Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Traycor]

I think it would be nice to separate the best ideas from the rest, placing them as optional or alternative, or simply other ideas.

A good suggestion. Maybe I can shift those down to my second post on the first page.

[Deleted]

I think I should prune the less lore friendly ideas from the OP. They seem to be causing confusion. Many people think the thread is proposing to implement all of these ideas together, which is not the case. It's to brainstorm new potential tools that could be mixed and matched or used for inspiration for something else entirely.

The primary usefulness of the dragon suggestion was to point out that something like an alliance with a magical race can in and of itself create enough distinction for racial design (see Dragonmaw). It's a game design philosophy thing. If the ideas work, then you try and see if the lore can be created around it. If not, you drop or modify the idea. That's the gradual process of design.

Traycor, I'll state again what I said before: I might not be a fan of the end result, but your work is still commendable. My opinion is that alone, mine. Might be shared by others, but there are also people who like it. So whatever I say, I do hope you understand this is not about you or you effort. With that out of the way.

I think you're underselling the dragon situation a bit and I'll try my best to explain to where I want to get with this. It's not about implementing all these ideas together, but how realistic this brainstorm is becoming. This was proposed and explored several pages ago and there was some excitement about it (hence being in your first post), but it is overreaching. I don't think the "let's throw things at the wall and see whatever sticks" is a philosophy that should be applied in this particular situation. Because what's being discussed (or its implementation) is already a very limited concept: there are very strong ideas of how High Elves should be portrayed and if things dwell too far from it, well... Then I ask you, how is this so different from what you think about Void Elves not fulfilling the expectations of High Elves? Does it justify having another added race that creates the same issues, but with a lighter skin tone?

Sometimes - and talking generally about ideas I see suggested over discussions like this - it reeks a bit of desperation and trying everything JUST to have them implemented. I understand the love! It's there, just like there was entertainment for implementation of naga or ethereals back in the day. Some things are not feasible. If my opinion counts for something - you do you - I think it might be in the interest of this "creative process" to not turn it into something even less feasible.

[Deleted]

my inverstment there only because i don't want my faction being f**king robbed

"Robbed", lol. You are aware that playable High Elves won't mean that Blizzard will have to delete Blood Elves from the game?

and i don't want another elven race in this game. Enough of world of elfcraft already.

Nobody will force you to play an elf. You don't like a race, you don't play it. It's really simple.

hi there mr thief.

Don't remember stealing anything from you.

So you ignoring the fact that this "high elves" theme had throughout Warcraft history ARE ACTUALLY SILVERMOON. Silvermoon still not changed! All themes of so "high elves" belong to Blood elves.

The Warcraft 2 High Elf themes are not being used by current High Elves, as well as there are different themes among High Elves and Blood Elves that developed during WoW timeline.

So you actually want copy+paste race without actuall lore confirmation why this High elves even exist. Like really - NOW they have no reason to fight with silvermoon. NO! ACTUALL! REASON! cause LTT and halduron not againts them at all! Only grudge after so many years passed could be from Alleria because she wasn't there.

High Elves are in the Alliance, they are very opposed to Blood Elves and that's the reality of the current lore. So either deal with it or take your complains to the Blizzard writing team.

you don't get it? it's reference to this thread where someone want "High elves" suddenly be nature based. And i am "seriously" telling them how they can get this "nature based elves". and similarities to VE - because they will be same "a**pull" as void elves.

Not really, it's a completely different situation to VE and you even comparing it as such is only laughable.

and ion stated that Blood elves are pretty much "High elves".

And I don't see how it's a problem given that the entire premise of Allied races is to give races that are "pretty much" the existing races. Like, what's the big difference between Lightforged Draenei and normal Draenei? Or between Orcs and Draenor Orcs?

