1. #16061
    The Unstoppable Force Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Odintdk View Post
    The few minority of Highelves who primarily hid in Dalaran during their people's hour of need, and abandoned them later,
    "Hid"? "Abandoned"?
    "Torturing someone is not an evil thing to do if it is done for good reasons" by Varodoc
    "You sit in OG/SW waiting on a Mythic+ queue" by Altmer <- Oh, the pearls in this forum...
    "They sort of did this Dragonriding, which ushered in the Dracthyr race." by Teriz <- the BS some people reach for their narratives...

  2. #16062
    I am Murloc! FlubberPuddy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    "Hid"? "Abandoned"?
    Not worth it. The people who diminish High Elves are the same type as those who will defend every one of Sylvanas's actions 'for greater good'.

    The fact that the line 'the few minority Highelves....do not represent the race in any way shape or form' exists already gives insight into what kind of arguments are going to be made. They've already used a Red Herring, you're just going to get more.

    People need to take a chill pill.

  3. #16063
    Bloodsail Admiral Sharby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LarryFromHumanResources View Post
    Goodness me I cannot believe this thread is still going. I want Alliance high elves as much as the next guy but the more new customization options they show the more it seems like we won't get 'em.
    Says who though.



    That's the entire problem with being against this. There will never be a point in time where such a simple request isn't possible unless the game officially dies.



    If you don't like Helves logically you should just ignore this thread and anything relating to it. You're only setting yourself up to fail by consistently fighting a losing battle.

    I think there is merit to having a discussion if you disagree with their addition, but not enough to warrant page after page of circular arguments.


    I think lots of the opposition against Helves in this thread is just people who like arguing for fun. I genuinely cannot see how its entertaining for a brick wall to try and convince a brick wall lol. I would rather see people post more model mock-ups and fanart tbh.
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  4. #16064
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    After 800 pages, some people still don't understand that High Elf (species) =/= High Elf (affiliation). It's amazing,
    They do understand; they just like to use the term High Elf as an umbrella term for the whole species because it obfuscates the conversation. When the schism occurred, it just became inaccurate to call High Elves the species as a whole when one of the resulting ideological groups retained the same name.

    We don't call Darkspear Jungle Trolls when referring to them even when they are that, We call them, Darkspear Trolls, because there's specificity to refer Darkspear instead of Jungle Trolls.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Odintdk View Post
    The majority of High Elves have agreed, and followed their leadership in changing their name to Bloodelves, in honor for the many fallen at the wake of the scourge.
    The majority indeed, that's the point. That some remained on the alliance. Regardless of any biased interpretation of why they did, the fact is that... they did, that there are High Elves on the alliance, and that is a fact regardless that the Blood Elves are more and are on the Horde.

  5. #16065
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    https://youtu.be/tMasO40DCK0

    So that’s a video on Worgen Customization and one of the things MrGM points out is “Male Worgen will finally get to look like Genn Greymane!” by getting the white skin option and having yellow eyes.

    This is further evidence that one of the things Blizzard is doing with the increased customizations is allowing players to be able to emulate their ‘racial leader’. Just as Blood Elves were datamined to be getting a face option like Lor’themar.

    This goes all the way back to Wrath of the Lich King where Human males got a hairstyle that people called, “the Varian hairstyle”.

    We’re most likely going to see more races being able to emulate their leaders.

    For Void Elves it would be Alleria, who is considered their leader.

    Oh and as Frenchvince pointed out, human males are datamined to be getting Kul’Tiran mustache/beard options.

    So we already see the sharing of Allied Race and original race customizations.
    Last edited by FlubberPuddy; 2020-04-28 at 06:06 AM.

  6. #16066
    Quote Originally Posted by Frenchvince View Post
    We don't care who invented it before or after. It's the alliance that has this option with just an important character who is a high-elf / void elf.
    Blue eyes + farstrider tattoos, it's already 2 options not available for blood elves.
    Blood elves have farstriders and they should have a tattoo option.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nevcairiel View Post
    If you are suggesting to take my Night Elfs Shadowmeld away, then please find some pike to run yourself through, tyvm.

