1. #13941
    Brewmaster elbleuet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post

    More to the point, if Dalaran was an Alliance nation they'd have fought on the side of the Alliance during the war.
    No since Dalaran is an Alliance nation neutral to the Horde.

    You can be neutral AND Alliance the same way you can be neutral AND Horde. You do not have to fought on the side of the Alliance to be recognized as being part of it. That's your own definition of what's being Alliance.

    Khadgar did not fight the Horde a single time since WoW yet he's described as an Alliance character by Blizzard, so you're pretty wrong on that matter.
    Last edited by elbleuet; 2019-12-12 at 02:08 AM.
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    I am Murloc! FlubberPuddy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    Actually I've never encountered an RP'er in game at all. I don't play on an RP server.
    Yeah that was pretty obvious once you started trying to imply there's only a certain way to RP. When RP in itself is very open to interpretation. I don't play on an RP server either, just meant I take a gander on em now and then because I never play on em.

    That's why I've been using the examples I have. Because there are players that are actually doing those things and have been for a long while. I am speaking from what I've seen.
    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    But this other approach, where a high elf can be a void elf, a green orc can be a mag'har and a human could be a really tall gnome, that's just nonsensical. If people want to do that, that's fine, but what they can't expect is other people to play along or indulge them.
    Exactly (the bold). Likewise, no one is required or beholden to your standards nor requires your approval for how they want to RP. Exactly as I've been saying all along. The people who do wanna RP with them, will. The ones who don't, won't. Everyone wins.

    - - - Updated - - -

    During the chaos, Grand Magister Rommath noted that, "It unsettles me to have to fight directly with the high elves of the Silver Covenant...but I never tire of slaying Alliance."

    BOOM, it was there all along. Now the people who say Silver Covenant are neutral can hopefully stfu about it. Straight from the Blood Elven Magister himself.

    https://wow.gamepedia.com/High_elf

    Silver Covenant are de-facto Alliance.
    Last edited by FlubberPuddy; 2019-12-11 at 11:45 PM.

  3. #13943
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pennem View Post
    During the chaos, Grand Magister Rommath noted that, "It unsettles me to have to fight directly with the high elves of the Silver Covenant...but I never tire of slaying Alliance."

    BOOM, it was there all along. Now the people who say Silver Covenant are neutral can hopefully stfu about it. Straight from the Blood Elven Magister himself.

    https://wow.gamepedia.com/High_elf

    Silver Covenant are de-facto Alliance.
    Sad thing that we have to get all pedantic about this, but yeah, thanks for providing the quote. I did the purge of Dalaran questline some time ago and forgot about these lines, but yeah. Tell me about those who call us 'flat earthers of wow' while ignoring plain common knowledge...

    I'm gonna take advantage of this post to also point out again that it's kinda silly to see people getting defensive with possible High elf customization options DEMANDING those for Blood elves while at the same time not demanding for what Void elves have. And it's even sillier when these same people don't stop repeating that Void elves are the High elves of the Alliance or a variation of High elf, obviously by surpassing logical barriers as Void elves coming from Blood elves, not High elves, and twisting it into saying that because Blood elves are High elves then Void elves are High elves, when that is a missrepresentation of the point. Let's talk about demagogy, hah.

    Because, obviously, a High elf would never mind to be mistaken for a Blood elf and viceversa, isn't it?

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    I am Murloc! FlubberPuddy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aldo Hawk View Post
    Because, obviously, a High elf would never mind to be mistaken for a Blood elf and viceversa, isn't it?
    I think it is quite silly when anyone who says Void Elves are the Alliance’s version of high elves while Blood Elves are the Horde’s version then gets defensive about those who ask for high elf customization on Void Elves.

    It becomes pretty apparent there is no compromise wanting to be reached (not that there ever was with those kind of people) and they’re most likely just hoping the high elves of the Alliance never become a playable aesthetic in any form.

    As for the last portion here, it is very established that there’s a lot of animosity between High Elves and Blood Elves and Rommath’s quote from the purge continues to reinforce it (as well as Vereesa’s delight in cracking down then too).

    But Blizzard has also been in the habit of retconning whatever they want and I believe it was former Blizzard employees themselves that said something like there’s only 2 people from the original Blizzard that continue to be there and it’s an entirely different entity now that it has grown.

