Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Obelisk Kai]

She is Sylvanas's sister, that makes her an important character. She also wants Blood Elves to come back into the Alliance, showing her choice of faction.

This makes her an "important Alliance character" - it's completely valid to say that.

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You can see Vereesa however you want. Just as some people see Sylvanas as "my true Warchief" and how some see her as a villain. There's nothing to argue in this post.

No, being a family member of someone important does not automatically make you important in your own right.

Ask Prince Edward of England.

Veressa is a notable character, but she is notable because she is Sylvanas' sister and the last two times she has been used in the story is because of who her sisters are. Notable is not important. Whatever role she had as the Alliance friendly Windrunner prior to the end of Legion has clearly been usurped by her far more interesting, far more important Void Elf sister.

[Aldo Hawk]

No!

I'm just going to keep giving lip. I will not admit to such absurd accusations, and if you continue to harass me, I'm going to report you to--time to go home, woohoo!

What-ever...

Stop stirring shit up.

Being part of the problem is not justifiable.

I can't consider you someone that is in pro of the request or a friendly poster if you are mocking it and adding to the pile of shit. You can't ask nobody to doublethink just for you or for anybody else that way.

[FlubberPuddy]

@Syegfryed is right it seems when he said '"anything that happens in warcraft is somehow someway a new story or a hint to high elves"'

Hey I just refresh the "General Discussions" link on MMO-C to see new posts and was surprised to see the High Elf discussion so checked it out. As my posts denote I didn't even realize those were there.

A more plausible explanation is that, with the Alliance stretched to breaking point militarily thanks to Sylvanas luring them into Azshara's trap, mothballed and outdated equipment has been pulled out of storage for this assault, including stuff from the Third War. Some of that stuff belonged to their former allies, the high elves of Quel'thalas.

Sure, an explanation that is full headcanon until explained by Blizzard. As I recall there were posts where people said "if High Elves are so important to Alliance where are they in the Faction War" well blam, right there in the finale lending their equipment.

People used to say High Elves didn't exist anymore since BFA didn't show their presence, as retarded as that sounds yet they didn't think so. Now it's well within others rights to say High Elves are contributing with Alliance forces by lending their ballistas

So this shuts down one of the silliest claims ever made.

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Snip

Like I said, you can see her however you wish. Just as most people meme about how Lor'themar does jack-shit despite his position. You can see Vereesa how you want, just how people see Lor'themar how they want, Anduin how they want, Sylvanas how they want, etc etc.

It's inarguable.

[Aldo Hawk]

Like I said, you can see her however you wish. Just as most people meme about how Lor'themar does jack-shit despite his position. You can see Vereesa how you want, just how people see Lor'themar how they want, Anduin how they want, Sylvanas how they want, etc etc.

It's inarguable.

I hate people calling him Bob.

But well... Anyone can have their opinion. As wrong as it can be.

[Rhlor]

Absolutely not!!! I don't want to play a fair-skinned, blonde-haired, green/golden-eyed Thalassian elf on the Alliance! I want TRUE High Elves. I want to play a fair-skinned, blonde-haired, blue eyed Thalassian elf on the Alliance. Anything less than that is unacceptable. If Blizzard ends up going that route by giving the Alliance Blood Elves instead of High Elves, there will be a new shit storm mega thread. I want to be able to ZOOM IN on my character and other player characters to VERIFY, that it is a High Elf by the indicative color of blue eyes. To have playable Blood Elves on Alliance instead of High Elves would be a slap on the face of every High Elf fan.

lol
The funny thing is that there will be no alliance and horde :P

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Yeah yeah, so funny isn't it?

However. That shallow view does not make any justice.

A Blood elf in the Alliance would still be a Blood elf. Not a High elf.

It would lack the voicelines, the class selection, the racials, the specific customization, the heritage armor, the High elven hub, etc...

It would exactly be as if they just slapped some tattoos to Dwarves and call it the Wildhammer Dwarves... That is not how it works.

Seriously, this has been spoken so much and your intent is only to deviate people into being misunderstanding about the matter, and it is not even a funny, well constructed joke. It's pretty under-average because it's based on ignorance and misunderstanding.

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I know. I just felt that I had to say it because your message implied that we were needed of such thing. When it is pretty much a well known part of the lore and a well known part of the Alliance.

the blood / high elves are the same race.

[Aldo Hawk]

the blood / high elves are the same race.

I never said otherwise.

Seriously, I -never- said otherwise.

