Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Aldo Hawk]

Not with the belfs around. I'm afraid the only thing they'd add is more gateways to whining about what the Belfs have which is, pretty much, the basis of the Helf crusade.

To anyone else who isn't an enraged helf fan, it's the second belf copy.

What you said is completelly irrelevant, just saying.

[Maxilian]

Why not just give out high elf skintones and blue eyes so we are hiding the void like little miss windrunner does

Well in the Blizzcon, they did mention that they were looking into the idea of giving the Void Elves customization option to look like HE (Hope that include tattoos and all that)

[FlubberPuddy]

Oh boy still you've completely missed the point, now I know it's intentional.

You honestly think having sex with humans means that they put twigs in their hair and paint their faces?

Explain to me why Silvermoon rangers, the ones who are out in the woods, fighting trolls, fighting anything that intrudes on their borders would not use camouflage, why any of them wouldn't have the tattoos you try to say would only be a high elf thing. Would a tattoo'd rangers markings simply vanish the moment he declared himself a blood elf, would mud and leaves simply not stick to his beautiful sin'dorei skin?

I've already answered this: it's the image Blizzard is having them convey.

Again, you are free to fuss about it all you want, and act as if it is something that should be on Blood Elves, but the truth is it isn't. Make a movement for it if you truly wish for Blizzard to "reconcile such an obvious part of Blood Elf image". Let's see how far anyone gets on that.

You have the established identity of Blood Elves and yet still argue against it, that's why I call it a losing battle. Every implementation that Blizzard has put into Blood Elves for years has kept this "majestic" city elf, self-importance atmosphere that Blood Elves hold.

Imo I'd consider the lessened spotlight on Farstriders as an indication it's an image of their past and thus not why Blizzard has included it to Blood Elves. Who knows, you can certainly ask them for it just as High Elf fans are asking for High Elves on Alliance.

The issue is that you seem to think I am saying all this without any ground to stand on, when the themes and moments that have represented Blood Elves has always exuded their Paladin and Mage icons and downplayed their Rangers.

You realize that Night elves have shared a highborne identity since Cata right? That now more than ever mages are appreciated by the night elves? Their mages were being cheered for in Golden's BFA short story.

You think that if something isn't shown in front of your face, that it must not be important, or no longer part of a races identity, it's not object permanence here. When is the last time we see high elven rangers mobilized doing anything? Elisande's retort shows one high elf ranger, a ranger who gave herself a title, and has never been considered some master exiled archer/ranger.

In the legion hunter order hall, I can't think of a single time where high elves were shown as rangers and blood elves were not.

We're talking about themes/icons and it truly doesn't matter if something is existing for a race, that doesn't automatically make it important. Where's all the shadowy themes of Rogues and Warlocks represented for Blood Elves? Do we see Black/demonic architecture/armor sets/weapons for them? No, because obviously even if they have these figures it isn't what the majority of Blood Elves represent. Or I should say it's not what Blizzard considers to be iconic to Blood Elves.

You argue that farstriders aren't important to the Blood elves anymore, that is obviously not true.

The only thing the high elves "have" that blood elves don't is that you can say they aren't as clean, maybe they left all their laundry rooms in Silvermoon, but not being clean doesn't justify this separate heritage just to take the blood elf model in it's entirety, slap blue eyes on it and make it playable.

You can reduce the points all you want: not being clean, fucking humans, etc. The point is these are customization options that would clash with the current lavish/majestic/Sun-Light based upper snob society that Blood Elves exude.

Again, bitch and moan all you want. It sounds like you are more upset that Farstriders are lacking and are just venting at me for something I have no control over. Blizzard is what made the situation like this.

Also Nightborne existing completely destroys any argument you make because they fall under the same "issues" that you are pointing out under the Night Elf Mages that have existed and been playable and part of Night Elf society in WoW since Cataclysm (6 years before Legion).

[protip]

Well in the Blizzcon, they did mention that they were looking into the idea of giving the Void Elves customization option to look like HE (Hope that include tattoos and all that)

You're a bit off base there, the question was whether or not there was a chance of additional customization options to "give the high elf feeling," and the answer was that there's always a chance. They didn't claim that they were actually looking in to it right now, only that there was some sort of chance for the future. The only customization options that were mentioned were skin/hair color, but that doesn't mean definitively that it's not also possible for other options to be opened up. It was a relatively supportive response, but absolutely nothing was promised.

