Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Darththeo]

Here is my obligatory "get my opinion in before it's lost to the flaming/arguing" of this thread:

People who want playable high elves for the Alliance only want to play a white skinned elf character with non-green eye customization(ie: blood elf model) on the Alliance side. It has nothing to do with lore reasoning for these people.

The utter refusal to play Horde as an elf proves it. They want the exact same kind of elf that the Horde gets, but waving the blue and gold flag instead. So you get your blood elf model race on the Alliance finally... only the skin is not white and the hair isn't your typical brown, blonde and/or dark.

At the end of the day it's all ABOUT THE SKIN COLOR!

Pretty much that is likely most of them ... but the counter is that the people who play those elves on the Horde aren't suddenly go "Well, I guess I am going to role Alliance now" if they were to be playable. The idea the Horde is simply the skin of the character is equally annoying.

[Enkrypt]

Funny, in one line, you proved you never read anything I said and yet think you "destroyed" each topic I presented. You clearly didn't pay attention.

You were not only destroyed by me several times, but my colleagues even had a few swings at you. It was quite amusing throughout.

The best you ever did was attempt to insult our intelligence. Which, I must say, backfired numerous times.

[Darththeo]

You were not only destroyed by me several times, by my colleagues even had a few swings at you. It was quite amusing throughout.

The best you ever did was attempt to insult our intelligence. Which, I must say, backfired numerous times.

Yeah, only in your mind ... not reality. And your posts insult your own intelligence more than I ever could.

[Obelisk Kai]

Here is my obligatory "get my opinion in before it's lost to the flaming/arguing" of this thread:

People who want playable high elves for the Alliance only want to play a white skinned elf character with non-green eye customization(ie: blood elf model) on the Alliance side. It has nothing to do with lore reasoning for these people.

The utter refusal to play Horde as an elf proves it. They want the exact same kind of elf that the Horde gets, but waving the blue and gold flag instead. So you get your blood elf model race on the Alliance finally... only the skin is not white and the hair isn't your typical brown, blonde and/or dark.

At the end of the day it's all ABOUT THE SKIN COLOR!

You are of course, correct.

And I am not making that claim just because I am Anti High Elf.

Immediately after the announcement of Void Elves the official forums were spammed by threads known as the Unofficial Void Elf discussion threads.

You can find the link here.

https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20761606896

These threads were the genesis of the latest iteration of the playable High Elf movement. At the time these threads were live, the goal was to 'improve' Void Elves by offering them extra customizations. And by extra customizations they meant normal skin tones.

The number of future pro High Elf commentators in the Void Elf discussion threads agitating for normal skin tones and proclaiming that they would be satisfied with it as a 'compromise' (ignoring that getting the thalassian model itself was the compromise) shows that for a large, large chunk of the pro High Elf community, this IS about the skin tone.

Even Ion recognized the large role skin colour plays in this debate by saying, bluntly, that the high elf fantasy of a pale, majestic elf is the Blood Elf fantasy and that it is available on the Horde.

Maybe a few players out there are are genuinely motivated by the desire to have a High Elf in the Alliance because it adheres to fantasy tropes or because it recreates a Warcraft 2 fantasy (both highly flawed positions in themselves) but I feel a lot of people use that as a respectable cloak for the real goal.

The ability to play a pretty white skinned elf without having to hang out with the 'monsters'.

And everyone who commentated in support of normal skins for Void Elves essentially admitted that, as a normal skinned Void Elf is still a Void Elf and NOT a High Elf.

[Deleted]

Part of me thinks that we're not going to get High Elfs because by the end of BfA we'll get..... Blood Elves.

Alliance fund and arm "rebels" (which also include the VE and HE) in a civil war to take out Bob and put their own chosen Alliance-friendly leaders in charge of Silvermoon. (Maybe some relative of Kael'thas with a claim to the throne)

They succeed in ousting him but he escapes with large amounts of loyalists and soldiers. A lof of Elves are happy to be away from the Horde and welcome the Alliance. Some hated that they joined the Horde in the first place, and others have turned away from the Horde after Sylvasnas recent actions. Ali can create new Elves now, happy to join the Alliance.

The current BE elves are now the exiled elves, stuck in Orgimmar, rightfully pissed off and demanding Sylvanas uses the might of the Horde to help them reclaim Silvermoon, as it's rightful leaders.

