Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Obelisk Kai]

Pandaren were mistake, and blizzard wasn't happy with how neutral race turned out to be.

Well I don't quite agree with you.

I think Pandaren are a fine race, but it is the idea of neutrality itself which failed.

Sadly this undermines the Pandaren. When I try and play one it alone out of all the races in the game does not feel right. As if it doesn't belong. At first I thought it was because some people had a point, that the Pandaren just aren't really a Horde race.

But when I tried an Alliance Pandaren I found that the same feeling of rootlessness, of not belonging, followed me.

Neutrality definitely hurt the Pandaren, and has prevented them developing a strong narrative within the factions. There is no point in compounding that mistake by adding another neutral race.

[Arrashi]

Okay but so was flying but now we've opened up pandora's box and we don't get to pretend it didn't happen.

And given the fact that blizzard never reconsidered neutral race ever since, we can assume that pandoras box got closed.

[Obelisk Kai]

Ex-Employee with no actual words from Blizz themselves on the subject so debunked from the getgo.

He was an employee at the time he made the comment. And they haven't added a neutral race in six years despite three opportunities to do so. And they've recently ruled out making another race neutral on the grounds of faction diversity.

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Okay but so was flying but now we've opened up pandora's box and we don't get to pretend it didn't happen.

We can't. Pandaren are there and always will be. But just because they made the mistake once does not mean they are obligated to make it again.

[Sigxy]

Those people don't disagree and put their opinion across they are telling you "You're wrong Im right and you should acknowledge me as correct because your wrong!!!" they're trying to force their opinion onto everyone and continually jump on everyone who posts even new posters who come in quite neutral..

Right, and if people DO try to say you're absolutely wrong and won't even give you a chance to talk back - it's bad on their side, absolutely. You deserve to speak as much as they do and share your opinions. But if they feel like they are bringing up legit things, talking about stuff which even devs said, they have a bit more 'proof' it won't happen. And that means they expect the same kind of 'proof' back. :<

[Geckoo]

They are still same race. Diffrence betwen blood elf and high elf is same as betwen right winger and left winger from same country.

And that's more than enough for some players, if it wasn't this whole megathread would not exist.
Why does it bother you how someone could enjoy the game?

edit: and please, don't just repeat Ion's words, i'm really interested in how could affect your gaming experience if they added playable high elves, how could my rogue being a high elf have a negative impact on your experience.

[Enkrypt]

Given I am far more likely to understand body language that you are, I doubt it. Honestly, you haven't read his written language and yet project that onto me. I have admitted he said no, but it is a no for now, not A NO AND THAT'S NEVER GOING TO CHANGE! ... seriously, you are laughing because you don't understand, not because I am wrong.

No, I am definitely laughing at you. You seriously don't even pick up on written language well enough to see the truth, yet you believe you can read body language better than other people? You must smoke the good stuff to be that out of touch.

You don't ever get to assert what I'm laughing at, Theodore.

[Obelisk Kai]

Bleh fuck it, I can't be arsed getting banned for aguing with you lot anymore, I'll just not reply to this thread any longer.

You've said that before too.

[Arrashi]

Well I don't quite agree with you.

I think Pandaren are a fine race, but it is the idea of neutrality itself which failed.

Sadly this undermines the Pandaren. When I try and play one it alone out of all the races in the game does not feel right. As if it doesn't belong. At first I thought it was because some people had a point, that the Pandaren just aren't really a Horde race.

But when I tried an Alliance Pandaren I found that the same feeling of rootlessness, of not belonging, followed me.

Neutrality definitely hurt the Pandaren, and has prevented them developing a strong narrative within the factions. There is no point in compounding that mistake by adding another neutral race.

But thats what makes playable pandaren a mistake. All pandaren lore is related and centered on neutral pandaren, who are clearly separated from playable ones. On the other hand, both playable groups...were never seen again after introduction ? I mean they have guards near fly points on timeless isle. And Ji/aysa apperance in SoO. And thats all.

Neutrality devastated any potential that race could ever have.

