Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[elbleuet]

Because it never hurts to remind certain people that what they are asking for is already there.

At this point it does when it is used to taunt other people.

Oh, would you care to share your sources showing the retcon? I would like to see it. Because I have all these sources in game and out saying the opposite and if you've information I've missed I'd be happy to accept the new lore.

Oh, since how much time do you care about the lore in game ? Because you know, IG High elves are everywhere. And IG, Blood elves don't consider themselves as High elves, and High elves clearly make the difference between them and blood elves.

As for the Blood Elves in Telogrus, as well as the high elf wayfarers, seem to be there to swell the ranks of the Void Elves. And a Void Elf, as so many others have pointed out, is 'not what was asked for'. The ranks of the Void Elves are very likley expanding, but not the exiles.
But I am happy you see the Void Elves as supplanting and replacing the exiles. Given that is probably their purpose within the Alliance, it speaks to a job well.

They're just high and blood elves manupulating the void, nothing more Before his transformation, Umbric was just a blood elf playing with the void.
So yeah, some blood elves are deserting Silvermoon to follow the teachings of Alleria and fight for the Alliance. This is an important point, as it shows nothing prevents the blood elves to defect from Silvermoon to fuel the ranks of the Alliance.

Except you inserted yourself into my response to Ielenia, who is most definitely not happy with the restatement of canonical fact. So my response was general.

Oh ok sorry

[Obelisk Kai]

At this point it does when it is used to taunt other people.

If you perceive it as a taunt that is your issue. It is a rebuttal to the never ending insistence from some that high elven exiles and Blood Elves are different people and that Blood Elves are not high elves. And if the statement is good enough for Blizzard to use to make the same point, then that's fine by me.

Oh, since how much time do you care about the lore in game ? Because you know, IG High elves are everywhere. And IG, Blood elves don't consider themselves as High elves, and High elves clearly make the difference between them and blood elves.

Nowhere has it been said in game that Blood Elves have a hostile reaction to being called high elves. That seems to be a headcanon devised by pro High Elfers to mirror the attitude of the single high elf exile in Allerian Stronghold who insisted she wasn't a Blood Elf. If you have any information that suggests otherwise, I am open to seeing it.

As for being 'everywhere' that isn't exactly true. They are present in Dalaran. They are present in Dalaran's Argent Tournament. They are present in Dalaran's Kirin Tor offensive on the thunder isle. They are present at Suramar at the Kirin Tor initiated offensive on the city. They WEREN'T present during the fourth war when Dalaran was neutral though except for one or two we saw about the place. One of which was even important enough to open the portals. But mostly they are seen in relation to Dalaran, and when Dalaran wasn't involved they weren't really seen at all.

The difference between an exile and a Blood Elf is politics. Nothing more, nothing less. Identical biologically, identical culturally and even both yoked to the same Sunwell and so subject to the same physiological changes that come with being attached to a power source of holy-arcane energy. They are as different from Blood Elves as the defias brotherhood mason stiffed for his pay is different from the rich stormwind noble who stiffed him.

They're just high and blood elves manupulating the void, nothing more Before his transformation, Umbric was just a blood elf playing with the void.
So yeah, some blood elves are deserting Silvermoon to follow the teachings of Alleria and fight for the Alliance. This is an important point, as it shows nothing prevents the blood elves to defect from Silvermoon to fuel the ranks of the Alliance.

More likely, in line with Moorgard's recent commentary that nothing is stopping you from headcanoning what ever you want within reason, they are there to facilitate those who wish to argue their Void Elf began as as an exile or a Blood Elf who had a more unique backstory than being one of Umbric's Mages. Besides, until they become Void Elves, they ARE just high and blood elves manipulating the void. Which means selecting the Void Elf option in the character creator does not encompass them, any more than selecting a Lightforged Draenei entitles you to play a pre-lightforged initiate.

[Primlight]

I wanted to clarify something because I think some people are still confused what I've been saying recently.

Two photos to make my point.

I'm sorry but.. those don't look the same? Certainly not any more similar than the gold eyes Kai posted earlier either. They look like they could literally be a color swap for the gold eyes actually.