[Syegfryed]

Updated male version. Every one of these skins is darker than the darkest Blood Elf skin. These varieties show that even with darker skin, a blue eyed High Elf can still look like a High Elf, and it will feel different from Blood Elves. I believe with the new hair styles, war paint, feathered wooden ear jewelry, optional hair streaks, optional battle scars, and darker skin tones, the High Elf design is more than sufficiently different from Blood Elves to warrant adding a High Elf Allied Race into the game.

apart from the hairstyles now they look even more like blood elves, lmao, the point was make then different no?

[Zorish]

And I don't see how it's a problem given that the entire premise of Allied races is to give races that are "pretty much" the existing races. Like, what's the big difference between Lightforged Draenei and normal Draenei? Or between Orcs and Draenor Orcs?

maybe the reason that they are added to ALREADY EXISTING faction? Because they are brothers? And not were exiled for REAL reasons like Void elves? (and even not fully exiled, but rather pointed that void near sunwell is bad)

High Elves are in the Alliance, they are very opposed to Blood Elves and that's the reality of the current lore. So either deal with it or take your complains to the Blizzard writing team.

For nonexistant reasons. While current leader of Blood elves not against them visiting sunwell if they not bring their "Aliance" back with them. And i still didn't see where this "High elves" came from if they were opposed to idea about draining magic from living creatures wich happened MUCH MUCH LATER than renaming of race.

The Warcraft 2 High Elf themes are not being used by current High Elves, as well as there are different themes among High Elves and Blood Elves that developed during WoW timeline.

The older the game the harder to use it's themes. and if you use them - you MUST add them to Blood elves too, because this blood elves were the part of this war. Can you compare orcs from this games to current orcs? i don't see them as the same. And again - your "High elves" live in human buildings. they didn't developed at all. They have no culture AT! ALL! Only some ghostly grudges against i don't know who. Even humans in dalaran not against horde now, but veresa and bunch of i don't know who are pissed.

"Robbed", lol. You are aware that playable High Elves won't mean that Blizzard will have to delete Blood Elves from the game?

You (Aliance) already have model with VE, not you want full copy with pretty blue eyes (wich if implemented must be added to Blood elves too)

[protip]

maybe the reason that they are added to ALREADY EXISTING faction? Because they are brothers? And not were exiled for REAL reasons like Void elves? (and even not fully exiled, but rather pointed that void near sunwell is bad)

For nonexistant reasons. While current leader of Blood elves not against them visiting sunwell if they not bring their "Aliance" back with them. And i still didn't see where this "High elves" came from if they were opposed to idea about draining magic from living creatures wich happened MUCH MUCH LATER than renaming of race.

The older the game the harder to use it's themes. and if you use them - you MUST add them to Blood elves too, because this blood elves were the part of this war. Can you compare orcs from this games to current orcs? i don't see them as the same. And again - your "High elves" live in human buildings. they didn't developed at all. They have no culture AT! ALL! Only some ghostly grudges against i don't know who. Even humans in dalaran not against horde now, but veresa and bunch of i don't know who are pissed.

You (Aliance) already have model with VE, not you want full copy with pretty blue eyes (wich if implemented must be added to Blood elves too)

Honestly man, it's not worth it. We just had this conversation like 2 days ago. Same points, same responses, all with no acknowledgement of the problems people have presented. I've tried to encourage a reasonable discussion multiple times, but there's really no interest in compromise. If people aren't willing to find a way to make the most of their circumstances for what they are, better to leave them to it. It's really just self inflicted disappointment.

[Traycor]

I think you're underselling the dragon situation a bit

Thanks for the comments and compliments, Greywyr! And welcome to the thread.

Unless I missed a post, I don't think 1 person had a positive comment on the dragon idea, which first was added several pages in. I later added it to the OP like most of the other things I posted up. It obviously didn't excite people. If it had excited people, it could have been refined, toned down, had creative ideas for lore, etc... I still don't think it was an idea that couldn't work, it was just something that didn't. And it confused several people about intent.

Then I ask you, how is this so different from what you think about Void Elves not fulfilling the expectations of High Elves?

