Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Andromedes]

Some of the more extreme players invested in this topic have apparently made death threats against Ion over this.

As much as you think this maybe personal, trust me when I say he has received far worse.

Some anti high elf players also made death threats, apparently one said, that he wants to personally kill every high elf fan,

[Traveler Voltin]

Some anti high elf players also made death threats, apparently one said, that he wants to personally kill every high elf fan,

high elf fans are not saints.
they have been doing the same thing to the anti-HE and towards Ion

[Obelisk Kai]

That logic is flawed for one single thing. Only blood elves are getting golden eyes. The others arent, including void elves

Daz you seem to be resistant to the explanation provided several times that at the moment all High Elves use a set of custom skins with the blue eyes and that the likeliest reason they haven't shown any High Elves with golden eyes is that they aren't bothered to make the update to do so.

There is no real reason why some High Elves wouldn't also have golden eyes given the lore of the game. But given High Elf population numbers, a golden eyed High Elf would probably be unbelievably rare regardless.

[Melsiren]

I mean at the end of the day the eye color was not the defining feature of the BE or even the HE. In theory any member of the SC that is exposed to Fel would have green eyes, that Warlock trainer in old Dalaran? Probably should have green eyes. Pretty sure Alleria was started to have green eyes before she was put into the game, and just being on Argus should turn any blue eyed elf green.

I guess what I am trying to get at is people focus way too much on the ingame eye color representation. In a purely hypothetical world where "HE" were playable there's no reason they could not have green eyes just as there is no reason BE cannot have blue eyes at this point lore-wise.

[RangerDaz]

high elf fans are not saints.
they have been doing the same thing to the anti-HE and towards Ion

That is why everyone must make a collective effort to keep it civil between each other, even if we all can't find a way to agree about this subject.
As long as high elf fans and anti high elf people talk civil to each other, everything will be fine.
This is just a game, and we are all passionate for it, or else we wouldn't be here.

Let's respect each other and let everyone express their own opinion, because that is what foruns where free speech is allowed do.
PS: Nothing againt anything you said. Just continuing the issue about respect between both sides.

[The Stormbringer]

high elf fans are not saints.
they have been doing the same thing to the anti-HE and towards Ion

Nice generalizations, bruh. I'm a fan of the idea of High Elves, Eredar, Ogres, Naga, you name it, and the only bad thing I've said about Ion is it seems like he's ignoring the arguments against the points he's made, and didn't bother elaborating on why Blizzard felt the way they did/were unwilling to compromise.

[RangerDaz]

Daz you seem to be resistant to the explanation provided several times

High elf non supporters seem to be extremely resistant to any valid argument from high elf fans

As i said before, Blizzard is giving golden eyes to blood elves only in BfA. If you find other groups of quel'thalas elves with golden eyes in BfA, please warn me
Until then, i believe Blood Elves are being slowly lightforged, and the others aren't. And i still believe the distribution i made below the Chronicles graphic:

NATURE: Kaldorei (Night Elves)
ARCANE: Quel'dorei (Alliance High Elves) + Shal'dorei (Nightborne) + Highborne Kaldorei (Night Elf Mages)
HOLY: Sin'dorei (Blood Elves)
VOID: Ren'dorei (Void Elves)
NECROMANTIC: Undead Elves (Sylvanas, Undead High Elves, Dark Rangers, San'layn,...)
FEL (HOSTILE): Felborne + Felblood Elves

[Friendlyimmolation]

High elf non supporters seem to be extremely resistant to any valid argument from high elf fans

As i said before, Blizzard is giving golden eyes to blood elves only in BfA. If you find other groups of quel'thalas elves with golden eyes in BfA, please warn me
Until then, i believe Blood Elves are being slowly lightforged, and the others aren't. And i still believe the distribution i made below the Chronicles graphic:

