1. #6561
    Date: 29 September 2005 WoW Forums Post by Caydiem (CM at the time)

    There are still some High Elves in the land, but the majority of those once known as the Quel'dorei no longer fit the bill of "High Elf".
    Your comparison with Gnomeregan is a logical conclusion to draw, but incorrect. The Gnomes managed to evacuate a good percentage of their people from their home as it was corrupted from within. Ironforge was close by; they were able to save a good number of their people. Naturally they were indebted to the Dwarves and, by extension, the Alliance, so they fight for their cause.
    The High Elves had less of a chance to flee, as they were surrounded by the vast bulk of the Scourge army as they pressed in and destroyed the Sunwell. Still, some survived, certainly enough to show a presence, right?
    And so they did after the destruction of Quel'Thalas, fighting for the Alliance, but with the destruction of the Sunwell they found an ever-increasing need, an addiction, for magical power. The remaining Elves were placed under the command of a man named Garithos, who was grossly intolerant of other races and drove the Elves into near-suicidal situations in the hopes they would no longer be his problem.
    These remnants of the High Elves -- named Blood Elves in remembrance of their people -- were not stupid, and the commands from their "Alliance" became more and more ludicrous. It was only through the help of the Naga that they were able to survive these grim tasks; time and again, they appeared to aid Prince Kael'thas and his men. The Blood Elves came to realize they could no longer trust in the Alliance. When the offer was extended to join the Naga in service of Illidan Stormrage -- and perhaps find a cure to their addiction to magic -- Kael took it, leaving the Alliance behind.
    In short, High Elves are not playable because there are very few true "High Elves" left -- far less so than Gnomes. While there are Blood Elves in much larger supply, they are busy with other pursuits alongside Illidan. You'd certainly not see them fighting side by side with the Alliance anytime soon, not after such betrayal.
    So Caydiem is basically stating that High Elves aren't Blood Elves here and Blood Elves now exist apart from High Elves, although they were once the same. They've diverged. They are a different faction. What do we play? Factions. He argues here they aren't playable due to numbers. Well, we now know with Allied Races that is irrelevant due to Void Elves and Lightforged Draenei who number less in total in the lore than named High Elf NPCs in the game. In fact, there are less named NPCs of Gnomes, Worgen, Void Elves and Lightforged Draenei combined than Alliance High Elf NPCs.

    Date: 8 March 2014 Twitter post by Sean Copeland
    "@Loreology Are Demons the source of Fel magic?"
    "They contain fel magic, but they aren't "the" source. The nature of this magic is created from destroying something else. "
    "Think "Burn life to create" kind of thing. "
    So remember when the Blood Elf consumes the Mana Wyrm in the TBC cinematic? That is fel in nature. Note her demonic appearance while consuming it. Now remember the quote from Taela Everstride:
    No, don't feel bad. I get that a lot.

    <Taela looks both amused and annoyed.>

    I'm a HIGH elf, not a blood elf. Don't worry, I'm not going to suck all of the magic out of you.
    That is undeniable ingame lore stating that High Elves are in fact, not Blood Elves. I rest my case.

  2. #6562
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sluvs View Post
    So there is lore, you are just trying to ignore it? Got it.
    Wow...are you so desperately clinging to straws that you think a single line makes real lore? Because that is it...a single line of text can explain the "lore" of the Void Elves...don't even need a full sentence...just a single line.

    Sorry but rather kinda sad.

  3. #6563
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yzak View Post
    Pro High Elfers don't need a pat on the back. They need an intervention. They are fanatical towards something that won't even effect them in not receiving it. They'll still have Blood Elves to play. Blood Elves are there to fulfil the typical eleven fantasy, we don't need another. Even though another was given.

    See what I did there.
    Sorry to crush in the boxes of your reality, Blood Elf fanboy. I know its painful.

    There is a YUGE difference between advocating constructively for something you want versus freaking out over a suggestion that has zero effect on you just because you don't like the idea of it. YUGE!

  4. #6564
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Iron Fist View Post
    He doesn't need a pat on the back. The man needs an intervention. He is fanatical towards something that won't even effect him. He'll still have his Blood Elf rogue main to play. It isn't going anywhere if High Elves were added.
    I can assure you Josh I do not need an intervention. This is simply a forum for debate and clearly the existence of an opposing point of view stresses you out. Perhaps you would like to lie down and work some of that aggravation out of your system? I would recommend you retreat to the High Elf discord for further discussion though.

