1. #13341
    Old God Maxilian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    Yea that's the idea.

    Absorbing the fel et getting fel eyes because of it is a form of corruption.

    To sum up, void elves are void corrupted blood elves, and blood elves are fel corrupted high elves.

    This is the same deal with Mag'har orcs not dealing with the fel and thus not getting their skin green, this name meaning "uncorrupted" in orcish.
    Well.. i would not compare Void Elves corruption with the Blood elf "corruption", as one is trully a corruption while the other is just not that big of a deal (nor have any negative for the BE).

    Note: Have in mind that the Orcs was, indeed, corruption, as the consumed it, pushing the demon blood into everyone

  2. #13342
    Blizzard missed the chance to easily close this debate for good with the Void Elves. Had they have Umbric and the rest be based on the Alliance High elven NPCs in game, or simply rename themselves High Elves again after their exile as others have done before them, and then have their actual ingame name be High Elves (and not Void, which I personally find extremely lackluster), then the entire topic would have been shut down hard. Blueberry skins or not, the name itself would do so. Blood Elves moved past it after the Scourge conquest, and it wouldn't infringe on their ingame faction representation more than what we have now. Could make for some additional narrative clashes between the two factions, but the ultimate playerbase debate would be closed for good, way more permanent than adding blue eyes for BE or fair skin tones for VE could achieve now.

  3. #13343
    Mechagnome elbleuet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maxilian View Post
    Well.. i would not compare Void Elves corruption with the Blood elf "corruption", as one is trully a corruption while the other is just not that big of a deal (nor have any negative for the BE).

    Note: Have in mind that the Orcs was, indeed, corruption, as the consumed it, pushing the demon blood into everyone
    To me, there are just different levels of corruption.
    "One day, Silvermoon will stand again on the side of the Alliance, I know it"

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  4. #13344
    The Lightbringer Pennem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starla View Post
    But that wouldn't make them High Elves on the Alliance, would it?
    It would make them High Elves on the Alliance the same way that Wildhammer fans are cheering to be able to finally get to play a Wildhammer Dwarf even though it's going to have the racials/voice jokes/etc of a Bronzebeard (aka mountain dwarf).

    Wildhammer Dwarves are Dwarves that specifically spend all their time above ground, having racials like "Stoneform" and "Might of the Mountain" make no sense, but guess what? Majority of people don't care because they get to have the aesthetic fantasy (Wildhammer Dwarf Shaman on the Alliance) which is much bigger to most everyone.
    Last edited by Pennem; 2019-11-05 at 02:11 PM.

  5. #13345
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starla View Post
    Where is this stated in the lore? Corrupted?
    "Corrupted" would be an appropriate term given the general negative connotation the Void has for most people (internal to the narrative). They were explicitly altered or mutated by the Void ritual that Nether-Prince Durzaan was enacting upon them, which Alleria stopped before it could completely turn Umbric's people into Void abominations in Durzaan's thrall.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Maxilian View Post
    I think he refers to the effect of the Fel radiation that they have, is not much of a corruption, but still... i can see why may see it that way
    I wouldn't say the Blood Elves are "corrupted," per se; not if you're contrasting them to what happened with the Void Elves. The Blood Elves are tainted by the Fel somewhat, evidenced by the emerald eyes the majority of them have, but it's a pretty minor alteration when compared to the Void Elves' alterations.
    "I remember what I told you, but I can't remember why. The moon is turning red and bleeding through the sky. Absolution, redemption, salvation at the end - when justice is served don't expect me to attend." - Trust Obey, "Raymond Chandler Evening"

  6. #13346
    The Lightbringer Pennem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    And this topic was hugely contentious six years ago. Just because you were not participating in the debate at that point does not mean it was a less active topic. The real difference is the Allied race system's introduction, which has meant a topic that used to be seasonal i.e in the run up to every expansion announcement where a new feature would be announced with the new expansion which could conceivably have been high elves has been replaced by the constant drum of beat of a pair of allied races being introduced every six to nine months since the first four were added. Which is one of the reasons we should offer thanks that the BFA Allied race cycle has almost certainly drawn to a close. With the opportunities for new additions to the Alliance and Horde once again becoming rare, hopefully this topic will return to what it was. Eight months of arguing before Blizzcon and sixteen months of quiet after.
    Here you go again presuming things and being wrong. I have followed WoW since I started in 2010 in Wrath of the Lich King. I have known about MMO-C and followed it's front page/forum/general discussions since then. I would check MMO-C everyday even when I wasn't subbed to WoW for years at a time, just to keep up with its development of things like LFR/Transmog, MoP and all that brought, WoD and its challenges/abrupt end etc etc.

