far), one of the skins could allow for a slight accent of blue scales maybe under the jawline or in other subtle areas.

Either one of these ideas clearly separates the High Elves from the "Majestic" theme of the Blood Elves. And they would still be High Elves.

[corebit]

Related to Ion's "You want to be a blue eyed elf? The Horde is there waiting for you."
I made a signature just for that... i'll be using it in the next couple of days or so just for the joke

The joke's on you then, as I see you already have several High Elf alts in your sig, therefore your request is already granted.

[LowestFormOfWit]

I don't think either of those work because they assume High Elves are still suffering magical withdrawls, which has not been the case since the end of TBC.

The Quel'delar questline in Wrath took us to "post TBC" Sunwell, where High Elven pilgrims were granted use and visitation of the Sunwell, hence why more recently eveb Alleria was granted a visitation.

Given the problems her Void magic gave, I'm not sure if visitation rights have changed, but no Blood/High elves are canonically suffering from magical withdrawl with the Sunwell restored.

[RangerDaz]

The joke's on you then, as I see you already have several High Elf alts in your sig, therefore your request is already granted.

They are blood elves, they are not an allied race, and they are not alliance high elves!
I love my horde chars and i truly believe the alliance high elves will bring good story possibilities to the game.

[Enkrypt]

How do you change the aesthetic of the High Elves without making them something besides a High Elf? People just want a Tolkien-archetype elf on Alliance, and Blizz has said "tough titty".

They tried that with Void Elves. Yet here we are. If it's not a Blood Elf with blue eyes, nothing will shut them up.