Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Thalassian Bob]

Yeah, i know not every HE were in Silvermoon or got exiled, but it's one of the starting points you know? it seems as enought interesting to me.

Yeah, it's a decent place to build on from for a character background.

We would probably need to get know something new and not stated before anyway, if that story could go. Yes, I vote for plot twist, that there were more exiles surviving in Lordearon, and we get to know about it after Alliance offensive there. The most simple way.

It's possible, but not plausible as far as I'm concerned. The reason given for the Quel'Lithien exile is so paper-thin (unless they were all radical vegans) that I have a hard time taking it as canon.

I think a much more plausible reason for a mass exile would be many elves refusing to accept Quel'Thalas joining the Horde because of a hatred for orcs and trolls for what both races did to them during the Second War (and before that where trolls are concerned).

But, I don't think many high elf fans would like playing those exiles because they might have the blood elf green eyes by that point.

[Deleted]

I disagree with whole "radical vegan" rhetoric, cause we talking about power, not food. And about something, what was in first place many years ago important part of Blood Elves portrait as being vampiric, more pragmatic, willing to make controversial decisions, and so morally ambivalent in their fight to survive. I stated it very clearly at first post - I'm strongly against justifying them anymore, presenting their decisions as lacking of consequences. I'm against rhetoric that makes them more, and more innocent, thus forcing straight into classical-elf territory. I even consider restoring Sunwell as storytelling disaster.

These are not elves, whose tragic history and moral ambivalence convinced me to them 12 years ago. They are not just overlapping with High Elves themes to much, but are also far less unique and exceptional now.

I consider this elven differences in ethics as still valid, and possibly convincing.

(...)

Again You are wrong in at least one in one of the points - your personal change of mind is not necessarily here.

As for changing of minds of neutral people - I presented advantages and possible profits for faction distrust story future development, Blood Elves future development and Night Elves future development. So I'ts possible, that I'm already aware, despite not feeling especially desperate.

[Aldo Hawk]

Let me put it into perspective. Blizzard said no. Now, it is of course possible to get your way. But you have to:

Change Blizzard's mind.

You have to change my mind.

You have to convince nuetral people.

You aren't fighting one battle but rather, three. Do you understand how desperate it is?

Calm down, you are not THAT important for us to want your aprooval.

This is not that one sided as you believe, it doesn't happened to come from thin air and as time passes people who want HE have and more arguments in favor than against.

For me, i would not been here if the AR system were not introduced.

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Of course High Elves aren't a neutral race. Not sure how you ever thought I did. You people WANT them to be handled in a similar fashion to Pandaren, and you're acting like they are a precedent for having the same race on both factions.

That argument isn't relevant, no matter how many times you type the word "relevant".

wat...

Okay so now it's me saying that i want a Pandaren treatment on HE, why is that?

Pandaren aren't a precedent to have HE, it's an example of the EXACT SAME RACE in two factions not hurting them. But with the difference that HE would not be treated as Pandaren.

And if i point to you that something is relevant is because it is and i can proove. Damn, i prooved that it is relevant xddddddd

[kaylag]

Hmmm......

[Ithekro]

If there is a heavy Light and Void Theme coming in the future expansions, especially with the early indications that we may eventually have to fight against the Naaru or some other heavily Light empowered groups, it actually makes sense for the Blood Elves to start changing even more than they are now. The Sunwell has started to change them again with its Light-based magic off the corpse of a Naaru. The High Elves, who live much farther away from the Sunwell and we have (to my knowledge) never been given confirmation that the High Elves even still get energy from the Sunwell at distances, or if it has a range limit and amount needed to be absorbed (passively or actively) per year to sustain them. That information is rather lacking in lore from what I can gather. The High Elves on Draenor didn't appear to be effected at all by the Sunwell in any state. Those living far from the Sunwell didn't wither suddenly for no reason. Only those living right next to it seemed to be hit hard by the lose of the Sunwell and the changes that happened to and around Silvermoon. Kael, who had lived in Dalaran did feel the pains of addition once it was gone, but as we have seen, he was someone that was always for more power. The line he got from the Naga might be a half-truth (Old God based lie with a hint of reality), based on other High Elves that survived the loss of the Sunwell.