[FlubberPuddy]

There’s no confusion, and it wasn’t even a correction. It is simply a different aspect of their identity that better suited the circumstances. Just like night elves are simultaneously peace loving and vicious, Blood Elves have a multifaceted society regardless of what is currently getting the most attention. There is still a Ranger General protecting Silvermoon; none of that has changed. The Farstriders never stopped being an important part of the Blood Elf military, and that remains an inseparable part of the Blood Elf fantasy.

The customization options discussed here don’t apply to high elves either, because the fantasy of WC2 did not carry through to WC3 or WoW. Effectively, it was retconned out of existence when Blizzard fleshed out the Blood Elf fantasy to make a playable race. I don’t disagree that a race of elves somewhat similar to those concepts could exist, I just don’t believe that it can be called a high elf, because high elves already have an established identity in WoW that is defined by their relationship to the Blood Elves.

What I'm saying is by correction is that Night Elf savagery is something that has always existed but wasn't displayed in-game because Blizzard didn't progress Night Elf story much at all once WoW released. There were a lot of events that may involve Night Elves or are related to Night Elves but nothing specifically progressing their story as a people.

Blood Elves on the other hand have had a whole expansion and then some of story dedicated to their progress as a people. That's the major key difference here. The Farstriders may exist, but have not had much story progression or only been minorly shown when they did. Something some of those against High Elves like to point out about High Elves on Alliance (even though I'd say High Elves story wise have gotten more attention than even the Farstriders).

It may have been retconned out, but it came back when Alleria came back. That is the quintessential WC2 High Elf Ranger identity right there, and it exists on the Alliance. Therefore, no matter what arguments @Friendlyimmolation likes to make, that iconic look exists on and is part of the Alliance. Which is what High Elf fans are asking for.

Again, another potential argument is that "No other High Elf looks like Alleria" that doesn't stop Blizzard from implementing that change if they were to add High Elves playable to the Alliance as an Allied Race. Rangers are most represented among the Silver Covenant and the Silver Covenant is essentially all High Elves.

- - - Updated - - -

Yeah and Blizzard does not give you Helfs because I personally asked them not to.

It's easy to search and see that High Elves have been asked for, forever compared to the lukewarm reception the thought of Junker Gnomes being on Alliance is getting from Alliance players.

Keep believing what you wish though and making posts that are pretty much variations of, "I know you are but what am I?"

The main win is that the High Elf discussion moved from "The Horde is waiting for you" to now "Yes it can happen, don't give up hope!" the latter bit inviting more discussion and potential ideas on the topic.

Went from 1) Blood Elves are the High Elves to 2) The High Elf fantasy has a chance of being on Void Elves.

Moving it brick by brick.

It also shows Blizzard isn't as adverse to the idea of getting that "High Elf fantasy" onto Alliance as they seemed to come off as before.

[Friendlyimmolation]

It may have been retconned out, but it came back when Alleria came back. That is the quintessential WC2 High Elf Ranger identity right there, and it exists on the Alliance. Therefore, no matter what arguments @Friendlyimmolation likes to make, that iconic look exists on and is part of the Alliance. Which is what High Elf fans are asking for.

And again one high elf dressing the way they do does not equal the "High elf fantasy" when every other ranger is just a carbon copy of the blood elf ranger but with blue armor instead of red.

Your argument is dishonest when you're trying to peddle it as a classic look that belongs to high elves, it's never been shown outside of Alleria, You can say "well Blizzard could just say all high elves have it." And I can respond with the equally reaching argument that blood elves would be just as likely to have it for their own rangers.

You base this all on a maybe, you got an inch and are trying to take a mile. The so called "high elf fantasy " is already there on the Horde, you're asking for something that already exists, not something new.

[FlubberPuddy]

You're a bit off base there, the question was whether or not there was a chance of additional customization options to "give the high elf feeling," and the answer was that there's always a chance. They didn't claim that they were actually looking in to it right now, only that there was some sort of chance for the future. The only customization options that were mentioned were skin/eye color, but that doesn't mean definitively that it's not also possible for other options to be opened up. It was a relatively supportive response, but absolutely nothing was promised.

