1. #3881
    Quote Originally Posted by Aldo Hawk View Post
    Ok ok right, so you are just directly not taking on account what i say and just say that my facts are not facts, but opinions.

    But then you are being so blatlantly dishonest that you say that of course VE and NB do not damage the faction wall because their aesthetic look different, and then, just before not taking into account that pandaren still counts even if developers didn't liked them you just don't consider HE being tweaked to look different enought from a BE, just nice, should i take you into account? come on, this isn't hard right?
    Blizzard making a mistake in their eyes, and then attempting to not make that mistake again is bad logic to you? All because they didn't remove their mistake from the game?

    A mistake that a percentage of the players still enjoy? That will have repercussions if that content is cleansed from the game? Should content ever be cut from the game?

    lmfaooooooooo okay

    Quote Originally Posted by Aldo Hawk View Post
    When someone is objectively wrong they are objectively wrong, and that are facts, you don't liking this statement doesn't make it less true, and calling them opinions doesn't make anything, again, speak for what you can proove, not for how you feel.
    No my response to you was for you to understand that your statements were in fact opinions. Get over yourself.

    "My opinion is fact!!!!!!!"

  2. #3882
    Quote Originally Posted by Goldielocks View Post
    You posted this:

    Yet you still ask why people would argue against them?

    Seriously?
    This is literally the "we don't want to blur faction lines" argument. All you've done is explain one of its many facets.
    This is not at all the "blur faction lines" argument, but I'm not surprised you took issue with my initial statement. It's an argument about narratives within a specific race and not the Horde as a faction.

  3. #3883
    Titan Sorrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by protip View Post
    I'm assuming that you're using the fel as an analogy, so I won't get into that.

    On topic, if it's just willpower versus convenience, there's a morally superior choice. There has to be consequences, or the narrative is just that High Elves are Blood Elves who were stronger/smarter/etc. That's not going to play well with most people, not just because it makes the most popular Horde race look bad, but also because it doesn't really make for an interesting story. I mean, it's not very thought provoking if the story is that the better elf makes the better choice.
    As i said before turning to allies of other races vs doing mostly on your own.

    Annd since when has the horde been purely about morals see the forsaken. If anything this would cement be as being a true horde race and even explain further their connection with the forsaken as a do anything to survive group

  4. #3884
    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    The green fel batterries in the be start zone says otherwise
    Except that the fel crystals were used to power the city not as a source to feed the population. And the burning crystals in the starting Zone predate Arthas invasion.

  5. #3885
    Give void elves more natural skin colour and everything would be okay.

  6. #3886
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by General Zanjin View Post
    asking for a change in model got you void elves.
    Hahaha good one, never heard that one. you know why people like rpgs? Because they want to be immersed into characters they create. After years of knowing warcraft strategies and races they saw in this universe. Would they create character of established race or race they never heard of?

  7. #3887
    Quote Originally Posted by Shinkishi View Post
    This is not at all the "blur faction lines" argument, but I'm not surprised you took issue with my initial statement. It's an argument about narratives within a specific race and not the Horde as a faction.
    It's the same thing. The races have narratives just as much as the entire Horde and Alliance have narratives. We've seen them time and time again.

    What makes this important by comparison is that this is the only scenario where a single race is split between both factions. Blizzard needs to treat both sides with delicate care.

  8. #3888
    Banned Syegfryed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andoras View Post
    Ok lets start again.. You are afraid this whole time, that alliance could once get prettier thing. I said deal with it. End
    you are just distorting things now

    i care less if alliance get prettier things, i care if they get a copy paste race with slightest modifications possible that not make sense in lore

    the bulky elves could be ass ugly, i would be against it anyway

  9. #3889
    Quote Originally Posted by Goldielocks View Post
    It's the same thing. The races have narratives just as much as the entire Horde and Alliance have narratives. We've seen them time and time again.

    What makes this important by comparison is that this is the only scenario where a single race is split between both factions. Blizzard needs to treat both sides with delicate care.
    You can make it part of your "blur the faction line" argument. It's not mine and it's not what I said at all.

  10. #3890
    Quote Originally Posted by Shinkishi View Post
    You can make it part of your "blur the faction line" argument. It's not mine and it's not what I said at all.
    That's cool, but by all means, continue this quasi intellectualism you've got going on here.

  11. #3891
    I am Murloc! Geisl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by protip View Post
    I'm assuming that you're using the fel as an analogy, so I won't get into that.

    On topic, if it's just willpower versus convenience, there's a morally superior choice. There has to be consequences, or the narrative is just that High Elves are Blood Elves who were stronger/smarter/etc. That's not going to play well with most people, not just because it makes the most popular Horde race look bad, but also because it doesn't really make for an interesting story. I mean, it's not very thought provoking if the story is that the better elf makes the better choice.
    I think that the people who see it as "a better choice" are kinda the one projecting their own fears. I mean that choice that split them, is really just a choice of idealism vs pragmatism. You can argue that no choice is truly right, it depends on the eye of the beholder.

    Each choice does have consequences. High Elves that didn't go through with Blood Elves lost their home and lands, and possibly families in the process. They gained Alliance friendship sure, but still there was consequence to that choice.

    Blood Elves on the turn around had consequences as well, they lost favor with their Alliance allies and also possibly HE family members, but then again gained the Horde in the process and got to keep their lands and home.

    I think one can always come up with good arguments on either side of idealism vs pragmatism. Indeed these high elf/blood elf debates are evidence of that, not the playability focus but back when people were debating the lore differences between the two.

    I mean now you could say a total 180 of the playable Blood Elves isn't an interesting dynamic to have playable, but I personally think it is.