That's why I've been saying those freshly datamined eyes looked like Void Elf eyes. Cuz that's the kind of eyes Void Elves have right now, in the game.

And even in the wowhead post you can see the clearly defined iris vs the blue ones having none. Just like Void Elves don't have a clearly defined iris.

Um, I can see the void elf's iris pretty clearly defined in the picture you posted actually, in fact the datamined blue eyes looks even less like the Void elf's eye upon closer inspection. I even went in-game on my void elf and inspected them closely as well, and confirmed it. It's especially apparent when the void elves glances to their sides as well. The blue edges do not look similar either, appearing darker, and more defined than the lines of the Void elf iris.

So when I say 'it doesn't matter if blue eyes go to blood elves at this point' is because after more of the refinement that keyboardturner did, it's quite clear those blue options datamined aren't for blood elves.

She didn't do any refinements though? All she did was dig up the same textures Wowhead dug up, and then say "Those look like Void elf eyes" and presented it as some sort of confirmation. Later when confronted about the similarity to the Blood elves golden eyes she quickly dismissed her earlier stance on the datamined textures and admitted that her "main" reasoning was that they didn't come with a blind option like the other colors (despite the fact that many eye color options do not have a blind option on other races either.)

So in the end, she didn't actually bring anything new to the table, and what she did bring she was so uncertain about she couldn't even stick to it under scrutiny. She dug a bunch of assets we've already seen, and made a speculation, which requires no more education than the ability to discern the differences in an image.

Forgive me if I remain unconvinced, as it would take some serious alignment of the stars in order for it to make sense. That out of all the races only the Blood elf folder contained customization options for an allied race. (in such an early build too.) That out of all the allied races, only Void elf customizations were found. That despite Devs stressing that new options were only going to core races, Void elves would still be getting 8 new eye color variations, 1 of which is partially green.

Now it's always been possible they aren't for the Blood elves, I'm not arguing that point, merely that the evidence I've seen hasn't been any more compelling than anything else I've heard on the forums by people with no skills in datamining. Earlier this week I posted a tweet to Danuser about my excitement for the new customizations and how I looked forward to Blue eyes on belves and got a like from him. Now I could have run to the forums posting it everywhere, claiming something with no factual evidence is some irrefutable proof of blue eyes coming to Blood elves, but I didn't.

The same can be said for Keyboardturner and her statements, she is not a Blizzard employee, everything she says is susceptible to interpretation and possible bias. The point is no one should be planning their ticker tape parade before anything is officially announced.

[elbleuet]

If you perceive it as a taunt that is your issue.

Your behaviour on this thread is the issue of a lot of people apparently.

Nowhere has it been said in game that Blood Elves have a hostile reaction to being called high elves. That seems to be a headcanon devised by pro High Elfers to mirror the attitude of the single high elf exile in Allerian Stronghold who insisted she wasn't a Blood Elf. If you have any information that suggests otherwise, I am open to seeing it.

Then I suggest you to read Day of the Dragon, and do the Purge of Dalaran questline.

As for being 'everywhere' that isn't exactly true. They are present in Dalaran. They are present in Dalaran's Argent Tournament. They are present in Dalaran's Kirin Tor offensive on the thunder isle. They are present at Suramar at the Kirin Tor initiated offensive on the city. They WEREN'T present during the fourth war when Dalaran was neutral though except for one or two we saw about the place. One of which was even important enough to open the portals. But mostly they are seen in relation to Dalaran, and when Dalaran wasn't involved they weren't really seen at all.

They're also present in Stromgarde, Outland, Stormwind, Kul'Tiras, the Hinterlands, off the coast of Theramore, Wintergarde Keep, the Ghostlands, the Borean Tundra, the Farstriders Lodge in Loch Modan and in various places in Kalimdor.

They WEREN'T present during the fourth war

Oh you mean just like the blood elves who didn't bother sending their own troops during the 3 main battles of the Fourth war ?

he difference between an exile and a Blood Elf is politics. Nothing more, nothing less. Identical biologically, identical culturally and even both yoked to the same Sunwell and so subject to the same physiological changes that come with being attached to a power source of holy-arcane energy. They are as different from Blood Elves as the defias brotherhood mason stiffed for his pay is different from the rich stormwind noble who stiffed him.

