Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[lettersandpunctuation]

note how all of then are in the same faction, not in the opposite

Oh, if thats the problem then there shouldn't be any issue going with

2). Nature/Druidic/Hunter society- Infringes on Night Elves

, which luckily seems to be one of the more popular ideas promoted in this thread!

[Sundreamer]

i am going to propose a scenario for you high elf demanders.

Say i am right and this happens.

High elves are added has a playable allied race for the alliance.
Horde overall population drastically drops to life support numbers.

what does blizzard do?
do they remove the high elves they just added and offer free race changes?

you mean like alliance numbers in pvp is dramatically low and they can't for the life of them find a way for more alliance people to sign up for pvp, even with a +50% honor buff?

the only people really leaving the horde for high elves would be people that have blood elf ALTS on the horde side cause they're maining alliance in the first place or people with no friends and no guild on the horde side.

if void elves didn't make people leave the horde, high elves won't either

[Traycor]

my current suggestion for High Elf classes is:

- Warrior
- Hunter
- Rogue
- Mage
- Shaman
- Monk

I love the idea of different groups of High Elves contributing different classes to the cause.

Highvale Elves:
Hunter
Rogue
Shaman

Silver Covenant:
Mage
Warrior

Stormwind High Elves:
Monk
Paladin
Priest

[Syegfryed]

I don't see how that is binding at all, though.

of course you don't

Oh, if thats the problem then there shouldn't be any issue going with

, which luckily seems to be one of the more popular ideas promoted in this thread!

the others races are identical to the others, orcs are orcs, tauren are tauren, they would not steal their fantasy, just upgrade

High elves "druids" pulled from their asses will diminish the night elf lore, cause they are the elves druids

rly baffle me how you guys like to bend and distort the lore just to attend your will, cause it can't get over a race not in your faction

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I love the idea of different groups of High Elves contributing different classes to the cause.

Highvale Elves:
Hunter
Rogue
Shaman

Silver Covenant:
Mage
Warrior

Stormwind High Elves:
Monk
Paladin
Priest

yeah just want everything don't you?

the "nature elves" but also have mages paladins and everything else with magic

even shamans you guys are shoving into the bag

[Utigarde]

I love the idea of different groups of High Elves contributing different classes to the cause.

Highvale Elves:
Hunter
Rogue
Shaman

Silver Covenant:
Mage
Warrior

Stormwind High Elves:
Monk
Paladin
Priest

I think Druid would probably also fit, because as of Chronicles/the hunter order hall, high elves had a big nature presence in Quel'thalas, with a bunch of people tending to their Mother tree, Thas'alah. Highvale elves that communed with the portal nearby would work great IMO.

[Magnagarde]

I love the idea of different groups of High Elves contributing different classes to the cause.

Highvale Elves:
Hunter
Rogue
Shaman

Silver Covenant:
Mage
Warrior

Stormwind High Elves:
Monk
Paladin
Priest

That's just too much to ask for and is too theme-shattering to begin with, isn't it? With all of what is mentioned here, they wouldn't even be high elves anymore, but just another group like void elves that steered away from who they were to embrace XYZ. The average high elf that makes sense class-wise would be a warrior, hunter, priest, mage and eventually paladin.

The only reason why I understand Alliance players who want high elves is because of the faction novelty they bring(the same way I want to play a two-headed ogre warlock or mage); if high elves can be shamans and druids, then that principle of faction theme and novelty is complete errased, at which point the addition stops making sense in its entirety.

Shaman, monk, warlock and druid shouldn't be on the list at all.

[Traycor]

yeah just wnt everythign don't you?

the "nature elves" but also have mages paladins and everything else with magic

even shamans you guy are shoving into the bag

We've been debating for several pages about what classes might be best to drop. There have been suggestions to drop Paladins and Priests but add Shamans (Wildhammer or Draenei trained). Others have suggested dropping Mages in exchange for Shamans.

As we've not settled on anything, I just listed all the classes. 7 is the most that I think any Allied Race has been allowed so far, and what I just listed has 8. At least one would need to be dropped, and possibly more. Monk seems like the most extraneous. Shaman is primarily in there to help make them different from Blood Elves.

Blood Elves can also be Warlocks, Death Knights, and Demon Hunters, so this class list is going to be very different no matter how it shakes out.

[Lumineus]

i am going to propose a scenario for you high elf demanders.

Say i am right and this happens.

High elves are added has a playable allied race for the alliance.
Horde overall population drastically drops to life support numbers.

what does blizzard do?
do they remove the high elves they just added and offer free race changes?

Well, I mean, let's examine this hypothetical. Most Blood Elf PCs are Paladins and Demon Hunters. Think they make up over half, along with another huge chunk of DKs pushing it well past 2/3. None of the other classes cared enough about Void Elves to switch en masse, despite them having key customization for Warlocks and Priests. The Demon Hunters and DKs aren't going anywhere, because High Elves won't have those.