Small correction it was skin/hair color. Void Elves already have Blue Eyes.

Plus yes it's obviously not a priority, but they've also said they want to go back and improve the customization on all those legion Allied Races. Mayhaps the "High Elf feeling" would be planned for then if it makes its way in.

- - - Updated - - -

And again one high elf dressing the way they do does not equal the "High elf fantasy" when every other ranger is just a carbon copy of the blood elf ranger but with blue armor instead of red.

Your argument is dishonest when you're trying to peddle it as a classic look that belongs to high elves, it's never been shown outside of Alleria, You can say "well Blizzard could just say all high elves have it." And I can respond with the equally reaching argument that blood elves would be just as likely to have it for their own rangers.

Are all these icons for Alleria only? Were there no generic High Elf WC2 Rangers?

Plus your argument is disingenuous. Illidan is the only one that looked as how he did as far as DHs went. Other DH NPCs at the time at generic elf skins with the same design tattoo plastered over them.





Come Legion what happens? Demonic Skin and Flaming eyes and Horns and Fel scars, etc. The whole shebang.





Again, Dark Irons never had tattoos when they were in the World of Warcraft, they just got that customization out of nowhere.

Whenever Blizzard makes a particular NPC race playable they always add improved customization. Trying to stick to "but it doesn't exist on them now so it can never exist" when 1 example is available (and my DID example shows no example is sufficient also) through Alleria is a battle lost.

You base this all on a maybe, you got an inch and are trying to take a mile. The so called "high elf fantasy " is already there on the Horde, you're asking for something that already exists, not something new.

I base my requests on "Ask for what you truly want, and maybe you'll get 80% of that". Asking for any lesser is asking for the possibility of another type of "Void Elf release" to happen again.

I am only consistently making it clear what I truly want: High Elves on Alliance as an Allied Race. And giving examples, along with others, of exactly what is meant by that.

Whatever Blizzard decides to give, if any, is in their hands from there on.

EDIT: my pictures aren't showing me, let me figure this out, there should be photos in the post lol

EDIT 2: okay just gotta get those WC2 ranger faces in, still working on that

EDIT 3: All done, all images added.

[protip]

What I'm saying is by correction is that Night Elf savagery is something that has always existed but wasn't displayed in-game because Blizzard didn't progress Night Elf story much at all once WoW released. There were a lot of events that may involve Night Elves or are related to Night Elves but nothing specifically progressing their story as a people.

Blood Elves on the other hand have had a whole expansion and then some of story dedicated to their progress as a people. That's the major key difference here. The Farstriders may exist, but have not had much story progression or only been minorly shown when they did. Something some of those against High Elves like to point out about High Elves on Alliance (even though I'd say High Elves story wise have gotten more attention than even the Farstriders).

It may have been retconned out, but it came back when Alleria came back. That is the quintessential WC2 High Elf Ranger identity right there, and it exists on the Alliance. Therefore, no matter what arguments @Friendlyimmolation likes to make, that iconic look exists on and is part of the Alliance. Which is what High Elf fans are asking for.

Again, another potential argument is that "No other High Elf looks like Alleria" that doesn't stop Blizzard from implementing that change if they were to add High Elves playable to the Alliance as an Allied Race. Rangers are most represented among the Silver Covenant and the Silver Covenant is essentially all High Elves.

I don't see how Blood Elf mages and paladins getting story development makes the Farstriders any less significant. They still exist in the same role that they always have, and can be used whenever the time is right. That's why I used the night elf example: they have always existed and haven't gotten much story development, but they are a story thread that can be picked up at any time. They are still a quintessential part of Blood Elf society.

It's easy to search and see that High Elves have been asked for, forever compared to the lukewarm reception the thought of Junker Gnomes being on Alliance is getting from Alliance players.

I don't have time to respond to the whole post, but I have doubts about this. Junker gnomes seem really cool to me, but then I play Horde, so I'll wait to see some numbers.

Small correction it was skin/hair color. Void Elves already have Blue Eyes.

Plus yes it's obviously not a priority, but they've also said they want to go back and improve the customization on all those legion Allied Races. Mayhaps the "High Elf feeling" would be planned for then if it makes its way in.

Fixed mistype.