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And that's more than enough for some players, if it wasn't this whole megathread would not exist.
Why does it bother you how someone could enjoy the game?

edit: and please, don't just repeat Ion's words, i'm really interested in how could affect your gaming experience if they added playable high elves, how could my rogue being a high elf have a negative impact on your experience.

And thats clearly not enough for devs.

[Obelisk Kai]

But thats what makes playable pandaren a mistake. All pandaren lore is related and centered on neutral pandaren, who are clearly separated from playable ones. On the other hand, both playable groups...were never seen again after introduction ? I mean they have guards near fly points on timeless isle. And Ji/aysa apperance in SoO. And thats all.

Neutrality devastated any potential that race could ever have.

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And thats clearly not enough for devs.

Agreed. But I still think as a race, with their sense of humour, easy going lifestyle and strong Asian theme really work and add something unique to the World of Warcraft.

So that is why I say that they work as a race, but neutrality is a failure and hurt them badly.

[Gaexion Ramza Beoulve]

Bleh fuck it, I can't be arsed getting banned for aguing with you lot anymore, I'll just not reply to this thread any longer.

Clearly I am.

High Elves aren't Blood Elves, but Blood Elves are High Elves. Are you willing to acknowledge this?

The High Elves Joined the horde 12 years ago, this is now the new normal. Are you willing to acknowledge this?

You gain nothing with HE joining the alliance, you are only taking away from the Horde. Are you willing to acknowledge this?

The Nays outnumber the Ayes, including the lead developer. Are you willing to acknowledge this?

How do you expect any discussion to move forward without acknowledging reality first? The rest of the world has moved on, has turned, and yet this small minority continues to make a big stink over what is essentially nothing. We are all Elf lovers but only one side still harbors such irrational hate and refuses to let people enjoy things as they are rather than what they wish them to be.

We are waiting for you on the other side.

Edit: The best arguments I've seen from the other side are the amazingly talented artists who have reimagined HE as celtic/gaelic warriors etc. This and the other mock ups are the strongest arguments you have, but this circular debate about the validity of a decision made 12 years ago is not. I encourage you to keep dreaming imagining, and producing more manifestations of your dream of Blue Elves, but let's not sabotage Red ones for your petty ego.

[Obelisk Kai]

No, i'ts not. As long, as you are guided solely by the belief that you know better what the other side needs, and wants, not as long you offer something that does not meet expectations - because you are not even willing to listen.

Misunderstanding or mistake are better terms, if you do it unconsciously, violent mockery - if consciously.

The problem with this is that by saying Void Elves are a mistake, you deny why they were created in this form in the first place. To provide a thalassian model to the Alliance that would not impugn the faction integrity of the Horde or undermine the theme and aesthetics of Blood Elves who are High Elves.

The alternative to Void Elves was not High Elves as you might suppose. The alternative to Void Elves would probably have been no thalassian elf at all.

The compromise offered by Blizzard to Alliance players was the model without the theme. In other words, part of what was desired but not all. That is by definition a compromise, albeit one representing as far as the party wielding the power was willing to go on the matter. While you may not appreciate the comparison, it is the compromise of a parent attempting to sate the unreasonable desires of a child having a tantrum by attempting to give them some but not all of what they want.

Anything further than Void Elves would not have been a compromise, but given the pro High Elf community everything they wanted.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Ex-Employee with no actual words from Blizz themselves on the subject so debunked from the getgo.

Now you're just outright trying to revise what was said.

And the classic response from everyone who can't handle it. He was speaking of how blizzard felt at the time, not his own personal opinion, and it's an opinion they still obviously feel judging by Ion's response. Why even try to state it otherwise?

[MauZeng]

I stand corrected!

[Friendlyimmolation]

He was not speaking on behalf of Blizzard Entertainment as a whole and there is NO statement clarifying they stand behind what he said.

He spoke at what they felt at the time, and the sentiment has not changed obvious by Ion's responses at the BFA reveal and later on the recent interview. The only person you are fooling would be yourself.

[Deleted]

You gain nothing with HE joining the alliance, you are only taking away from the Horde. Are you willing to acknowledge this?