The fact you bring that up to me just shows how little you understand from what you say.

[Rhlor]

I never said otherwise.

Seriously, I -never- said otherwise.

The fact you bring that up to me just shows how little you understand from what you say.

You want a whole new personalization, voice, racial for those who are blood elves with blue eyes.

[Aldo Hawk]

You want a whole new personalization, voice, racial for those who are blood elves with blue eyes.

What is your reasoning for it not being possible?

Why a High elf say things Blood elves would say?

Oh yeah, 'Tauren are now our allies? Grea-...'

Oh yeah yeah

Customization for them? Why not?

Racials? Why would they use the same 'racials' (more like things their group does) as Blood elves? You know, as teachings from Kael'thas that they despised...

As you can see, you are the one talking from ignorance. As your last words in the sentence also proves.

High elves, just to start, as the most basic concept of what they are. Are not Blood elves.

The fact that this has to be repeated so many times just shows a willing lack of understanding that just rubs into trolling territory.

Blood elves are High elves. Even tho they don't call themselves like that anymore. And High elves are not Blood elves.

Is easier than a 3-point scheme. It's a 2-point scheme. Come on, what image of yourself do you want to portrait?

[elbleuet]

The thing is you are trying to pretend Veressa is more than she is, insisting she is on the battlefield 'because she is an important Alliance character' rather than the blatantly obvious reason she has turned up for the first time in two years, that she is Sylvanas' sister.

As usual, you're biaised.

When she was asked by Terenas to be an Alliance ambassador, and when she freed Alexstrazsa during the second war, she did not acted as "Sylvanas sisters". Sylvanas was a random character at this time.

Your comparison with Lor'themar is flawed because Lor'themar has nothing to prove. He is the acknowledged leader of the Blood Elves, a core Horde race, and an important character whose presence is justified on that basis.

My comparison is based on your arguments.

He did nothing during several expansions. He did nothing when the Horde and Azeroth were threatened by the Legion & Argus, so he's irrelevant.

[Rivex]

https://imgur.com/a/DUTnUpp

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You are too naive to think you can cause some sort of 'ragefest' with that.

You are simply incorrect.

Only the other way is correct, and to some extent.

Someone being wrong is just someone being wrong.

And I don't think you are genuinely wrong, you know what you are doing, so I just reported it for what it is.

Good night.

You reported it and I respect your ability to do so... Doesn't that and your 2 page moaning and defending your views against it afterwards qualify as a 'ragefest'?
Many Devs have come out saying "you wanna play as a high elves? then play blood elves" I was merely basing my comment on that.

Reading the majority of your replies I think this subject is a little to close to home for you, you're forever shooting down people who go against your idea of high elves and call out their ignorance and how they're wrong. You don't need to be the white knight for High Elves accept peoples views instead of shooting them down. Please note I say accept their views and their ability to say it, not believe in them.

Good Morning.

[Obelisk Kai]

Hey I just refresh the "General Discussions" link on MMO-C to see new posts and was surprised to see the High Elf discussion so checked it out. As my posts denote I didn't even realize those were there.

Well we are entering the last month of this debate having relevance so I am not surprised to see it come back for one last hurrah. If the pro High Elfers haven't managed to convince Blizzard to change their minds by that point, and with Blizzard moving away from Allied races in the next expansion cycle (ARs will never be as regular again as they are in BFA), then it's done. Likely for quite a while.

Of course if blue eyes are given to Blood Elves, if Blood Elves are allowed to play in Alliance in some capacity, or if Void Elves are given High Elf like (not necessarily exact) skins, then we are also done.

Sure, an explanation that is full headcanon until explained by Blizzard. As I recall there were posts where people said "if High Elves are so important to Alliance where are they in the Faction War" well blam, right there in the finale lending their equipment.

People used to say High Elves didn't exist anymore since BFA didn't show their presence, as retarded as that sounds yet they didn't think so. Now it's well within others rights to say High Elves are contributing with Alliance forces by lending their ballistas

So this shuts down one of the silliest claims ever made.

Nobody said High Elves didn't exist anymore. That is exaggerating what your opponents say to make them look unreasonable. What has been said is that the High Elf exiles are so low in numbers as to be a non-factor.

There are no High Elven exile forces within the Alliance. This is a fact, as the only High Elven exile force of any merit is based in Dalaran. Dalaran did not participate in this battle and there are no High Elf exiles on the field of battle with the exception of Veressa. Veressa's appearance is a personal one in that she has a connection with her sister.