NATURE: Kaldorei (Night Elves)
ARCANE: Quel'dorei (Alliance High Elves) + Shal'dorei (Nightborne) + Highborne Kaldorei (Night Elf Mages)
HOLY: Sin'dorei (Blood Elves)
VOID: Ren'dorei (Void Elves)
NECROMANTIC: Undead Elves (Sylvanas, Undead High Elves, Dark Rangers, San'layn,...)
FEL (HOSTILE): Felborne + Felblood Elves

This however relies on one sweeping the entire magic focus of the blood elves under the bus. Silvermoon, Magisters, you think of magic, you don't think about high elves, and definitely not in the same level of arcane exposure as the Sin'dorei, golden eyes or not.

[FlubberPuddy]

Nice generalizations, bruh. I'm a fan of the idea of High Elves, Eredar, Ogres, Naga, you name it, and the only bad thing I've said about Ion is it seems like he's ignoring the arguments against the points he's made, and didn't bother elaborating on why Blizzard felt the way they did/were unwilling to compromise.

I'm starting to think maybe this is why Wowhead made the article they did on High Elves. I think there are lots on the pro or neutral side that feel Ion didn't even take a moment to glance at the feedback and model suggestions/ customization suggestions that were brought up from the HE topics.

Maybe it was their way of bringing again to Blizzard's view. "Hey did you guys even take a look at this?" type of question. Because in the end no one can really say but Blizzard themselves. Ornyx may have said they were delivering feedback but how quickly does that feedback take to get reached? If it was soon, then wouldn't he have replied back in the threads instead of allowing it to continue?

Just seems like there is a huge disconnect between the few days before the Q/A where the discussion was encouraged to continue and then the tone-deaf response Ion gave that didn't acknowledge any feedback at all.

Even lore heavy peeps like Red Shirt Guy chimed in on how soured they felt over Ion's response because it's plain as day to see that Void Elves existence screws up every reason Ion gave. Not that he minds Void Elves as an okay compromise. So it's pretty clear the main annoyance from most, even peeps like Taliesin is just: Own up to it bro.

I think people are rightfully pointing out that it would've been a lot better to just admit, "hey we don't want to do em" instead of the ignorant response Ion gave. I mean he literally said the exact same stuff he said at Blizzcon, meaning he hasn't refuted any of the reasons given for inclusion of High Elves.

[Melsiren]

This however relies on one sweeping the entire magic focus of the blood elves under the bus. Silvermoon, Magisters, you think of magic, you don't think about high elves, and definitely not in the same level of arcane exposure as the Sin'dorei, golden eyes or not.

I mean the only Bloodelf NPCS to have golden eyes are Blood Knights right?

[Deleted]

Nice generalizations, bruh. I'm a fan of the idea of High Elves, Eredar, Ogres, Naga, you name it, and the only bad thing I've said about Ion is it seems like he's ignoring the arguments against the points he's made, and didn't bother elaborating on why Blizzard felt the way they did/were unwilling to compromise.

Didn't you get the memo? Both pro-High Elfers and anti-High Elfers are two hiveminds fighting with each other.

[Friendlyimmolation]

I mean the only Bloodelf NPCS to have golden eyes are Blood Knights right?

That we have seen so far.

[RangerDaz]

This however relies on one sweeping the entire magic focus of the blood elves under the bus. Silvermoon, Magisters, you think of magic, you don't think about high elves, and definitely not in the same level of arcane exposure as the Sin'dorei, golden eyes or not.

Lightforged draenei can be mages. I race changed my alliance mage into one. This means lightforged creatures can be masters of magic and arcane as well. Blood elves absorb arcane and holy from the sunwell and slowly become lightforged.

[bowlink]

Even lore heavy peeps like Red Shirt Guy chimed in on how soured they felt over Ion's response because it's plain as day to see that Void Elves existence screws up every reason Ion gave. Not that he minds Void Elves as an okay compromise. So it's pretty clear the main annoyance from most, even peeps like Taliesin is just: Own up to it bro.