My opinion: Void Elves are not a compromise for players who wanted High Elves. Mainly because they are nothing like High Elves in concept, feel, affiliation, look, or design. They are FAR closer to Draenei than High Elves, and actually serve to make many High Elf fans feel "robbed" instead of compromised with.

Here's what an actual compromise MIGHT have looked like:
Fans--> We want Blood Elf models with blue eyes that follow the light!
Blizz--> We'll give you blue/purple goth elves with tentacles and void powers, that have no association with High Elves.
Compromise--> Let's find something that still has the feel and concept of High Elves, but that implements a fun new look and design.

Which is exactly what we're doing here. Will these concepts satisfy everyone? Of course not, but they do capture the feel of High Elves. Even the failed Blue Dragon idea would have still felt like High Elves. The war paint might not work for everyone, but it is based on High Elf lore from WCII and it seems to work for the vast majority of posters in this thread that like High Elves. I think ANY idea that still captures the feel and concept of High Elves would be acceptable to the vast majority of High Elf fans. Even the ideas I hate, like using the Human or Night Elf models to build High Elves from, would have still been acceptable to most High Elf fans because it could at least retain the feel and concept.

Sometimes - and talking generally about ideas I see suggested over discussions like this - it reeks a bit of desperation and trying everything JUST to have them implemented.

I've noticed that when someone doesn't want a given thing, they tend to smell desperation on anyone that does. Which typically means they just don't share the same passion.

As for me? It was obvious Blizzard had no design ideas for High Elves. They are a race I want, so I thought it would be fun to post a thread for brainstorming new ideas that Blizzard could run with, or get inspired from. It seemed like a fun exercise that many other people are enjoying as well.

I think it might be in the interest of this "creative process" to not turn it into something even less feasible.

Honestly, I had hoped that posters would throw out other ideas even crazier than the ones I had created. Sometimes those wild ideas will have a grain of something useful, or they will spark an idea for something else that helps. Blizzard likes crazy, which is why we got Void Elves in the first place. Design work likes crazy. In this case, the ideas from crazy just need to be reigned back in afterwards and molded into something workable. It needs to still feel like a High Elf.

Post your crazy High Elf ideas today!

[Deleted]

I'm terrible at quoting, so let's see.

Sometimes those wild ideas will have a grain of something useful, or they will spark an idea for something else that helps.

I agree. And this is why, despite being at odds with the concept, I don't think you or others should stop. Something good might come out of this, even if to apply to something else.

I've noticed that when someone doesn't want a given thing, they tend to smell desperation on anyone that does. Which typically means they just don't share the same passion.

No doubt this can happen, but I don't think this is generally the case as presented by some good posters around here and other threads. Even if they are counterpoints to your passion, you cannot deny they are elaborate, logical and respectful. When you really want something you can also lose sight on the purpose/idea/discussion easily. Some take it too far to the point of ridicule. Passion is a good thing... if measured. This one specifically, is loaded of problems.

Which is exactly what we're doing here. Will these concepts satisfy everyone? Of course not, but they do capture the feel of High Elves. Even the failed Blue Dragon idea would have still felt like High Elves.