The total High Elven exile participation beyond Veressa in the war was four individuals, three of whom didn't even fight and the only evidence we have for Veressa's participation is that she has finally turned up at the very end.

So with the High Elves not having a meaningful presence within the Alliance, and the Alliance in command of a few ballistas from the third war era, and no High Elves about, my 'headcanon' explanation as you put it makes a lot more sense than your suggestion that the High Elves are a strong part of the Alliance and making weapons for them, even if they can't be bothered to show up and fight for them.

Because these ballistas don't answer that initial question, if High Elves are so important to Alliance where are they in the Faction War"?

They still aren't there.

Like I said, you can see her however you wish. Just as most people meme about how Lor'themar does jack-shit despite his position. You can see Vereesa how you want, just how people see Lor'themar how they want, Anduin how they want, Sylvanas how they want, etc etc.

It's inarguable.

Actually your point is that people have multiple, differing interpretations of the same character and so that would make the opposite of inarguable, which means that the position in question is beyond dispute. Multiple viewpoints produce arguments and is very much arguable.

Having said that, this isn't a case of people's differing views, which is why you've gotten the wrong end of the stick. This is about divining developer intent. Is Veressa here because she is a major, important Alliance character or is she here because she is Sylvanas's sister?

Given that the first words out of Alleria's mouth (Veressa says nothing) is 'Our sister' it would seem the emphasis is on the familial drama. She is not present because she is a major, important Alliance character because she is not a major, important Alliance character. At best she is a secondary character, although with Alleria's return she has seemingly been shunted to tertiary status.

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As usual, you're biaised.

When she was asked by Terenas to be an Alliance ambassador, and when she freed Alexstrazsa during the second war, she did not acted as "Sylvanas sisters". Sylvanas was a random character at this time.

You mean in the books that featured her as a major character?

On that basis Aramar Thorne of Traveller is a major character.

Veressa has her moments in the books, but her importance in the stories where she actually played a major role does not translate into the game where she is a sidekick to someone else's story whether it be Rhonin, Jaina or Alleria.

My comparison is based on your arguments.

He did nothing during several expansions. He did nothing when the Horde and Azeroth were threatened by the Legion & Argus, so he's irrelevant.

You didn't actually address my core point, that Lor'themar has nothing to prove as an acknowledged racial leader, whereas Veressa is treated as representing the relevance of the High Elven exiles to the story. Lor'themar's presence or activities has no bearing on the importance of the Blood Elves, as they are a playable race.

Veressa is a proxy for your feelings. If Veressa is marginalised, it marginalises the High Elven exiles.

[Gurluas]

You reported it and I respect your ability to do so... Doesn't that and your 2 page moaning and defending your views against it afterwards qualify as a 'ragefest'?
Many Devs have come out saying "you wanna play as a high elves? then play blood elves" I was merely basing my comment on that.

Reading the majority of your replies I think this subject is a little to close to home for you, you're forever shooting down people who go against your idea of high elves and call out their ignorance and how they're wrong. You don't need to be the white knight for High Elves accept peoples views instead of shooting them down. Please note I say accept their views and their ability to say it, not believe in them.

Good Morning.

I mean he's not wrong. Blood elves and High elves are very different ideologically and culturally.
Could I use a Blood elf or a Void elf to RP a High elf? Sure, but the game will never consider me a proper High elf.

I see so much potential for High elves to be taken into a unique and different direction within the Alliance that resonates with their lore and backstory.
We do not want Blood elves with blue eyes, we want the High elves from the Alliance to be made playable and in a direction that resonates with the image they've been presented in since Vanilla.

So no we do not want the High elves to become void monsters. But there's so many paths open to change the High elven cultural identity into something far more distinct.

[Pheraz]

If blizzards analysts think bringing high elf skins for void elves gives them an increase of income it will happen. No matter if it makes sense, makes some people cry or give squirrels diarrhea.
If they think those X people wanting it are just a very loud minority then it won't happen.

[elbleuet]

You mean in the books that featured her as a major character?

On that basis Aramar Thorne of Traveller is a major character.

Veressa has her moments in the books, but her importance in the stories where she actually played a major role does not translate into the game where she is a sidekick to someone else's story whether it be Rhonin, Jaina or Alleria.