I told you countless times I considered the blood elves and the high elves to be part of the same race. Are you practicing a selective read?

Besides, until they become Void Elves, they ARE just high and blood elves manipulating the void.

Or you can also refer to the facts. That's just what I said actually. So the Alliance has also blood elves in her ranks.

[Obelisk Kai]

Your behaviour on this thread is the issue of a lot of people apparently.

I express a legitimate point of view similarly held by many others. I am sure it would be much more convenient for those who want this if there was no opposition, if their desire was applauded from every angle, but that is not the case. Similarly, it seems that if the purity of the argument doesn't win any over the opposition, if people aren't convinced by the sheer absolute need for playable High Elves, then they are labelled 'toxic' for not seeing the light.

So long as this argument persists and what I consider essential, the maintenance of two distinct factions comprised of unique races that are part of parcel of those factions, is attacked by commentators here, then I will put my word in.

Then I suggest you to read Day of the Dragon, and do the Purge of Dalaran questline.

Both of which I have done. I have a copy of Day of the Dragon. I would be very surprised to learn of a Blood Elf upset to be called a High Elf in that book, considering it is set well before the Third War and the Scourge invasion which precipitated the renaming.

As for the Purge of Dalaran I have done the questline on both my Horde and Alliance characters. I don't recall anytime a Blood Elf objected to being called a High Elf. If you could provide the quest wherein this happens, it can be validated on wowpedia or wowhead.

They're also present in Stromgarde, Outland, Stormwind, Kul'Tiras, the Hinterlands, off the coast of Theramore, Wintergarde Keep, the Ghostlands, the Borean Tundra, the Farstriders Lodge in Loch Modan and in various places in Kalimdor.

In most of those cases, there are literally one only a handful of them about. So handfuls of high elves, scattered across the world.

Oh you mean just like the blood elves who didn't bother sending their own troops during the 3 main battles of the Fourth war ?

Blood Elf participation in the fourth war was seeing during the War of Thorns.

https://wow.gamepedia.com/Sin%27dorei_Vanguard

Blood Elves were present during the Siege of Undercity, led by Lor'themar Theron.

A Blood Elf was a boss in the Alliance version of the Battle of Dazar'alor.

Blood Elf NPCs could be recruited for the mission table and were sent off to participate in the war.

Blood Elves were present in the fleet dispatched to Nazjatar.

Blood Elf forces led by Lady Liadrin regularly participated in the Arathi Warfront.

A Blood Elf Paladin was tragically killed defending an aid convoy being transported to Darkshore.

Blood Elves were present during the incursion of Lady Jaina into Orgrimmar in an attempt to liberate Baine.

However, even though I have justified a part of their efforts, justification is unneccessary. As a major power within the Horde, the Blood Elves were clearly there. It is the exiles who were absent. As the exiles are near dead and are not a distinct part of the Alliance, nobody expected them to be there. It is only those who claim the exiles are a strong, important part of the Alliance (one user has even go so far as to say they are the core of the Alliance) who must justify their absence and square it with the claim that the exiles are important

I told you countless times I considered the blood elves and the high elves to be part of the same race. Are you practicing a selective read?

Are you? You keep quoting a mysterious in game source who argues Blood Elves don't like being referred to as High Elves. The only person who ever said that was a High Elf who didn't like being thought of as a Blood Elf, and her objection was based on practices that have since ceased.

As they are the same race, and as the philosophical dispute is resolved, all that is left is political contention.

Or you can also refer to the facts. That's just what I said actually. So the Alliance has also blood elves in her ranks.

Whose purpose is merely to facilitate roleplaying and nothing else.

[FlubberPuddy]

I'm sorry but.. those don't look the same?

BIG ASS YIKES DUDE! Selective reading and selective quoting at it's finest! Are you Obelisk 2.0?

Notice how similar they look, the data-mined one just lacks glow effect.

^ From the same post, funny how it's missing in your response! Then there's also the post after my first reaction to the news elbleuet brought

Could Blizzard always create Blue Eyes for Blood Elves? Yeah they still can, as well as red or purple or any color.