I disagree here. I don't feel the essence of High Elves captured in any of the suggestions so far. This is a personal view, of course. I don't think however the majority strays much from the "thalassian model, blue eyes, pale skin" path, at least that's the impression that I gather from reading. And we know that creates an issue for many players. This is not merely a silly complaint or a dismissive "I don't want you to have it" - if it was the case of the Horde getting Lightforged Draenei for example or Alliance getting Mag'har Orcs, my feelings would be the same. It's healthy to have distinction between factions. Or to not have "all the races that you consider best" in a single faction. The game should promote opportunities for different experiences you wouldn't otherwise go for.
I see to an extent "pro High Elves crowd" (such a terrible designation, but you know what I mean) understands this, for the simple fact that you think a compromise might be reached. That you are willing to give up on a existent perception of what you'd like to get something with a tiny part of it. And what you (and others in other discussions) are trying to do here is to find a better compromise than what Void Elves achieved. Which I can relate, there are some points I don't find satisfying either. But I don't think Void Elves were to fill the void in regards of lore, familiarity or recognition of High Elves or whatever, it was simply a "Ok, people like the thalassian model, let's work on a similar one, one with the same structure but distinct enough and give them a new story", hoping that would be satisfatory enough. And one can easily see, while their story might not be refined yet, it's most likely going to have a higher purpose later on, if we follow how the general wow theme is going. We'll have to wait an see. Back on topic: I still don't see enough distinction here (this is not your burden to bear alone, mind! haha), I'm able to see a bit more on Void Elves themselves.
At the end of the day, it's still a compromise, something that will never deliver what people really wanted initially and will leave somewhat a bitter taste. I honestly don't see this situation being so different than Void Elves and creates more problems for me as a outside player that doesn't have much of a.... how to say... a hardcore stance in this whole debate. I think it was you that mentioned LFR? Might be wrong. I'm not particularly fond it and has negative points, but never delved into that sort of discussion because I know that actually offers an experience that otherwise some could not have. Don't feel it's the exact same case here, because there are two alternatives offered (even if they don't follow your exact standards, they don't exclude you).

I might be rambling too much, my posts get fucking long.

But do carry on! Just don't go too crazy

[Traycor]

I don't feel the essence of High Elves captured in any of the suggestions so far.

What do you feel is the essence of the High Elves?

[Deleted]

Don't think you'll like the answer... But in terms of physique: elegant hairstyles/clothing, slender body suggesting agility/finesse, magical attunement somehow expressed by marks or traits, refined face features depicting their long life span. The ordinary, don't think these are uncommon concepts, in a way or another we see these in game on high/blood elf models.

[Deleted]

Sometimes when I read through threads like this I wonder if I'm the only person alive that plays Horde but also wishes the Alliance just got Belfs and Horde got Draenei.

I legit don't understand why the Alliance are so frustrated. If you ask me, you got the better deal out of TBC races.

(I still play Horde because I just do. Couldn't ever play Alliance and have no real reason for not doing so).

[Cien]

I dont understand why some posters act so shafted at people even 'wanting' alliance high elves playable. Its absolutely fine to desire it just like some players have desired straight back orcs, or mag har orcs to RP all the different orc clans or whatever gross nonsense horde players want.

High elves arent an unreasonable demand, I think the fear that they'd be copy pasted from blood elves with blue eyes is what scares people but there is an opportunity to do it differently like this concept and it looks cool. Even the very original high elf models use night elf models but with white skin/blonde hair. Either way we'll end up reusing something or to have an entirely new build altogether wouldn't be too demanding.

People want it, people would play it, people would pay £££££££ for it, Blizzard would be silly not to cash in on it.

[Traycor]

Don't think you'll like the answer... But in terms of physique: elegant hairstyles/clothing, slender body suggesting agility/finesse, magical attunement somehow expressed by marks or traits, refined face features depicting their long life span. The ordinary, don't think these are uncommon concepts, in a way or another we see these in game on high/blood elf models.

Agreed, but that description is exactly like Blood Elves. I think there are ways to capture the feel of High Elves without just doing the same thing as Blood Elves. There is room for variation.

Ultimately, all races wear the same equipment. It has to come down to a change in hair, skin, eyes, markings, animation, soundset, texturemap, and/or model. Those are the only possible variation for any race, Allied or not. (This doesn't count situational things like druid forms or totems)

Which (if any) of those do you think could be changed while capturing the feel of High Elves?

[Goldielocks]

I dont understand why some posters act so shafted at people even 'wanting' alliance high elves playable. Its absolutely fine to desire it just like some players have desired straight back orcs, or mag har orcs to RP all the different orc clans or whatever gross nonsense horde players want.

