Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Sigxy]

Given how the insult didn't really work out, perhaps it might be good to go back to the High Elf discussion. I mean, I WANT it to end but that's what should be discussed in this thread.

[Arrashi]

Do you actually not remember the post of yours I replied to? The one that had nothing to do with the topic and was only an insult? It wouldn't surprise me if you don't actually remember. I replied in kind and now you're really mad about being called fat. Seems like I struck a nerve. Don't dish it out if you can't take it, fella.

The post when i talk about people who basically don't agree on anything blizzard does, as long as it doesnt directly pander to them.

And no, you didn't stuck the nerve. You are just random guy all to happy to throw random insults at random people to make himself feel superior. And the fact that you feel like insulting random traits make you "superior" shows what you really are.

[Ithekro]

The Horde has too many troll races (three, soon to be potently five if they get vampire troll elves), while the Alliance has only two troll races, and has been long denied a their High troll elves that have been in the game since Vanilla.

[Shinkishi]

The post when i talk about people who basically don't agree on anything blizzard does, as long as it doesnt directly pander to them.

And no, you didn't stuck the nerve. You are just random guy all to happy to throw random insults at random people to make himself feel superior. And the fact that you feel like insulting random traits make you "superior" shows what you really are.

I'll go ahead and remind you since you can't think that far back, apparently. It was the post where all you said was that someone else was throwing a tantrum like a child based on their disagreement. Yeah, I'm happy to throw insults at people with who also throw them out. Nothing random about it. Not my fault you can't keep up.

[Arrashi]

I'll go ahead and remind you since you can't think that far back, apparently. It was the post where all you said was that someone else was throwing a tantrum like a child based on their disagreement. Yeah, I'm happy to throw insults at people with who also throw them out. Nothing random about it. Not my fault you can't keep up.

Yup, and that was in response to poster saying "its blizzard fault for not meeting our demands, they are wrong". You seem to have problems following.

And it feels you are happy throwing insults just in general.

[Shinkishi]

Yup, and that was in response to poster saying "its blizzard fault for not meeting our demands, they are wrong". You seem to have problems following.

And it feels you are happy throwing insults just in general.

So it's cool for you to just throw an insult at someone's argument but it's not okay for someone to do it back? Like I said, don't do it if you're going to get mad about someone doing it back.

[Aldo Hawk]

Blood Elves are High Elves.

Tushui are Pandaren. Huojin are Pandaren.

Playable Alliance High Elves sole difference from Blood Elves is their political alignment.

The sole difference between Tushui and Huojin Pandaren are their political alignments.

Alliance High Elves therefore de facto turn the Horde's most popular race neutral.

As I said, it is very simple.



Neutrality failed the Pandaren because it crippled any further story potential they can have.

Neutrality failed the Alliance and Horde by blurring the lines between the faction to an unacceptable extent and that was with a race designed and introduced as neutral with a theme of neutrality and a storyline of balance and neutrality.

You are attempting to justify that Pandaren worked when all the evidence we have, including the fact Blizzard has failed to introduce any further neutral races in six years, a dev tweet showing they were unhappy with how it worked and Ion's recent comments indicating that maintaining faction diversity is a top priority shows that the concept of a neutral race failed.

Again, just because you believe the opposite does not make it true. You hold a contrarian opinion because you want playable Alliance High Elves. Because you want playable Alliance High Elves, you are willing to overlook or twist actual facts, or disregard what the devs say, because they are an impediment to your goal.

You argument is hopelessly biased. Of course you will argue I am biased as well, and I admit that, but my biases match what the developers clearly want for the game. This is why I can quote sources, both in game and out, to support my positions.





High Elves do undermine Horde. Again, this is a contrarian position you have adopted based on a personal goal that you have the luxury of taking because you are not a developer. The developers have to take a holistic view of the entire game. If they feel High Elves would damage the lines between the faction, the faction wall, then they are correct and you are wrong. You are wrong because you are biased. You are biased because your goal of playable High Elves means you would be incentivized to minimize or ignore the negative consequences of playable High Elves.