    I kind of see Shadowlands and beyond of the WoW team’s way to take a break from Azerothian lore for a bit, have us basically adventure in lands that are not beholden to any existing rules/lore of Azeroth so that they can do a sort of “fresh start” going forward.

    Probably why all the new customizations and the amount of them are coming in too, and why the leveling is getting revamped, etc. it’s all an attempt to sort of make a clean slate.

  5. #13945
    Bloodsail Admiral Aldo Hawk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pennem View Post
    It becomes pretty apparent there is no compromise wanting to be reached (not that there ever was with those kind of people) and they’re most likely just hoping the high elves of the Alliance never become a playable aesthetic in any form.
    It gets better when the phrases: 'I care about the lore' or 'I disagree because I respect the lore' are spouted alongside that stance.

    The problem here is that asking for playable High elves is undoubtedly something that goes alongside what the lore is, since High elves are part of the Alliance, but for some reason the existence of Blood elves create some sort of cognitive dissonance on all of this.

    High elves are not Blood elves, nor are Void elves, nor are Horde nor Void infused people. They have been seen alongside the Alliance since world of warcraft started, Warcraft III or any previous iteration are not even needed to point out the fact. Asking for High elves to be playable is lore friendly, asking for them to not be playable because Blood elves are Horde is not only lore unfriendly, but pretty unrelated. Ion Hazzikostas is a human being, not a god with omniscience and the capability of transforming words into truth.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aldo Hawk View Post
    but for some reason the existence of Blood elves create some sort of cognitive dissonance on all of this.
    Especially funny when more often than not the spotlight on Blood Elves is usually when they're talking about the differences/animosity between them and the High Elves.

    We haven't had a whole lot of Blood Elf lore that focuses strictly on them and not other Thalassians. This is very different from how for instance we've had multitudes of exploration into Troll culture with each of the different tribes that isn't tied to revolving around another Troll tribe.

    The Blood Elf and High Elf groups racial infighting is as intertwined as Alliance v Horde at this point. Recent example: Sunreavers in the War Campaign referencing the Purge of Dalaran which heavily featured High Elf v Blood Elf animosity/hatred and where their faction allegiances lie.

  7. #13947
    The Unstoppable Force Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    You mean the ones I've listed repeatedly to demonstrate the contribution from the high elves was pitiful? Hard to argue they are an important part of the Alliance when only one did any real fighting.
    So you're going with the erroneous "in-game population = lore population" argument? "There is only one single high elf fighting for the Alliance." I expected more of you.
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  8. #13948
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    So you're going with the erroneous "in-game population = lore population" argument? "There is only one single high elf fighting for the Alliance." I expected more of you.
    I would not entertain such arguments, since the principal focus is High elves being part of the Alliance, and therefore people asking to have them playable on their respective faction.

    This is NOT a competition about who did more, which totally misses the point and it's nothing more than mere filler. That dude doesn't like playable High elves, and that doesn't mean everything he spouts has to be taken into consideration. As for example, this useless point.

    The matter is about wether or not High elves are Alliance, which they are. Not how much they have done in comparison to playable races.

  9. #13949
    Legendary! Obelisk Kai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    No since Dalaran is an Alliance nation neutral to the Horde.

    You can be neutral AND Alliance the same way you can be neutral AND Horde. You do not have to fought on the side of the Alliance to be recognized as being part of it. That's your own definition of what's being Alliance.

    Khadgar did not fight the Horde a single time since WoW yet he's described as an Alliance character by Blizzard, so you're pretty wrong on that matter.
    Individuals can be aligned to either faction, but when they live in Dalaran they are neutral. Hence the Sunreavers 'owed fealty' to the Horde, yet when Thalen Songweaver was allowed to assist the defence of Dalaran it was because he was doing so as part of a neutral delegation of Dalaran mages. Loyalty to Dalaran and the Kirin Tor and it's stance of neutrality supersedes loyalty to the Alliance and Horde. Dalaran itself is not a person, it is a political state and it is neutral, neither Alliance or Horde.

    In order for those 7th Legion Shield Mages to even act on behalf of the Alliance during the Fourth War, they had to do so as part of the 7th Legion and not as a part of the Silver Covenant. If you are a member of the Silver Covenant, you clearly have to put Dalaran first even if everyone knows of the pronounced Alliance lean of that organisation.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Pennem View Post

    During the chaos, Grand Magister Rommath noted that, "It unsettles me to have to fight directly with the high elves of the Silver Covenant...but I never tire of slaying Alliance."

