1. #8181
    Moderator Rozz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    To be fair I believe the core issue is insurmountable, High Elves are already playable as Blood Elves and no amount of creative thinking can get around that. Void Elves worked because they were moved sufficiently away from Blood/High Elves to be their own thing, but at the cost of no longer being High Elves.
    I personally agree but for people that are willing to fight the fight, it's good to remember this when asking for 'compromise' of any sort. Blizzard changes things bc people can be wildly creative or wildly aggressive. Ion answered aggressive pro-Elfers with your quote. The creative front is their last appeal imo, but Blizzard seems spent for now.
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  2. #8182
    Legendary! Obelisk Kai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vasaru View Post
    Doesn't change the fact that you have Ion's quote as your signature to spite people, that's what it seems like to me.
    The quote is there to remind a community notorious for forgetting or minimising anything that doesn't agree with playable High Elves that what was said, was said.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rozz View Post
    I personally agree but for people that are willing to fight the fight, it's good to remember this when asking for 'compromise' of any sort. Blizzard changes things bc people can be wildly creative or wildly aggressive. Ion answered aggressive pro-Elfers with your quote. The creative front is their last appeal imo, but Blizzard seems spent for now.
    The problem is that what are Void Elves but a creative take on Blood/High Elves? If Blood Elves are High Elves, and they are, and they represent the High Elf fantasy in Warcraft, and they do, then a variant can only deviate from that ideal as Void Elves have.

    What the creative pro High Elfers seem to be trying to do is to reinvent the wheel. To succeed though, they have reinvent the wheel in such a way that it isn't round. Which is of course impossible.

  3. #8183
    I am Murloc! FlubberPuddy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    While you may have a point in that the Void Elves were depicted as former Blood Elves rather than Silver Covenant High Elves, in the end that has to be seen as a minor consideration. Particularly as it is implied that some High Elves are in fact being turned into Void Elves. The implication has not been refuted. Most of the pushback against the suggestion Void Elves can turn other Elves comes from pro High Elfers, who do not wish to deal with the consequences if that was to confirmed to be the case.
    This is wrong, and the proof to refute it has been brought up in the thread many times but keeps getting ignored by those that wish the implication stayed. You can speak to Magister Umbric in BFA. As a Void Elf player he has additional dialogue for you. The additional Void Elf player unique dialogue is bolded.

    https://www.wowhead.com/news=284450/...magic-spoilers

    What is your role in this campaign, magister?

    "As a magister, my duty has always been to Silvermoon and its people. When the mad Arthas devastated our lands, I knew we must harness every power available to ensure our survival.

    Prince Kael'thas proposed one way. I sought out another."
    So you sought the power of shadow?
    "My followers and I felt no loyalty to the Horde. When Grand Magister Rommath forbade our Void research, we did not hesitate to break away and follow our own path.

    But hubris got the best of me. I was certain I could master any force we encountered.

    I was so wrong..."

    The Void nearly claimed you?

    "I led us right into the ethereals' trap. If not for Alleria Windrunner's intervention, we would have been lost.

    As it was, the shadow energies transformed us... and opened our minds to the whispers of the Void. Without Alleria's guidance, we would have fallen into madness.

    She has helped us quiet our minds. Dampen the whispers. It is a constant struggle."

    Now you fight for the Alliance.

    "We do not stand with the Alliance out of convenience. Nor is it a mere gesture of thanks to Alleria.

    Our ordeal has taught us the importance of great powers being in the right hands. We could not allow the Horde to know the things we know, or to use us as a weapon in their schemes.

    We fight for the Alliance because we believe in its values. And one day, I pray we will bring all of Silvermoon back into the fold."

    How fare you, Magister Umbric?

    "I struggle to fetter the whispers, same as you. Thankfully, Alleria Windrunner continues to offer us her guidance.

    Without her intervention... well, I fear we would have all been lost.

    And though I was reluctant to treat with him at first, I have learned much from the Locus-Walker. Just bear in mind that anything he offers is bound to serve his own goals in some way."

    Do you believe we have earned the trust of the Alliance?

    "So long as Silvermoon stands with the Horde, there will always be those who mistrust us.

    But the Alliance is where our people belong. I am more certain of that now than ever before.

    Stay the course, $n. Show our comrades in the Alliance that we fight for the same cause.

    One day the Horde's grip on our land will be broken, and the children of Quel'Thalas will stand united once more.

    I know it."
    The last question in particular cements that all Void Elves playable are de-facto Silvermoon Blood Elves.

    "Do you believe we have earned the Alliance's trust?" Alliance High Elves don't have to do that. Did Alleria have to? No. Neither would those who are already loyal to the Alliance.

    "So long as Silvermoon stands with the Horde, there will be those who distrust us." Here clearly is another nod to Void Elves being strictly Silvermoon Blood Elves because who are those in Silvermoon that stand with the Horde? Blood Elves.

    "But the Alliance are where our people belong." Our people, again referencing the now Horde Blood Elves, since High Elves have existed on the Alliance at the beginning of World of Warcraft.