High elves arent an unreasonable demand, I think the fear that they'd be copy pasted from blood elves with blue eyes is what scares people but there is an opportunity to do it differently like this concept and it looks cool. Even the very original high elf models use night elf models but with white skin/blonde hair. Either way we'll end up reusing something or to have an entirely new build altogether wouldn't be too demanding.

People want it, people would play it, people would pay £££££££ for it, Blizzard would be silly not to cash in on it.

It's actually really simple. There are people on planet Earth who aren't consumed by their own desires and understand that some things aren't possible.

Blizzard says High Elves aren't coming 10 years ago. Those who want High Elves don't listen.
Blizzard says High Elves aren't coming now. They still don't listen.

Beyond being realistic, some people just get this urge to shut people like this down because their extreme denial is reaching psychosis levels. Shit like this:

Its like telling someone you got no real pure blood sith from star wars and telling them to go play jedi. That's same excuse from you and so many others on this website and your right some of threads do bully high elf fans to a point where they might end up losing their minds to a point of a mass shooting.

inb4 "lol that's not all of us!"

[Deleted]

maybe the reason that they are added to ALREADY EXISTING faction? Because they are brothers? And not were exiled for REAL reasons like Void elves? (and even not fully exiled, but rather pointed that void near sunwell is bad)

I am contesting the point Ion made and his point had nothing to do with factions, considering that he argued that Void Elves, a race from the same faction, made High Elves redundant.

For nonexistant reasons. While current leader of Blood elves not against them visiting sunwell if they not bring their "Aliance" back with them. And i still didn't see where this "High elves" came from if they were opposed to idea about draining magic from living creatures wich happened MUCH MUCH LATER than renaming of race.

It doesn't matter, it's what it is now, again DEAL WITH IT. And anyway, the fact that there are no reasons for High Elves to be in the Alliance is purely your opinion and nothing else. There are plenty sufficient reasons for them to be in there if you actually bother to think about it. For starters, Dalaran was also a part of the Alliance and hence some High Elves who lived in Dalaran for hundreds of years may have felt more loyalty towards Dalaran than Quel'Thalas and hence weren't really fond of Quel'Thalas joining Horde, the faction that Dalaran fought not that long ago for its survival. Secondly, Horde did destroy some regions of Quel'Thalas and the High Elves living there might have harbored a much bigger hatred towards the Horde than the High Elves from the untouched regions and hence might have felt betrayed when Quel'Thalas joined the Horde and that made them go to Alliance instead with whom they were fighting together to stop said Horde. And there are other reasons some why some High Elves might have went Alliance. They are not some kind of robots that have to obey Silvermoon's leadership no matter what.

The older the game the harder to use it's themes. and if you use them - you MUST add them to Blood elves too, because this blood elves were the part of this war. Can you compare orcs from this games to current orcs? i don't see them as the same. And again - your "High elves" live in human buildings. they didn't developed at all. They have no culture AT! ALL! Only some ghostly grudges against i don't know who. Even humans in dalaran not against horde now, but veresa and bunch of i don't know who are pissed.

No, they must not add them to Blood Elves, there are no rules stating that they should.
And the fact that High Elves have no culture is purely your opinion. Again, don't like High Elves, don't play them. You clearly aren't the target audience. Blizzard is not forcing you to play a race they implement. Seriously, arguing with such passion against something that many people want that would have had absolutely no effect on you, your gameplay and lore seems incredibly petty for me.

(Aliance) already have model with VE, not you want full copy with pretty blue eyes (wich if implemented must be added to Blood elves too)

I don't care about the Blood Elf model. Blizzard can take it away for all I care.

[Obelisk Kai]

I dont understand why some posters act so shafted at people even 'wanting' alliance high elves playable. Its absolutely fine to desire it just like some players have desired straight back orcs, or mag har orcs to RP all the different orc clans or whatever gross nonsense horde players want.