    An echo chamber where everyone nods in approval at your pro High Elf musings seems to be just the intellectual stimulation you need.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by The Iron Fist View Post
    Sorry to crush in the boxes of your reality, Blood Elf fanboy. I know its painful.

    There is a YUGE difference between advocating constructively for something you want versus freaking out over a suggestion that has zero effect on you just because you don't like the idea of it. YUGE!
    I have never freaked out.

    I have never wished cancer on my opposition.

    Or threatened to kill myself.

    Or mused that being denied High Elves could likely lead to a school shooting.

    Or wished death or unemployment on the developers. All of which has been done by the pro High Elf community.

    Nor do I have to freak out as you put it. Lest we forget, the anti high elf side is in the stronger position because our arguments are backed up word of god and lore. Why would I freak out when literally every advantage has been conferred on my side of this argument? And the reason every advantage is on my side of the argument is because my side of the argument is correct.

  5. #6565
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Iron Fist View Post
    Sorry to crush in the boxes of your reality, Blood Elf fanboy. I know its painful.

    There is a YUGE difference between advocating constructively for something you want versus freaking out over a suggestion that has zero effect on you just because you don't like the idea of it. YUGE!
    Like I said...it's a "We have it so you can't" attitude.

    Or they're so vain that the only reason they're playing Blood Elves is because they're the *pretty* Horde race...they don't want Alliance to have High Elves because they're so vain that they'd have to faction change to High Elves because the soft blue eyes are prettier than fel green or gold.

  6. #6566
    Quote Originally Posted by Keihndeth View Post
    That is undeniable ingame lore stating that High Elves are in fact, not Blood Elves. I rest my case.
    And Democrats are not Republicans.

  7. #6567
    Deleted
    About the High Elf discord - anyone knows the link to this?

  8. #6568
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bjoramier of Lordaeron View Post
    can we get some obelisk kai appreciation for taking the time out of his life to reply to this thread after several months now?
    You joined this website in July 2015 and since that time you have made one and a half times the posts I have in nearly six years.

    Hypocrisy has a name, and it is Bjoramier of Lordaeron.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Sorotia View Post
    Like I said...it's a "We have it so you can't" attitude.

    Or they're so vain that the only reason they're playing Blood Elves is because they're the *pretty* Horde race...they don't want Alliance to have High Elves because they're so vain that they'd have to faction change to High Elves because the soft blue eyes are prettier than fel green or gold.
    You've been informed multiple times that the reason for our opposition to playable Alliance High Elves is to preserve the integrity of our faction and to respect the Blood Elf storyline.

    Saying it's all about being petty and selfish is just a convenient strawman for you so you don't have to consider the other side of the argument.

    You know, the one with the all the evidence and developer support?

  9. #6569
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yzak View Post
    Right, I'm; and anyone, speaking against High Elves are the ones freaking out.



    But these have happened in this very thread and High Elf discord.

    But yep, ya got me. Ma poor reality and ma poor mentality! Not really replying to you Kai, you; as usual, beat me to the punch.
    Obelisk Kai is outright lying about the High Elf discord. Never seen such a discussion or comments in it as he suggests. Maybe in these forums as I haven't followed, but not in the High Elf discord, which I started following after Taliesin and Evitel suggested it and Alurna's thread. How would he even know unless he has a stealth account on there, which in and of itself should show how nuts he's gone over the topic if he's gone to those lengths.

  10. #6570
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Iron Fist View Post
    Obelisk Kai is outright lying about the High Elf discord. Never seen such a discussion or comments in it as he suggests. Maybe in these forums as I haven't followed, but not in the High Elf discord, which I started following after Taliesin and Evitel suggested it and Alurna's thread. How would he even know unless he has a stealth account on there, which in and of itself should show how nuts he's gone over the topic if he's gone to those lengths.
    I have never been on the High Elf discord.

    Others have and shared interesting screenshots which the moderators then asked weren't posted, so none have been posted since.

    But all of those events I listed have occurred, and to accuse me of lying shows you are jumping to conclusions without any evidence.

    So a typical pro High Elf position then.

  11. #6571
    Can't we just have the Silver Covenant disband? Seriously. Give Blood Elves a blue eye tint, kill Vareesa, have them welcomed back in to Quel'Thalas. Then blow up Dalaran. Problem solved.

  12. #6572
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yzak View Post
    There's screen shots from the Discord in this very thread regarding this, unless they've been removed. It's very real and absolutely true.
    The were removed. It was Zorish I think posting them, and the High Elf discord people got upset and they pm'ed the mods here and then they pm'ed Zorish and asked he not do it anymore. He agreed and that was that.

    Besides, the examples I listed mostly happened on twitter and here.

