1. #1201
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    Don't think you'll like the answer... But in terms of physique: elegant hairstyles/clothing, slender body suggesting agility/finesse, magical attunement somehow expressed by marks or traits, refined face features depicting their long life span. The ordinary, don't think these are uncommon concepts, in a way or another we see these in game on high/blood elf models.

  2. #1202
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    Sometimes when I read through threads like this I wonder if I'm the only person alive that plays Horde but also wishes the Alliance just got Belfs and Horde got Draenei.

    I legit don't understand why the Alliance are so frustrated. If you ask me, you got the better deal out of TBC races.

    (I still play Horde because I just do. Couldn't ever play Alliance and have no real reason for not doing so).

  3. #1203
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    I dont understand why some posters act so shafted at people even 'wanting' alliance high elves playable. Its absolutely fine to desire it just like some players have desired straight back orcs, or mag har orcs to RP all the different orc clans or whatever gross nonsense horde players want.

    High elves arent an unreasonable demand, I think the fear that they'd be copy pasted from blood elves with blue eyes is what scares people but there is an opportunity to do it differently like this concept and it looks cool. Even the very original high elf models use night elf models but with white skin/blonde hair. Either way we'll end up reusing something or to have an entirely new build altogether wouldn't be too demanding.

    People want it, people would play it, people would pay £££££££ for it, Blizzard would be silly not to cash in on it.

  4. #1204
    Quote Originally Posted by Greywyr View Post
    Don't think you'll like the answer... But in terms of physique: elegant hairstyles/clothing, slender body suggesting agility/finesse, magical attunement somehow expressed by marks or traits, refined face features depicting their long life span. The ordinary, don't think these are uncommon concepts, in a way or another we see these in game on high/blood elf models.
    Agreed, but that description is exactly like Blood Elves. I think there are ways to capture the feel of High Elves without just doing the same thing as Blood Elves. There is room for variation.

    Ultimately, all races wear the same equipment. It has to come down to a change in hair, skin, eyes, markings, animation, soundset, texturemap, and/or model. Those are the only possible variation for any race, Allied or not. (This doesn't count situational things like druid forms or totems)

    Which (if any) of those do you think could be changed while capturing the feel of High Elves?

  5. #1205
    Quote Originally Posted by Cien View Post
    I dont understand why some posters act so shafted at people even 'wanting' alliance high elves playable. Its absolutely fine to desire it just like some players have desired straight back orcs, or mag har orcs to RP all the different orc clans or whatever gross nonsense horde players want.

    High elves arent an unreasonable demand, I think the fear that they'd be copy pasted from blood elves with blue eyes is what scares people but there is an opportunity to do it differently like this concept and it looks cool. Even the very original high elf models use night elf models but with white skin/blonde hair. Either way we'll end up reusing something or to have an entirely new build altogether wouldn't be too demanding.

    People want it, people would play it, people would pay £££££££ for it, Blizzard would be silly not to cash in on it.
    It's actually really simple. There are people on planet Earth who aren't consumed by their own desires and understand that some things aren't possible.

    Blizzard says High Elves aren't coming 10 years ago. Those who want High Elves don't listen.
    Blizzard says High Elves aren't coming now. They still don't listen.

    Beyond being realistic, some people just get this urge to shut people like this down because their extreme denial is reaching psychosis levels. Shit like this:
    Quote Originally Posted by WoWKnight65 View Post
    Its like telling someone you got no real pure blood sith from star wars and telling them to go play jedi. That's same excuse from you and so many others on this website and your right some of threads do bully high elf fans to a point where they might end up losing their minds to a point of a mass shooting.
    inb4 "lol that's not all of us!"
    Last edited by Goldielocks; 2018-04-03 at 08:17 PM.