    And on the Fel thing, I mean the newest chronicles mentions that Blood Elves did Fel siphoning. Not the old lore of "oh they just used fel-powered structures and that seeped into their eyes" so regardless of how this entire topic turned out. The newest lore does say they actually Fel siphoned and how it affected their mind, body, and soul. Does it not? o.o

  12. #3892
    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    As i said before turning to allies of other races vs doing mostly on your own.

    Annd since when has the horde been purely about morals see the forsaken. If anything this would cement be as being a true horde race and even explain further their connection with the forsaken as a do anything to survive group
    Correct me if I'm wrong here, but you're saying that the High Elves were able to get support from the Alliance, while the Blood Elves had no one? Isn't that kind of strange? It seems like you're saying here that the Alliance were better friends than the Horde, so the Blood Elves had to fend for themselves. That would be just explaining the difference by saying that the Alliance is morally superior. There's no complexity to the story, the implication is just A > B.

    To make the story interesting, overcoming the addiction has to have a price. Otherwise, it will just boil down to a demonstration of how High Elves are better than Blood Elves, or how the Alliance is better than the Horde. That kind of story isn't going to pass the quality test.

  13. #3893
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    you are just distorting things now

    i care less if alliance get prettier things, i care if they get a copy paste race with slightest modifications possible that not make sense in lore

    the bulky elves could be ass ugly, i would be against it anyway
    How does it not make sense in the lore though?

    They are all over the place, truly few things say "Alliance" as much as high elves. It's extremely integral to the faction's identity imo.

    It'd be like the old crew has all finally come back together, Humans, Dwarves, Gnomes and High Elves, isn't that nice and wholesome?

  14. #3894
    Quote Originally Posted by Goldielocks View Post
    That's cool, but by all means, continue this quasi intellectualism you've got going on here.
    Sorry little guy, there's nothing intellectual about video game forums, "lol" "lmao"

  15. #3895
    Legendary! Obelisk Kai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    Yeeah no pretty sure it was some off hand comment from 2014 or somesych where it was mentioned the art team loved working on HE designs
    They never said they loved working on High Elf designs.

    Had that been said it would have been shoved into every single topic on this debate since then.

    Please provide a source for that comment that they loved working on High Elf designs. If you cannot, you have imagined it.

    Ion really did make an off hand comment regarding High Elves in 2014, that did happen. However, look what happened after he sat down to think the sub-race system through.

  16. #3896
    Banned Syegfryed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diezel View Post
    How does it not make sense in the lore though?
    we are talking about how high elves would be bulkier than blood elves, and that don't make any sense in lore

    even more if you use the justification of "no magic"

    They are all over the place, truly few things say "Alliance" as much as high elves. It's extremely integral to the faction's identity imo.
    the race who barely make part of the alliance don't "scream alliance, and don't make part of the faction more than others, maybe in the time of lordaeron, but that time is long lost

    isn't that nice and wholesome?
    sincerely, no, it would not, another tolkien cliche of elf+human+dwarfs is not nice and wholesome

    elves left the alliance and joined the horde, thats the "new" lore, set in stone back in the frozen throne campaign and thats ok,we don't need to dismiss that,

    focus the void elves and forget/kill t high elves left, or set then to maybe bring half elves in a future
    Last edited by Syegfryed; 2018-04-29 at 09:22 PM.

  17. #3897
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    you are just distorting things now

    i care less if alliance get prettier things, i care if they get a copy paste race with slightest modifications possible that not make sense in lore

    the bulky elves could be ass ugly, i would be against it anyway
    slight modidications make no sense in lore? i see you didnt see how hafthor bjornson became kul tiran human in 6 years.
    Why wouldnt vegetarian high elf look skinnier than his blood elven brother?

    still dont know why do you insist on that we want them bulkier, whatever is more convenient, i would take it
    Last edited by mmoc09bcb5d61f; 2018-04-29 at 09:25 PM.

  18. #3898
    Banned Syegfryed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andoras View Post
    slight modidications make no sense in lore?
    the "slight modifications" suggested by the high elf fans don't make sense inlore

    i see you didnt see how hafthor bjornson became kul tiran human in 6 years.
    false analogy

    Why wouldnt vegetarian high elf look skinnier than his blood elven brother?
    why would they be bulkier?

    and again, false equivalence

  19. #3899
    Bloodsail Admiral Aldo Hawk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    "differentiate slightest as possible so they still look like the elves but better"

    yeah sure, He fans calling other people crybabies is the juiciest bit of hypocrisy




    cause different hairstyles and tattoos sure make then different enough

    oh no but they can be bulky with no reasons at all, sure, that make sense, even if don't make then "different enough"


    this is just you point of view, if an elf have no magic source, and overcome his addiction,he will be skinny and pale thana n elf who regularly have his source of magicc, is like eating


    you now what represent high elves as we see then? exactly the same as blood elves

    you know what NOT represent high elves as wee seen then? being bulky
    So Blood Elves are 'bulky'......

    And anything you can come is tattoos and hairstyles, not something like erasing the bright from the eyes, changing facial structure, giving them another idle, a slightly changed body (more or less musculated, i don't care) and do not forget about the new voicing.

    Please try harder, i'm not find myself in any trouble to proove myself right.

    Just presenting the idea of skinny high elves just because they don't suck on mana anymore is not how i know high elves should meant to be, from what i know who suffers this way are the Nightborne (and the playable ones at least ate the arcan'dor's fruit, so they don't have this condition anymore), while High Elves are those who feel weakened and in need of mana like a crack addict if do not get a dose, and just converting into a wretched when they consume too much of it, and dying if they do not consume any of it.
    Default dancing over the Obelisk of the Kairos's ruins.

  20. #3900
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    why would they be bulkier?

    and again, false equivalence
    i dont know, you tell me

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