    The topic of players asking for High Elves was almost non-existant. It didn't explode until Allied Races became a system.

    Maybe you're the one spending 99% of your time hoping High Elves never happen and thus cannot lift your gaze from the fact that the request has been pretty niche compared to everything else until AR system came. Now we have almost every convention some media person asking about High Elves status updates or Blue Eyes on the Blood Elves - something that was never a thing because of how niche the ask truly was before.
    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    As for 'blue eyes for blood elves' being the end of the High Elf request, it isn't. The high elf request died the moment they added Blood Elves to the Horde. And it was buried on the two occasions Ion was asked about it, the first of those occasions being over two years ago mind. Just as the April Forbes' interview with Hazzikostas, the one where he defended the faction wall, shows that you REALLY should pay attention to whatever the developers are telling you (as I recall you disagreed with that article almost immediately and tried to discount it), so perhaps you should listen to what they are saying regarding a High Elf allied race. That is, it's not happening.
    Actually, I said Ion chose his words very carefully that if they wanted to implement faction-grouping, his talks of it not being a mercernary system would still be correct. That's what I said for the article.

    Also, I do listen: "It's always possible in the future, but no plans in the near term for High Elves as an Allied Race" - Ion Hazzikostas, also "It's possible, it's always possible. Don't give up hope! Just be respectful about it" - Alex Afrasiabi (you keep referring to him as Holinka. SWOLEinka is the Class Design dude, he was part of the deep dive panel this year).
    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    Blue eyes for Blood Elves is just that, blue eyes for Blood Elves. A simple and small customization option for Blood Elves that many Blood Elves would like and one that is entirely consistent with the lore. If the pro High Elf side has invested that eye colour with so much importance, that they see it psychologically as the lynchpin of their request, then more fool them. At the end of the day, it's just an eye colour.
    Actually, from what you should be able to see, many do not consider it the "lynchpin of their request" as many continue to say that they will keep asking for High Elves despite whenever/if Blood Elves get Blue Eyes as a customization.

    It's almost as if it's about more than an eye color, and hopefully once people continue to ask about Alliance High Elves post blue eye customization then Blizzard finally sees that as well. Only time will tell.
    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    Dwarves and Trolls, the core races, are pretty generic everydwarves or everytrolls. Nothing about them really differentiates them from MOST other Dwarves or MOST other Trolls beyond their allegiance to the Alliance and Horde respectively beyond tattoos or moderate skin tone differences, which as you've pointed out are being added to the base model.
    This is where your bias continues to show, as you very aptly below try to explain why High Elf skins on a Void Elf wouldn't be enough for a person to say "yay I finally can play a High Elf on the Alliance!"

    Btw, a generic jungle troll finally getting customization to become a desert troll destroys your argument here. A desert and jungle are completely different environments and the societies they develop will be different too.

    Let's also not forget that Blood Trolls are apparently coming as well, who are batshit insane cultists as per your words I think. Yeah that'll totally jive with the whole 'relaxed vibes' that Darkspear voice-lines/greetings/etc give. Blood Trolls were also directly against the Horde so even that customization doubles down on how different it is from your explanations.

    Again, for most people - it will be enough. Though I really wonder how sappy it'll look when you try to go individuals that refer to their characters as "X troll type" and say 'nuh uh you're still a jungle troll!!" Most people will probably respond to you and others that say that as most RPers do -> /ignore. Might even report people if they do it enough times for harassment. You know it's gonna happen with some, as there's already asshats across the forums being uppity over the added people of color customization coming to Humans for instance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    Where your argument falls apart is the unique circumstances of certain Allied races. What you suggest could not allow people to play as Dragonmaw Orcs within the Mag'har, because the Mag'har Orc very specifically comes from an alternate timeline and could not have been one of the Orcs at the Battle of Grim Batol. A Dark Iron Dwarf cannot pretend to be a Wildhammer, both because of their substantially different lore backgrounds but also because the Dark Irons seemingly have minor yet notable physiological differences with other Dwarves, the touch of fire about them.
    Dragonmaw are most likely coming to regular Orcs customization. Again, the customization options are not getting any new lore updates to explain being added. They are simply happening because of player request. It seems you have not seen my recent post after this one you're replying to where they just explained that there will be no quests or anything to 'unlock the new looks' and that it will just be available to everyone upon release (even existing characters).