Except no. This one is pure bullish for sure, as Blood Elves and High Elves split is still potent, when it comes to storytelling, and faction tensions escalating, and Blizzard is aware of that - using frequently Silver Covenant as preferred Alliance exposure.

As well, as taking all Thalasian themes solely by Blood Elves, does not work in favor of them being portrayed as unique, or kept within original, non generic concept.

[Obelisk Kai]

I feel like im talking to a brick wall sometimes... I wish people would stop quoting me to be argumentive with things that have been rebutted several times over..

They have not been rebutted, you've simply satisfied yourself that you've rebutted them with reasoning everyone else tears apart in moments, then you seemingly complain about people not being swayed by your immensely flawed logic and place them on ignore for not agreeing with you.

And again, if you don't want to be quoted or have arguments, why are you in an internet video game forum!?

[Enkrypt]

1) Blood elves cast off their past to move forward as Blood elves ie no longer reknowned as High elves it was a past tense for them.

2) Blood Elves joined the Horde, High elves remained in the Alliance and are still Alliance to this day.

3) We gain a race we have requested since Vanilla, The Horde Blood Elves gain a more personal rivalry there are no loses in my eyes because both High Elves and Blood Elves have nothing but hate and disdain for eachother.

4) Lead Dev has not outright said no he said "see what the future brings".

And finally I have tried playing Horde in the BfA beta and you know what I have no fucking interest in the faction, I got bored within half an hour I don't care for trolls and I dont care for the Horde politics, sure Zandalar is pretty but to me its fucking boring and uninteresting, so much for "play what you want to play - Ion".

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He was not speaking on behalf of Blizzard Entertainment as a whole and there is NO statement clarifying they stand behind what he said.

Oh, look, you're back so soon.

1) High Elves cast off their past to become Blood Elves. In large part, mind you, to the degree where there aren't enough of them left to establish a playable race. Not my words, just Blizzard's. Y'know, the people who make the game.

2) You're not wrong here. However, if the High Elves were going to join the Alliance as playable and not continue to be a scarce background semi-faction that hasn't done anything notable since Wrath, then Legion would have been primetime. Alleria could have done it with Turalyon's help to usher them into a prominent force. But that didn't happen, and voila, le Void Elf. Have you ever wondered why Void Elves feel like such an ass-pull? It was almost like it was a last-minute decision to not blur the faction lines. But we both know you won't admit that.

3) You don't always get what you request, fortunately. They've provided you with ample reasons why you won't be given the playable race, but denial and delusions perpetuate this argument beyond it's ripening. The race you want now belongs to the faction you're unwilling to play. Hard to pill to swallow, it seems. At this point, for me, it's pure entertainment to come here to witness the poorly made arguments and immature screeches.

4) WatcherDev, aka Ion Hazzikostas, outright said, and I quote, "If you want to play a fair-skinned, light-haired... elf, the Horde is there waiting for you." You conveniently show your ignorance and denial to that statement each and every time you screech "see what the future brings".

Nobody cares what you like or don't like, honestly, especially how you condescend differing opinions and pretend to tell us we have no right to express our opinion here. I speak for myself here, but frankly, I don't want you to join the Horde. You're unworthy of it.

[Deleted]

The Horde Blood Elves gain a more personal rivalry there are no loses in my eyes because both High Elves and Blood Elves have nothing but hate and disdain for eachother.

What the heck do you think the void elves are? I mean I know this entire movement rests on the idea that void elves are just a silly side project, a filler race until the Real Thing (blond-haired, pale-skinned, blue-eyed blood elves with... tattoos?) comes along, and aren't actually the blood elves' playable Thalassian counterpart in the Alliance (despite literally representing the Light vs Void dichotomy, the fundamental rivalry of all creation... ), but seriously. Void elves are already the blood elves' personal enemy in the Alliance.

[Friendlyimmolation]

I've not seen Ion back this statement up anywhere and I've seen no one else from Blizzard backing it up either, its a personal comment from an ex employee.

Did you already forget the interview? "The Horde is there waiting for you."

They aren't going to give your high elves you think are owed.

[Sabajle]

HalfAssElves