    BOOM, it was there all along. Now the people who say Silver Covenant are neutral can hopefully stfu about it. Straight from the Blood Elven Magister himself.

    https://wow.gamepedia.com/High_elf

    Silver Covenant are de-facto Alliance.
    During the chaos is the operative phrase here.

    Everyone knew that the Silver Covenant had a pronounced Alliance lean just as everyone knew the Sunreavers had a pronounced Horde lean. They were not neutral because they wanted to be, but because the politics of their city home demanded that they should be neutral.

    So when he arrives, he basically finds his suspicions confirmed. The Silver Covenant has been let loose and Jaina is conducting a purge of the Horde population of the city. At this point, Dalaran has clearly abandoned neutrality and declared for the Alliance. This means the Silver Covenant are also no longer technically neutral, but are an active Alliance fighting force.

    His line therefore should be read as resigned, grim determination to deal with those who have shown their true colours, the true colours he has known were always there.

    Yet this political situation has passed. To fight the Burning Legion, Dalaran again had to let the Horde in. By letting the Horde in, they had to re-establish neutrality. By re-establishing neutrality, they left the Alliance again. This has been reinforced by Khadgar saying he would not play a role in the upcoming war as he had fought beside both Alliance and Horde. No Kirin Tor forces fought beside the Alliance. And no Silver Covenant forces have been seen, beyond TWO seventh legion shield mages whose association with the the Silver Covenant was only divined from datamining.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    So you're going with the erroneous "in-game population = lore population" argument? "There is only one single high elf fighting for the Alliance." I expected more of you.
    As I said, this is an example of hypocrisy. You discount the idea that High Elves are mistrusted because in personal experience in-game you've not encountered any.

    Yet when the in-game representation of high elven exile numbers fighting for the Alliance is less than you can count on the fingers of one hand, you resort to the in-game representation not matching the lore population.

    The thing is, I am not relying on the in game representation alone. I am relying on the numerous occasions the high elf exile population has been cited as vanishingly low. The tiny coterie represented in game actually tallies with the lore population out of game.

  10. #13950
    Quote Originally Posted by Pennem View Post
    Ah my mistake, I assume people wouldn't just randomly share fan-edits as if they're upcoming features datamined because that'd be a pretty useless thing to do.
    It's indeed a fan made, wish it was datamined

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    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    Snip
    So what you're saying is Silver Covenant were Alliance then, and Silver Covenant are Alliance now as its members are participating and supporting the Alliance during a Warfront.

    Awesome

  12. #13952
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pennem View Post
    So what you're saying is Silver Covenant were Alliance then, and Silver Covenant are Alliance now as its members are participating and supporting the Alliance during a Warfront.

    Awesome
    No I am saying the individual members are Alliance aligned but the Silver Covenant as an organisation is neutral. The Silver Covenant could only participate directly in the war against the Horde during Pandaria because Dalaran declared for the Alliance during the purge.

    In the Fourth War, Dalaran remained neutral and the Silver Covenant did not participate. Some members of the Silver Covenant, in fact we can confirm only two, joined the 7th Legion in order to fight in the war.

    But so long as they are an active member of the Silver Covenant, they are neutral. When they take off that uniform they can declare themselves as Alliance.

    A real world example is the United Nations. When my father served in the UN peacekeeping forces in Cyprus he did not go as a member of the Irish Defense Forces. He went as a UN Peacekeeper. Ireland's attitudes towards the Cyprus conflict were irrelevant to his status as he was operating under the UN.

    The Sunreavers, the parallel organisation for the Horde, had to be 'added' to the Blood Elf military following their expulsion. They still haven't gone back and are actively fighting as a part of the Horde. The Silver Covenant remained and as soon as Dalaran left the Alliance at the start of Legion, so did their organisation.

  13. #13953
    The Unstoppable Force Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    As I said, this is an example of hypocrisy. You discount the idea that High Elves are mistrusted because in personal experience in-game you've not encountered any.

    Yet when the in-game representation of high elven exile numbers fighting for the Alliance is less than you can count on the fingers of one hand, you resort to the in-game representation not matching the lore population.
    There is absolutely zero hypocrisy in what I'm writing, despite your attempts at frame my words as such.

    I "discount" the idea of high elves being mistrusted because that's what the game has been showing us since TBC: more and more high elves in the Alliance, even in the military.