    So you're most likely going to have Dragonmaw with the racials of a corrupted Green Orc, just like Wildhammer w/racials of Bronzebeards, and Desert Trolls w/racials of Jungle Trolls (aka Darkspear).

    The lore background doesn't matter here. A Blood Troll's lore origins are incredibly different from a Darkspears, yet that doesn't matter. Because this is purely a gameplay addition despite the lore.

    They also said they are not doing customization for Allied Races at this time, though that they can bring the expanded tech (like separate eye color from face) to them as well.

    And did I not tell you, that people were going to ask for expanded customization on their Allied Races? See, it is very likely that once original race customization finishes, they will expand customization later on for Allied Races. And since we see from the examples they've shown that they're not sticking to the original color palettes (pale Undead -> now getting Dark/Murky/Mucky options, blue trolls -> now getting Tan/Dark/Black options) this means the goal of these new customization updates is purely to increase aesthetic diversity.

    Comfortably, I can deduce that for Allied Races - when it's their turn, will also get the same treatment. You should hope that they decide to keep AR within a specific aesthetic, but like I already said - judging by desert trolls and blood trolls who have completely different environments at aesthetics to jungle trolls -> Blizzard doesn't seem to care. As the goal is purely, increase the aesthetic diversity for any given race.
    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    A Void Elf with a High Elf aesthetic is still a Void Elf. A new skin tone will not allow you to escape the origin of that race. It will not allow you to pretend your character has not made a pact with the Void. Every time your character speaks, emotes, jokes or flirts and you hear that reverb in their voice that signifies their connection to something otherwordly, the illusion will break. Every time you wear your Void Elf heritage armor, the illusion will break. Every time entropic embrace procs, the illusion will break. You cannot pretend to be a High Elf on a Void Elf because of how highly specific the origins Void Elves are and those origins are highly specific as part of the process of differentiating them from their parent to begin with.

    A Dwarf player who customises themselves as a Wildhammer will have no bother living out that fantasy. A Void Elf player who attempts to pretend to be a High Elf is going to be kidding themselves as the very game conspires to prove them wrong.
    Everything you say in the first paragraph can be applied to Wildhammers coming under Bronzebeards, and Desert/Blood Trolls coming under Darkspear. Even a developer mentioned, "if you simply don't want to be just a Darkspear or Zandalari you now have that choice" so it is with developer blessings that yes people can live out the fantasy they want regardless of the race origin.

    You're putting a really big emphasis on things that most people don't care. My proof: just look at how excited people are to play the aforementioned Wildhammers, Dark Trolls, Desert Trolls, Blood Trolls and oh yeah quite possibly Dark Skin Blood Elves who will just poof into existence as well.
    Last edited by Pennem; 2019-11-05 at 02:16 PM.

  7. #13347
    Quote Originally Posted by Pennem View Post
    It would make them High Elves on the Alliance the same way that Wildhammer fans are cheering to be able to finally get to play a Wildhammer Dwarf even though it's going to have the racials/voice jokes/etc of a Bronzebeard (aka mountain dwarf).

    Wildhammer Dwarves are Dwarves that specifically spend all their time above ground, having racials like "Stoneform" and "Might of the Mountain" make no sense, but guess what? Majority of people don't care because they get to have the aesthetic fantasy (Wildhammer Dwarf Shaman on the Alliance) which is much bigger to most everyone.
    They wouldn't be High Elves then. They'd still have void-related racials.

    I want High Elves as its own race, so it could get a nice blue heritage armor set, High Elf racials and a unicorn mount.

  8. #13348
    don't we have enough whites in the game. we need more diversity...we can't get more Brown races but we can get 500,000 different white ones. -_-
    Last edited by Preston Garvey; 2019-11-05 at 04:57 PM.