[FlubberPuddy]

I don't see how Blood Elf mages and paladins getting story development makes the Farstriders any less significant. They still exist in the same role that they always have, and can be used whenever the time is right. That's why I used the night elf example: they have always existed and haven't gotten much story development, but they are a story thread that can be picked up at any time. They are still a quintessential part of Blood Elf society.

They may be essential but they are not the thematically iconic part of Blood Elves that Blizzard continues to convey, and that is all I have meant in regards to them. Friendly is over here suggesting that the concepts used by WC2 Elven rangers would go to BE yet that would thematically clash with the image Blizzard has given them. I'm unsure of how that can be argued. Especially when that iconic look is given to Alleria is who de-facto Alliance.

I don't have time to respond to the whole post, but I have doubts about this. Junker gnomes seem really cool to me, but then I play Horde, so I'll wait to see some numbers.

That's the point, you're not an Alliance player and imo if you look through Alliance player posts about Junker Gnomes they are very much received in a lukewarm manner.

Now of course Gnome fans may be excited for it and that's cool and justified. But my point simply was that High Elves would have mainstream appeal than Junker Gnomes, and honestly Void Elves are a correlated proof of that seeing as they're the 4th most played race on Alliance at max level. I can only imagine how high much higher that spot would've been had they been actual High Elves.

This is something that can be easily deduced. Gnomes are only like 2% or so of overall player population at max level.

[Florida Man]

I apologize if this has been explained: why does Alleria have pale skin and blonde hair when other Void Elves do not? Did the void affect everyone else's skin and hair differently?

Doesn't seem like a stretch that some void elves maintained their pale skin and/or lighter hair.

Like, what's the issue?

[Friendlyimmolation]

Are all these icons for Alleria only? Were there no generic High Elf WC2 Rangers?

Plus your argument is disingenuous. Illidan is the only one that looked as how he did as far as DHs went. Other DH NPCs at the time at generic elf skins with the same design tattoo plastered over them.

point out all that tattooed elf rangers in warcraft 3. Again, you're trying to say a high elf with tattoos magically means they all have tattoos. Yea by your argument blizzard could decide "You know what all high elves now have tattoos" they could do that, but that would be a change, not a callback, when literally no other named elf was seen with it. It's only ever been mentioned in lore on Alleria. You could just as easily argue Hauldron or Lor'themar painted/ had tattoo's on their faces, that other rangers would as well. It's weird to be so insistent that this customization is a true example of "high elf only"

- - - Updated - - -

I apologize if this has been explained: why does Alleria have pale skin and blonde hair when other Void Elves do not? Did the void affect everyone else's skin and hair differently?

Doesn't seem like a stretch that some void elves maintained their pale skin and/or lighter hair.

Like, what's the issue?

Alleria became a void elf differently then how Void elves became void elves.

[FlubberPuddy]

point out all that tattooed elf rangers in warcraft 3. Again, you're trying to say a high elf with tattoos magically means they all have tattoos. Yea by your argument blizzard could decide "You know what all high elves now have tattoos" they could do that, but that would be a change, not a callback, when literally no other named elf was seen with it. It's only ever been mentioned in lore on Alleria. You could just as easily argue Hauldron or Lor'themar painted/ had tattoo's on their faces, that other rangers would as well. It's weird to be so insistent that this customization is a true example of "high elf only"

How come you're talking about Warcraft 3 when it's a callback to WC2?

I am saying it because they have done it multiple times already. Once with Dark Iron Dwarves getting tattoos "just cuz" and with the Demonhunters who went from generic elf models with the same type of tattoo design to get additional customizations like horns, fel eyes, and demonic skin to emulate the look of the most iconic Demonhunter: Illidan.

Your argument was Alleria is the only one with such customization but the callbacks to WC2 shows it was something used by generic High Elf Rangers back then, and I showed you in World of Warcraft proof how it doesn't even take 1 character to justify adding additional customization to races once they become playable.

Now you're trying to be pedantic and say "it's a change not a call back", nice dude.

What's weird is your insistence that Alleria's look, which is derived from the WC2 High Elf Ranger icons which have been provided, isn't High Elf only.

Then you bring up how it can be easily argued that Halduron and Lor'themar painted/had tattoos on their faces (first as if Halduron is any way equatable to Lor'themar in standing) and on top of that Alleria's look actually exists in both WoW, and previously in Warcraft and even on generic High Elf Rangers in Warcraft.