  6. #1206
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zorish View Post
    maybe the reason that they are added to ALREADY EXISTING faction? Because they are brothers? And not were exiled for REAL reasons like Void elves? (and even not fully exiled, but rather pointed that void near sunwell is bad)
    I am contesting the point Ion made and his point had nothing to do with factions, considering that he argued that Void Elves, a race from the same faction, made High Elves redundant.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zorish View Post
    For nonexistant reasons. While current leader of Blood elves not against them visiting sunwell if they not bring their "Aliance" back with them. And i still didn't see where this "High elves" came from if they were opposed to idea about draining magic from living creatures wich happened MUCH MUCH LATER than renaming of race.
    It doesn't matter, it's what it is now, again DEAL WITH IT. And anyway, the fact that there are no reasons for High Elves to be in the Alliance is purely your opinion and nothing else. There are plenty sufficient reasons for them to be in there if you actually bother to think about it. For starters, Dalaran was also a part of the Alliance and hence some High Elves who lived in Dalaran for hundreds of years may have felt more loyalty towards Dalaran than Quel'Thalas and hence weren't really fond of Quel'Thalas joining Horde, the faction that Dalaran fought not that long ago for its survival. Secondly, Horde did destroy some regions of Quel'Thalas and the High Elves living there might have harbored a much bigger hatred towards the Horde than the High Elves from the untouched regions and hence might have felt betrayed when Quel'Thalas joined the Horde and that made them go to Alliance instead with whom they were fighting together to stop said Horde. And there are other reasons some why some High Elves might have went Alliance. They are not some kind of robots that have to obey Silvermoon's leadership no matter what.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zorish View Post
    The older the game the harder to use it's themes. and if you use them - you MUST add them to Blood elves too, because this blood elves were the part of this war. Can you compare orcs from this games to current orcs? i don't see them as the same. And again - your "High elves" live in human buildings. they didn't developed at all. They have no culture AT! ALL! Only some ghostly grudges against i don't know who. Even humans in dalaran not against horde now, but veresa and bunch of i don't know who are pissed.
    No, they must not add them to Blood Elves, there are no rules stating that they should.
    And the fact that High Elves have no culture is purely your opinion. Again, don't like High Elves, don't play them. You clearly aren't the target audience. Blizzard is not forcing you to play a race they implement. Seriously, arguing with such passion against something that many people want that would have had absolutely no effect on you, your gameplay and lore seems incredibly petty for me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zorish View Post
    (Aliance) already have model with VE, not you want full copy with pretty blue eyes (wich if implemented must be added to Blood elves too)
    I don't care about the Blood Elf model. Blizzard can take it away for all I care.

  7. #1207
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cien View Post
    I dont understand why some posters act so shafted at people even 'wanting' alliance high elves playable. Its absolutely fine to desire it just like some players have desired straight back orcs, or mag har orcs to RP all the different orc clans or whatever gross nonsense horde players want.

    High elves arent an unreasonable demand, I think the fear that they'd be copy pasted from blood elves with blue eyes is what scares people but there is an opportunity to do it differently like this concept and it looks cool. Even the very original high elf models use night elf models but with white skin/blonde hair. Either way we'll end up reusing something or to have an entirely new build altogether wouldn't be too demanding.

    People want it, people would play it, people would pay £££££££ for it, Blizzard would be silly not to cash in on it.
    You know, I've seen that line bandied around for years now, that Blizzard would eventually do it for the ££££££££ or the $$$$$$$$$ or something like that.

    If they were ever going to do that they would have done it years ago. And if High Elves were such a 'cha-ching' opportunity, then they would have included them in the first tranche of Allied Races released rather than creating Void Elves.

    And yes, I know the next counter to that is that clearly Void Elves were created to get SOME race changes from those so desperate they can't wait any more and THEN unleash playable High Elves on the Alliance, leading to even more race changes and even more $$$$$$$$ or whatever currency symbol you'd like to spam. Maybe if people believe that, Blizzard will throw in a free tinfoil hat with the purchase.