Well, i would be personally rather disappointed, in Alliance got those redeemed Blood Elves, with golden eyes. Partially because I don't see them fitting expectations, as they are part of the story about fel sucking and mana sucking already. Partially because that would be a total waste of existing High Elves groups, including this ones, who gave up magic for example.

But first of all, because this is not the way, I like to solve problems. Not only would it take away from Horde capital city, but also light theme. And Horde as well need at least partially light based race. And should never lose on what already gained when comes to customization.

A 3rd isn't needed.

In fact I agree. There was never really need for creating Void Elves, and giving Alliance "just blood elf model with blue eyes". I already called it total mistake, with totally missed existing expectations, as even giving Alliance Blood Elf model was in fact unnecessary to solve problem.

Only true difference between Thalasian elves, and races You recall here, is that division accrued in front of our eyes. Before Kalimdor Tauren, and Highmountain Tauren started to live separately - they once too shared common ancestry as well.

ie: blood elf model

No. Identical model is in fact not necessarily here. It could be done on Night Elf model skeleton as well, and it would still fit.

And everyone who commentated in support of normal skins for Void Elves

Happily, I never suported anything like that. And I say more - I would be rather repulsed by such solution.

I stand for "recreating WC2, and adhering to fantasy tropes" as You call it. And, so accept only solutions consistent with classic elf theme. That doesn't mean a field for compromise is small.

But if we want't to talk about skin color - we came back to point, that there are already in fact three kind of elves with blue skin, on both factions, and it seems to be no problem for that. No one raises voice, that three groups of blue skinned elves (however various thematically, and aesthetically) are "blurring the lines". Only demanding classic elf brings such ridiculous voices.

And restricting human skin color to Blood Elves have in fact no sense. Never had.

(...)

I think pointing, that obedience and subordination are no signs of maturity for me, are quite simple words... But if more people will address my statements as hard to understand, then I will have to think, if I'm able to do something about it.

[The Iron Fist]

You are of course, correct.

And I am not making that claim just because I am Anti High Elf.

Immediately after the announcement of Void Elves the official forums were spammed by threads known as the Unofficial Void Elf discussion threads.

You can find the link here.

https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20761606896

These threads were the genesis of the latest iteration of the playable High Elf movement. At the time these threads were live, the goal was to 'improve' Void Elves by offering them extra customizations. And by extra customizations they meant normal skin tones.

The number of future pro High Elf commentators in the Void Elf discussion threads agitating for normal skin tones and proclaiming that they would be satisfied with it as a 'compromise' (ignoring that getting the thalassian model itself was the compromise) shows that for a large, large chunk of the pro High Elf community, this IS about the skin tone.

Even Ion recognized the large role skin colour plays in this debate by saying, bluntly, that the high elf fantasy of a pale, majestic elf is the Blood Elf fantasy and that it is available on the Horde.

Maybe a few players out there are are genuinely motivated by the desire to have a High Elf in the Alliance because it adheres to fantasy tropes or because it recreates a Warcraft 2 fantasy (both highly flawed positions in themselves) but I feel a lot of people use that as a respectable cloak for the real goal.

The ability to play a pretty white skinned elf without having to hang out with the 'monsters'.

And everyone who commentated in support of normal skins for Void Elves essentially admitted that, as a normal skinned Void Elf is still a Void Elf and NOT a High Elf.

It is amazing how many thousands of hours you have invested into trying to deny High Elves as a playable race. You post non-stop in the official forums, any High Elf thread that pops up here, and even changed your signature to Ion's snarky comment. I'm not sure if I'm impressed by the dedication or feel sad that your life is so unrewarding. Imagine all the constructive things you could have done with your time.

[FlubberPuddy]

First, if its so interesting to you, you'll have probably noticed that at no point in my post did I talk about the existence or longevity of the thread; beyond my statement of coming to read it for my stated reasons, after being prompted by a quote wondering out loud why people came to read it.

Further, you avoided each thing I mentioned in my post, while spamming the 'both sides' button and playing the 'leave Helven Brittany alone' victim trope, which never adds much to consider. Its the forum equivalent of a squid shooting ink at predators before swimming away.

Since it seems as though dutifully maintaining the elven discussion threads is important to the community in general, you're welcome, I guess? Because without people posting here you'd be down to talking about racials and starting zones. Over...and over....and Over....and Over...and Over....