High elves arent an unreasonable demand, I think the fear that they'd be copy pasted from blood elves with blue eyes is what scares people but there is an opportunity to do it differently like this concept and it looks cool. Even the very original high elf models use night elf models but with white skin/blonde hair. Either way we'll end up reusing something or to have an entirely new build altogether wouldn't be too demanding.

People want it, people would play it, people would pay £££££££ for it, Blizzard would be silly not to cash in on it.

You know, I've seen that line bandied around for years now, that Blizzard would eventually do it for the ££££££££ or the $$$$$$$$$ or something like that.

If they were ever going to do that they would have done it years ago. And if High Elves were such a 'cha-ching' opportunity, then they would have included them in the first tranche of Allied Races released rather than creating Void Elves.

And yes, I know the next counter to that is that clearly Void Elves were created to get SOME race changes from those so desperate they can't wait any more and THEN unleash playable High Elves on the Alliance, leading to even more race changes and even more $$$$$$$$ or whatever currency symbol you'd like to spam. Maybe if people believe that, Blizzard will throw in a free tinfoil hat with the purchase.

As to the rest of your post, High Elves on the Alliance is as unreasonable demand as Humans on the Horde. We want to preserve as much faction diversity as possible, and giving the Alliance a carbon copy of our most popular race in a faction based game is going to undermine that. You don't believe it will, but let's be honest;anyone who wants playable Alliance High Elves isn't going to rate faction diversity as one of their more pressing concerns and is very likely to minimise the impact in pursuit of their goal.

[FlubberPuddy]

I dont understand why some posters act so shafted at people even 'wanting' alliance high elves playable. Its absolutely fine to desire it just like some players have desired straight back orcs, or mag har orcs to RP all the different orc clans or whatever gross nonsense horde players want.

High elves arent an unreasonable demand, I think the fear that they'd be copy pasted from blood elves with blue eyes is what scares people but there is an opportunity to do it differently like this concept and it looks cool. Even the very original high elf models use night elf models but with white skin/blonde hair. Either way we'll end up reusing something or to have an entirely new build altogether wouldn't be too demanding.

People want it, people would play it, people would pay £££££££ for it, Blizzard would be silly not to cash in on it.

Because the people who are acting so shafted are actually the ones taking it extremely personally. As if you're trying to rip away their children from them or something, when really all that most of the people who'd like High Elves are just asking for a race that's always been present alongside Alliance in WoW to be playable.

But nope, some people have to take it very personally and say stuff like, "taking Horde's most popular race" lol please. It never hurts to ask for something, yet some are even trying to stifle discussion of it.

Take for instance this Gorian Ogres thread someone made, on April 1st: https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20762096574

It's barely getting support in comparison and not stimulating much discussion at all.

The most recent High Elf thread, when it was up for 2 days before being capped, garnered 3x as much likes on the main post. And that's not counting how many likes all previous threads had too.

Some people need to face the reality of this and why it is that High Elves are still being asked for and discussed:

1) High Elves are really really popular, extremely popular. Probably the most popular Allied Race being asked for still as evidenced above in comparison to all other Allied Race requests. I mean people can say "it's the same 5-10 ppl talking" but you can only like a post once per account. Proof is in the pudding. No other potential AR has generated this much discussion/support except for maybe Wildhammer Dwarves, oh look another classic Alliance race.

2) Ion's comment was the spark that ignited all the recent High Elf talk, suffice it to say that there are many that don't believe his comment was a flat "No" or a "No" in any sense of finality.

3)The recent High Elf talk is making a case for High Elves to be playable by collating and presenting that case in a very cohesive manner. Suffice it to say, that's been done extremely well by looking at the amount of support those threads have had and continue to have. Also by the comments that people have made about how they wished this excitement or passion would go towards something else.

4)Most of the people that put up the High Elf talk are actually trying to come up with a compromise through all the discussion and brainstorming.

Since Ion made that comment before the explosion of recent High Elf discussions, and has yet to reinforce that statement, it could even possibly be that they're re-thinking their idea. Maybe not, but we won't really know until they make further comment on it after acknowledging recent threads like this and those on the official forums.