    High Elves turned Void Elves wouldn't warrant any of those responses because 1) They've been in the Alliance forever, 2) They haven't lived in Silvermoon for ages.

    This broadcast text has yet to be refuted in terms of showing that it references both High Elves and Blood Elves. Therefore the conclusion that can be deduced is all Void Elves for the time being are Blood Elves.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    What the creative pro High Elfers seem to be trying to do is to reinvent the wheel. To succeed though, they have reinvent the wheel in such a way that it isn't round. Which is of course impossible.
    There is no reinvention of the wheel that has to take place. Merely following the precedent set forth by the Nightborne. AKA taking a thematic unexpressed in a larger society (Night Elf Mages) and blowing it up to be its own unique selection.

    If what Obelisk was saying is true, then the likes of Wildhammer Dwarves which seems to be incoming at some point would not exist. Since the WH can be reduced to be "dwarves with blue tattoos" same as High Elves get reduced to "blood elves with blue eyes".

    The best bet that one can hope for who never wishes to see High Elves become a thing is to hope that Blizzard doesn't add 3rd iterations of already playable races. With Wildhammer coming in at some point, that hope needs to shift to being implemented in a way that makes High Elves on Alliance unlikely of being implemented. A way which I cannot see happening.

    Especially since the latest official word is that there is a chance of getting the feeling of a High Elf through Void Elf customization. Giving that opening allows for further discussion and iteration on how much that option would suffice vs being their own stand-alone AR. Or a possible different way that Blizzard hasn't yet shown us of how they can implement various races, as are being discussed with Wildhammer Dwarves.
    Last edited by FlubberPuddy; 2018-11-25 at 06:02 PM.

  4. #8184
    Dear god. 429 pages and growing of idiots arguing for high elves.

    Gross.

  5. #8185
    Quote Originally Posted by Necrosaro123 View Post
    They dont get it, that Blizzard is not going to make a new race of elves, when the alliance already have Void elves (that are exactly the same thing!).
    Right? Four whole unique elf races, yet people still want more.

    World of elf craft I tell you

  6. #8186
    Quote Originally Posted by Stardrift View Post
    Dear god. 429 pages and growing of idiots arguing for high elves.

    Gross.
    Well, you are also helping to increase the pages with your post. That makes you one of us as well, no?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Necrosaro123 View Post
    They dont get it, that Blizzard is not going to make a new race of elves, when the alliance already have Void elves (that are exactly the same thing!).
    Void elves and silver coventant high elves are very different from each another.
    It like saying Blood trolls and Zandalari trolls are the same thing.

  7. #8187
    Quote Originally Posted by RangerDaz View Post
    Well, you are also helping to increase the pages with your post. That makes you one of us as well, no?

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    Void elves and silver coventant high elves are very different from each another.
    It like saying Blood trolls and Zandalari trolls are the same thing.
    You really want a 5th elf race with much less indentity than the others?

  8. #8188
    Immortal roahn the warlock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post

    As others have stated, that doesn't make sense considering the Nightborne. The trigger for the transformation into thalassian elves was a loss of connection to the second well of eternity, that sustained Night Elven immortality. No canonical answer has been provided as to why this manifested as a loss of height, a change in skin pigmentation and a loss of overall strength but we can speculate that without some kind of magic source, the thalassian elves physically weakened and the Sunwell stabilised and prevented any further physical degradation.
    No, it doesn't make any sense, nor was thinking that black people were naturally less intelligent during the 1800s. Racism doesn't need to make sense. But in lore it has been stated that the blood elves believe more fair skin=more magical ability/political status. As they wanted to differentiate themselves from other elves.
    It was never Hardcore Vs Casual. It was Socialites Vs. Solo players
    Quote Originally Posted by ringpriest View Post
    World of Warcraft started life as a Computer Roleplaying Game, where part of the fun of the game experience was pretending to be your character. Stuff like applying poisons and eating food enhanced the verisimilitude of the experience of playing a fantasy character in another world. Now that game has changed to become a tactical arcade lobby game.

  9. #8189
    Quote Originally Posted by Stardrift View Post
    Right? Four whole unique elf races, yet people still want more.

    World of elf craft I tell you
    Some of which no one asked for.

  10. #8190
    I am Murloc! FlubberPuddy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stardrift View Post
    You really want a 5th elf race with much less indentity than the others?
    Sometimes people want a Vanilla race. This is why Mag'har were clamored for, they're basically Vanilla orcs. Nightborne are also a call back to Vanilla highborne elves. Zandalari trolls are where all troll tribes descended from, another "Vanilla" race.

    High Elves would be the Vanilla version of Thalassian elves (Blood Elves and Void Elves), Ion has even mentioned those two as "flavors of High Elves". Just as Stormwind Humans are the "vanilla humans" and we have Undead humans, Werewolf humans, and incoming Stronk humans.

  11. #8191
    Legendary! Obelisk Kai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by roahn the warlock View Post
    No, it doesn't make any sense, nor was thinking that black people were naturally less intelligent during the 1800s. Racism doesn't need to make sense. But in lore it has been stated that the blood elves believe more fair skin=more magical ability/political status. As they wanted to differentiate themselves from other elves.
    I don't think it has ever been stated that the Blood Elves believe that. If it has, could you please provide the source?