Collectively, if you guys don't start learning to let go of the cookie, its going to keep controlling you.

That said, its none of my business--take care.

Comparing it to not being able to let go of the cookie implies about the longevity/existence of the thread. You can't "continue to keep holding on" without length of time being a factor.

You also seem incredibly defensive about me simply pointing out that your same observation isn't happening on only 1 side but both sides. That's all my comment's purpose was to state. Have a good time!

Debatable, I could just as easily say it's an expansion that makes them money considering how many people tend to return to the game when one comes out. Allied races haven't shown to do much of anything just yet.

Any proof of this? Or is this just more Alliance High Elf fluff that will some how save this game? If your next argument is going to be the "overwhelming" support they got on the official GD forums then it's a rather moot point. Your essentially saying that people that are already subscribed and paying for the game are some how making Blizz more money than if High Elves weren't added, which is a bit of a misnomer as they're already making Blizz money. Now if they were added to the Cash Shop that would be a different story.

I was more on the neutral side, didn't care either way and understood why they didn't want to, but also why they might. But again classic servers are a different beast from that of HE's. Adding Classic servers allows Blizzard to hit three birds with a single stone. It saves them money in having to combat private/pirate servers due to court and lawyer fees, it protects their IP, and it stands to make them a considerable amount of money depending how/if they're charged for whether that is through sub fees or just a one time software purchase.

This all goes out the window considering your earlier quoted statement:

If this were the case they would have been one of the primary races to advertise this expansion with the Allied Race system, they would have been one of the initial six races, and yet they weren't. If they were such a huge draw and attraction that the Pro High Elf props them up to be; ignoring other arguments temporarily (faction lines/wall), then they would have been right there where the Void Elves are.

When did I ever say it was just Nostalrius? I've always ever said private/pirate serverS. But as I said it's most likely a combination of the three things I mentioned above in that they're protecting their IP, saving money, and creating potential to make money.. well four if you also consider fan support and requests.

How does releasing a race which paying subscribers have repeatedly ask for, for years, make Blizzard money? What? Simply look at Dark Iron Dwarves for that answer. Even if they're already paying monthly to stay subbed, race changes are a thing hello?? And race changes are additional profit on top of the monthly sub. This is really, really...I can't even say the adjective because it would get me banned or infracted but let's just say this line of thinking is very down there they even stated the reason for adding Dark Iron Dwarves was because players were asking for it for years, they didn't give some BS answer like "it's way more unique than Wildhammer Dwarves who add not enough uniqueness" etc. It's the same explanation that holds true for if High Elves get added. A way to get more money from existing subscribers, that's the entire point of every Allied Race. A portion may be to attract new players/lost players but the majority are going to existing players.

All I meant with the Classic comparison is that there were those who believed it would never be a thing for the same reasons that anti-helfs are saying for High Elves. That it would be a waste of Blizzard's money/time, that the focus of wow is moving forward (akin to saying Blood Elves are High Elves), that people are only playing Classic private servers because they're free (akin to saying people just want High Elves for the pale/white/fair skin tones), etc. That's the conclusion being drawn from the "No" crowd.

Also again, you seem to be blinded to how Blizzard operates and in fact many businesses do this. They don't blow their load immediately at every opportunity they get, they say what the sure things are can see if it's something they can hold onto for later, if they can then they'll do that. Just like Demon Hunters, they didn't blow their load and release Demon Hunters right at Burning Crusade, and people were asking for them for years, and their reasoning was they wanted to do things for the Demon Hunter that weren't capable with their current tech at the time. Again a case of "just because we know it'd be super popular doesn't mean we'll release it right away" they held off on it for different reasons.

Same thing for Allied Races, you can immediately see this turning its head. There's lots of people asking for long-time favorite races: High Elves, Ogres, Forest Trolls, Wildhammer Dwarves, Naga, Tuskarr, Taunka, etc. Blizzard didn't just blow their load and release the highly requested stuff that's been asked for several years, why? Because any good company doesn't do that, and this has been Blizzard's M.O. for a while. Hence why I brought up the gated content and etc. It's why they say that for instance "Anything's possible in the future" they aren't going to shut down direct access to guaranteed money by saying NO to any potential Allied Race because that's just shooting yourself in the foot. On top of that they want them to make story sense, hence why we see the races we're getting first being added since they have a place in the foreground of the game's upcoming story.