  7. #16067
    Brewmaster elbleuet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by matrix123mko View Post
    Blood elves have farstriders and they should have a tattoo option.
    But they won't because that's a high elf thing.

    Alleria who has some, is firmly Alliance.
    "If you want to play alongside High and Void elves, the Alliance is waiting for you"

  8. #16068
    Legendary! Obelisk Kai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pennem View Post
    A lot better than claiming 'what makes you think it's a majority! I self-proclaim with no absolute evidence to the contrary that it's a mere hundred or so. The anti-position is quite clearly the majority despite me providing no evidence to back up such claims it's just because I say so!'.

    Which is what I was pointing out. Now either please provide evidence to support your claim to the contrary. Or drop this line of argument which is clearly destroyed.

    Or continue arguing it and looking inane for everyone else to see.
    What are you talking about? Did you even read the response or are you responding to the response in your mind you THINK I made? Given your established habit of seeing what you want to see in any kind of commentary I believe that is a very valid possibility.

    So, once again, the vast majority of people don't support the pro or anti positions. Stating that the vast majority of people don't support the pro position is not the same thing as insinuating they supporting the anti position. You were the one who said the majority supported the pro position, something for which there is no evidence at all.
    The vast majority of people don't care.

    And if you read the response, which you either didn't do or mentally rewrote as you did so into something you felt you could 'clearly destroy', you would see that the reference to a hundred people was a very, very, very rough number designed to cover the number of people who bother to comment on this topic across the multiple forums. Could be twice that, could be half that, but the same names keep cropping up.

    You were the one who in response to that brought up the 700 people who upvoted the reddit post, which again is about the same number of people who signed the high elf petition. Which to you is seemingly a great success but also suggests the number of people who actively go out of their way to support your cause has never breached a thousand people. One of the pro High Elf tactics is to cite Blizzard changing their mind on classic servers as a demonstration getting them to change course is possible.
    Comparing the numbers the classic movement achieved of a quarter of a million people voicing their support and comparing that to the pro High Elf failure to even get beyond a thousand people is therefore a very valid metric of puncturing this comparison.

    So please, by all means, prove to me that the vast majority of people actively support the addition of high elves to the Alliance. That was your initial claim wasn't it( albeit couched in the quite nasty sentiment that Bellular is wisely shutting up because he shouldn't antagonise a majority with minority opinions)? You are the one seeking to change the status quo. You are the one who made the outlandish claim. I am quite confident in saying the vast majority of people don't care because the tools available to the pro High Elf movement were also used by the classic server movement, and they got a quarter of a million to your less than a thousand.

    So please, prove me wrong.
    Last edited by Obelisk Kai; 2020-04-28 at 09:26 AM.

  9. #16069
    Brewmaster elbleuet's Avatar
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    Classic is an entire game/concept. High elves are a minor feature, and only asked by some from one of the 2 factions. Are you seriously comparing both ?
    "If you want to play alongside High and Void elves, the Alliance is waiting for you"

  10. #16070
    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    But they won't because that's a high elf thing.

    Alleria who has some, is firmly Alliance.
    Tattoos are a farstrider thing. That is a fact. I fully expect tattoo options for blood elves (again not 100% guaranteed but I think a very high possibility)

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    Classic is an entire game/concept. High elves are a minor feature, and only asked by some from one of the 2 factions. Are you seriously comparing both ?
    Pro high elfers have used the excuse "they said no to classic then changed their mind, they'll do the same for high elves". So pro high elfers have attempted to compare the two. Though as you correctly point out, they're not even comparable. One was a concept with a massive backing of 200,000+ signatures on its official classic petition, while the other is a concept which has a measly 700 signatures on its official petition. One comprised a massive supporting by the community at large, while, as you point out, the other comprises a few people from one of the factions asking for a race already playable.
    Last edited by Strippling; 2020-04-28 at 09:40 AM.
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  11. #16071
    Legendary! Obelisk Kai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pennem View Post
    https://youtu.be/tMasO40DCK0

    So that’s a video on Worgen Customization and one of the things MrGM points out is “Male Worgen will finally get to look like Genn Greymane!” by getting the white skin option and having yellow eyes.