Annnnnnd, they also just recently updated Lor'themar and I don't see any warpaint/tattoos.

You're reaching real hard with no evidence to back it up whereas I've been able to provide proof of existence of my statements.

[Naked Snake]

Well in the Blizzcon, they did mention that they were looking into the idea of giving the Void Elves customization option to look like HE (Hope that include tattoos and all that)

People shouldn't ask for customization options to make them look more like High Elves. They'd still be Void Elves with Void Elf racials. They wouldn't have their own racial mount and they wouldn't have their own racial heritage armor. High Elves need to be its own Allied Race.

- - - Updated - - -

I apologize if this has been explained: why does Alleria have pale skin and blonde hair when other Void Elves do not? Did the void affect everyone else's skin and hair differently?

Doesn't seem like a stretch that some void elves maintained their pale skin and/or lighter hair.

Like, what's the issue?

She's not a Void Elf. She's just a High Elf with the power of a Dark Naaru.

[FlubberPuddy]

I lurk this thread mainly because it's more of a war than a discussion with both sides getting pretty "reachy". But I couldn't pass up the irony in this post.

So, speaking to the person I'm quoting, don't you find it to be a little bit of a double-standard to buy into "Blizzard's image" and "what is Blizzard trying to convey" with things like Lor'themar and new character models, but also at the same time refuse to accept what Blizzard is trying to convey regarding High Elves and Blood Elves and their respective faction home?

More often than not on the "pro" side, I see people blatantly disregarding what lore and stance Blizzard is trying to convey about their feelings regarding High Elves and their future for personal reasons, mostly starting with "I want...". I'm not trying to be snarky, I just want to point out that you're chastising an "anti" poster for not divining the image that Blizzard is painting, but you're on the side that outright refuses to understand the image that Blizzard wants to paint regarding who, and what, the High Elves have become. Which would be that High Elves became Blood Elves a long time ago, and have joined the Horde. This is what you keep ignoring, is it not?

I personally don't care if they ever are implemented at this point. I just cringe at the sight of people twisting, turning, and slithering their argument at each intersection just in an attempt to feel "right" in all of this.

Blizzard's opinion is, at the moment, the only thing that matters.

It's not twisting and turning anything at all. If anything it's Blizzard who has made the situation like this because of all their tipsy turvy on dealing with the High Elves on Alliance side.

Your entire post is undermined by the easily observed fact that High Elves on Alliance have existed since the creation of WoW and continue to hold their existence and have had some prominent screen time over a couple/few expansions (notably Wrath, MoP, Legion).

Everyone knows what High Elves are, everyone knows (or should by now) what people have been asking for when they asked for wanting High Elves playable.

This whole "Blood Elves are High Elves" thing didn't get brought up, nor defended, or trolled about seriously until after the introduction of Void Elves where the easiest answer at the time for Blizzard was "Blood Elves are High Elves" even though all the moments beforehand, including in Legion where Void Elves were introduced they've understood and pointed out multiple what High Elves are.

Besides your post is now also not taking into the recent consideration of what the most recent word by Blizzard on High Elves regarding Alliance is, which is that there's a chance of getting "the High Elf feeling" by added customization in the form of skin/hair colors to Void Elves.

So the "BE are HE" is dead since now they're willing to entertain the idea of getting some of that "HE feeling" onto Alliance side. Whether it ends up in the form of extra customization for Void Elves or something more.

Again, another example of a demonstrated moment where Blizzard recognizes exactly what is meant when people ask for High Elves.

The whole BS about "aren't you seeing that they consider the Blood Elves the High Elves" has started very recently and even that didn't last longer than about a year.

It's not twisting or turning anything, it's that Blizzard has been inconsistent and continue to be inconsistent regarding High Elves when they've always developed them accurately and accordingly on the Alliance side.

It's clear "the High Elf fantasy" isn't restricted to Blood Elves anymore, or at least isn't sacred like how some people make it out to be.

- - - Updated - - -

Not exactly related to High Elves, but looks like Wildhammers aren't as impossible as others may have seemed.

It honestly feels like Blizzard is taking into consideration many more derivatives of existing races than some players like to make it seem.

"About character customizations, can we expect more of them?

