1. #5041
    Titan Zulkhan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlubberPuddy View Post
    Not twisting at all. He specifically focused on looks for his explanations.
    And he did that to enlighten the fact that the "fair-skinned" elf is already playable in the Horde and you should pick that if you want to play one. It can't be simpler than that, seriously.
    Quote Originally Posted by Keyblader View Post
    It's a general rule though that if you play horde you are a bad person irl. It's just a scientific fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by Heladys View Post
    The game didn't give me any good reason to hate the horde. Forums did that.

  2. #5042
    Quote Originally Posted by Andoras View Post

    And no, pandaren on both factions werent considered mistake by blizzard. Only ghostcrawler said, that he wasnt fan of that.
    Ah ok, not only you dismiss his opinion when he was the head of designers but you also dismiss the fact that Ion's last comment about how they don't wanna blur the faction lines actually intensifies ghostcrawler's comment. Not one single person makes all the decisions for the team, but when they do a Q&A, they talk on behalf of the team.

    Stop being a fanatic for a second and think.
    Last edited by Deno; 2018-05-07 at 07:19 PM.

  3. #5043
    Legendary! Obelisk Kai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deno View Post
    Ah ok, not only you dismiss his opinion when he was the head of designers but you also dismiss the fact that Ion's last comment about how they don't wanna blur the faction lines actually intensifies ghostcrawler's comment. Not one single person makes all the decisions for the team, but when they do a Q&A, they talk on behalf of the team.

    Stop being a fanatic for a second and think.
    Well notice the pattern.

    Ghostcrawler says something they didn't like (and he didn't) and he is just one man expressing a personal opinion. That was and is the standard response on his comments since he made them.

    Ion rules out playable High Elves in the Jesse Cox interview at Blizzcon, and he is just one man or he doesn't know what he was talking about or he is ignorant of the lore.

    Ion AGAIN rules out playable High Elves, even more emphatically this time because he lists the reasons it isn't happening, and again it's just one man.

    There is a desperation among the pro High Elf posters to believe that just one person stands in the way of the realisation of their goal. And it isn't hard to understand why. If it just one person, then IF that person moves on then maybe the next person in that position will be more pre-disposed towards their demand. It also allows them to indulge the fantasy of a tyrant game director, lording it over the rest of the Warcraft development team who would be more than happy to grant the completely reasonable and in no way harmful demand for Alliance High Elves. That individual then becomes the target for character assassination, a face they can blame for their frustration at this particular desire not being realised.

    They simply will not accept the more prosaic truth. That the development team is not a dictatorship and that there is a lot of collective discussion going on. The stance against playable Alliance High Elves is almost certainly the collective attitude of the team, not necessarily everyone but a clear majority, on the basis of preserving the distinction between the factions and that this attitude is probably a part of that team's culture which will persist and survive any change of game director. After all, the demand for Alliance High Elves pre-dated Ion as Game Director and they didn't add them.

    Ion is not the barrier to playable High Elves.

    The team's collective belief that they damage the faction wall is. And frankly, nothing the pro High Elf side is going to do is going to convince the team that playable High Elves don't damage the faction wall because it does, that is an inevitable consequence of playable Alliance High Elves.

    What they have to do then is to convince Blizzard that the faction wall itself doesn't matter. Which is a tall ask when Blizzard regularly talks about how fundamental and important the division between Alliance and Horde is.
    Last edited by Obelisk Kai; 2018-05-07 at 07:56 PM.

  4. #5044
    I am Murloc! FlubberPuddy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zulkhan View Post
    And he did that to enlighten the fact that the "fair-skinned" elf is already playable in the Horde and you should pick that if you want to play one. It can't be simpler than that, seriously.
    No one said it's complicated. But as I already said, that would then imply if people want to play Alliance's purple elves they should go Alliance. But Horde players don't have to, they get the option of both choices.

    It's a comment that doesn't hold up to scrutiny (not that it needs to), but it's still contradictory regardless by the advent of purple elves on Horde.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    The team's collective belief that they damage the faction wall is. And frankly, nothing the pro High Elf side is going to do is going to convince the team that playable High Elves don't damage the faction wall because it does, that is an inevitable consequence of playable Alliance High Elves.

    What they have to do then is to convince Blizzard that the faction wall itself doesn't matter. Which is a tall ask when Blizzard regularly talks about how fundamental and important the division between Alliance and Horde is.
    Not really no, the group of fair-skinned elves that call themselves High Elves are already staunch Alliance supporters so there's no issue of faction wall not mattering.