We're still pretty early into character customizations and as we're seeing the type of customizations with humans -> there's still way more and more different customizations to come.

So fret not people that wish for blue eyes on Blood Elves (or red or purple or etc)

Seems like people are trying to push onto me that my stance is "no BlUe EYes fOr BlOOd ELVeS" when that's never been my stance at all.

What I am trying to push is against this notion that VERY MANY High Elf antagonists have which is "If Blue Eyes come to Blood Elves then the High Elf request is dead in the water!!"

It's very easily seen whenever things like the DK eye change happened, people posting 'lul there's high elves now bb alliance!' and with the wowhead datamining post too where there's several comments of people talking about 'omg there goes high elfers last hope' etc etc. Even though Stiven (literal wowhead dataminer yet gets brushed under the rug) himself as he was gathering the photos said he's not sure if those eye colors are for Blood Elves.

And you can very easily see the people who get very defensive by just the mention of more blue eyes coming to Void Elves, taking it to mean as if blue eyes won't come to Blood Elves.

People gotta chill, the main thing is what one side gets isn't cutting out the availability from the other. People are already asking for Void Elf customizations to go Blood Elves and vice versa lol. So everyone's already asking for what the other has.

Just because currently the blue eye textures match up with Void Elves, doesn't mean Blood Elves won't get their own blue eye textures!

[Ielenia]

Individual members of a species can live quite lengthy time periods. A Galapagos turtle has a lifespan of what, nearly a hundred years?

They are nearly extinct though, or 'nearly-dead'.

Very few exiles are alive, but the emphasis is on 'very few' rather than 'alive'.

Real life examples don't work because real life, unlike works of fiction, cannot be "expanded upon" or "retcon-ed" by a few strokes of a pen or a few key presses on a keyboard.

Blizzard has expanded on the high elves (not the blood elves) in Wrath with the creation of the Silver Covenant. And they can do so again, becauase they have done so in the past. More than once. "Oh, did we say that the high elves are a near-extinct race in the past? Oh, oops. Oopsie! Well, not anymore!" Blizzard "retconing" things is nothing new, because they have done so in the past. More than once: the playable draenei were retconed into existence. The playable worgen was retconed into existence. The Wandering Isle was retconed into existence (A GIGANTIC turtle as big as a sizable island roaming the seas and no sailor in all those many, many years has ever spotted it? Really?).

They used what? Two named high elves in BFA? One of whom just opened portals.

If you don't care to look, of course you won't find any. Oh well.

- - - Updated - - -

As Blood Elves are High Elves

But not all high elves are blood elves.

Understand this, Kai: when we say "high elves" here, we're talking about the group of Thalassian elves THE GAME AND LORE identify as "high elves". That means we are not talking about the "blood elves". And you know this. Yet, despite the race already having an appropriate name (Thalassian elves) you insist on calling the whole race "high elves", in what I can only understand as a clear intention to muddle the conversation by playing word games.

[FlubberPuddy]

A Blood Elf Paladin was tragically killed defending an aid convoy being transported to Darkshore.

More like hilariously, people even memed the image for a bit lol



LOL still funny today!

[Ielenia]

Because it never hurts to remind certain people that what they are asking for is already there.

Except... you cannot "remind certain people what they're asking for is already there" when what is being asked is clearly not available yet.

[FlubberPuddy]

Understand this, Kai: when we say "high elves" here, we're talking about the group of Thalassian elves THE GAME AND LORE identify as "high elves". That means we are not talking about the "blood elves". And you know this. Yet, despite the race already having an appropriate name (Thalassian elves) you insist on calling the whole race "high elves", in what I can only understand as a clear intention to muddle the conversation by playing word games.

It's why we've seen multiple times in this thread when people just post a statement like 'lul go play blood elves they're already there' or 'lul why this thread alive high elves exist: blood elves' they get hit with the infraction bat.

Even mods know when someone is being intentionally obtuse

[Varodoc]

At this point all arguments pro and anti high elves have been repeated like dozens of times. This thread has 800+ pages, after all.