JF: We're definitely looking for more ideas from the community. I know that there are particular groups of Dwarves that really wanna be a Wildhammer member and have all those awesome tattoos, and these ideas ultimately result in us having very nerdy conversations on the whiteboard talking about "oh this is a great idea!", so please, keep shoving those ideas at us, we love hearing them!"

https://www.wowhead.com/news=288498/...ns-flying-in-n

[protip]

It's not twisting and turning anything at all. If anything it's Blizzard who has made the situation like this because of all their tipsy turvy on dealing with the High Elves on Alliance side.

Your entire post is undermined by the easily observed fact that High Elves on Alliance have existed since the creation of WoW and continue to hold their existence and have had some prominent screen time over a couple/few expansions (notably Wrath, MoP, Legion).

Everyone knows what High Elves are, everyone knows (or should by now) what people have been asking for when they asked for wanting High Elves playable.

This whole "Blood Elves are High Elves" thing didn't get brought up, nor defended, or trolled about seriously until after the introduction of Void Elves where the easiest answer at the time for Blizzard was "Blood Elves are High Elves" even though all the moments beforehand, including in Legion where Void Elves were introduced they've understood and pointed out multiple what High Elves are.

Besides your post is now also not taking into the recent consideration of what the most recent word by Blizzard on High Elves regarding Alliance is, which is that there's a chance of getting "the High Elf feeling" by added customization in the form of skin/hair colors to Void Elves.

So the "BE are HE" is dead since now they're willing to entertain the idea of getting some of that "HE feeling" onto Alliance side. Whether it ends up in the form of extra customization for Void Elves or something more.

Again, another example of a demonstrated moment where Blizzard recognizes exactly what is meant when people ask for High Elves.

The whole BS about "aren't you seeing that they consider the Blood Elves the High Elves" has started very recently and even that didn't last longer than about a year.

It's not twisting or turning anything, it's that Blizzard has been inconsistent and continue to be inconsistent regarding High Elves when they've always developed them accurately and accordingly on the Alliance side.

It's clear "the High Elf fantasy" isn't restricted to Blood Elves anymore, or at least isn't sacred like how some people make it out to be.

His point isn't undermined so easily. All evidence Blizzard has presented on Blood Elves and Alliance high elves is that they have the same fantasy. If you're going to talk about the implications of what gets focus in the story, I don't think it's reasonable to ignore that the story of the Blood Elves is dependent on the nature of a high elf being something different from or including what you want high elves to be. That is a stone cold fact.

I have to say, the argument that story focus has changed Blood Elf identity is extremely weak. You're implying that the group as a whole is changing because two distinct groups are getting story development, as a means to argue that a different group (that has not changed in any capacity) has become less relevant to the identity of the race itself. Those two things have nothing to do with each other. The more recent Blood Elf story developments may not have focused on the Farstriders, and therefore the Farstriders are less relevant to those specific story developments, but the identity of the Blood Elves is defined by their origins.

As for your other point, the "Blood Elves are high elves" quote doesn't get discussed anymore because it's been discussed to death already, but since you're suggesting that it's not relevant anymore, I will explain it in the updated context. When Ion responded to the high elf question at the Q&A in April last year, his opening line was to explain that the basic fantasy of Blood Elves and Alliance aligned high elves is basically identical, and then he said "When we add an Allied Race, there's a desire to have things be even more distinct especially between the two factions." That statement is not refuted by what Alex Afrasiabi said in the Lost Codex's interview, but instead the two answers paint a cohesive picture: the prevailing philosophy at Blizzard is that playable races should have their own distinct fantasy, but that doesn't mean there isn't "a chance." On the contrary, Ion said exactly the same thing last year.

[FlubberPuddy]

His point isn't undermined so easily. All evidence Blizzard has presented on Blood Elves and Alliance high elves is that they have the same fantasy. If you're going to talk about the implications of what gets focus in the story, I don't think it's reasonable to ignore that the story of the Blood Elves is dependent on the nature of a high elf being something different from or including what you want high elves to be. That is a stone cold fact.

It's not that Blood Elf story is dependent on being different from High Elf story, it's that the story of Blood Elves on Horde and High Elves on Alliance HAS been different, this is a fact that can't be twisted in any way.