    As to the rest of your post, High Elves on the Alliance is as unreasonable demand as Humans on the Horde. We want to preserve as much faction diversity as possible, and giving the Alliance a carbon copy of our most popular race in a faction based game is going to undermine that. You don't believe it will, but let's be honest;anyone who wants playable Alliance High Elves isn't going to rate faction diversity as one of their more pressing concerns and is very likely to minimise the impact in pursuit of their goal.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cien View Post
    I dont understand why some posters act so shafted at people even 'wanting' alliance high elves playable. Its absolutely fine to desire it just like some players have desired straight back orcs, or mag har orcs to RP all the different orc clans or whatever gross nonsense horde players want.

    High elves arent an unreasonable demand, I think the fear that they'd be copy pasted from blood elves with blue eyes is what scares people but there is an opportunity to do it differently like this concept and it looks cool. Even the very original high elf models use night elf models but with white skin/blonde hair. Either way we'll end up reusing something or to have an entirely new build altogether wouldn't be too demanding.

    People want it, people would play it, people would pay £££££££ for it, Blizzard would be silly not to cash in on it.
    Because the people who are acting so shafted are actually the ones taking it extremely personally. As if you're trying to rip away their children from them or something, when really all that most of the people who'd like High Elves are just asking for a race that's always been present alongside Alliance in WoW to be playable.

    But nope, some people have to take it very personally and say stuff like, "taking Horde's most popular race" lol please. It never hurts to ask for something, yet some are even trying to stifle discussion of it.

    Take for instance this Gorian Ogres thread someone made, on April 1st: https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20762096574

    It's barely getting support in comparison and not stimulating much discussion at all.

    The most recent High Elf thread, when it was up for 2 days before being capped, garnered 3x as much likes on the main post. And that's not counting how many likes all previous threads had too.

    Some people need to face the reality of this and why it is that High Elves are still being asked for and discussed:

    1) High Elves are really really popular, extremely popular. Probably the most popular Allied Race being asked for still as evidenced above in comparison to all other Allied Race requests. I mean people can say "it's the same 5-10 ppl talking" but you can only like a post once per account. Proof is in the pudding. No other potential AR has generated this much discussion/support except for maybe Wildhammer Dwarves, oh look another classic Alliance race.

    2) Ion's comment was the spark that ignited all the recent High Elf talk, suffice it to say that there are many that don't believe his comment was a flat "No" or a "No" in any sense of finality.

    3)The recent High Elf talk is making a case for High Elves to be playable by collating and presenting that case in a very cohesive manner. Suffice it to say, that's been done extremely well by looking at the amount of support those threads have had and continue to have. Also by the comments that people have made about how they wished this excitement or passion would go towards something else.

    4)Most of the people that put up the High Elf talk are actually trying to come up with a compromise through all the discussion and brainstorming.

    Since Ion made that comment before the explosion of recent High Elf discussions, and has yet to reinforce that statement, it could even possibly be that they're re-thinking their idea. Maybe not, but we won't really know until they make further comment on it after acknowledging recent threads like this and those on the official forums.

    To me, a the posters who seem to take it really personally most often seem to say things such as, "if High Elves got those things then Blood Elves should have it too!" seems like basic envy to me.

    EDIT: @Ddi brought up a great point as well that some of the opposers who take it personally seem to fail to understand: Not all Allied Races are meant to appeal to everyone. I mean didn't Ion essentially say this, "play what you want to play" during Blizzcon when talking about why they went with the Allied Race system.

    And again there is basis in the request asking for High Elves. It's not like some people are asking to play a Titan or something. Yet some seem to think asking for High Elves is to ask for the impossible. I don't agree with that.
    Last edited by FlubberPuddy; 2018-04-03 at 08:41 PM.

  9. #1209
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    Quote Originally Posted by Traycor View Post
    Agreed, but that description is exactly like Blood Elves. I think there are ways to capture the feel of High Elves without just doing the same thing as Blood Elves. There is room for variation.