I think people are rightfully pointing out that it would've been a lot better to just admit, "hey we don't want to do em" instead of the ignorant response Ion gave. I mean he literally said the exact same stuff he said at Blizzcon, meaning he hasn't refuted any of the reasons given for inclusion of High Elves.

thank you. but sadly their doing damage control and we all know well blizzard does that.

real idea 1.0 where a CM's Personal info was used to harras to prove a point
the Azeroth Choppers Fiasco. where they had freaking chris metzen on the alliance camp because they couldn't find anyone better, while he was the horde poster boy at the time.
flying not gonna into detail we all know what happend.

Blizzard needs to suck it up and own up to it.

[ercarp]

I actually like second hairstyle the most. Sixth mark is sick!

Thanks! I tried to go for a Marilyn Monroe kind of hairstyle with that.

Would 100% date 3A and 3B

And 3C gets elf-zoned. Pah!

Don't worry about posting too much art. This is an art post thread. Just look at the OP. Part of what I wanted was for other people to post their art!
The #3 mustache has a VERY different feel from Blood Elves. I could never imagine them wearing something like that. A perfect High Elf look for a people that have been hanging out with humans.

These hair styles are excellent. They feel very different from what we have with Blood Elves. The beads and feathers were a nice touch. Love the shaving into the side of the hair.

Cheers. The feathers were a good call -- props to @FlubberPuddy for suggesting it. I want to do more with beads and feathers for both genders.

[FlubberPuddy]

I want to chime in on the Gold Eye BE topic too. Blizzard has admitted that going forward, you will see BE Paladins and Priests having the Gold Eyes, all other NPC BEs are still going to have the Fel Green.

They just also made it available to all Players, whether the player wants to put it on a BE Warlock is up to them for instance.

But Blizzard themselves are actually only giving the eyes to Paladins and Priests to show the forward progression from the Sunwell story. Doesn't mean every BE can now have Gold Eyes, playable ones can because it's more a gameplay choice to allow all types of BEs to have it (imagine the shit show if only Paladin and Priest BEs could access it?) but NPC ones it's dedicated to those closest to the Light.

Why won't they add Blue Eyes to BEs? Simple, another gameplay reason, to differentiate from High Elves - whether on Alliance or neutral. As you can see with the BE mouth fixes, if Blue Eyes were on the table for BEs it would've happened at the same time as the Gold Eyes.

Also just because the Sunwell is made of Holy Light and arcane, doesn't mean for instance the Holy Light can't overpower the arcane portion of it. Here is proof:

Nightborne Allied Race Unlock Scenario:

Time: 9:13

Thalyssra: The sense of power is palpable. As potent as the Nightwell, but of a different nature.

Liadrin: The Sunwell was corrupted by our enemies, but a naaru's sacrifice purified its waters. Now the essence of the Light sustains us.

I mean be as biased as you want, but clearly the game, developers, and lore are showing that the Holy Light portion of the Sunwell is more overriding than the arcane, even if both are still present.

It's also why in the Chronicles Vol 3 passage about the renewed Sunwell, it says it's a mixture of the Holy Light and arcane. Notice how it gives a proper noun to the light portion? This is to emphasize the power of that specific magic.

https://wow.gamepedia.com/Light

https://wow.gamepedia.com/Arcane

Arcane magic is just the lifeblood of Azeroth:

Volatile arcane energies is described as the lifeblood of the nascent titan of Azeroth.[14]

Wheres the Holy Light is actually some big dick level of magic:

The Light (also known as the Holy Light,[1][2][3] Holy Light of Creation[4] and light of Creation[5]) is an endless, shimmering sea of energy situated outside the barriers of reality and one of the two most fundamental forces in the world of Warcraft along with the Void, which was born from the absence of the former.