    By the way: you can also count the "in-game representation" of the dark iron dwarves in WoW, prior to BfA (when they were announced as a future Allied Race) in one hand, from Cataclysm to Legion.

    The thing is, I am not relying on the in game representation alone. I am relying on the numerous occasions the high elf exile population has been cited as vanishingly low. The tiny coterie represented in game actually tallies with the lore population out of game.
    "Vanishingly low". Look at you, making hyperbole and trying to pass it as fact.

    The high elf population may be low now, and yet void elves, who are even fewer in numbers, are playable. And before you say "but they can make more void elves", two things: first, we have not yet been shown that to be true. In Telogrus' Rift, we don't see a single elf being converted into a void elf.

    And on top of that, there are many, many ways of boosting the high elf population. From undiscovered lands to even different dimensions.
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  14. #13954
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    No I am saying the individual members are Alliance aligned but the Silver Covenant as an organisation is neutral. The Silver Covenant could only participate directly in the war against the Horde during Pandaria because Dalaran declared for the Alliance during the purge.
    I don't think this is the case from either a lore or gameplay standpoint, myself. The Silver Covenant was created in response to the creation of the Sunreaver faction by Aethas, itself explicitly designed to give the Horde access to Dalaran and a presence there. It literally has its origins as a partisan organization designed to counter the presence of the other faction. Silver Covenant NPC's are tagged as Alliance, just as the Sunreavers are Horde, and the Silver Covenant location of WotLK-era Dalaran is flagged Alliance-only with Horde members ported out. While the NPC's may not be openly hostile and attack on sight this is pretty far from neutral, and Horde members are very obviously unwelcome and denied access to Silver Covenant territory (the same being true of the Sunreavers for Alliance members).

    With Silver Covenant NPC's quite literally Alliance flagged, I would say they're not neutral at all. Nor are the Sunreavers, for that matter.
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  15. #13955
    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    No I am saying the individual members are Alliance aligned but the Silver Covenant as an organisation is neutral. The Silver Covenant could only participate directly in the war against the Horde during Pandaria because Dalaran declared for the Alliance during the purge.

    In the Fourth War, Dalaran remained neutral and the Silver Covenant did not participate. Some members of the Silver Covenant, in fact we can confirm only two, joined the 7th Legion in order to fight in the war.

    But so long as they are an active member of the Silver Covenant, they are neutral. When they take off that uniform they can declare themselves as Alliance.

    A real world example is the United Nations. When my father served in the UN peacekeeping forces in Cyprus he did not go as a member of the Irish Defense Forces. He went as a UN Peacekeeper. Ireland's attitudes towards the Cyprus conflict were irrelevant to his status as he was operating under the UN.

    The Sunreavers, the parallel organisation for the Horde, had to be 'added' to the Blood Elf military following their expulsion. They still haven't gone back and are actively fighting as a part of the Horde. The Silver Covenant remained and as soon as Dalaran left the Alliance at the start of Legion, so did their organisation.
    As much as the respect I have for your father for his work in the UN, it's not a relevant comparison. It is relevant if Cyprus and Ireland were enemies at that time, were they? Even then I would be careful with those comparisons, the world of Azeroth is not similar to the real world.

    The Silver Covenant sides with the Alliance, no matter how relevant they are now. They are not neutral. They don't do anything but to kill Horde if they get the chance. They are siding with Alliance even in peace times. That you say that the Sunreavers are always horde but the Covenant is not always Alliance doesn't bode well with me.

  16. #13956
    I am Murloc! FlubberPuddy's Avatar
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    I think Aucald's and Doffen's responses explain it well enough, but beyond that
    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    The Silver Covenant remained and as soon as Dalaran left the Alliance at the start of Legion, so did their organisation.
    There's no proof of this if you are saying the Silver Covenant left the Alliance at the start of Legion. Considering that in BfA we also have their faction as opening portals to old Dalaran in the new "as of BFA" summoning rooms.

    I think continuing to latch onto the idea that "the Silver Covenant are a neutral faction" just shows the lengths of ignorance one is willing to go to reduce the presence of High Elves on the Alliance.

    The Silver Covenant is

    1) Only friendly to the Alliance
    2) Reputation that can only be earned by Alliance members
    3) Kicks out Horde players from their section of Dalaran for not being an Alliance member
    4) Has its members providing aid to the Alliance throughout numerous occasions and has shown delight in killing Horde members

    I'm not sure how one can continue to say they are neutral besides not wanting to admit that they're wrong. It's such an obvious thing and I don't take you for missing the obvious. But you have shown yourself to resist admitting when you're wrong.