I am not sure I can agree with it. Why would HIGH ELVES make a lot of money? Honestly, it seems like most people who want them playable already play WoW so it they wouldn't gain THAT much out of it.

I'm not sure I can think of -ANY- race that they, ALONE, make a LOT of money. Would they make some kind of income? Sure, a little bit. But it's more about the expansion and the content you can play around with.

You are also doing the same line of thinking that @Yzak is doing. High Elves are the most requested race to be playable. Pretty "down there" to say "mmmm they probably wouldn't make much off of this highly requested for many years, and still highly requested now despite Void Elves existing race." That's how silly both of you are sounding.

[Obelisk Kai]

Happily, I never admitted anything like that. And I say more - I would be rather repulsed by such solution.

I stand for "recreating WC2, and adhering to fantasy tropes" as You call it. And, so accept only solutions consistent with classic elf theme. That doesn't mean a field for compromise is small.

But if we want't to talk about skin color - we came back to point, that there are already in fact three kind of elves with blue skin, on both factions, and it seems to be no problem for that. No one raises voice, that three groups of blue skinned elves (however various thematically, and aesthetically) are "blurring the lines". Only demanding classic elf brings such ridiculous voices.

And restricting human skin color to Blood Elves have in fact no sense. Never had.

I did say there were a few not motivated by skin colour but I reckon they are in the minority.

As for three elf races having blue skin colours (leaving aside that we have FOUR elf races in the game)...well that's not strictly true.

Night Elves actually have more purple skin tones than blue, and the blues one they do have (skins four, five and six) are quite washed out, almost blue gray in fact.

Nightborne have three skin colours, two extremely vivid blues that cannot be mistaken for any Night Elf skin tone and one gray skin tone.

Void Elves are actually predominantly gray rather than blue. Skin two has a blue tinge, and skin four is out and out blue, but mostly gray. There is even a Dark gray, almost black skin (skin 5).

So while there is SOME overlap, there IS substantial difference in the skin tones used for those three elven groups.

As for the Blood Elves having fleshy tones...well, they are the only race on the Horde to have such fleshy tones. Like the Alliance the Horde has many blue skinned (Trolls and Nightborne) races, we have some green skinned races (Orcs and Goblins) but only one 'normal' (by which we mean relative to Humans) race.

The Alliance on the other hand has Humans, Dwarves and Gnomes and soon Kul Tirans when it comes to more relatable skin tones.

So to complain about having too many blue skinned races on the Alliance is a bit hypocritical when what apparently can fix it will be the addition of a fifth normal skin tone race.

And as for your final point, that restricing normal skin tones to the Blood Elves makes no sense...the Void Elves got nuked by Void energy and the transformation manifested itself as a skin tone change. In fact, ALL the Allied races based on an existing model have had skin tone changes (with the exception of HM Tauren who have fur). So this is not unusual as a choice.

- - - Updated - - -

It is amazing how many thousands of hours you have invested into trying to deny High Elves as a playable race. You post non-stop in the official forums, any High Elf thread that pops up here, and even changed your signature to Ion's snarky comment. I'm not sure if I'm impressed by the dedication or feel sad that your life is so unrewarding. Imagine all the constructive things you could have done with your time.

I haven't posted in the official forums in months Josh. I am not sure who you think I am there, but I hope that individual is doing a good job.

[Sigxy]

You are also doing the same line of thinking that @Yzak is doing. High Elves are the most requested race to be playable. Pretty "down there" to say "mmmm they probably wouldn't make much off of this highly requested for many years, and still highly requested now despite Void Elves existing race." That's how silly both of you are sounding.

Well if you think that is so silly sounding...

Which race did Blizzard earn the most money on and how much was it?

[Deleted]

As for three elf races having blue skin colours (leaving aside that we have FOUR elf races in the game)...well that's not strictly true.

And it would not be true for High Elves either, as proposals showed here, at the beginning of the topic, showed skins ranging from current pale, to slightly brown, avoiding a wide arch red colorization, introduced in TBC era.

Moreover, I already stated, that poses used by current Thalasian elves, are also not best for what were High Elves portrayed once as. Which is obvious, since this model was created to present Blood Elf behavior and style. And this statement is not current invention, but opinion I sustain since more than 12 years.