  9. #13349
    Are we all ready for Blood Elves to get blue eyes? ^_^

  10. #13350
    Herald of the Titans Graden's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Serenity River View Post
    Are we all ready for Blood Elves to get blue eyes? ^_^
    Well they said allied races won't get any new customization and that Blood Elves will get more than forty new options so....yeah, more than likely imo.

  11. #13351
    Quote Originally Posted by Graden View Post
    Well they said allied races won't get any new customization and that Blood Elves will get more than forty new options so....yeah, more than likely imo.
    Agreed, it's going to be exciting.

  12. #13352
    Quote Originally Posted by Maxilian View Post
    Well.. i would not compare Void Elves corruption with the Blood elf "corruption", as one is trully a corruption while the other is just not that big of a deal (nor have any negative for the BE).

    Note: Have in mind that the Orcs was, indeed, corruption, as the consumed it, pushing the demon blood into everyone
    Not really, the Frostwolves didn't drink Mannoroth's blood, but the fel magic being used around them turned them green anyway.
    It's the same with the High elves vs Blood elves.

  13. #13353
    Quote Originally Posted by Graden View Post
    Well they said allied races won't get any new customization and that Blood Elves will get more than forty new options so....yeah, more than likely imo.
    Actually they did say that allied races were.

  14. #13354
    Quote Originally Posted by delus View Post
    Actually they did say that allied races were.
    They've given conflicting answers, more say no allied race updates than yes.

    Regardless, it's going to be blood elves that finally get those precious blue eyes and tattoos.

  15. #13355
    Herald of the Titans Graden's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by delus View Post
    Actually they did say that allied races were.
    Really? I'd swear I saw somewhere that they won't but my bad if they said otherwise.

  16. #13356
    The Lightbringer Pennem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Preston Garvey View Post
    don't we have enough whites in the game. we need more diversity...we can't get more Brown races but we can get 500,000 different white ones. -_-
    Have you seen the new customization updates coming? They're adding Brown/Dark skins for all the ones they've shown so far and have apparently said Dark skins will come to Blood Elves too!

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Serenity River View Post
    Agreed, it's going to be exciting.
    I'll play a Blue Eyed Blood Elf Paladin finally. Then continue asking for Alliance High Elves

  17. #13357
    Quote Originally Posted by Graden View Post
    Really? I'd swear I saw somewhere that they won't but my bad if they said otherwise.

    So, with new character customization, we are focusing mainly in the original races, not allied races. we are able to apply new customizations to them, like separate the eyes from the rest of the models, with the help of the Technical team, so you have more options to choose from. We are not touching Allied Races at this time, we are focusing on the main races. There are no plans to expanding custom DK customization at this point.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by KyleEverett View Post
    They've given conflicting answers, more say no allied race updates than yes.

    Regardless, it's going to be blood elves that finally get those precious blue eyes and tattoos.
    Chances are equally high there will be felblood and wretched skins.

  18. #13358
    Even if they have no intention of making high elves playable they'd be silly to give blue eyes to blood elves. I doubt there's many blood elf fans that care to get the eye color of what is now their enemy back, and it would piss off a lot of alliance players for no good reason. It would also be confusing in-game to not have any visual difference between blood elves and all the alliance high elves around, however small it may be.

  19. #13359
    Quote Originally Posted by Uthan View Post
    Even if they have no intention of making high elves playable they'd be silly to give blue eyes to blood elves. I doubt there's many blood elf fans that care to get the eye color of what is now their enemy back, and it would piss off a lot of alliance players for no good reason. It would also be confusing in-game to not have any visual difference between blood elves and all the alliance high elves around, however small it may be.
    It'll be confusing why there's playable Farraki and Dark Trolls too but that's not stopping Blizzard.

  20. #13360
    Quote Originally Posted by Uthan View Post
    Even if they have no intention of making high elves playable they'd be silly to give blue eyes to blood elves. I doubt there's many blood elf fans that care to get the eye color of what is now their enemy back, and it would piss off a lot of alliance players for no good reason. It would also be confusing in-game to not have any visual difference between blood elves and all the alliance high elves around, however small it may be.
    This is false, the sunwell gives off Holy and Arcane to sustain the blood elves so it's their right to get blue eyes back.

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