The Nightborne, the other magic addicted elf species we have represented, were quite literally, living off the Nightwell. So for them to be cut off from it, even by not getting enough Arcwine, would turn them into withered within a relatively short period of time. They do not appear to draw on the energies passively, or if they do, they amount need to sustain their bodies has reach a point were they require direct arcane sustenance until the introduction for the Arcan'dor rebalances their systems to something more Night Elf in nature.

The Blood Elves living near the Sunwell may have been closer to this, but no were near that dependent on the Sunwell. Note that the Wretched are not Blood Elves/High Elves that didn't get enough sustenance from the Sunwell, its those that overdosed on the arcane and later fel.

So the introduction of the Light may start to effect them more as the expansions pass. What plot development this might take on could go in many directions. My earlier speculation is one or two extremes based on if the Light effects them even greater over time and mutates them even more (resulting in another model change, perhaps to angelic over majestic) resulting in the High Elves having the old model and the Blood Elves (who should rightly be remained the Light Elves or something at some point) get a new model. The other extreme is that their Light alignment causes issues within the Horde and essentially they get kicked out for being at the side of the enemy (The Light) and because they are, by then, surrounded by the more Light inclined Alliance (the Forsaken and other Horde members have since left the areas in and around Lordaeron), they are force to either join the Alliance, or return to being neutral/isolationist for survival. These are extremes, but potential plot threads going forwards if Blizzard pushes the Light as the enemy after we deal with the Old Gods threat. Also if they push to have the Blood Elves be the Light Elves group (as oppose to the Alliance's Void Elves) that the changes to the Blood Elves would have to start to become more and more obvious, them mutating more with the power of the Light, since elves seem to mutate quickly with various energy sources (see the Withered and Wretched as extremes but still relatively rapid mutations). This would leave the High Elves in the Alliance as the only baseline elves left in Warcraft (well baseline from the Warcraft 2 day, rather than the Night Elf or Troll ancestors of many millennia ago).

[Enkrypt]

Calm down, you are not THAT important for us to want your aprooval.

This is not that one sided as you believe, it doesn't happened to come from thin air and as time passes people who want HE have and more arguments in favor than against.

For me, i would not been here if the AR system were not introduced.

The only somewhat convincing stance I've seen about High Elves is the existence of the Silver Covenant. But they have not been meaningful or relevant since Wrath of the Lich King.

Please show me another convincing argument that doesn't require mental gymnastics and perversions of the current story that, in short, is: Blood Elves are the new High Elves, and there aren't enough High Elves to constitute a playable faction, which is Blizzard's official stance. As well as their belief that the High Elves are currently playable, in the form of Blood Elves on the Horde faction. And as you read this, I bet you're drooling impatiently to say, "If Void Elves can be playable, so can High Elves." Don't forget, Void Elves only exist to silence the screeching Alliance masses, not to make any real sense. That's why they feel so cheap.

Not a single one of you have refuted that point to a degree that makes sense. Don't pretend the tallies are beginning to add up in your favor. That's a lie.

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wat...

Okay so now it's me saying that i want a Pandaren treatment on HE, why is that?

Pandaren aren't a precedent to have HE, it's an example of the EXACT SAME RACE in two factions not hurting them. But with the difference that HE would not be treated as Pandaren.

And if i point to you that something is relevant is because it is and i can proove. Damn, i prooved that it is relevant xddddddd

You didn't prove anything. You said something, that's it.

Pandaren were added to both factions simultaneously.

Blood Elves were added to the Horde over a decade ago.

The Pandaren situation is not relevant to High Elves, at all. Adding them ten years later to the Alliance is not the same as adding them simultaneously. And obviously the Pandaren race did suffer from being cross-faction. Even Blizzard admitted it. I don't require your seal of approval on that to know it's true. You didn't prove a single thing other than you think the word prove is spelled with two o's.

[Vasaru]

Because obviously NOT everyone want's to play a Night elf with a badly textured fish head that only has one gender...

I mean seriously if you don't want Elves why hang around in a elf thread you're just making your persistence seem annoying.

Because they're edgy wannabe sociopaths who want others to be miserable.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Because they're edgy wannabe sociopaths who want others to be miserable.

continue to dig that hole further.

pointing out the obvious makes us sociopaths because you disagree with us?