So this doomsday scenario you pitched is really just "what if no one actually wants to play a Paladin on the Horde?" Well, what's this gigantic megathread demanding Troll Paladins, then?

[FlubberPuddy]

We've been debating for several pages about what classes might be best to drop. There have been suggestions to drop Paladins and Priests but add Shamans (Wildhammer or Draenei trained). Others have suggested dropping Mages in exchange for Shamans.

As we've not settled on anything, I just listed all the classes. 7 is the most that I think any Allied Race has been allowed so far, and what I just listed has 8. At least one would need to be dropped, and possibly more. Monk seems like the most extraneous. Shaman is primarily in there to help make them different from Blood Elves.

Blood Elves can also be Warlocks, Death Knights, and Demon Hunters, so this class list is going to be very different no matter how it shakes out.

Every Race gets Warrior and Hunter so those will always be a given

My vote goes for Mage, Priest, and Paladin to continue and finish the line of classic classes for High Elves

To me up in the air would be Rogue, Monk, Druid, Shaman. I think of those 4 I would honestly say Rogue has the most likely.

Then I think reallyyy up in the air would be the last 3 Monk, Druid, Shaman. If I could only pick 1 from here I would go with Druid honestly but that is my own personal bias likely with WildHammer friendship then Shaman would be the last one fitting.

So to me, the most likely class list would be:

Hunter
Mage
Paladin
Priest
Rogue
Shaman
Warrior



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Well, I mean, let's examine this hypothetical. Most Blood Elf PCs are Paladins and Demon Hunters. Think they make up over half, along with another huge chunk of DKs pushing it well past 2/3. None of the other classes cared enough about Void Elves to switch en masse, despite them having key customization for Warlocks and Priests. The Demon Hunters and DKs aren't going anywhere, because High Elves won't have those.

So this doomsday scenario you pitched is really just "what if no one actually wants to play a Paladin on the Horde?" Well, what's this gigantic megathread demanding Troll Paladins, then?

Good use of statistical data to prove your point. I agree with these findings. Most people playing Blood Elves are doing so because they already want to be on Horde AND look pretty. High Elves would only affect those you didn't want to be on Horde in the first place, but are just playing for the model love.

[Traycor]

finish the line of classic classes for High Elves.

There is a major appeal to having the classes for High Elves that players expect. Hunter and Rogue both = Ranger, so those are a must.

Warrior to me could be optional, I just don't know if Blizzard would do that because of design philosophy.

Paladin... this one is iffy. Technically the High Elves would have had a handful of paladins of the Silver Hand, but we never saw them. And the Blood Knights are such a big theme for the Blood Elves. This is a class that I feel High Elves could drop and still maintain their identity.

If Warrior could be dropped, my class list would be:

Hunter
Rogue
Mage
Priest
(and maybe Shaman)

In WCII, High Elves were Rangers, and in WCIII the High Elves were mages and priests. Hunter, Rogue, Mage, and Priest have that covered. Adding in Shamans would be the wild card that could make the High Elves feel truly different from Blood Elves, along with the aesthetic changes.

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If High Elves are meant to be traditionalists and are set in their old ways before the destruction of Sunwell, then they'll still share the same Church with the Humans and Dwarves, so priests and paladins are definitely a must

I agree about keeping Priests. What do you think about the compromise of dropping the Paladin class? It was never a theme of the High Elves and only really came into play with the Blood Elves and the Blood Knights.

[FlubberPuddy]

There is a major appeal to having the classes for High Elves that players expect. Hunter and Rogue both = Ranger, so those are a must.

Warrior to me could be optional, I just don't know if Blizzard would do that because of design philosophy.

Paladin... this one is iffy. Technically the High Elves would have had a handful of paladins of the Silver Hand, but we never saw them. And the Blood Knights are such a big theme for the Blood Elves. This is a class that I feel High Elves could drop and still maintain their identity.

If Warrior could be dropped, my class list would be:

Hunter
Rogue
Mage
Priest
(and maybe Shaman)

In WCII, High Elves were Rangers, and in WCIII the High Elves were mages and priests. Hunter, Rogue, Mage, and Priest has that covered. Adding in Shamans would be the wild card that could make the High Elves feel truly different from Blood Elves, along with the aesthetic changes.

I actually cannot agree on the Paladin part being dropped. There were High Elves that believed in the same Holy Light that Humans and Dwarves have believed in, they only started turning away from it when their world was being turned upside down and they lost their own faith in the Holy Light but blamed it instead on the Light instead of themselves. Then the Blood Knights came to be due to deciding the control the Light to their will instead of being led by it.

in the wake of their ancient kingdom's destruction, many of the elves of Quel'Thalas came to view the Holy Light with contempt. This led to a great number of the blood elves losing their faith, and in turn, their Light-given powers,[8] coming to believe that the Light had failed them in their homeland's hour of greatest need.[6] Thus, they needed to find a new way to access the Light. They did this by sapping Light energy from the captive naaru M'uru held beneath the Blood Knight headquarters.