[Obelisk Kai]

And it would not be true for High Elves either, as proposals showed here, at the beginning of the topic, showed skins ranging from current pale, to slightly brown, avoiding a wide arch red colorization, introduced in TBC era.

Moreover, I already stated, that poses used by current Thalasian elves, are also not best for what were High Elves portrayed once as. Which is obvious, since this model was created to present Blood Elf behavior and style. And this statement is not current invention, but opinion I sustain since more than 12 years.

The proposals at the start of this thread, no matter how much they impress you, are visual fanfiction. They have no bearing on the game.

There is no evidence that thalassian elves have a skin tone range exceeding the ones they currently have. Every thalassian elf skin ranges from pale white to a flushed skin tone. There is no evidence for any darker tones.

Even if there were darker tones, the idea that they can be confined to High Elves alone is ridiculous. Blood Elves are High Elves, therefore darker skin tones of the sort you describe would have to be available to Blood Elves also, as there is no rationale reason for them not to be.

Your opinion, as far as I can make out, seems to be that High Elves can be meaningfully differentiated from Blood Elves. They cannot. Redesigning High Elves to be different from Blood Elves yet still remaining High Elves is like reinventing the wheel. And given the developer's statements in the last Q and A, to even stand a chance you would have to reinvent the wheel in such a way that it is not ROUND. None of the artwork presented in this thread comes anywhere near accomplishing that.

Everything suggested from the tattoos to the hairstyles could easily be done with a Blood Elf.

[Deleted]

And yet, it was not done. Cause classical ranger tattoos, as presented for example on Alleria, rather broke current way of portraying Blood ELves. And so they stay unused since decade.

I pointed, that even if implementing such changes for Blood Elves was possible, it for sure would not serve their developmend well, as it rather would push further erosion of their concept, already softened to much since TBC era. Blood Elves with inclusion of those ideas only lose on their uniqueness. And we have already many people complaining, that they are not the same, as they were originally introduced. That they became to generic.

There is no other way for them, to being portrayed again as in TBC era, than make High Elves playable, based on WC2 art, and highlighting differences showed in WC3.

Last but not least - I see easy explanations for those appearance changes - more frequent crossbreeding, different ways of dealing with magic addiction in past, change in lifestyle etc. Much of those ideas were already presented here as well.

You seem to be very tied to what You consider possible... Like You were not present here during great Draenei retcon, when all word presented before, get just turned upside down, for no other reason, than one picture being more "cool" than another.

[Obelisk Kai]

And yet, it was not done. Cause classical ranger tattoos, as presented for example on Alleria, rather broke current way of portraying Blood ELves. And so they stay unused since decade.

Moreover - I pointed, that even if implementing such changes for Blood Elves was possible, it for sure would not serve their developmend well, as it rather would push further erosion of their concept, already softened to much since TBC era. Blood Elves with inclusion of those ideas only lose on their uniqueness. And we have already many people complaining, that they are not the same, as they were originally introduced. That they become to generic.

There is no other way for them, to being portrayed again as in TBC era, than make High Elves playable, based on WC2 art, and highlighting differences showed in WC3.

Last but not least - I see easy explanations for those appearance changes - more frequent crossbreeding, different ways of dealing with magic addiction in past, change in lifestyle.

You seem to be very tied to what You consider possible... Like You were not present here during great Draenei retcon, when all word presented before, get just turned upside down, for no other reason, than one picture being more "cool" than another.

I was here during the great Draenei retcon. I remember visiting the village of the lost ones in the Swamp of Sorrows before the revelation of the new Alliance race but when it was heavily suspected to be Draenei and wondering if they would really be it.

That entire plot has seen been completely rewritten. No longer did Sargeras fall to evil because of his interactions with Demons, instead it was driven by his fear of the Void and the Old Gods. But the key thing about that retcon is that it didn't require them to make an in game change, it merely altered the background information in a way that was fully consistent with the way the game world is portrayed now.

Any retcons used on Blood/High Elves to produce a set of different skin tones would be noticed. They would stand out. They would be immersion breaking.

As for your concern regarding Blood Elves losing their uniqueness due to the introduction of concepts such as the tattoos or hairstyles, having a thematically and biologically identical race join the Alliance would be much, much worse in regards to their uniqueness. You cannot use Blood Elves losing their uniqueness as an argument in favour of playable High Elves, that is a complete contradiction.