  13. #6573
    Quote Originally Posted by Yzak View Post
    There's screen shots from the Discord in this very thread regarding this, unless they've been removed. It's very real and absolutely true.
    If you think that threats of violence are unique to the High Elf people, you should see the threats of violence I have received for my videos. There are always quacks on both sides. Don't act like they all come from the High Elf side.

  14. #6574
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keihndeth View Post
    If you think that threats of violence are unique to the High Elf people, you should see the threats of violence I have received for my videos. There are always quacks on both sides. Don't act like they all come from the High Elf side.
    Yup, plus the anti-helf side has had people actually DO things such as removing wowpedia entries about High Elves (which got fixed but is there in the history) and also when the High Elf discord peeps made a Google Drive full of their High Elf fanart to send to Chris Robinson, some anti-helfer replaced it with bunch of pics of Trolls killing Elves and the like (which also got fixed and luckily fixed quickly before Chris Robinson saw those troll-y pics).

    So in essence it's kind of dumb to say "well this side SAID these things!" vs the side that actually DID real world stuff (inb4 'those sole actions don't rep all anti-helfers).

    Well no shit the actions of a few don't rep the actions of many, but it's funny to see that these anti-helfers who've been back and forth into this thread acting as if some from the anti-helf side did nothing similar, if not worse, than some pro-helfers.

  15. #6575
    Quote Originally Posted by FlubberPuddy View Post
    Yup, plus the anti-helf side has had people actually DO things such as removing wowpedia entries about High Elves (which got fixed but is there in the history) and also when the High Elf discord peeps made a Google Drive full of their High Elf fanart to send to Chris Robinson, some anti-helfer replaced it with bunch of pics of Trolls killing Elves and the like (which also got fixed and luckily fixed quickly before Chris Robinson saw those troll-y pics).

    So in essence it's kind of dumb to say "well this side SAID these things!" vs the side that actually DID real world stuff (inb4 'those sole actions don't rep all anti-helfers).

    Well no shit the actions of a few don't rep the actions of many, but it's funny to see that these anti-helfers who've been back and forth into this thread acting as if some from the anti-helf side did nothing similar, if not worse, than some pro-helfers.
    I'm really curious why would someone bother to threaten the "high elf" people, since high elves are not even planned in the near or distant future, from a chief dev's mouth. I mean it's not like I can't imagine getting some moron getting all emotional and making threats, but the way people act here, it's like they get showered with threats constantly.

    If it is true, it sucks, if not, it's really not helping the "cause". It just makes it more annoying.

  16. #6576
    Quote Originally Posted by Clearcut View Post
    If high elves are not blood elves then who are the blood elves exactly?
    Blood elves are a new version of the old high elves. different beliefs...but before you go bla bla bla here a INGAME bit clearly stating that they something DIFFERENT:




    Quote Originally Posted by Clearcut View Post
    What the actual fuck is this clusterfuck of petulant crying and nonsense? There are horde exclusive raids now? Horde are the only faction with druid forms? cool races? win most of the battles? Losing and gaining more heroes what are you on about seriously, if horde gets so much better then go play horde and you will finally get to play your stupid barbie high elf.
    Raids: First raid is horde ( about them and their faction). Second raid is alliance just like in WoD...oohhh wait the cancelled that raid.
    Druid forms: Cool new druid forms. Horde get different forms that look like dino's. We get a bunch of sticks. That all are the same texture but stretch to meet the form. They are very light in the legs ( see through), bland in the body ( nothing their but fur), and then a very very busy skull. Very poor design the whole body should have been like legs or head. Furthermore the head is pretty much the same on most of the forms. And the cat a bear form are just a before and after for a diet commercial.
    Cool races:
    Horde: very though warrior orcs, thought warrior tauren, Strong magic elves, Cool epic trolls < all of them have great story before and options for later.
    Alliance: Cool iron dwarfs , fantatic paladins 2.0 who look just like there normal parts ( more the tauren do), Addicted ( out of city kicked) elves, fat humans ( yes they are fat and not bulky) that are supposed to be a epic navy. But look more like some fat inbred dummy's. < only dark iron have and will have great story potential. The rest has to few people in it to matter.
    battle's:Alliance loose pretty much 3 zones ( night elf ones), gets their fleet destroyed by zandalari And 1 fleet is lost, SW is burned. Horde looses lordaroan...yeah seems about even.
    hero:We loose Lady Greyman, Celia Menathil and Jaina's brother body gets taken by the forsaken to be ressed and used. against.....?
    Mounts: Horde gets all kind of new animals. Alliance gets more horses to add to the 28 we can get ( that does not include class and raid mounts btw :P then the number is in the 40).