    Ultimately, all races wear the same equipment. It has to come down to a change in hair, skin, eyes, markings, animation, soundset, texturemap, and/or model. Those are the only possible variation for any race, Allied or not. (This doesn't count situational things like druid forms or totems)

    Which (if any) of those do you think could be changed while capturing the feel of High Elves?
    Told you you would not be pleased. It is complicated to answer this because Blood Elves were High Elves. I'm not going to dwell on this, was mentioned several times. But in terms of looks, the issue risen with it is there wasn't enough transformation by Fel or magic siphoning. It's debatable if there should be further or not, but as they are depicted, there isn't. And both represent general traits that infer these sort of intrinsic values.

    Perhaps instead of trying to look for features, the story would have to change first in order to change our perception as well and be able to associate new characteristics to new traits.

    To give you an example. This is what happened - I believe done very well - with the Nightborne: the dark skin tones, hair/eyes colors for being closed in by the barrier for millennia, their diminished bodies compared to their past form (more akin to night elves nowadays) influenced by their dependence of a single source of power, their sustenance (and sometimes inability of sustaining), the glyphed bright tattoos that reflect arcane school of magic (a more visually refined type of magic or associated with time in this game) and so on.

    That was also done to Void Elves to some extent, I can't say personally how much because I haven't check them thoroughly. But let's not forget this is also a new race coming into a new point of lore (I mean, over all these years we thought Legion was the "ultimate threat" aside Old Gods, even the Void plot gets some time to get used to), perhaps later on they it will feel less strange (though from what I understand a good chunk of people are pleased). Unlike Nightborne that uses origins/locations/concepts that we heard before, it was there, we just didn't have enough to go on to create a profile - Void Elves come from an abrupt transformation that we barely had anything to go on.

    Unfortunately, this is all talk. Because people want the standard "blue eyes, pale skin tone, same model". Which has found opposition because it has no real differentiation. And people can claim massive influx or support for this, but I think about this over 60 pages thread and I feel I can count the posters by hand, just volume made by the same people going back and forth. Doesn't mean much.
    Last edited by mmoc56209c6654; 2018-04-03 at 09:03 PM.

  10. #1210
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    Quote Originally Posted by protip View Post
    Honestly man, it's not worth it. We just had this conversation like 2 days ago. Same points, same responses, all with no acknowledgement of the problems people have presented. I've tried to encourage a reasonable discussion multiple times, but there's really no interest in compromise. If people aren't willing to find a way to make the most of their circumstances for what they are, better to leave them to it. It's really just self inflicted disappointment.
    Again, I salute you for trying, but Void Elves are the compromise and they didn't want it.

    Their rationale is that because they didn't like the compromise, Blizzard has to try again until they do like it. Which is sort of a nonsense because anyone who has studied history or politics knows a compromise isn't meant to make everyone happy but be equally unsatisfactory to all sides. Void Elves, a modified port of a model I feel should have remained Horde unique, fulfil that purpose admirably.

  11. #1211
    Quote Originally Posted by Lucius View Post
    At this point I'm not sure whats worse. The high elf druid suggested here or the fact that anti-high elf horde players are salty because people want high elves, and they're doing anything they can to stop people from wanting it.

    ??????
    Any suggestions for High Elf changes? New themes, etc... ?

  12. #1212
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    Quote Originally Posted by Traycor View Post
    Any suggestions for High Elf changes? New themes, etc... ?
    Purple. With tentacles and a void theme.

    Take the hint, what you are asking for was already done and you don't like it. That is unfortunate but I don't see how it's anyone else's problem but your own.

  13. #1213
    Quote Originally Posted by FlubberPuddy View Post
    And again there is basis in the request asking for High Elves. It's not like some people are asking to play a Titan or something. Yet some seem to think asking for High Elves is to ask for the impossible. I don't agree with that.
    How much you agree or any of us argue is irrelevant. The dev team doesn't want to do it, and have heavily implied that they don't want to do it.

    This crusade is grand delusion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Traycor View Post
    Any suggestions for High Elf changes? New themes, etc... ?
    I know you're using the commando style warpaints to harken back to WC2 settings, but how about some tattoo styles like those of Alleria, Traycor?