    It would be like someone trying to say Hozen and Jinyu are neutral factions to Alliance and Horde.
    Last edited by FlubberPuddy; 2019-12-12 at 03:29 PM.

  17. #13957
    Brewmaster elbleuet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    Individuals can be aligned to either faction, but when they live in Dalaran they are neutral. Hence the Sunreavers 'owed fealty' to the Horde, yet when Thalen Songweaver was allowed to assist the defence of Dalaran it was because he was doing so as part of a neutral delegation of Dalaran mages. Loyalty to Dalaran and the Kirin Tor and it's stance of neutrality supersedes loyalty to the Alliance and Horde. Dalaran itself is not a person, it is a political state and it is neutral, neither Alliance or Horde.

    In order for those 7th Legion Shield Mages to even act on behalf of the Alliance during the Fourth War, they had to do so as part of the 7th Legion and not as a part of the Silver Covenant. If you are a member of the Silver Covenant, you clearly have to put Dalaran first even if everyone knows of the pronounced Alliance lean of that organisation.
    You still don't get it.

    Dalaran will always favor the Alliance, and will never fight for the Horde.

    The Horde is only invited, to fight for the greater good. The Alliance isn't invited in Dalaran. Because the Alliance & Dalaran are part of the same side.
    "If you want to play alongside High and Void elves, the Alliance is waiting for you"

  18. #13958
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    There is absolutely zero hypocrisy in what I'm writing, despite your attempts at frame my words as such.

    I "discount" the idea of high elves being mistrusted because that's what the game has been showing us since TBC: more and more high elves in the Alliance, even in the military.

    By the way: you can also count the "in-game representation" of the dark iron dwarves in WoW, prior to BfA (when they were announced as a future Allied Race) in one hand, from Cataclysm to Legion.

    There is plentiful hypocrisy. You discount a canon statement by stating you have personally seen no evidence for it in game, yet then say in game evidence of the pitiful contribution the high elven exiles made to the Alliance during the war should be discounted as an in game representation cannot be fully trusted.

    The game has not been showing you more and more high elves within the Alliance. It has been showing the same small group at different points in time and in different areas. As the population of this group has been affirmed again and again and again and again as being very low, attempting to pretend there are more of them than there actually are is wish fulfilment.

    Dark Iron Dwarves had a strong presence in three outdoor zones and a role in a major dungeon. Their presence was substantial from day one. And they are a distinct variant of Dwarf, not identical to Bronzebeard Dwarves with only an ideological bone to pick.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    "Vanishingly low". Look at you, making hyperbole and trying to pass it as fact.
    Caydiem in 2005 said the High Elf population was way below that of Gnomes, who had recently suffered an extinction level event depleting their population by approximately 80%.

    The Warcraft Encyclopedia, confirmed canon by Sean Copeland, stated that there were too few High Elves for them to count as a distinct race.

    On both occasions Ion Hazzikostas rejected playable High Elves for the Alliance, he cited their population levels as the lore based rationale for their rejection (the gameplay rationale being them being identical to an already existing, playable race).

    You want to imagine the High Elf exiles as a strong, important component of the Alliance. Nothing supports that assertion. On the issue of population, every statement and source emphasises how small they are.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    The high elf population may be low now, and yet void elves, who are even fewer in numbers, are playable. And before you say "but they can make more void elves", two things: first, we have not yet been shown that to be true. In Telogrus' Rift, we don't see a single elf being converted into a void elf.
    Yes, that is the normal response. But let's try something different. It doesn't matter. The population issue is the lore based rationale for why they aren't playable. The real reason is that they are already playable as the Blood Elves of the Horde and they don't want to water down the factions by giving you a duplicate of a core Horde race.

    Frankly there could be ten times as many high elves and they still wouldn't give them to the Alliance because of the existence of Blood Elves. But then you'd argue against the gameplay reason by citing how big and important hey are in lore, and you'd have actual evidence to that effect, hence why they are actually written as impoverished and puny.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    And on top of that, there are many, many ways of boosting the high elf population. From undiscovered lands to even different dimensions.
    When they do that you may have an argument. But I don't think they do that because a.) such answers would be blatantly ridiculous and b.) if they'd wanted to do that, they wouldn't have invented Void Elves.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    You still don't get it.