  12. #8192
    Quote Originally Posted by Stardrift View Post
    You really want a 5th elf race with much less indentity than the others?
    Actually i want a 5th and 6th elven races, because i would love to have high elves in alliance and san'layn on the horde.
    And Alliance High Elves can and have their own identity, either ingame, in lore and also in many suggestions from high elven fans.
    It is just a matter of Blizzard wanting to release them in a future expansion, or not.

  13. #8193
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    The issue with High Elves is they are not interesting enough to be playable, they have no unique lore. They are literally Blood Elves, who are ashamed to be Blood Elves, but cosmetically have blue eyes. That's it.

    Their history, their occupations, even their capitol city (Silvermoon, which is disputed) are all the same. They have absolutely nothing going for them.

    They have been in the game since Vanilla, in every expansion, but how often have they been the center of any events? It's always a bunch of Humans and/or Night Elves, with maybe one or two High Elves just standing around doing nothing.

    I think Elisande said it better "all too willing to mingle with lesser races which dilute your bloodline".

    There are four different flavours of playable elves in the game. Pick one of them and come to terms with the fact that High Elves are never coming.

    Some of us are still waiting for Ogres. Come to think of it, can we just replace replace all Blood Elves with Ogres and Silvermoon with a damp cave? The Horde won't mind.
    Last edited by mmoc1e668ebde8; 2018-11-25 at 10:48 PM.

  14. #8194
    Quote Originally Posted by Vasaru View Post
    I was in a dark place back then. I've made good progress since You, however, still have that toxic signature.
    You also keep arguing against something other people want because it doesn't suit you. You actively try to prevent people from having something they think would make the game more enjoyable.

    Do what I did and take a break from the game. I promise you'll feel better if you worry less about the game and spend less time on forums.
    Fair enough we all go into dark places from time to time... yet instead of just apologizing for your abusive language, you're instead trying to defend your actions?

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    I love how Alex asked high elf fans to keep their requests respectful... and here we are yet again with high elf fans putting down or downright abusing people who express a differing opinion. It's a valid opinion if people are elf fatigued, or are worried about blurring factions lines, or are worried about detracting from blood elf uniqueness.. yet high elf fans treat these people like they're trolls. And yet you want Blizz to take your requests seriously...
    Blood elves are our high elves - Chris Metzen

  15. #8195
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vasaru View Post
    Some of which no one asked for.
    And where are you taking that conclusion from, your ass?


    Night Elves have been a staple in this franchise for decades, the third most played race only beaten by Blood Elves and Humans. Nightborne are the most played of allied races introduced so far. Granted, Void Elves might not have been embraced by some/many, but you can find people that enjoy them.


    Should take your own advice and piss off of this thread, your interventions are the usual shit. Go sort yourself and get out of that "dark place", you still seem to be in it.

  16. #8196
    Quote Originally Posted by Greywyr View Post
    And where are you taking that conclusion from, your ass?


    Night Elves have been a staple in this franchise for decades, the third most played race only beaten by Blood Elves and Humans. Nightborne are the most played of allied races introduced so far. Granted, Void Elves might not have been embraced by some/many, but you can find people that enjoy them.


    Should take your own advice and piss off of this thread, your interventions are the usual shit. Go sort yourself and get out of that "dark place", you still seem to be in it.
    So rude. That's just insulting.

  17. #8197
    Quote Originally Posted by Vasaru View Post
    So rude. That's just insulting.
    dont worry

    high elves will come

    they just need to lose enough subs

    people said demon hunters would never happen for years

    and...well WoD happened LOL

  18. #8198
    Quote Originally Posted by Strippling View Post
    Fair enough we all go into dark places from time to time... yet instead of just apologizing for your abusive language, you're instead trying to defend your actions?

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    I love how Alex asked high elf fans to keep their requests respectful... and here we are yet again with high elf fans putting down or downright abusing people who express a differing opinion. It's a valid opinion if people are elf fatigued, or are worried about blurring factions lines, or are worried about detracting from blood elf uniqueness.. yet high elf fans treat these people like they're trolls. And yet you want Blizz to take your requests seriously...
    I was depressed for 10 years. That shit does stuff to your brain, mate.
    No, I wasn't trying to defend my behaviour, just trying to explain myself. I see now that it went poorly.
    I'm very sorry to everyone for what I've said in the past.

  19. #8199
    Legendary! Obelisk Kai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyoloco View Post
    dont worry

    high elves will come

    they just need to lose enough subs

    people said demon hunters would never happen for years

    and...well WoD happened LOL
    What silly logic. If sub loss was going to be the catalyst for granting High Elves, they'd have granted High Elves years ago.

  20. #8200
    Quote Originally Posted by Strippling View Post
    I love how Alex asked high elf fans to keep their requests respectful...
    https://www.firesofheaven.org/thread...ok-at-wow.353/

    I'm done playing ball with you useless fuckers... it's my turn.
    Alex "Keep It Respectful" Afrasiabi.
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    And His disciples said unto Him, "Can we get Kings instead?"

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