    That's actually one of the reasons many want playable High Elves on Alliance, BECAUSE they're Alliance.

    What's clear that needs more convincing is how to make the current group of High Elves different enough visually to be playable, just how Wildhammer were side-lined to give the even more different Dark Iron.

    Like I said, people are utterly pants on head illogical if they think no more elves will ever be added to Alliance again. Nightborne and Void Elves just brought on temporary respite from more Elf Races, but their popularity continues.

    Just have to take a look at the 2nd biggest AR potential race: San'layn aka Undead Elves lol

    What HE fans should be on the lookout for will be story progression that follows Alliance High Elves to becoming different enough to be playable. Something that will require more of BFA to release to know.

  5. #5045
    Immortal Darththeo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zulkhan View Post
    If you play deliberately dumb, maybe. But in fact, Void Elves aren't a copy-pasted allied race where High Elves and Blood Elves are literally the same shit.



    Your view is objectively wrong. Here you did nothing but stating your dislike for Void Elves but nothing to prove that Void Elves are similar to Blood Elves as High Elves are.



    That has been the fundamental core of the issue since 2006.
    So you argument against me is I am literally doing what Anti-Helfer do.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Kilz View Post
    No shit Sherlock. However to say that you can't identify a Void Elf or a Blood Elf when you can see their skin at least when you know that they exist isn't an example of that. That's an example of you apparently being unable to see well enough to tell colors.

    Void Elves and Blood Elves look very different. Shape body shape, but very different appearances. So an argument that they're so similar that High Elves would also work is silly at best. Then again I saw people saying Void Elves and San'layn were as identical as Blood Elves and High Elves so I guess being silly is just the norm now. People that want High Elves would rather blatantly lie or conveniently ignore things than admit the truth that they're not getting High Elves and they've been given a valid reason.
    Just because a reason is valid doesn't make it acceptable or good.

    Did you also not pay attention to what I wrote in the post before that one? Did you not pay attention to my goat example? Here is a hint ... goats in general have different color hair than deer. I still had people look at my goats and ask if they were deer or worse sheep ... do you think people don't know goats exist?
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  6. #5046
    Immortal Darththeo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kilz View Post
    They never saw a goat in their lives before that moment so their brain went fuzzy and they said something stupid. Luckily for us Void Elves and Blood Elves aren't rare for the average WoW player to see.
    Don't assume. And Blood elves are far more common than Void Elves ... that's a fact ... so if you see something that looks like a Belf what is the first reaction?
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  7. #5047
    Stop discussing and asking for it again and again! Daddy said NO!

  8. #5048
    Kanye West spoke the truth and his people hated him for it.

    In that moment he was the most Christ-like man since Oscar Schindler.

  9. #5049
    Immortal Darththeo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kilz View Post
    My first reaction is that it's fucking purple and pale white so it's a Void Elf. If you can actually see them you can't mistake them. Void Elves don't have natural looking skin tones.

    Seriously just admit that the difference between them is large enough for people to not confuse the two. A new player could start the game and tell the difference between the two elves. However if it were High Elves instead a new player probably wouldn't notice the eyes at first and think that it's a neutral race.
    If you aren't going to be honest, do me a favor and don't reply.
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  10. #5050
    I am Murloc! FlubberPuddy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yzak View Post
    Essentially, people being petty and not wanting to play Horde, because something about feelings or some other sensibility BS.
    The real pettiness comes from trying to shut down a discussion that isn't harming anyone.

    Do people feel offended there are those still talking about Alliance High Elves?

  11. #5051
    Immortal Darththeo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yzak View Post
    Essentially, people being petty and not wanting to play Horde, because something about feelings or some other sensibility BS.
    Or you know they are talking about something they would like to have happened despite being told no. If someone tells you no to get something you want, do you just stop thinking about it?
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  12. #5052
    Wasn't there talk about Blood Elves with blue eyes due to Sunwell exposure? As barbershop option or sth?

  13. #5053
    Immortal Darththeo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yzak View Post
    Yeah, I do. Especially when it comes from someone that has control over whether or not you get it or not.
    Then you never cared to actually have it in the first place.

    Oh no, they said no ... guess I don't want it anymore. That literally makes no sense for anyone to think. You can accept you won't get it, but doesn't mean you stop wanting it. Those aren't the same thing.
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  14. #5054
    Quote Originally Posted by torish View Post
    Didnt Hazzikostas say that blood elves are high elves?