    Dalaran will always favor the Alliance, and will never fight for the Horde.

    The Horde is only invited, to fight for the greater good. The Alliance isn't invited in Dalaran. Because the Alliance & Dalaran are part of the same side.
    The fact Dalaran didn't participate in the recent war is proof that you are incorrect on this point.

    Were Dalaran a member of the Alliance, it would have fought for the Alliance. It did not.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    I don't think this is the case from either a lore or gameplay standpoint, myself. The Silver Covenant was created in response to the creation of the Sunreaver faction by Aethas, itself explicitly designed to give the Horde access to Dalaran and a presence there. It literally has its origins as a partisan organization designed to counter the presence of the other faction. Silver Covenant NPC's are tagged as Alliance, just as the Sunreavers are Horde, and the Silver Covenant location of WotLK-era Dalaran is flagged Alliance-only with Horde members ported out. While the NPC's may not be openly hostile and attack on sight this is pretty far from neutral, and Horde members are very obviously unwelcome and denied access to Silver Covenant territory (the same being true of the Sunreavers for Alliance members).

    With Silver Covenant NPC's quite literally Alliance flagged, I would say they're not neutral at all. Nor are the Sunreavers, for that matter.
    Nor did I say individuals are neutral. They are clearly Alliance and Horde aligned. But living in neutral Dalaran as they do, they must are bound by the neutrality of the Kirin Tor.

    This is why Thalen Songweaver was allowed into the city of Theramore as part of the Dalaran delegation, because his membership of the Kirin Tor was supposed to outweigh his partisan alignment to the Horde. This of course proved to a be a mistake, but this was the rationale behind why he was admitted.
    This is also why the Sunreavers did not participate openly against the Alliance, nor the Silver Covenant against the Horde, during the Pandaria Horde-Alliance war. They were bound by the neutrality of Dalaran.
    The Sunreavers only became a part of the Blood Elf, and thus the Horde military, following their purging and their integration into the forces of the Blood Elves was specifically requests by Lor'themar in the quest text immediately following the return of the Horde player to Silvermoon foolowing the purge.

    The Silver Covenant is hostile to the Horde, but they are bound by Dalaran neutrality. The Sunreavers were kicked out and still have not returned to Dalaran, they are no longer bound by Dalaran neutrality.

    Were this not the case, please explain why

    1.) The Silver Covenant has almost always only been present during story periods when Dalaran played a major role in the narrative and is otherwise absent. The one exception to this, their presence outside Zul'Aman, seemingly counted for very little given Chronicles canonically confirmed the Horde dealt with the Amani threat in cataclysm. (The presence of the SC seems to have been solely to facilitate Alliance adventurers going to ZA. As the Alliance did not clear Zul'Aman, I would doubt the canonicity of their presence, in the same way the Shrine of the Storms was not cleared by a group of Horde adventurers and Rexxar).
    2.) The Silver Covenant did not assist the Alliance during the opening stages of the Pandaria war and only actively assisted the Alliance after Dalaran joined the Alliance.
    3.) The Silver Covenant did not participate in the Fourth War, neither in game or in any of the missions represented by the mission table which detailed the wider conflict.
    4.) That the only npcs we think were associated with the Silver Covenant were two shield mages who didn't get off the airship to fight, whom we only know were silver covenant because of datamining, and if we assume that was not a mistake (which is possible) have had to fight the war as 7th Legion, not Silver Covenant.

    None of these scenarios fit with a part of the Alliance.

    They do however fit with a partisan organisation based in and living in Dalaran, constrained by the official policy of neutrality of that city.
    Last edited by Obelisk Kai; 2019-12-12 at 04:41 PM.

  19. #13959
    Three Pandarens ingame made a playable race. Six, if we count the fact that the two factions got them. There is no need for additional high Elves, when the whole population of just Quel'danil is at least thrice the size of those, ingame.

  20. #13960
    Brewmaster elbleuet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post


    The fact Dalaran didn't participate in the recent war is proof that you are incorrect on this point.

    Were Dalaran a member of the Alliance, it would have fought for the Alliance. It did not.
    That's just what I said. Dalaran is an Alliance nation, but neutral to the Horde, and led by an Alliance character.
    "If you want to play alongside High and Void elves, the Alliance is waiting for you"

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