Most Blood Knights were once members of the Royal Guard, proud defenders of high elven society.[6]

Following the mass conversion of the high elven survivors to the blood elves, many members of the Royal Guard—who came to believe that the Light had failed them in their hour of greatest need—went on to join the newly-founded Blood Knight order, a prominent group of sin'dorei paladins under the command of Lady Liadrin[2]

https://wow.gamepedia.com/Blood_Knights

To me, in WoW, Having Faith in the Light tends to lead one to being a Priest or Paladin. We see here that "the Royal Guard" believed in the Light until the decimation of their kingdom. I believe the Royal Guard would consist of Knights, and Knights who believed in the Holy Light? Paladins! And it says many members of the Royal Guard joined the Blood Knights and the Blood Knights are all essentially Paladins.

I do not think many regular Warriors would have had the dedication to the Holy Light like this Royal Guard is implied to have.

Blood Elves were once high elves allied with the humans like the dwarves. Like the two others, high elves also believed in the Holy Light. A few were members of the Silver Hand, such as Mehlar Dawnblade, while others belonged to the high elven Royal Guard.

https://wow.gamepedia.com/Paladin_races

See, again it is noted here that High Elves also believed in the same Holy Light as Humans and Dwarves. And again it references that while a few were members of the Silver Hand, others belonged to the high elven Royal Guard. Further implying the Royal Guard was made up of Paladins or had Paladins at the very least.

Thus this is my case put forward that High Elf Paladins would indeed be a guaranteed slot.

[Traycor]

To me, in WoW, Having Faith in the Light tends to lead one to being a Priest or Paladin.

Aren't Paladins relatively new, lore wise? For some reason I thought Uther was the first paladin... Maybe it was just the Silver Hand that was new.

[Mutineer]

I'd say no to paladin, personally. No to druid, shaman, warlock, and demon hunter as well. Death knight might depend on when they're added, but so far no BFA allied race has the class available to it.

So, my preference would be: Warrior, hunter, rogue, mage, priest, and monk.

All of them, save for monk, are callbacks to Warcraft 3 units, and monk is a class I think should just be available to everyone. Moreover, the emphasis the Silver Covenant had on meditating to deal with their magic addiction ties in nicely with the class, and leaves high elves open to being influenced by wandering pandaren enough that I can see a few cool stories coming out of them taking that path.

[Syegfryed]

Why do High Elves cause you so much discomfort?

because no more goddamn elves, even worse, one who is exactly the same as the other we already have, just to fuck up the barely good blood elf lore. This is not world of elfcrat that is it

You seem legitimately upset people are engaging in discussion over something they want in the game.

not upset, just when people try to shove headcanon and bad fanfic, that pisses me off

and the game do not belong to they, if they want something other people don't want that, simple

like i said in other threads i love worgens, i like human lore, but if i start to creating threads asking then to be playable in the horde, it will be shut down

the reasons for those races not be playable in the horde is the same reasons used on the HE on the alliance, no matter how headcnaon and fanfics i bring on to justify

"yah but we had like a lot of HE npcs in the alliance!1!!" npcs means nothing, their lore is just to be BE antagonists, now you have your own elf, with no hold with the Blood elves lore anymore, ask for then to be represented, not to get other, just because you didn't like the color

when blizz end the faction, then it would make

If you don't want it, don't reply.

it need to be replied to show that people don't want it

if i open thread saying i don't want something, people would come up and say they want it, this is how it works

By turning this into a shouting competition you are just unnecessarily bumping the thread, and you're kind of coming off as a hot head by questioning the merit of peoples character instead of politely countering their points.

like i said, the only thing who bother me is bullshit, like the dragon druids, there is no politely way to answer those kind of things

this whole "silver covenant concept" who have nothing to do with the silver covenant bugs me

the whole "i want to be everything" elves bug me

The less this thread gets bumped. The less likely high elves are. So if you don't want it, contribute something meaningful, don't just insult people who are in the 'yes' camp.

i didn't insult anyone here, yet, only if someone insulted me first

and my comments against this idea, contribute to the subject in general, contribute to this race not be added again, but in the other faction

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We've been debating for several pages about what classes might be best to drop.

thas because you guys have no idea on what to stick with their fantasy, cause High elf fantasy is blood elf fantasy, this is an attempt to fuse a bit of blood elf and night elf fantasy with (holy shit) wildhammer fantasy, but just become a big mess