Your final assertion, that HE would improve the faction conflict by giving the Blood Elves a rival, is subjective. While possible, it is not worth the cost to the identity of the Horde and the role of the Blood Elves to allow this thematic intrusion. Void Elves now more than fulfil this role of 'rival' you postulate, given they are traitors that are ideologically opposed to Silvermoon on every level. High Elves offer nothing a Void Elf cannot in terms of rivalry. Void Elves offer the void theme contrast to Blood Elves which High Elves cannot.

High Elves are irrelevant.

Pandaren aren't invested in their factions, in contrary to elves, and their differences aren't threatening against the others, in contrary to elves, tell me why, how can you say that if Pandaren didn't got good stories the same is going to happen with elves?

And you don't have anything pointing that Pandaren blurred the faction lines in a 'unacceptable extent', you don't like that Pandaren are bringed to the table because it shows that they didn't damaged anything.

Really, it's very hypocritical that you acuse me of being biased while writing such an answer going totally against what i wrote without giving more than your opinion. What is all that evidence showing that Pandaren didn't worked by being neutral? maybe it is because they are not that interesting and have the same problem as gnomes, goblins and other races that doesn't have a great amount of story developing? Because gameplay wise they work very fine.

And really, please, stop hiding behind the developers because at this point is just ridiculous, appeal to authority is just an easy escape to say: 'look i'm right and you are wrong because this guy who is a professional on the matter says so', and then not giving anything more factual than that, and the worst thing is that even you twist Blizzard's words to make as they said that HE aren't going to be a thing ever, tell me then what happened with Mag'har orcs and Dark Iron Dwarves, weren't they denied until today? until allied race system got introduced?

Again, it's Blizzard's decision, not ours, what we can do is give facts about why it make or doesn't make sense, but at this point HE makes more sense than the contrary, i'm still waiting for the factor that gets rid of HE.

If you don't even take one of the demonstrable facts that were given in 300 pages of thread as true, i'm sorry, but you are being very, very delusional at this point.

[Arrashi]

So it's cool for you to just throw an insult at someone's argument but it's not okay for someone to do it back? Like I said, don't do it if you're going to get mad about someone doing it back.

The diffrence is that i try to stay on topic. Unlike you.

[Shinkishi]

The diffrence is that i try to stay on topic. Unlike you.

Not sure if you are aware that your post is still up in this thread and anyone can go see where all you posted was an insult and no argument. You're not doing a very good job since your posts are nothing but drivel, I'm just giving some back to you here.

[Arrashi]

Not sure if you are aware that your post is still up in this thread and anyone can go see where all you posted was an insult and no argument. You're not doing a very good job since your posts are nothing but drivel, I'm just giving some back to you here.

It wasn't an insult. It was pretty much a good allegory to mentality of high elf fans past interview. On the other hand, you are guy who considers health issues to be something you should mock. And then hilariously pretend to have any moral high ground.

[Shinkishi]

It wasn't an insult. It was pretty much a good allegory to mentality of high elf fans past interview. On the other hand, you are guy who considers health issues to be something you should mock. And then hilariously pretend to have any moral high ground.

It was a worthless insult that added nothing and it's plain to see. What I consider something to mock is a guy with an ego too big for his head. No moral highground here, since, like I said, all I'm doing is responding in kind to you. I'm basically slumming it with you here.

[Deleted]

Thank You for defend, however to offend or upset me, usually takes more effort.

If I was working at Blizzard and going to design Wild Elf assets for anyone, I'd hand them all over to the Kaldorei to keep them happy. They need someone to pander to the kind of things they want one of these days. As they are now, Night Elves are probably closer to what High Elf fans want High Elves to be than what Night Elf fans actually think Night Elves should be.

On the other hand, the Blood Elves are rudely capitalizing on the whole Light Elf themes and have traded off a fair amount of the edge they once had. This fucks up what could have been an easy jumping off point for developing tangible differences. It's not the direction I'd have chosen for Blood Elves. But I wouldn't have killed off Kael'thas either.