[FlubberPuddy]

At this point all arguments pro and anti high elves have been repeated like dozens of times. This thread has 800+ pages, after all.

Yup, I believe we've even had mod step in a few times to say regurgitating the same line over and over isn't having a real discussion, which Obelisk even acknowledged at the time.

Ofc it was maybe a couple hundred pages back so maybe people forgot about it already.

Frankly we all know who are also the main frequenters of these threads so to say to each other the same points that have already been brought up numerously is in my opinion clearly just trying to antagonize or troll the other.

[Ardenaso]

Maybe the mind control spells the Blood Elf leadership used to keep people from going back to the Alliance are wearing off finally ;P

Yes I'd like to see Ennas and Lyria come back as Void Elves

- - - Updated - - -

At this point all arguments pro and anti high elves have been repeated like dozens of times. This thread has 800+ pages, after all.

Wasn't the point of this thread to simply pool all the ideas and ask more questions about anything High Elves in general? I recall seeing here that a mod or the op at least agrees or says that anti-helfers and naysayers should stop being killjoys already

[Starla]

Yes I'd like to see Ennas and Lyria come back as Void Elves

- - - Updated - - -



Wasn't the point of this thread to simply pool all the ideas and ask more questions about anything High Elves in general? I recall seeing here that a mod or the op at least agrees or says that anti-helfers and naysayers should stop being killjoys already

This just seems like you don't believe anyone who disagrees with the idea of alliance getting playable high elves should be allowed to post here. Are you suggesting that the moderator believes that and stated so?

[Ardenaso]

This just seems like you don't believe anyone who disagrees with the idea of alliance getting playable high elves should be allowed to post here. Are you suggesting that the moderator believes that and stated so?

I mean even as an anti helfer it's getting old and futile already

[Frenchvince]

New Mechagnome Customization Options in the Shadowlands Alpha.

https://warcraft.blizzplanet.com/blo...dowlands-alpha

[FlubberPuddy]

New Mechagnome Customization Options in the Shadowlands Alpha.

https://warcraft.blizzplanet.com/blo...dowlands-alpha

So with this there's a small chunk of AR getting some additional options. And what's not surprising is so far it's all the AR that use the same model as their core race counterpart.

1) There was the new Mag'har eyes datamined, probably because eye color choice is being separated from face. Oh look so because Green Orcs are getting worked on, they did something for the Mag'har.

2) There is already confirmation that because Draenei are getting tail length customization, so too will LF Draenei. Another same model pair.

3) These mechagnome tweaks here. Who carry the same model as Gnomes. Goggle changes because of the separation of face choice and eye choice.

4) And ofc the datamined set of Blood Elf and Void Elf eye colors. Because again, BE and VE share the same exact model.

Thus adding more evidence to what I've been saying: When Blizzard does work on races, if there's relatable work to another race that can be done they'll incorporate that in as well.

[Menog]

High elf is already a playable race in game. It's called Blood Elf. Deal with it peasent.

[The Silver Covenant]

Because it never hurts to remind certain people that what they are asking for is already there.

Great. We’re at that point in the cycle where they’re willfully ignorant about Warcraft simply because they think it’ll win them the conversation. Or maybe Obelisk isn’t pretending. Either way: sad.

High Elves aren’t already there as a playable race. If they were then people would not keep asking for over 15 years, now.

[Frenchvince]

So with this there's a small chunk of AR getting some additional options. And what's not surprising is so far it's all the AR that use the same model as their core race counterpart.

1) There was the new Mag'har eyes datamined, probably because eye color choice is being separated from face. Oh look so because Green Orcs are getting worked on, they did something for the Mag'har.

2) There is already confirmation that because Draenei are getting tail length customization, so too will LF Draenei. Another same model pair.

3) These mechagnome tweaks here. Who carry the same model as Gnomes. Goggle changes because of the separation of face choice and eye choice.

4) And ofc the datamined set of Blood Elf and Void Elf eye colors. Because again, BE and VE share the same exact model.

Thus adding more evidence to what I've been saying: When Blizzard does work on races, if there's relatable work to another race that can be done they'll incorporate that in as well.

Allied races also need more customizations, to improve them and increase the choice of options which are very poor for some.