Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Darththeo]

You place undue emphasis on the later and nowhere near enough on the former. He offered merely a soft let-down, a platitude with the intent that if in the far future they DO decide to do this, some poster won't turn around after the fact on another topic and say 'but you said never on playable High Elves so when you said never on this you clearly cannot mean it'.

He gave an extremely clear no, and backed it up with an almost immutable rationale, that the faction wall cannot be blurred. The real debate isn't about playable High Elves, although that is where your focus is, it is whether you can get Blizzard to decide the differences between the factions aren't worth it.

Good luck with that.

See my prior posts. I addressed this. Do you enjoy reading your own posts?

[Obelisk Kai]

See my prior posts. I addressed this. Do you enjoy reading your own posts?

You still seem to be pushing the narrative that 'anything is possible' means more than it did. That is my problem with your stance.

Fine. Anything is possible in the fullness of time.

Doesn't change the fact that the rationale he gave for rejecting High Elves is going to persist over the lifetime of the game, and that to realise the goal of playable High Elves Blizzard is going to have to be convinced to abandon their stance on THE core aspect of the game.

[Darththeo]

You still seem to be pushing the narrative that 'anything is possible' means more than it did. That is my problem with your stance.

Fine. Anything is possible in the fullness of time.

Doesn't change the fact that the rationale he gave for rejecting High Elves is going to persist over the lifetime of the game, and that to realise the goal of playable High Elves Blizzard is going to have to be convinced to abandon their stance on THE core aspect of the game.

Yeah, faction wall isn't the core aspect of the game ... sorry to burst your bubble. It's a minor aspect. The core concept of Warcraft is well conflict ... which is story, it can be a faction conflict or a conflict with a common foe, etc ... seriously, it's called World of Warcraft. Kind to hard to argue conflict isn't the core aspect.

Also, see my posts to you about asserting my stance. You aren't arguing against me and haven't been, you assert my stance and argue against that.

[Obelisk Kai]

Yeah, faction wall isn't the core aspect of the game ... sorry to burst your bubble. It's a minor aspect. The core concept of Warcraft is well conflict ... which is story, it can be a faction conflict or a conflict with a common foe, etc ... seriously, it's called World of Warcraft. Kind to hard to argue conflict isn't the core aspect.

Also, see my posts to you about asserting my stance. You aren't arguing against me and haven't been, you assert my stance and argue against that.

What are you on about?

The faction struggle between the Alliance and the Horde isn't the core of the game?

Everything is built around it. Everything returns to it. It's been the story of the game as long as the game has had a story, with brief periods of co-operation always returning to the war between the factions before too long.

I get that to get playable High Elves the factions have to be trivialised, but thankfully it is clear the developers aren't about to agree to that drastic step.

[Darththeo]

What are you on about?

The faction struggle between the Alliance and the Horde isn't the core of the game?

Everything is built around it. Everything returns to it. It's been the story of the game as long as the game has had a story, with brief periods of co-operation always returning to the war between the factions before too long.

I get that to get playable High Elves the factions have to be trivialised, but thankfully it is clear the developers aren't about to agree to that drastic step.

That's a huge oversimplification and faction struggle =/= required faction wall. You do know there are games with "faction" struggle where races cross factions right? Just because Factions are important doesn't mean the "wall" is important.

[Martaq]

I'm confused as to why this is such a big deal. If you want to roll a 'High Elf' then create a Blood Elf and make it's eyes yellow in BFA. What's that? You don't want to be Horde? Well boo f'in hoo. I'd love to have Horde Dwarves but such is life!

[Obelisk Kai]

That's a huge oversimplification and faction struggle =/= required faction wall. You do know there are games with "faction" struggle where races cross factions right? Just because Factions are important doesn't mean the "wall" is important.

You really don't understand WoW do you? Other games are other games, nobody is going to remember the Defiants or Guardians of Rifts. Or the three factions of Elder Scrolls Online. Or the Elyos or Asmodians of Aion.

Most of those games APED WoW when they invented their factions, coming up with faction based gameplay because WoW had it.

The Alliance and the Horde are absolutely iconic, I would argue that in videogaming no other 'sides' are as well known or as beloved.

Keeping them distinct in theme and appearance is a logical outworking of maintaining their iconic status, lest both sides end up looking and feeling like each other.

Your response, comparing the meaningless factions invented by other games to WoW in an attempt to state 'it doesn't cause an issue there, it won't cause an issue here' at least illustrates you are aware of the consequences of what you are asking for.

You just don't care about them and seek to pretend they won't have an impact, when they will.

I am pleased Blizzard recognised in their response to playable High Elves what it would to the lines between the factions. I am pleased they seek to maintain that wall and therefore the distinct feel and themes of each of the factions. I am pleased they respect their own game, their own story and their own interests.

Because it is far more important that the Alliance and Horde remain distinct than being able to play whatever race you want regardless of faction.

- - - Updated - - -

I'm confused as to why this is such a big deal. If you want to roll a 'High Elf' then create a Blood Elf and make it's eyes yellow in BFA. What's that? You don't want to be Horde? Well boo f'in hoo. I'd love to have Horde Dwarves but such is life!

I'd like Draenei myself but hey, them's the breaks.

[Ithekro]

That would be fine and all except that both the Alliance and Horde have this High Elf theme going on that has nothing to do with the overall Alliance or Horde themes as usually presented (Orc vs Human, with Forsaken and Night Elf being the two next prominent themes). These elves are and have been on both sides since the Blood Elves join the Horde. That's the point that is being made. They cannot be an issues of any faction wall nonsense because they already straddle where any wall would be.