Also considering your post history, I can't tell if it's irony or just detachment

[Gaexion Ramza Beoulve]

I disagree with whole "radical vegan" rhetoric, cause we talking about power, not food. And about something, what was in first place many years ago important part of Blood Elves portrait as being vampiric, more pragmatic, willing to make controversial decisions, and so morally ambivalent in their fight to survive. I stated it very clearly at first post - I'm strongly against justifying them anymore, presenting their decisions as lacking of consequences. I'm against rhetoric that makes them more, and more innocent, thus forcing straight into classical-elf territory. I even consider restoring Sunwell as storytelling disaster.

These are not elves, whose tragic history and moral ambivalence convinced me to them 12 years ago. They are not just overlapping with High Elves themes to much, but are also far less unique and exceptional now.

I consider this elven differences in ethics as still valid, and possibly convincing.


Again You are wrong in at least one in one of the points - your personal change of mind is not necessarily here.

As for changing of minds of neutral people - I presented advantages and possible profits for faction distrust story future development, Blood Elves future development and Night Elves future development. So I'ts possible, that I'm already aware, despite not feeling especially desperate.

ME, representing anti-HE side.

You have to change my mind because if you don't I will work against you to stop HE.

I am one person. But Anti-HE side isn't one person, it's the majority. You can create a poll if you got the guts.

[Enkrypt]

Because they're edgy wannabe sociopaths who want others to be miserable.

Says the guy who told @Obelisk Kai to kill himself.

The hypocrisy is strong with you.

[Gaexion Ramza Beoulve]

Calm down, you are not THAT important for us to want your aprooval.

I am not that important. These are true facts.

[Obelisk Kai]

The "they don't bother with it" comes very handy in these situations

Well, if they don't bother, that means there isn't an ultimate proof that Blizzard really wants them to be the same.

For now the cosmetic changes tell me that they want us to see that Silver Covenant High Elves, aka Quel'dorei, and Blood Elves, aka Sin'dorei, are both drifting appart even in physical terms.

Not really, they could easily show a golden eyed High Elf if they wished to. There is no lore reason why they shouldn't. as High Elves also feed on the Sunwell. Because they are the exact same as Blood Elves. That there are no golden eyed Alliance High Elves in game merely means that we haven't met any yet.

[jase93]

Look cooler than Void Elves honestly.

[Obelisk Kai]

Says the guy who told @Obelisk Kai to kill himself.

The hypocrisy is strong with you.

Nah he told Arrashi to go kill himself. I just think it's important to remind anyone who deals with Vasaru exactly what they are dealing with.

[Aldo Hawk]

The only somewhat convincing stance I've seen about High Elves is the existence of the Silver Covenant. But they have not been meaningful or relevant since Wrath of the Lich King.

Please show me another convincing argument that doesn't require mental gymnastics and perversions of the current story that, in short, is: Blood Elves are the new High Elves, and there aren't enough High Elves to constitute a playable faction, which is Blizzard's official stance. As well as their belief that the High Elves are currently playable, in the form of Blood Elves on the Horde faction. And as you read this, I bet you're drooling impatiently to say, "If Void Elves can be playable, so can High Elves." Don't forget, Void Elves only exist to silence the screeching Alliance masses, not to make any real sense. That's why they feel so cheap.

Not a single one of you have refuted that point to a degree that makes sense. Don't pretend the tallies are beginning to add up in your favor. That's a lie.

Do you want some specific sentence that prooves what you want? I can play that game too. And i'm gonna be very kind to you and ask for something easier so you don't feel overhelmed.

Show me something that proove the inhability of HE to be playable for today standards, why is it, and what is the backup of that.

The rest of things you asked for (is not a point, is a cumulative list of points but whatever dude xddd) had been answered here a hundred times and again and again and again.

Is ironic that you are talking about doing mental gymnastics while saying that pointing to where HE are and who they are is a perversion to the lore.

BE the new HE is a lie or a twisted statement as best.

Population issue does not backup, it barely did before, and now it simply doesn't.

Blizzard's official stance is not a true, it's human words that do not support by itself and can be pointed out if they are wrong.