Pure Light cannot exist within the physical universe but shades of it manifest as holy magic.[6]

The naaru, enigmatic beings composed of shards of fractured Light, may be the purest expression of the Light in the physical universe. They taught the use of the Light to the draenei and other enlightened races, but others have come into the study and practice of Light-based magic of their own accord.[10]

So there we have it, and this falls in line with how Blizzard is treating it and how the Sunwell is being portrayed in lore. I've never seen anywhere that says the Sunwell is 50/50 arcane/Holy just that it's a mixture or contains both.

The prophet Velen sanctified the legendary Sunwell using the power of the Light, reigniting it as a fount of both arcane power and Holy Light.[44]

But a mixture doesn't automatically mean 50/50 and as I said all precedence the developers are setting is that Holy Light in the Sunwell is overpowering the arcane, even if it's still there.

[Garfurion]

I'm starting to think maybe this is why Wowhead made the article they did on High Elves. I think there are lots on the pro or neutral side that feel Ion didn't even take a moment to glance at the feedback and model suggestions/ customization suggestions that were brought up from the HE topics.

Maybe it was their way of bringing again to Blizzard's view. "Hey did you guys even take a look at this?" type of question. Because in the end no one can really say but Blizzard themselves. Ornyx may have said they were delivering feedback but how quickly does that feedback take to get reached? If it was soon, then wouldn't he have replied back in the threads instead of allowing it to continue?

Just seems like there is a huge disconnect between the few days before the Q/A where the discussion was encouraged to continue and then the tone-deaf response Ion gave that didn't acknowledge any feedback at all.

Even lore heavy peeps like Red Shirt Guy chimed in on how soured they felt over Ion's response because it's plain as day to see that Void Elves existence screws up every reason Ion gave. Not that he minds Void Elves as an okay compromise. So it's pretty clear the main annoyance from most, even peeps like Taliesin is just: Own up to it bro.

I think people are rightfully pointing out that it would've been a lot better to just admit, "hey we don't want to do em" instead of the ignorant response Ion gave. I mean he literally said the exact same stuff he said at Blizzcon, meaning he hasn't refuted any of the reasons given for inclusion of High Elves.

The more Blizzard says about High Elves, the more they would undermine Void Elves so they won't respond any further and any interviewer will probably have to promise not to bring up the subject.

Blizzard repeated the mistakes they made with the Draenei introduction when introducing Void Elves and it will take multiple expansions to fix it if that is even possible.

[ThatBloodElfEnjoyer]

Blizzard is a mother that got one of her children, let's call him Hordey, a toy one day. Blizzard mother gave little Hordey a little pink doll with green eyes. Hordey loved this doll, and played with it for about... 40% of his free time.
But there was a problem, Hordey's twin brother, Alliancebert was insanely jealous of this toy. Alliancebert screamed and cried for his twin brother's toy, saying that it belonged to him and that he deserved it way more than Hordey. After throwing this tantrum for hours, Blizzard mother finally gave in and brought Alliancebert a present. "Open it, Alliancebert, I'm sure you'll love it!" Blizzard mother said, though the tantrum only grew louder and more fierce as Alliancebert threw his new toy across the room. "No! I want what Hordey has!" Alliancebert screeched. "But, son, it's just like your brothers, but it's purple instead of pink. If I give you the same exact toy, wouldn't it not be special any more?" Alliance mother asked, only to be met by more crying and screaming. "No! I want his toy! Give me his toy! It's mine! It's my toy!" Alliancebert cried and cried and cried...

Accurate depiction of the Pro-High Elf mentality circa 2005-2018.

[FlubberPuddy]

thank you. but sadly their doing damage control and we all know well blizzard does that.

I think we will see a reduction in the amount of High Elf topics and I believe that was their main goal, something they're not going to do anytime soon at all so having lots of topic on it right now is pushing probably more forefront topics that they would like to see.