Other races might not have this issue and could be solidly claimed to be one faction only. That is not the case for High Elves and Blood Elves. They have been on both sides since Blood Elves were added into the Horde. Before that they could claim to be on the Alliance and neutral (as the Blood Elves were isolated)

[Deleted]

It is a compromise.

I don't think that world means, what you think it means.

Here in my country, we have women reproductive law, which is commonly known as "The Compromise". Which is in fact nearly total abortion ban, and one of the most restrictive laws in Europe. Few months ago we had thousand of people on the streets shouting "this is not a compromise, this is disgrace" (sounds better in luggage, in which both worlds are similar). Point is, that if opponents of reproductive rights make ever any "compromise" here, then with each other, rather than with ones, to whom this law applies.

I would have problem with calling small and carelessly done concessions taken from the position of power "compromise", even if rejecting to hear one side's actual demands was not as obvious as it was here.

[Ilissandros]

We don't need a third Blood elf faction. The faction conflict has always been the core of WoW and we shouldn't blur the blurry lines even further.

[Obelisk Kai]

Ladies and Gents, Your typical Anti High Elfer...

We aint asking for Blood Elves, We're asking for High Elves there's a clear difference. It seems to me you saw one of Obelisks repetitive lines and decided to use it for yourself please do some research into the race instead of claiming it's just a Blood Elf when it clearly isn't.

I don't know about you but the game director stating Blood Elves are High Elves should be enough to satisfy anyone except the most hardcore pro Alliance High Elf zealot.

He even did it twice.

I'd expect Ion to know more about the game, and have a more holistic approach to the game, than a fan with an agenda.

- - - Updated - - -

I don't think that world means, what you think it means.

Here in my country, we have women reproductive law, which is commonly known as "The Compromise". Which is in fact nearly total abortion ban, and one of the most restrictive laws in Europe. Few months ago we had thousand of people on the streets shouting "this is not a compromise, this is disgrace" (sounds better in luggage, in which both worlds are similar). Point is, that if opponents of reproductive rights make ever any "compromise" here, then with each other, rather than with ones, to whom this law applies.

I would have problem with calling small and carelessly done concessions taken from the position of power "compromise", even if rejecting to hear one side's actual demands was not as obvious as it was here.

Compromise is the best word available for what happened.

Blizzard does not want to grant the Alliance High Elves on the grounds of faction diversity.

They have been consistent on this.

Blizzard therefore designed a variant of the race with it's own flavour and theme to the Alliance.

It allows Alliance players to play a High Elf variant without encroaching on the Horde.

Seems like a compromise to me, and it is a compromise in that Blizzard went as far as they were willing to meet the demand of some Alliance players for a type of thalassian.

That not everyone was happy with the compromise is unfortunate, but they won't be happy unless the compromise is they get absolutely everything they want, which is definitely not a compromise either.

[Deleted]

Why havent they just done it....

[Friendlyimmolation]

Because they are probably afraid of upsetting the Horde snowflakes, whom you have most likely seen constantly posting in this thread even though they hate High Elves and they pass their hate and spite off as reasonable.

Or because unlike some people, they understand how ridiculous it is that some people can't get over Blood elves joining the Horde in Burning Crusade.

[Deleted]

Compromise is the best word available for what happened.

No, i'ts not. As long, as you are guided solely by the belief that you know better what the other side needs, and wants, not as long you offer something that does not meet expectations - because you are not even willing to listen.

Misunderstanding or mistake are better terms, if you do it unconsciously, violent mockery - if consciously.

[Ehrenpanzer]

Why is everyone so obsessed with this shit? Isnt FOUR different kinds of elves enough? This isn't World of ElfCraft. I'd rather them realize that there ARE other races in the game they could spend art assets on to flesh out

[Arrashi]

Fixed that for yer, and as I said it's not Blood Elves we want its High Elves that if you take 5 mins will find walking around stormwind and teaching portals to mages aswell as other places... ignorance and self rightousness must be bliss.

But high elves are blood elves. And they are already playable as horde race.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Fixed that for yer, and as I said it's not Blood Elves we want its High Elves that if you take 5 mins will find walking around stormwind and teaching portals to mages aswell as other places... ignorance and self rightousness must be bliss.

and anyone not spinning themselves up into a frenzy realizes they are the exact same race, it's just as petty if Horde begged for an Alliance race. It's a ridiculous request no matter how you try to package it.

[Captain Douchebag]

Because they are probably afraid of upsetting the Horde snowflakes, whom you have most likely seen constantly posting in this thread even though they hate High Elves and they pass their hate and spite off as reasonable.

Pulling the good old "horde bias"-card always makes you seem like a rational person.

You're vastly overestimating the influence of a vocal minority if you think the reason for no high elves on Alliance, is because they're afraid of making a small group of people angry.

[Arrashi]

AGAIN Ignorance you are WRONG Blood Elves "were" High Elves they cast that aside and their are High Elves who never went down the Blood elf route but you know this because you are just argumentitve and stupid.

Actually devs said that blood elves are high elves so yeah, you are wrong here.

[Ehrenpanzer]

AGAIN Ignorance you are WRONG Blood Elves "were" High Elves they cast that aside and their are High Elves who never went down the Blood elf route but you know this because you are just argumentitve and stupid.

...this is like arguing that 50 Germans moving to Finland no longer makes them German.