    Those would feel very modern, yet still that High Elf Ranger theme esque. Could even make some rune-looking tattoos based off of Dalaran for High Elves of the Silver Covenant?

    Just throwing more ideas out there, wish I had the artistic skills to help contribute designs!

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldielocks View Post
    How much you agree or any of us argue is irrelevant. The dev team doesn't want to do it, and have heavily implied that they don't want to do it.

    This crusade is grand delusion.
    That's very true. It doesn't matter what you or I or anyone else thinks individually. But to say the community as a whole thinks doesn't matter is completely wrong since when it concerns Allied Races, the devs have said to us to tell them what we'd like to see.

    Therefore people are gathering and supporting and putting forth cases for the Allied Races they'd like to see. Again, this is still up to the devs, but so far I'd say it's looking good.

    If you truly believe it won't happen then as I said before, that's good for you. You're not going to convince most to stop though, that's like asking sports fan to stop cheering for their team before the game is over. It's not over till the game's over! (Or in this case till there's a definitive "No")

  15. #1215
    Quote Originally Posted by FlubberPuddy View Post
    If you truly believe it won't happen then as I said before, that's good for you. You're not going to convince most to stop though, that's like asking sports fan to stop cheering for their team before the game is over. It's not over till the game's over! (Or in this case till there's a definitive "No")
    You're not going to get a definitive no for the same reason why it makes sense that High Elves will never come to the Alliance. They're a company first. If Blizzard outright says "High Elves are never happening," who knows how many zealots will quit enjoying the game and stop paying their subs.

    You have to ask yourself, if High Elves are such an easy and bountiful cash grab, then why haven't they happened yet? Don't say "oh the Devs wanted to do something new." That's not a real answer. Most of the allied races aren't new at all. There must be a reason why Void Elves look the way they do, as opposed to the other allied races looking like they could pass for racial aesthetic features. It has to do with the marketing of the game. That's what matters to Blizzard first. The lore heels to keep the game running.

    The amount of people who say "I just don't understand why people are against High Elves" is ridiculous. It's a realistic perspective.

  16. #1216
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goldielocks View Post
    How much you agree or any of us argue is irrelevant. The dev team doesn't want to do it, and have heavily implied that they don't want to do it.

    This crusade is grand delusion.
    The Alliance can't have them as, despite Traycor's doodles, they are a de facto neutralization of the Horde's most popular race. It would be akin to Horde players demanding Alterac Humans as a playable race but they are totally different because now they all have mohawks.

    Faction diversity matters and saying 'no it doesn't', as some have implied, is not only a completely ridiculous stance as we head into an expansion dominated by all out war between the two factions but it's just such a pathetic response. "Faction diversity doesn't matter, because if I accepted it did I'd understand I am wasting my time asking for High Elves" is a far more honest reading.

    The continuing agitation for High Elves is becoming a poison. Alliance players wail about the all attention the Horde is getting this expansion, yet they devote themselves to this goal that they have no chance of realising. The Horde is doing better because the Horde asks for reasonable things.

    They truly believe that a demonstration of their desire is all that is required, ignoring the fact that Blizzard has quite happily ignored them for a decade and will ignore them for the next decade too. This game's development is NOT a democracy and sometimes just because a group of players desires something does not mean they are going to get it, especially if that group persists in minimising or ignoring the valid concerns and points raised against their goal because they find such discussion inconvenient or not actually important.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldielocks View Post
    You're not going to get a definitive no for the same reason why it makes sense that High Elves will never come to the Alliance. They're a company first. If Blizzard outright says "High Elves are never happening," who knows how many zealots will quit enjoying the game and stop paying their subs.

    You have to ask yourself, if High Elves are such an easy and bountiful cash grab, then why haven't they happened yet? Don't say "oh the Devs wanted to do something new." That's not a real answer. Most of the allied races aren't new at all. There must be a reason why Void Elves look the way they do, and it has to do with the marketing of the game. That's what matters to Blizzard first. The lore heels to keep the game running.