    This is further evidence that one of the things Blizzard is doing with the increased customizations is allowing players to be able to emulate their ‘racial leader’. Just as Blood Elves were datamined to be getting a face option like Lor’themar.

    This goes all the way back to Wrath of the Lich King where Human males got a hairstyle that people called, “the Varian hairstyle”.

    We’re most likely going to see more races being able to emulate their leaders.

    For Void Elves it would be Alleria, who is considered their leader.

    Oh and as Frenchvince pointed out, human males are datamined to be getting Kul’Tiran mustache/beard options.

    So we already see the sharing of Allied Race and original race customizations.
    You are assuming with absolutely zero evidence that being able to emulate the racial leader is an actual design goal. Your evidence? A white wolf skin tone previously one employed by Worgen racial leader Genn Greymane.

    Worgen are anthropomorphic Wolves. A white Worgen skin tone is there not unexpected given white wolves are a thing in real life. It is actually more surprising the white tone wasn't there to begin with. They are quite famous. There is even a company who makes tabletop roleplaying games called white wolf.
    It's addition therefore should not be presumed to be motivated by 'making players look like Genn' but more 'white is an obvious tone to add to Worgen, toss that in as well'.

    This is yet another example of you attempting to interpret things out of context and extrapolate with no basis in order to support a conclusion you've already reached.

    Your conclusion is 'Void Elves are going to be able to look like High Elves after the customisation pass'. You have therefore decided that the motive for granting white tones to Worgen is that it is to allow players to mimic their leader, Genn Greymane, rather than the far more likely motive that white was just an obvious generic wolf colour to toss into the mix.

    You then extrapolated a motive you have no evidence for across to Void Elves and assume that the considerations that led to the creation of Void Elves in the first place, namely creating aesthetic and thematic distance between Void Elves and Blood/High Elves, will somehow no longer apply and they will be determined to ensure Void Elf players can look like their leader.

    That is, to put it mildly, 'reaching'.

    As is your final point of shared facial hairstyles. Sharing hairstyles and facial hair has been done for years between the core races. It happening with Void Elves is to be expected. Skin tone is a far more fundamental area though, given that Void Elf skin is the major aesthetic differentiator between Void Elves and Blood Elves. I have yet to see Orcs getting Mag'har tones, or Dwarves getting Dark Iron tones in their customisation passes. If that happens, maybe what you hope for has a chance of coming to pass.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    Classic is an entire game/concept. High elves are a minor feature, and only asked by some from one of the 2 factions. Are you seriously comparing both ?
    I'll be quite happy to stop comparing the two once pro High Elf commentators stop citing Blizzard changing it's mind on classic servers as precedent for a hypothetical changing of their mind on high elves within the Alliance. But if the example is cited, the interrogation of that example and the demonstration they aren't actually comparable at all is to be expected.

  12. #16072
    Brewmaster elbleuet's Avatar
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    That doesn't go against what I just said.

    And sorry, but the Farstriders are also in the Alliance. Also Silver Covenant rangers and Allerian high elves are former farstriders.

    See Ros'Eleth's quote and see : https://wow.gamepedia.com/Farstrider_Lodge :
    When I first arrived, I'd hoped to meet the town's namesake.

    <Ros'eleth glances around.>

    Most young high elves outgrow the 'I wanna be a Farstrider' phase by the time they're taken as apprentices. Then, it's onto the 'I'm going to be a magister' stage.

    I don't think I ever quite outgrew the Farstrider phase, to be honest. No one dreams of growing up to be a seamstress, but we can't have the Farstriders running around naked, as my mother used to say.