    I wonder why this discussion is still going on.
    They wanna be blonde and pretty but they don’t wanna play on the evil!!! side
    change can't wait.

  15. #5055
    Quote Originally Posted by FlubberPuddy View Post
    The real pettiness comes from trying to shut down a discussion that isn't harming anyone.

    Do people feel offended there are those still talking about Alliance High Elves?
    I’m offended that he’s told you no more than once but you cover your ears and say that what the game director says isn’t true or good enough for you.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Malacrass View Post
    Wasn't there talk about Blood Elves with blue eyes due to Sunwell exposure? As barbershop option or sth?
    I 100% support this. End this Helf discussion once and for all. Would be great for sin’dorei lore too
    change can't wait.

  16. #5056
    Immortal Darththeo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yzak View Post
    Except the difference is that they are available, you just don't want to play the faction they're on, but sure, lets assume that there's nothing that's been made for you.
    First off, I play Horde not Alliance. I don't want to play High Elf ... I am arguing against the bad logic of the Anti-Helfer side (I don't need to argue against the bad logic of the Pro-Helfers because well, the Anti-Helfers do a good enough job for the most part).

    I have mentioned that I personally don't care if they are ever made playable (though I am leaning to I hope one day they are, just to piss you anti-helfers off) ... I play Horde and I do see playable High Elves taking anything away from the Horde, I can see why people do but I personally find their reasons to be bullshit and in most cases to be actual bullshit.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by united View Post
    I’m offended that he’s told you no more than once but you cover your ears and say that what the game director says isn’t true or good enough for you.
    If that offends you, your definition of offensive needs work.
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  17. #5057
    Quote Originally Posted by torish View Post
    Didnt Hazzikostas say that blood elves are high elves?

    I wonder why this discussion is still going on.
    Mainly because while the blood elves being high elves is true, high elves aren't all blood elves. And this can be clearly seen in game, right now.

    Thus discussion remains, until Blizzard does something with their damned hanging threads of a plotline, there will always be someone who wants to play an Alliance High Elf. Because they are there, in plain sight.
    Last edited by Ithekro; 2018-05-08 at 12:11 AM.

  18. #5058
    Immortal Darththeo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yzak View Post


    Well, you need to do better then. /shrug
    I put in as much effort as they do.



    Ah, maturity.
    Are you new to the internet?


    And thankfully you don't get to decide what does or does not affect people. If someone says it does then it does, regardless how you feel about it. I feel they shouldn't be playable for lore reasons and maintaining the faction wall.
    A wall that has a ton of holes? Yeah, sure "maintain" that illusion all you like. And no, that isn't how it works ... this topic is proof of that.
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  19. #5059
    A faction wall that is meaningless when it comes to the topic of High Elves and Blood Elves being playable. Because both groups exist. One is on the Alliance and one is on the Horde. That is how it is right now in the game. There is no faction wall that needs crossing or breaking because these things already exist in game.

    What people want is to be able to play something that already exists within their faction. High Elves are already there, in the Alliance. That is the entire point and why the faction wall argument is pointless.

    If this was about as a race crossing over the line so someone could play it on the opposite faction, yeah it would be a valid argument and could be very heated. But the fact is, High Elves are already in the Alliance, and have been since the game started in 2004. They never left, and they didn't die. The Blood Elves, who are the admittedly larger population, joined the Horde when TBC launched after having left the Alliance following the events of the Third War (while some would say they left in the aftermath of the Second War, we'll give some agency to the Elves that fought at Lordaeron's side against the Scourge and later had a falling out at Dalaran centered around Kael and his Blood Elves growing magic addition issues (and Naga, and an asshole High Marshal)). Yet the Alliance still has High Elves to this day. They never crossed the faction wall, nor do they have to, because they are part of the Alliance since day one World of Warcraft.

  20. #5060
    Immortal Darththeo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yzak View Post
    Oh let me guess is this the part where you point out VE's, Nightborne, and Pandaren and declare you've proven something?

    Void Elves are seemingly different enough with their skin tones, tentacles, and void transformation during combat. Nightborne different enough with hair colors (I believe) that NE don't have access to, skin tones, and tattoos. And the failed Pandaren experiment that to this date; 6 years later, have not been replicated in that there have been no other neutral races.

    You know what isn't different from High Elves? High Elves. You know what Blood Elves are? High Elves. And what are High Elves? High Elves. And that there is the problem.

    But sure, maintain that delusion of you believing you have a point.
    You think that those races are the only things that break the "faction wall"? My sweet summer child, you are wrong.
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

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