    The amount of people who say "I just don't understand why people are against High Elves" is ridiculous. It's a realistic perspective.
    Ion didn't say High Elves are never going to be playable.

    He said High Elves are pretty much playable as Blood Elves on the Horde.

    So they're right, he really didn't say no. High Elves are playable.

  17. #1217
    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    Ion didn't say High Elves are never going to be playable.

    He said High Elves are pretty much playable as Blood Elves on the Horde.

    So they're right, he really didn't say no. High Elves are playable.
    Not playable on the Alliance though. That's the dream these people want. If Ion says "High Elves will always be Horde," imagine the outrage.

    Or even worse the "he'll probably eventually change his mind" reaction that I've seen a few people on this forum put up.

  18. #1218
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goldielocks View Post
    Not playable on the Alliance though. That's the dream these people want. If Ion says "High Elves will always be Horde," imagine the outrage.

    Or even worse the "he'll probably eventually change his mind" reaction that I've seen a few people on this forum put up.
    Well yes, the logical inference a rational minded person would take from his statement is that High Elves are playable on the Horde and as such are not going to be available to the Alliance, particularly as they've just created Void Elves as a variant.

    But he literally didn't say no and he literally said they are playable...so I guess we actually have to concede on something. Ion did not say 'no' in that video.

  19. #1219
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goldielocks View Post
    You're not going to get a definitive no for the same reason why it makes sense that High Elves will never come to the Alliance. They're a company first. If Blizzard outright says "High Elves are never happening," who knows how many zealots will quit enjoying the game and stop paying their subs.

    You have to ask yourself, if High Elves are such an easy and bountiful cash grab, then why haven't they happened yet? Don't say "oh the Devs wanted to do something new." That's not a real answer. Most of the allied races aren't new at all. There must be a reason why Void Elves look the way they do, as opposed to the other allied races looking like they could pass for racial aesthetic features. It has to do with the marketing of the game. That's what matters to Blizzard first. The lore heels to keep the game running.

    The amount of people who say "I just don't understand why people are against High Elves" is ridiculous. It's a realistic perspective.
    Ahh now the "Business argument" comes up, when I've been using it this whole time trying to say to High Elf opposers the reason he made that comment was because Void Elves had just been revealed. Again, as I said another time too, Blood Elves got Golden Eyes, if they really wanted to end the High Elf debate they would've added Blue Eyes to Blood Elves too.

    So how come you say it's a "business decision" that he won't ever say "No" on High Elves, but I can't say it's a "business decision" that he tried downplaying High Elves in the midst of Void Elf reveal? No business would ever shoot themselves in the foot by mentioning, "oh yeah that race you really want is going to come later." He can say that about Mag'har because they hadn't just unveiled an Orc at all.

    It's kind of like saying, do people think then that Wildhammer Dwarves are never happening, because of Dark Irons? Because following some of your guys' logic it would mean WH Dwarves won't happen due to Dark Iron, and Blizzard have been staying mum about WH Dwarves too, it's just Ion wasn't asked about them at Blizzcon.

    inb4 "WH Dwarves don't take an opposite faction race" because that's exactly what Void Elves did already, so that argument is dead.

  20. #1220
    Quote Originally Posted by FlubberPuddy View Post
    I know you're using the commando style warpaints to harken back to WC2 settings, but how about some tattoo styles like those of Alleria, Traycor?
    Thanks! Her tattoo is based on the same WCII designs. These concepts here are just flat solid colors for the most part, but if these were implemented in game, I imagine they would look similar to what her model has. Maybe with less detail, because she's a major NPC, but you get the idea. I've not taken the time to make any of these concepts look like final artwork or fully modeled texture maps, etc, nor would I want to.

    ___________________________

    As a completely random side note, I ran across this old piece of fan art I made way back in 2008. For some reason I thought this was older than that, but I guess I made it when WotLK was on the way.


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