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    That may not just be a blood elf thing from the start. Apparently you're not going to get blue eyes any time soon (but it can change ofc, beta is beta) so Blizzard likely akhnowleged high elves are high elves, and blood elves are blood elves and does not want to add additional confusions.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post



    I'll be quite happy to stop comparing the two once pro High Elf commentators stop citing Blizzard changing it's mind on classic servers as precedent for a hypothetical changing of their mind on high elves within the Alliance. But if the example is cited, the interrogation of that example and the demonstration they aren't actually comparable at all is to be expected.
    So you're basically admitting your comparison is bullshit.

    Since TBC, High elves is the most requested thing when it comes to bring on the table additional races.

    And I think up until Cataclysm, Ogres and Nagas were not far from that.

    Blizzard can change its mind, that's a reality. Yet we don't know if it will. We'll just have to wait and see.
    "If you want to play alongside High and Void elves, the Alliance is waiting for you"

  13. #16073
    Legendary! Obelisk Kai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RangerDaz View Post
    You do know that you just need Ion or another wow decision maker to give the order to make this (any-) thing happen, just like they created void elves out of thin air

    Having Alliance High Elves with the void elf starting screen and racials is a bit cringy, but if blizzard has choosen this path to give more subrace options as extra costumizations, well it is better than nothing. but at least they should give a visual animation update to the void elf racials for high elves.
    Of course. If the developers change their mind they can easily make Alliance High Elves possible. But I think anyone who starts arguing that Blizzard can retcon the current situation is implicitly accepting the reality of the current situation regarding the exiles and their status.

    Your second point is the slippery slope though and yet more proof that there is no unified pro High elf demand.

    Some reject the idea of void elf customisation outright, only a pure High Elf option will do.

    Others will accept void elf customisation.

    But there are other for whom void elf customisation wouldn't be enough and would want updated racials. And maybe emotes. And the Paladin class wouldn't go amiss either.

    There are levels of what is apparently acceptable and each individual differs on what they would accept.

    Frankly I think what is likeliest to happen is that they'll give Void Elf players a monkey paw result. Normalish yet obviously void flawed skin tones that still drive home the message you are playing a Void Elf. I think they would be very, very wary of attempting to facilitate the 'de-voiding' of Void Elves as that is the core theme of the race. Think of their actions during the character model updates, they set out to rebuild the models but they also kept them spiritually in tune with what went before. Their philosophy was that someone playing a particular race clearly enjoyed that model, and that they were the people they had to please, not groups who hated the model and wanted Blizzard to transform it into something else they would prefer. The same philosophy should be presumed to be at work here and that whatever customisations void elves get, the won't violate or compromise the fantasy of being a void elf.

    Because ultimately, just as there is a werewolf option in the game and nobody questions that despite it being Alliance only, there is a traditional style high elf option in the game and if people want to play that, well, the Horde IS waiting for them. Just as it would be unfair on Blood Elves to duplicate them to the Alliance, it is unfair on Void Elves to devalue their own fantasy and attempt to turn them into ersatz high elves.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    So you're basically admitting your comparison is bullshit.

    Since TBC, High elves is the most requested thing when it comes to bring on the table additional races.

    And I think up until Cataclysm, Ogres and Nagas were not far from that.

    Blizzard can change its mind, that's a reality. Yet we don't know if it will. We'll just have to wait and see.
    Not at all, I am critiquing the comparison. The notion that Blizzard reversing course on classic servers presages a similar about turn on Alliance high elves has always been one of the sillier things blurted out by the pro high elf movement. That was a juggernaut of a movement that few other questions in WoW's history have ever replicated. The closest I can think of was the flying debacle of WOD where there was an outcry, and they did change (but not reverse course).

    As for Blizzard changing their minds, well, we don't know if they will change their minds but it's not as if we have no evidence of which way they are leaning. Fifteen years of commentary can all be summed up in one message. Blood Elves are playable as the high elf option of WoW. If you want to play a high elf, the Horde is waiting for you. If you can't stomach the Horde, the high elf variant of void elves is a part of the Alliance.