I have to say, the argument that story focus has changed Blood Elf identity is extremely weak. You're implying that the group as a whole is changing because two distinct groups are getting story development, as a means to argue that a different group (that has not changed in any capacity) has become less relevant to the identity of the race itself. Those two things have nothing to do with each other. The more recent Blood Elf story developments may not have focused on the Farstriders, and therefore the Farstriders are less relevant to those specific story developments, but the identity of the Blood Elves is defined by their origins.

They did change culturally, that is the entire reason there was a split of High Elves who kept that old name and those who had their new name under Kael'thas. The Blood Elves became a people that would do anything necessary to survive, they were very pragmatic. The High Elves weren't/aren't, and it's the reason the schism exists in the first place between these two groups.

Blood Elf origins, as per Heritage scenario, has to do about what they consider important as a people, it's nothing to do about their fighting forces, this section honestly makes no sense as the story of the Blood Elf/High Elf divide has been kept pronounced throughout WoW.

As for your other point, the "Blood Elves are high elves" quote doesn't get discussed anymore because it's been discussed to death already, but since you're suggesting that it's not relevant anymore, I will explain it in the updated context. When Ion responded to the high elf question at the Q&A in April last year, his opening line was to explain that the basic fantasy of Blood Elves and Alliance aligned high elves is basically identical, and then he said "When we add an Allied Race, there's a desire to have things be even more distinct especially between the two factions." That statement is not refuted by what Alex Afrasiabi said in the Lost Codex's interview, but instead the two answers paint a cohesive picture: the prevailing philosophy at Blizzard is that playable races should have their own distinct fantasy, but that doesn't mean there isn't "a chance." On the contrary, Ion said exactly the same thing last year.

This is disingenuous because "basic fantasy" meant looks. Ion's entire response was centered around looks, not about anything story related. In fact when he does bring up he shows a difference (through lack of knowledge) about how "there's not a clear example of who or what High Elves are as a larger group that remains to be seen on Azeroth".

Then he continues and provides 1 example he identifies as a "High Elf": Alleria. His entire response is based upon looks, not any type of major themes/story tied to Blood Elves. Posting his response and I will bold the parts where it shows he's focused on looks and not any type of theme or story context as this section implies.

So, Blood Elves kind of are High Elves with different eye colors and backstory in terms of their relationship to magic in the Sunwell. But if you want to be a fair-skinned, light, blonde-haired, tall, majestic, elf...that is a Blood Elf.

Giving that race directly to the Alliance would have blurred a lot of the lines between the two factions, but also there isn't a clear example of who or what High Elves are as a larger group which remains in Azeroth. There's a couple...we just met Alleria again...but they're not out there in the same way. When we add an Allied Race, there's a desire to have things be even more distinct especially between the two factions with the faction conflict being so prominent. And so, the Void Elf angle, as it tied into the story of Argus, the powers of Alleria awakened and was able to train others to harness, was able to give something that felt a bit like a Blood Elf but had a unique flavor of its own to the Alliance.

That said, obviously I understand you would love Alliance elves...you're an Alliance player, and want to be a fair-skinned, light-haired, blue-eyed elf. Sorry? The Horde is there and waiting for you. Eye color is not quite the same but maybe contact lenses in the future, you never know? Anything is possible in the future, but no plans in the near-term to add High Elves as an Allied Race.

Everything bolded is pertaining to looks. He even starts out saying that Blood Elves are High Elves that have a different eye color and backstory in terms of relationship with the Sunwell.

So it's pretty BS to say that Ion's response isn't grounded on looks, and talking about "basic fantasy", I don't even know what you meant by that but if you're talking about looks that is the "easiest" thing that can be changed regarding adding an Allied Race.

Besides the main reason Ion's response isn't relevant IS because his whole "if you want to be a tall, fair-skinned, blond haired elf" bit doesn't hold true anymore regarding the possibility that exists now for Alliance to have that exist in a playable form, whether through added customization through Void Elves or hopefully as their own Allied Race.

The Wildhammer Dwarf response by Jeremy Feasel also suggests Blizzard isn't against adding more derivatives of existing races anymore.

Again, I'll just say it was utterly retarded from the get-go for anyone to think that it's fine to have 3 different variations of purple elves in the game but for some odd reason the 1 fair skinned type elf "must remain unique." It's utter bollocks.