Good points. I'd add, that Blood Elves suffer from tendency of making appeal to classic elf fans as well. However I still believe, that there are ways of portraying elven nature connection in different ways, and developed to the different degree. And I would also repeat my basic thought from the first post - only putting High Elves somewhere in center of that themes, would force Blizzard to do the work necessarily to make other elven races distinct again.

They were never meant to be drow any more than night elves were.

I'm afraid they were. Skin colors are much more drow-like, change in appearance under the influence of Nightwell were much drow-like, motifs of living without the sun for centuries, on spider-like mutants around their settlement, or later allying themselves strictly with the most drow-like in behavior race - those are hints. However I agree, that Blizzard didn't decided to take them any further. It's not suprising. It would not be their first attempt to portrait races described in other universums as villains, in much more positive light.

I'm just wondering if this time it did not go little too fast to give them depth.

Would half elves be an acceptable alternative?

I personally like half-breeds in fantasy very much. Or honestly, I should rather say that I love and favor. And yes - half elves, sounds more like a compromise.

Thing is, Warcraft was never based on halfbreeds, as they rarely allow for strong visual differences. And when You prefer strong visual differences, there is no need to use half-orcs for example, in roles in which you can use regular orcs. Halfbreeds sounds like idea strongly foreign to Warcraft, as they are always destinated to temper racial differences, not highlight them. Hard too say, how I't would work.

However as for justification in lore, for high elves to become different, higher average level of crossbreeding is as good, as ideas of nature shift, or magic induced changes.

its blizzard fault

Nooo.... I clearly and directly stated, for two times at least, that it is Your fault.

Your - as commentators and posters - unwillingness to listen what it is all about, Your cheerful messing with the feedback, and Your simplifications based on bad will, lead Blizzard to waste resources, and stay with problem unsolved. This is how I see it.

pretty much a good allegory

Just as Void Elves are pretty much good attempt to implement High Elves - seeing wild emotions, in actual calm and patience presented

[Gaexion Ramza Beoulve]

Good morning sun. Good morning birds. Good morning cancerous high elf thread. Are you ready for a full day of shitposting?

[Arrashi]

It was a worthless insult that added nothing and it's plain to see. What I consider something to mock is a guy with an ego too big for his head. No moral highground here, since, like I said, all I'm doing is responding in kind to you. I'm basically slumming it with you here.

Nah, you are just a random guy with bloated sense of self-righterousness. Nothing more.

- - - Updated - - -

Nooo.... I clearly and directly stated, for two times at least, that it is Your fault.

Your - as commentators and posters - unwillingness to listen what it is all about, Your cheerful messing with the feedback, and Your simplifications based on bad will, lead Blizzard to waste resources, and stay with problem unsolved. This is how I see it.

You mean people who tell you to get over it and be happy with what you get ? I understand that you want us to just nod and agree with you right ?

[Shinkishi]

Nah, you are just a random guy with bloated sense of self-righterousness. Nothing more.

Not sure where you're getting self-righteous when I've clearly said I'm as bad as you are. Seems like you're surprised someone spit back at you, despite your very poor attempts at banter before.

Good morning sun. Good morning birds. Good morning cancerous high elf thread. Are you ready for a full day of shitposting?

Got started early, boss.

[Arrashi]

Not sure where you're getting self-righteous when I've clearly said I'm as bad as you are. Seems like you're surprised someone spit back at you, despite your very poor attempts at banter before.

Nah im just amused by your attempts....at something. Mostly spewing insults.

[Shinkishi]

Nah im just amused by your attempts....at something. Mostly spewing insults.

Yeah, you seem really amused and not mad at all. Keep it up.

[Aldo Hawk]

Yeah, you seem really amused and not mad at all. Keep it up.

Stop.

Answering.

Him.

It's.

Useless.

He.

Is.

Trolling.

You.

[Shinkishi]

Stop.

Answering.

Him.

I think you've got the situation backwards, considering his reactions. He's not trolling anyone.

[Arrashi]

I think you've got the situation backwards, considering his reactions. He's not trolling anyone.

Nah, its just you thinking you are much smarter than you really are