  14. #16074
    Brewmaster elbleuet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post


    Not at all, I am critiquing the comparison. The notion that Blizzard reversing course on classic servers presages a similar about turn on Alliance high elves has always been one of the sillier things blurted out by the pro high elf movement. That was a juggernaut of a movement that few other questions in WoW's history have ever replicated. The closest I can think of was the flying debacle of WOD where there was an outcry, and they did change (but not reverse course).

    As for Blizzard changing their minds, well, we don't know if they will change their minds but it's not as if we have no evidence of which way they are leaning. Fifteen years of commentary can all be summed up in one message. Blood Elves are playable as the high elf option of WoW. If you want to play a high elf, the Horde is waiting for you. If you can't stomach the Horde, the high elf variant of void elves is a part of the Alliance.
    Yet Ion said maybe there was a possibility to add some high elf costumization options so I don't really know what are you trying to say. Ofc we won't get High elves as a race.

    But that's the same deal with the Highborne. But apparently, we could play some blond blue-eyed, light skinned night elves soon so ...
    "If you want to play alongside High and Void elves, the Alliance is waiting for you"

  15. #16075
    Legendary! Obelisk Kai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    Yet Ion said maybe there was a possibility to add some high elf costumization options so I don't really know what are you trying to say. Ofc we won't get High elves as a race.

    But that's the same deal with the Highborne. But apparently, we could play some blond blue-eyed, light skinned night elves soon so ...
    Ion never said that. You are confusing what he said with what Afrasiabi said. And what Afrasiabi said was 'it's possible' before spinning off into a comparatively lengthy tangent about forum behaviour.

    What Ion said was 'Anything was possible'. He said the same thing to Preach too when Preach asked about the return of master looting, and Preach took it the correct way i.e.'it's not likely at all Preach so don't hope for it' and not the wishful-thinking pro high elfer way of 'we are completely open to and very likely to change our minds if you keep complaining long enough. Please complain more'.

    In regards to void elf customisations themselves, we don't know but I still reckon it is more likely than not that whatever the Void Elves get won't be anywhere near enough for the majority of those hoping for high elves on the alliance who look like Blood Elves.

  16. #16076
    Brewmaster elbleuet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    Ion never said that. You are confusing what he said with what Afrasiabi said. And what Afrasiabi said was 'it's possible' before spinning off into a comparatively lengthy tangent about forum behaviour.

    What Ion said was 'Anything was possible'. He said the same thing to Preach too when Preach asked about the return of master looting, and Preach took it the correct way i.e.'it's not likely at all Preach so don't hope for it' and not the wishful-thinking pro high elfer way of 'we are completely open to and very likely to change our minds if you keep complaining long enough. Please complain more'.

    In regards to void elf customisations themselves, we don't know but I still reckon it is more likely than not that whatever the Void Elves get won't be anywhere near enough for the majority of those hoping for high elves on the alliance who look like Blood Elves.
    Oh sorry for my mistake you're right.

    For me it will be largely enough with 2 or 3 light skinned options. Blond hairs are not necessary. I think a blue/purple haired, light skinned void elf with blue eyes would look great.

    Maybe this would be some sort of compromise. Not a blond hairs option for the void elves. Only dark colors for the hairs available (purple, pink, black, blue, even greyish, white).
    "If you want to play alongside High and Void elves, the Alliance is waiting for you"

  17. #16077
    Legendary! Obelisk Kai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    Oh sorry for my mistake you're right.

    For me it will be largely enough with 2 or 3 light skinned options. Blond hairs are not necessary. I think a blue/purple haired, light skinned void elf with blue eyes would look great.

    Maybe this would be some sort of compromise. Not a blond hairs option for the void elves. Only dark colors for the hairs available (purple, pink, black, blue, even greyish, white).
    But as has been demonstrated, what is enough for you won't be enough for others. Some would be satisfied with what you want. Some would be satisfied with less than what you want. Some want more, including the ability to be indistinguishable from a high elf so as to roleplay as one. Some want more yet, including updated racials, updated emotes and even access to the Paladin class.