Should we do the nature elves? "but i want an elf mage BabyRage"

then we should stick the the arcane mages? "but i want elf druid BabyRage"

then what we do? "everything!1! and put paladin too, cause i want to be a BE paladin without be horde"

like i said in previous pages, the only way they got a new fantasy, own their own, is no magic at all that mean they would be more pale, skinny, with white and white/blueish eyes, that would be a decent plot

but no way we had more elves before the 9.0, regardless the fantasy, blizzard know the community is pissed of about the elf disease, and thy will not suddenly put another elf to fuck up a recent added race

[Syegfryed]

Look at it as an opportunity for another horde race. It opens doors for a horde equivalent that is not an elf. Like undecayed Undead (Like Nathanos), Eredar, Taunka, Yaugol, etc.

no, i want the exactly same alliance race, but with a minor difference like eye color, the alliance need to give up the same thing

undead nathanos? no, it should be the humans of alterac, who sided with the horde in warcraft 2

Eredar? just if they are blue, the original eredar, not the demonic manari

Honestly High Elves are an inevitability given Blizzard's recent comments

then lets wait and see, like i said, it would be more plausible to give less voidish colors to void elves

i can't see they adding second elf so quickly, at least no in this expansion, it will diminish the VE as whole and BE lore in the end

[Magnagarde]

What is clear is that Blizzard is setting up a void versus light elf conflict because blood elves are basically light elves now. The question remains what they'll do with those that are neither. It's either kill them off(more likely than any other option) or add them(a lot less likely).

[Lothaeryn]

i am going to propose a scenario for you high elf demanders.

Say i am right and this happens.

High elves are added has a playable allied race for the alliance.
Horde overall population drastically drops to life support numbers.

what does blizzard do?
do they remove the high elves they just added and offer free race changes?

How about:

1. Write a better narrative for the Horde that actually incentivizes players to PLAY Horde

2. Stop using a barely acceptable excuse for why the Blood Elves were added to the Horde as a BAND-AID FIX, for the Horde's already problematic population numbers.

If people are going to migrate to the Alliance on a whim that High Elves are playable, that's on Blizzard to correct that action. Shoe-Horning a desired race into a disfavored faction because you want more players to play said faction is as scummy a design choice as one could have done back in 2005 and it still is to this day. It's analogous saying you can only get a prescription filled at a pharmacy only IF you buy their discount service and switch all your prescriptions over to them. Does it work? Yea, it can. But its a shitty paradigm and practice nonetheless.

If the Horde was so weak in appeal that the Blood Elves are the ONLY reason the Horde has a population after 10+ fucking years of game design, Blizzard is entirely at fault and are failures in game design. And considering how much players LIKE the Horde as a faction, I highly doubt adding High Elves will matter at this rate; if faction populations matter at all considering most people migrate to the best realms for PVE or PVP content alone, and not by faction.

[Azen]

But they could and they should. Just like the High Elves.

For the sake of nostalgia it would be great. I don't think it suits the direction of the story now anymore though. According to the Chronicles (retcon or not) the High elves that were loyal to the Alliance were a small sect acting independently, the High elves in the larger sense had a different agenda. Having the high elves as an allied race implies otherwise and contradict most of their recent history.

The fact is, as a race the High elves became blood elves.

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So I'm not allowed to have an opinion anymore because it conflicts with yours? Not even an opinion on what allied races I think should be added just because you don't like it?

You can have any opinion you want. I'm just pointing out it conflicts with the game, it's fantasies, the story form the past and the direction the story is taking moving forward.

[Deleted]

For the sake of nostalgia it would be great. I don't think it suits the direction of the story now anymore though. According to the Chronicles (retcon or not) the High elves that were loyal to the Alliance were a small sect acting independently, the High elves in the larger sense had a different agenda. Having the high elves as an allied race implies otherwise and contradict most of their recent history.

Not really. Lore-wise there are very few Void Elves too. And Death Knights. And Demon Hunters. These are playable nevertheless.

[Azen]

Not really. Lore-wise there are very few Void Elves too. And Death Knights. And Demon Hunters. These are playable nevertheless.

The quantity is irrelevant. High elves as you knew them now exist as Blood elves. The race as it existed changed into what it is now. You want to ignore this change? Pretend it didn't happen and reestablish it as something it was in the past as of nothing that lead to its transformation ever happened.

Might as well take one of the old human kingdoms, restore it to its former glory and make it part of the Horde. Just ignore everything that happened inbetween.

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It does? What points to that? Can you tell me how this game is going in a direction different from what I am trying to debate? It seems like the opposite, with allied races being a dime a dozen.

Allied races doesn't grant free reign to create or recreate anything you like that matches your own fantasies and ideas.

The events from the creation of the Sunwell up to the current events are quite clear in showing that the High elves as you want them is gone. Dead and buried. They are now Blood elves. And what remains of want you want is just a reminder of the past.