High Elves cannot be portrayed differently from Blood Elves because both groups are the same and divided only by a political opinion. Void Elves are what Blizzard ended up with when they tried to differentiate a group of Blood/High Elves meaningfully from the rest of the group. They are the answer.

[Deleted]

IAny retcons used on Blood/High Elves to produce a set of different skin tones would be noticed. They would stand out. They would be immersion breaking.

That's just personal opinion. Distorted by personal assumption, that all players follow this discussion holding their breaths, with the heart on the shoulder. I would rather said, they would welcome end of this topic with open arms, for such little cost as those few new bronze skins.

You ignore the fact, that the said retcon changed completely what the players understood as 'Draenei'. And yet - we are still here. The sky over Azeroth did not collapse.

thematically and biologically identical

Thing is - themes of this races were always slightly different. Parallel - yes, very strongly. But not ever exactly the same.

And if Blood Elves now are recognized only by skin color, then they are already lost. And Horde already lost their most unique race, and even did not noticed it.

[Obelisk Kai]

That's just personal opinion. Distorted by personal assumption, that all players follow this discussion holding their breaths, with heart on the shoulder. I would rather tell, they would welcome end of this topic with open arms, for such little cost as those few new bronze skins.

You ignore the fact, that the said retcon changed completely what the players understood as 'Draenei'.

If you believe the player base is sick to death of this topic, perhaps you can make the first step, accept that Void Elves are the answer and resist from asking for a horde race to be made available to the Alliance.

And no, it is not personal assumption. A group of Elves previously presented as identical to the Blood Elves suddenly changing to the degree described would definitely be immersion breaking and to deny that is just minimizing the consequences of your suggestions.

Thing is - themes of this races were always slightly different. Parallel - yes, very strongly. But not never exactly the same.

And if Blood Elves now are recognized just by skin color, then they are already lost. And Horde already lost their most unique race, and even did not noticed it.

The themes of the High Elf and the Blood Elf identical. To quote the developer, a 'fair-skinned, light blonde haired majestic elf'. A traditional tolkien style elf in other words.
That is not parallel. Parallel is two roads going in the same direction that never cross. This is the same road.

[Darththeo]

If you believe the player base is sick to death of this topic, perhaps you can make the first step, accept that Void Elves are the answer and resist from asking for a horde race to be made available to the Alliance.

And no, it is not personal assumption. A group of Elves previously presented as identical to the Blood Elves suddenly changing to the degree described would definitely be immersion breaking and to deny that is just minimizing the consequences of your suggestions.



The themes of the High Elf and the Blood Elf identical. To quote the developer, a 'fair-skinned, light blonde haired majestic elf'. A traditional tolkien style elf in other words.
That is not parallel. Parallel is two roads going in the same direction that never cross. This is the same road.

How would playable High Elves break immersion? That is really not making any sense. If it does break immersion, how did Void Elves apparently avoid this fate?

[Deleted]

If you believe the player base is sick to death of this topic, perhaps you can make the first step, accept that Void Elves are the answer and resist from asking for a horde race to be made available to the Alliance.

Well I could... If only the High Elf fans ever really requested for "the horde race", as it is for sure unfortunately what they got. Thing is, they asked for the old Alliance race, that differs from what Horde get in TBC, and which is still to some point presented in game.

And no, it is not personal assumption. A group of Elves previously presented as identical to the Blood Elves suddenly changing to the degree described would definitely be immersion breaking and to deny that is just minimizing the consequences of your suggestions.

For one time as identical, for another as different. Seems to depend on Blizzards mood. But more seriously - I remember different behavior from RTS, so I assume, that for example High Elves having Blood Elf poses are just consequence on them having no own model. Would that really be something we have never seen before?

To quote the developer, a 'fair-skinned, light blonde haired majestic elf'. A traditional tolkien style elf in other words.

Praise our lord savior Ion Hazzikostas, the Elfbreaker! And who sounds like sectarian here?

No matter how many times Ion goes to tell people, that he decided, since now 2 +2 = 7, there will still be people who won't admit it, if they do not recognize High Elves in Blood Elves. And they don't.

That is not parallel. Parallel is two roads going in the same direction that never cross. This is the same road.

They made different decisions facing the same problems. They intentionally try to present to foreign as different. They fight each other, they can not have peace or unite.

Perfect parallel as for me. Just highlight differences, not similarities, and You got it.