- - - Updated - - -

Besides, the "High Elf fantasy" is known to be defined by being on Alliance, therefore saying it's there on Horde shows a huge lack of understanding of what is meant by it.

This is why Blood Elves are Blood Elves, their fantasy rests with being the Horde Elves and this Sun-Light based society worshipping their Sunwell and working with other misfits to survive as a people.

The Void Elf fantasy are these elves who delved into a dark void power and now have to deal with controlling their inner whispers while earning the loyalty of newfound friends.

None of those fantasies fit why High Elves are wanted in the first place, which is to be able to play a long-time ally of the Alliance that remained loyal to them to this day.

Parts of the Blood Elf fantasy and High Elf fantasy were alluded to by Elisande anyway, so I'm not sure what people are still trying to argue against their being a difference of identity between Blood Elves and High Elves.

[Alixie]

I wouldn't mind another dwarf race/fraction if they offered enough options that make them different than Dark Iron and Bronzebeard. The lore supports them; the Wildhammers are technically apart of the Alliance, as their leader has a seat of power in the Council of Three Hammers. The Wildhammer Clan has helped the Alliance in several excursions, most recently in the War campaign. Physical differences could be hair styles and tattoos, and offer both the dwarves and Alliance a new playable Druid.

Wildhammers also have a kinship with High Elves (and Night Elves); they share an affinity with nature, and often work with them in their lodges and outposts. High Elves check off all the markers to make a satisfying unique playable race. Their fraction is different from their cousins: High, Void, Blood Elves are proud of their cultural differences between each other, and the Wildhammer, Bronzebeard, and Dark Iron clans like the elves, will punch you in the face if you dare homogenize all dwarves. If these races happen, they would mirror each other as playable fractions of the same race.

Ironforge Dwarf: Bronzebeard, Wildhammer, Dark Iron
Thalassian Elf: High Elf, Blood Elf, Void Elf

Speaking of 3's, the Alliance only has one nature centric playable race. Adding Wildhammers and High Elves would bump that up to three races that bring some rustic diversity to the Alliance. The three races: Blood Elf, Tauren, and Zandalari are also 3 light worshipping races that bring in some theocracy to the Horde. As the Wildhammers bring another playable Druid race to the Alliance, the High Elves could bring both Paladins and Druids, effectively making them counterparts to the Zandalari who also bring both classes.

Also, they dont have to be an entirely separate race to be qualified to join. Allied Fractions would have been a better name than Allied Races. The original idea players had were Sub Races, but they didnt use that for obvious reasons. For example, there is no biological difference between regular Draenai and Lightforged Draenai. Hell, there isnt even a cultural difference either. This should be used as an opportunity to make popular fractions playable, even if they are "copies", so they wont be obligated to create 1:1 ratios and ignore fractions with a long history with the Horde or Alliance. For example, creating "Junker Gnomes" so that the Gnomes have a sub race to fill their quota. Unfortunately for them, nobody is hyped for more Gnomes.

[Byleth]

Unfortunately for them, nobody is hyped for more Gnomes.

Untrue, I totally am! Gnomes FTW!

[Alixie]

Untrue, I totally am! Gnomes FTW!

Congrats. You're part of the 2% of the entire population that play Gnomes. For the record, I have 3 myself, the one in my avatar from Vanilla has been retired for Void Elf. They're cute, but very gimmicky. I got tired of never seeing my transmog or weapons. I wouldnt consider 2% of players excited to play more Gnomes, hype or a selling point.

[Byleth]

Congrats. You're part of the 2% of the entire population that play Gnomes. For the record, I have 3 myself, the one in my avatar from Vanilla has been retired for Void Elf. They're cute, but very gimmicky. I got tired of never seeing my transmog or weapons. I wouldnt consider 2% of players excited to play more Gnomes, hype or a selling point.

I mean, yeah, Gnomes have a whole host of issues...

>Transmog too small
>Drowning in a puddle
>Getting LoS as a caster by 1 f-ing step
>No one takes you seriously (until you kick their butt at something)

But they have their fans, and I'm willing to bet it's a lot more than 2%. Especially with their new junker/cyborg looks.

Anyway, as for helfs? *shrug* Anything is possible. Wishing for something and keeping it in the public conscious will get you all closer.