To me, a the posters who seem to take it really personally most often seem to say things such as, "if High Elves got those things then Blood Elves should have it too!" seems like basic envy to me.

EDIT: @Ddi brought up a great point as well that some of the opposers who take it personally seem to fail to understand: Not all Allied Races are meant to appeal to everyone. I mean didn't Ion essentially say this, "play what you want to play" during Blizzcon when talking about why they went with the Allied Race system.

And again there is basis in the request asking for High Elves. It's not like some people are asking to play a Titan or something. Yet some seem to think asking for High Elves is to ask for the impossible. I don't agree with that.

[Deleted]

Agreed, but that description is exactly like Blood Elves. I think there are ways to capture the feel of High Elves without just doing the same thing as Blood Elves. There is room for variation.

Ultimately, all races wear the same equipment. It has to come down to a change in hair, skin, eyes, markings, animation, soundset, texturemap, and/or model. Those are the only possible variation for any race, Allied or not. (This doesn't count situational things like druid forms or totems)

Which (if any) of those do you think could be changed while capturing the feel of High Elves?

Told you you would not be pleased. It is complicated to answer this because Blood Elves were High Elves. I'm not going to dwell on this, was mentioned several times. But in terms of looks, the issue risen with it is there wasn't enough transformation by Fel or magic siphoning. It's debatable if there should be further or not, but as they are depicted, there isn't. And both represent general traits that infer these sort of intrinsic values.

Perhaps instead of trying to look for features, the story would have to change first in order to change our perception as well and be able to associate new characteristics to new traits.

To give you an example. This is what happened - I believe done very well - with the Nightborne: the dark skin tones, hair/eyes colors for being closed in by the barrier for millennia, their diminished bodies compared to their past form (more akin to night elves nowadays) influenced by their dependence of a single source of power, their sustenance (and sometimes inability of sustaining), the glyphed bright tattoos that reflect arcane school of magic (a more visually refined type of magic or associated with time in this game) and so on.

That was also done to Void Elves to some extent, I can't say personally how much because I haven't check them thoroughly. But let's not forget this is also a new race coming into a new point of lore (I mean, over all these years we thought Legion was the "ultimate threat" aside Old Gods, even the Void plot gets some time to get used to), perhaps later on they it will feel less strange (though from what I understand a good chunk of people are pleased). Unlike Nightborne that uses origins/locations/concepts that we heard before, it was there, we just didn't have enough to go on to create a profile - Void Elves come from an abrupt transformation that we barely had anything to go on.

Unfortunately, this is all talk. Because people want the standard "blue eyes, pale skin tone, same model". Which has found opposition because it has no real differentiation. And people can claim massive influx or support for this, but I think about this over 60 pages thread and I feel I can count the posters by hand, just volume made by the same people going back and forth. Doesn't mean much.

[Obelisk Kai]

Honestly man, it's not worth it. We just had this conversation like 2 days ago. Same points, same responses, all with no acknowledgement of the problems people have presented. I've tried to encourage a reasonable discussion multiple times, but there's really no interest in compromise. If people aren't willing to find a way to make the most of their circumstances for what they are, better to leave them to it. It's really just self inflicted disappointment.

Again, I salute you for trying, but Void Elves are the compromise and they didn't want it.

Their rationale is that because they didn't like the compromise, Blizzard has to try again until they do like it. Which is sort of a nonsense because anyone who has studied history or politics knows a compromise isn't meant to make everyone happy but be equally unsatisfactory to all sides. Void Elves, a modified port of a model I feel should have remained Horde unique, fulfil that purpose admirably.

[Traycor]

At this point I'm not sure whats worse. The high elf druid suggested here or the fact that anti-high elf horde players are salty because people want high elves, and they're doing anything they can to stop people from wanting it.

??????

Any suggestions for High Elf changes? New themes, etc... ?