[Obelisk Kai]

Well I could... If only the High Elf fans ever really requested for "the horde race", as it is for sure unfortunately what they got. Thing is, they asked for the old Alliance race, that differs from what Horde get in TBC, and which is still to some point presented in game.

They are the same race. The devs have acknowledged them to be the same race on multiple occasions. To argue that High Elves are different enough from Blood Elves to warrant being made an Allied race flies in the face of everything we have been told, they are not.

The Blood Elves are the same race as that 'old Alliance race'. They switched sides.

For one time as identical, for another as different. Seems to depend on Blizzards mood. But more seriously - I remember different behavior from RTS, so I assume, that for example High Elves having Blood Elf poses are just consequence on them having no own model. Would that really be something we have never seen before?

It does not depend on Blizzard's mood. Blizzard has described Blood Elves as High Elves consistently since 2005. There are multiple sources for this.

Praise our lord savior Ion Hazzikostas, the Elfbreaker! And who sounds like sectarian here?

No matter how many times Ion goes to tell people, that he decided, since now 2 +2 = 7, there will still be people who won't admit it, if they do not recognize High Elves in Blood Elves. And they don't.

Whether you like it or not, the position of a developer and the team outranks the position of a fan with an agenda. What I mean by that is you want playable High Elves. You are therefore incentivised to ignore or minimize all information that goes against that.

You personally believe High Elves are different from Blood Elves.

The developers have left us know that they do not hold that position. As a result, your belief is incorrect.

They made different decisions facing the same problems. They intentionally try to present to foreign as different. They fight each other, they can not have peace or unite.

If political differences resulted in biological differences, you might have a point. They do not. As it is, Blood Elves and High Elves are physically identical. What separates them is a political ideology. More than that, the vast, vast majority of thalassian elves elected to become Blood Elves.

Perfect parallel as for me. Just highlight differences, not similarities, and You got it.

There are no differences of any note. That is why this thread began as an attempt to invent some. That attempt failed, but the fact it exists is tacit acknowledgement of the truth that Blood Elves are High Elves and therefore High Elves are already playable, albeit as a Horde race. Duplicating a core race of the Horde for use on the Alliance, allowing Alliance players to play that race without having to commit to the Horde, is fundamentally unfair to the Horde.

If you desire to play a High Elf so much, you may join the Horde.

If you cannot stomach the Horde and wish to remain Alliance, the Void Elf variant is available to play.

If you want to play something thematically identical to a Blood/High Elf within the Alliance you are out of luck, the same way I am out of luck if I wanted to play a Horde Draenei.

[elbleuet]

High elves will never be a thing, unfortunately. But new void elf Lore satisfies me. Reclaiming Quel'Thalas (or let's say trying to) in the name of the Alliance, even if we probably aren't gonna see this in WoW is a good step.
Plus the fact Vereesa seems to survive post-BfA, so we'll still get 2 windrunner sisters. I just hope that the Silver Covenant is somewhat involved within the new void elf Lore.

Having normal high elves fighting alongside void elves would be a good start.

[Sorrior]

They don't have HE plans, if by high elves you mean Alliance high elves becoming playable.

They bluntly told you they have no HE plans.

Saying 'I think they have HE plans' after they bluntly tell you they don't isn't even grasping at straws. There is no straw to grasp.



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I suspect this thread is kept open for one reason only, to contain this never ending discussion. Prior to it's existence there were multiple pro High Elf threads as everyone and their mother came up with some new angle they felt justified another new thread, yet it always rapidly devolved back into the same topic and arguments.

By keeping this megathread open, the moderators probably think they are sparing the rest of the forums from being overwhelmed by countless High Elf threads. The moderators on the official forums took a similar stance as well recently and they now actively lock or delete High Elf topics outside of one main one.

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Source please, because I have never heard that said.

Fact you cannot even pay attention to context yet again proven.

No i meant story wise thus why turning them down

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And then this...



Genuine curiosity, what makes you suspect it?

Their constabtly turning HE down implies to me they plan to do something storywise or SOMETHING we as players don't know prevents it. If so they really should have hinted at it.

Buut i am also in the suspecting this is the last faction war camp and maybe the divide between races will go away soon in favor of old god, void lord and light war. We have MUCH bigger fights coming up and much bigger wars. The petty faction wars mean nothing compared to what we have and will fight.