But Vereesa has always been an Alliance, secondary character since she's not a racial leader. But again, she's been more relevant to the story than some racial leaders of both the Horde and the Alliance.
And I'm sorry for you, but given the current state of the Horde (only 2-3 important leaders left as the rest of the leadership was either killed or exiled), Vereesa was more impactful on the story than all other current leaders of the Horde excepted Thrall. Not bad for a secondary leader

You didn't actually address my core point, that Lor'themar has nothing to prove as an acknowledged racial leader, whereas Veressa is treated as representing the relevance of the High Elven exiles to the story. Lor'themar's presence or activities has no bearing on the importance of the Blood Elves, as they are a playable race.

When the entire world is threatened, he has indeed. But instead he sat on his throne and did nothing to save the world he lives on.
Vereesa has nothing to prove either.

Veressa is a proxy for your feelings. If Veressa is marginalised, it marginalises the High Elven exiles.

That's a game Obelisk Kai. Take a deep breath And you know High elves and void Blood elves are in the Alliance and we have the 2 windrunner sisters at our side, I'm entirely satisfied I would have loved to get my playable High elves, but I can deal with my sexy void elf

[Obelisk Kai]

snip

It takes effort when quoting someone to remove their names, so that they don't receive a notification. If you don't want to debate because of the weakness of your position, simply don't respond.

[elbleuet]

It takes effort when quoting someone to remove their names, so that they don't receive a notification. If you don't want to debate because of the weakness of your position, simply don't respond.

You're refreshing this page every minute of your time since months and years Obelisk Kai so you actually don't need to receive any "notifications".
You just lack of arguments at this point, and that's why maybe you should stop posting in this thread for a moment

[Obelisk Kai]

You're refreshing this page every minute of your time since months and years Obelisk Kai so you actually don't need to receive any "notifications".
You just lack of arguments at this point, and that's why maybe you should stop posting in this thread for a moment

The point remains, when quoting someone it is polite not to edit the post so that they don't receive a notification in a desperate attempt to get the last word.

Your opinion on how often I post here is, ultimately, meaningless and seems to be a case of 'playing the man and not the ball' as they say.

As for 'lacking arguments', I don't think so. Remember, everything official said on this topic agrees with my interpretations, and your interpretations have collectively amounted to creative fan-fiction.

[elbleuet]

The point remains, when quoting someone it is polite not to edit the post so that they don't receive a notification in a desperate attempt to get the last word.

Your opinion on how often I post here is, ultimately, meaningless and seems to be a case of 'playing the man and not the ball' as they say.

As for 'lacking arguments', I don't think so. Remember, everything official said on this topic agrees with my interpretations, and your interpretations have collectively amounted to creative fan-fiction.

Nah. I know I will never get the last word with you for a simple reason : you're not here to debate Obelisk Kai. You're just here to say "I'm right and I'll explain to you why you're all wrong". This isn't debate, and never has been one So again, you won't need to receive any notifications since you're always there

As for 'lacking arguments', I don't think so. Remember, everything official said on this topic agrees with my interpretations, and your interpretations have collectively amounted to creative fan-fiction.

You think they agree. But this is just your interpretation at this point, nothing else.

[Obelisk Kai]

Nah. I know I will never get the last word with you for a simple reason : you're not here to debate Obelisk Kai. You're just here to say "I'm right and I'll explain to you why you're all wrong". This isn't debate, and never has been one So again, you won't need to receive any notifications since you're always there

I will admit it is hard to call something a debate when you have all the evidence on your side.

Your sole hope of course is that this world is indeed fictional, and the evidence is based on Blizzard's interpretation of how the game exists now. Unlike reality, Blizzard could change their mind. But until they change their mind, you are right, this isn't a debate and never has been as the facts presented are self evident as things stand.

You think they agree. But this is just your interpretation at this point, nothing else.

No, they clearly do agree. No playable High Elf exiles, and High Elf exiles ruled out because High Elves are playable as Blood Elves. That was our last word on the matter. If they've changed their mind they've not told us, and if they do tell us then that will become the latest word on the matter.

[Koroniss]

Actually, I will have to respectfully disagree there. This IS a debate (or least supposed to be one) between people wanting Alliance High Elves to be playable, with proposing different ideas as to the matter, and various other people, naturally including opponents.

It is NOT a debate that Alliance High Elves are not currently playable – that one is factual, indeed (Void Elves excluded). But the topic itself is what is self evident – suggestions and designs as to how AHE might work. Not whether they are playable, not even whether they will or will not be playable. Or at least this is what I subjectively find the thread to be.