I think as long as people can continue discussing High Elves though, then that's good enough as far as forum-going goes. While I am disgruntled by how they answered the question, I'm glad enough that many are seeing how it was really nothing new at all and just deflection. Whether for just because they don't want to admit hamfisting Void Elves, or the faction wall etc. It's obvious to many that the way it was answered was poorly handled

- - - Updated - - -

The more Blizzard says about High Elves, the more they would undermine Void Elves so they won't respond any further and any interviewer will probably have to promise not to bring up the subject.

Blizzard repeated the mistakes they made with the Draenei introduction when introducing Void Elves and it will take multiple expansions to fix it if that is even possible.

I'm sure they'll keep mum on the subject now. I mean Ion acknowledged "I know i'm going to get hate mail" etc, I think they understand with the responses from some high ranking community peeps that it's best to "stay inside the house" for now lol, before more PR blunder.

- - - Updated - - -

Hey @ercarp your artwork is truly a joy to see glad I could help but you're the one using your magical artwork to bring the ideas to life! Just like @Traycor and Talendrion and all the various other High Elf fan art I really appreciate all the hard work you peeps do!

- - - Updated - - -

And wanted to chime in on the Lor'themar lets High Elves have pilgrimages to the Sunwell. I think people are blowing this out of proportion to mean that the vast majority of High Elves actually do.

If that were the case then we'd see more often in-game and novels /etc where Blood Elves and High Elves have a good relationship. Instead we haven't, the vast majority of times they're shown to be interacting with each other they're venomously hateful toward the other.

Lor'themar "allowing pilgrimage and not denying it" is the same as for instance a pastor saying that other members of the Church cannot stop a certain group of that Church from coming. But if that certain group if already miffed with the vast other members of that Church, most are probably not going to go to the Church anyway.

Allowing =/= everyone is doing it, or even that a majority are. Probably it's mainly a few HE citizens here and there.

But again, I know we have a case of MMO-Citis where 1 or 2 or so beings are considered to be "oh everyone is doing it now"

[Sorrior]

I think we will see a reduction in the amount of High Elf topics and I believe that was their main goal, something they're not going to do anytime soon at all so having lots of topic on it right now is pushing probably more forefront topics that they would like to see.

I think as long as people can continue discussing High Elves though, then that's good enough as far as forum-going goes. While I am disgruntled by how they answered the question, I'm glad enough that many are seeing how it was really nothing new at all and just deflection. Whether for just because they don't want to admit hamfisting Void Elves, or the faction wall etc. It's obvious to many that the way it was answered was poorly handled

- - - Updated - - -



I'm sure they'll keep mum on the subject now. I mean Ion acknowledged "I know i'm going to get hate mail" etc, I think they understand with the responses from some high ranking community peeps that it's best to "stay inside the house" for now lol, before more PR blunder.

- - - Updated - - -

Hey @ercarp your artwork is truly a joy to see glad I could help but you're the one using your magical artwork to bring the ideas to life! Just like @Traycor and Talendrion and all the various other High Elf fan art I really appreciate all the hard work you peeps do!

- - - Updated - - -

And wanted to chime in on the Lor'themar lets High Elves have pilgrimages to the Sunwell. I think people are blowing this out of proportion to mean that the vast majority of High Elves actually do.

If that were the case then we'd see more often in-game and novels /etc where Blood Elves and High Elves have a good relationship. Instead we haven't, the vast majority of times they're shown to be interacting with each other they're venomously hateful toward the other.

Lor'themar "allowing pilgrimage and not denying it" is the same as for instance a pastor saying that other members of the Church cannot stop a certain group of that Church from coming. But if that certain group if already miffed with the vast other members of that Church, most are probably not going to go to the Church anyway.

Allowing =/= everyone is doing it, or even that a majority are. Probably it's mainly a few HE citizens here and there.

But again, I know we have a case of MMO-Citis where 1 or 2 or so beings are considered to be "oh everyone is doing it now"

A real world example might actually be Jerusalem i think it is. A holy place for multiple religions so ot is a pseudo neutral ground buuut those not in control merely tolerate others going.