And just with the whole VE thing... are you just saying that Blizzard added a race without intention of it making sense? that Blizzard did it to solve the HE dillema and by that we aren't entitled to discuss? you lack vision if that is your argument, void elves seems like an insult for some people, and not just for people who want high elves.

You seem to screech more than the 'screeching alliance masses' just by the format of your post, it seems written with pain and anger, take a break dude.

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You didn't prove anything. You said something, that's it.

Pandaren were added to both factions simultaneously.

Blood Elves were added to the Horde over a decade ago.

The Pandaren situation is not relevant to High Elves, at all. Adding them ten years later to the Alliance is not the same as adding them simultaneously. And obviously the Pandaren race did suffer from being cross-faction. Even Blizzard admitted it. I don't require your seal of approval on that to know it's true. You didn't prove a single thing other than you think the word prove is spelled with two o's.

You seems to forgot my image on the quote.



If that is not enought for you i recommend you to open your mind just a little.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Do you want some specific sentence that prooves what you want? I can play that game too. And i'm gonna be very kind to you and ask for something easier so you don't feel overhelmed.

Show me something that proove the inhability of HE to be playable for today standards, why is it, and what is the backup of that.

The rest of things you asked for (is not a point, is a cumulative list of points but whatever dude xddd) had been answered here a hundred times and again and again and again.

Is ironic that you are talking about doing mental gymnastics while saying that pointing to where HE are and who they are is a perversion to the lore.

BE the new HE is a lie or a twisted statement as best.

Population issue does not backup, it barely did before, and now it simply doesn't.

Blizzard's official stance is not a true, it's human words that do not support by itself and can be pointed out if they are wrong.

And just with the whole VE thing... are you just saying that Blizzard added a race without intention of it making sense? that Blizzard did it to solve the HE dillema and by that we aren't entitled to discuss? you lack vision if that is your argument, void elves seems like an insult for some people, and not just for people who want high elves.

You seem to screech more than the 'screeching alliance masses' just by the format of your post, it seems written with pain and anger, take a break dude.

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You seems to forgot my image on the quote.

[IMG]https://i.gyazo.com/54b8a5816ae6f7fc081686c320e076eb.png[IMG]

If that is not enought for you i recommend you to open your mind just a little.

god the "Blizzard is wrong because I said so" arrogance is just off the charts.

You can't tell the difference between what is fact and your opinion and you want others to "open their minds?"

[Obelisk Kai]

Is not a personal belief, it is a demonstrable fact by just seeing how Pandaren are built from minute one, and how an allied race, or a different race are.

Pandaren came from the turtle island and just join faction to travel the world and all that.

They look the same, they are the same, they just separate themselves by pure choice without any backside than not being in the other faction.

And even just by that, the only way that saying they are neutral is because from where they came, and that every player starts in the same place, and with the same storyline.

Tell me please, how HE and BE would work as Pandarens, show me da wae.

.

Blood Elves and High Elves are the same race divided by a political opinion.

Tushui and Huojin Pandaren are the same race divided by a political opinion.

This is self evident.

[Traveler Voltin]

Blood Elves and High Elves are the same race divided by a political opinion.

Tushui and Huojin Pandaren are the same race divided by a political opinion.

This is self evident.

and pandaren are mistake in blizzard's eyes.

[Obelisk Kai]

and pandaren are mistake in blizzard's eyes.

The Pandaren as a race aren't but the idea of neutrality, definitely. Pandaren would have been better served being introduced as an Alliance race and the Horde getting something like the Hozen or the Horde getting Pandaren and the Alliance getting Jinyu.

But it is neutrality that damaged the Pandaren and that is sad.

Still, it was a mistake and one Blizzard is unlikely to repeat. Especially as allied races allow them to reuse older models and not create new starting zones, which was a large part of the rationale of only doing one race at the time rather than two.

[Aldo Hawk]

god the "Blizzard is wrong because I said so" arrogance is just off the charts.

You can't tell the difference between what is fact and your opinion and you want others to "open their minds?"

What are you trying to do? if blizzard is wrong on something because i can backup that i'm going to do that, in fact, it is you who is saying that i'm wrong because you say so. Nice try dude.