    Why? because you are not that smart. Its not that i think we need the high elves. But after so much(or better said less) alliance stuff. 1 good thing would be nice.

  17. #6577
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evilfish View Post
    I'm really curious why would someone bother to threaten the "high elf" people, since high elves are not even planned in the near or distant future, from a chief dev's mouth. I mean it's not like I can't imagine getting some moron getting all emotional and making threats, but the way people act here, it's like they get showered with threats constantly.

    If it is true, it sucks, if not, it's really not helping the "cause". It just makes it more annoying.
    The internet allowing for as much anonymity that it does leads some really shitty people to do those shitty type of things. It's why Live Streamers are pretty hush hush on where they live or even the vicinity of where they live by.

  18. #6578
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    @baskev So you admit that blood elves are high elves then? If you want some more ingame stuff feel free to read the actual official blood elf page on blizzards website: https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/game/races/blood-elf
    Most notably:
    "As a result, Kael’thas desperately searched for a means to help his people—whom he had renamed the blood elves—and thus he set out for the shattered world of Outland. "
    It's been the same dialog since the blood elves were introduced back in TBC, and summarizes the events of warcraft 3, both of which happened long long long before Ion joined blizzard, it is not just his opinion that blood elves are high elves, it is the exact story that blizzard as a whole, back in early 2000's wrote for them.

    I am not even going to bother with the rest because it's all opinionated nonsense where you think that there is some horde bias simply because you personally dislike some things in the game. The same game that has had an actual raid tier dedicated to raiding the hordes capital city to kill their second warchief, then kill off their third warchief right after being initiated simply to even up the fact that the alliance were going to lose their king as a part of the plot line to appease people like yourself who have it in their heads that 'factions are not allowed to lose something unless the other faction loses something, unless again it is their faction that doesn't lose anything then by all means screw the other faction because i do not play it'.

    This is pretty much the end of the discussion for me because it will be like talking to a brick wall, especially reading your signature where you come across as the stereotype who i genuinely thought was just a meme where people seem to completely forget that the horde and alliance are just factions in a video game, they are not real. This discussion feels like trying to debate with a flat earther or someone who thinks that there is 50+ different genders, no matter what i say will change your mind, but no matter what you say the facts will always be the same, Blood Elves are High Elves.
    Last edited by mmoc1448478633; 2018-06-27 at 09:15 PM.

  19. #6579
    Quote Originally Posted by Clearcut View Post
    @baskev So you admit that blood elves are high elves then? If you want some more ingame stuff feel free to read the actual official blood elf page on blizzards website: https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/game/races/blood-elf
    Most notably:
    "As a result, Kael’thas desperately searched for a means to help his people—whom he had renamed the blood elves—and thus he set out for the shattered world of Outland. "
    It's been the same dialog since the blood elves were introduced back in TBC, and summarizes the events of warcraft 3, both of which happened long long long before Ion joined blizzard, it is not just his opinion that blood elves are high elves, it is the exact story that blizzard as a whole, back in early 2000's wrote for them.

    I am not even going to bother with the rest because it's all opinionated nonsense where you think that there is some horde bias simply because you personally dislike some things in the game. The same game that has had an actual raid tier dedicated to raiding the hordes capital city to kill their second warchief, then kill off their third warchief right after being initiated simply to even up the fact that the alliance were going to lose their king as a part of the plot line to appease people like yourself who have it in their heads that 'factions are not allowed to lose something unless the other faction loses something, unless again it is their faction that doesn't lose anything then by all means screw the other faction because i do not play it'.

    This is pretty much the end of the discussion for me because it will be like talking to a brick wall, especially reading your signature where you come across as the stereotype who i genuinely thought was just a meme where people seem to completely forget that the horde and alliance are just factions in a video game, they are not real. This discussion feels like trying to debate with a flat earther or someone who thinks that there is 50+ different genders, no matter what i say will change your mind, but no matter what you say the facts will always be the same, Blood Elves are High Elves.
    /thread well done sir. There's literally nothing to discuss past this.

  20. #6580
    Blizzard thinks they can have it both ways: constantly use the Silver Covenant and High Elves as Alliance NPCs and in the Alliance storyline, and claim that they are Blood Elves at the same time. Well, I guess by that logic then Blood Elves are in the wrong faction, huh? Maybe we should just campaign to move the entire Blood Elf population over to the Alliance. I mean, that is their logic, afterall. Might as well keep it consistent.

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