    Others reject the idea of Void Elf customisation completely and would demand nothing less than a high elf. When we say the high elfers can't agree on what they want, we mean this, the inability settle for what could be presented as a compromise option. I believe the Void Elf as it stands IS the compromise option of course given that it's a thalassian elf model that is unambiguously a thalassian elf. The question therefore becomes to what degree will Blizzard want to 'water down' the void elf theme by allowing them access to a human skin tone range?

    I believe the answer to that will not be enough for most of those asking. Personally I would prefer them to go the other way, to lean into the void elf fantasy as much as possible and go in a lovecraftian direction with tattoos consisting of living eyeball patterns, optional tentacles sprouting from odd angles, eyes with weird glows, freaky cultist tattoos, facial hairs that have tentacles built in. Because we have no other race that does the void theme, whereas we have several that do the light theme.
    Last edited by Obelisk Kai; 2020-04-28 at 12:18 PM.

  18. #16078
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    But as has been demonstrated, what is enough for you won't be enough for others. Some would be satisfied with what you want. Some would be satisfied with less than what you want. Some want more, including the ability to be indistinguishable from a high elf so as to roleplay as one. Some want more yet, including updated racials, updated emotes and even access to the Paladin class.
    Everytime you make these sorts of statements it's as if to say, "they aren't going to please every high elf fan so they may as well not make effort towards appeasing the high elf fans they can."

    And Blizzard has shown time and again they're willing to go ahead and give people more of what they want despite it not being able to satisfy every single player in existence. They look at the critique and when the time comes to be able to rectify it, they'll be able to do what they can with the requests in mind.

    The response Danuser gave on Wildhammer is an example of this. He literally said they're not gonna not do Wildhammer just because they don't have the resources/time to explain in-game and give your Wildhammer Dwarf a proper starting experience stating you are one.

    That's exactly the kind of thing others are talking about here. If they can do a bit more to legitimize the High Elves on Alliance that'll be great. Just like the players who wish for Dark Ranger skins and Red Eyes to come to Blood Elves, there will be a portion of players who are disappointed their ideas for extra customization options didn't get in. But that's not stopping Blizzard from adding a slew of options to Blood Elves and other races.

    They're not just going, "you know guys, there's people that want to play a Dark Ranger Blood Elf with Red Eyes but honestly that skin option and eye color doesn't make sense so since we can't please all the Blood Elf fans let's just not do these increased customizations at all!"

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    Personally I would prefer them to go the other way, to lean into the void elf fantasy as much as possible and go in a lovecraftian direction with tattoos consisting of living eyeball patterns, optional tentacles sprouting from odd angles, eyes with weird glows, freaky cultist tattoos, facial hairs that have tentacles built in. Because we have no other race that does the void theme, whereas we have several that do the light theme.
    Seeing as most of the increased customizations are based in long-time player requests for fans of the race, I'm doubtful they'll go that route. As essentially every void elf fan keeps reverberating about wanting to 'look like Alleria'.

    Also just because Void is their specific theme doesn't mean that's the only thing they need to focus on. Light is the theme of Blood Elves but how many are agitating for Farstrider tats? Blood Elves are being shown to be getting body jewelry <-- nothing to do with the Light. Gnomes are also getting lots of gem-based jewelry, that's not strictly engineering related.

    The purpose is to give variety that's pretty much what Ion said.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    But that's the same deal with the Highborne. But apparently, we could play some blond blue-eyed, light skinned night elves soon so ...
    Yeah this too. Night Elves aren't only getting skin colors/eye colors/hair colors that stick to 'purple/green/pink shades'

    They're getting options of blue eyes, blonde hair, and proper dark elf skin colors as well as very light-pink almost human tone skin colors.

    It's breaking the doors open on the range of looks any particular race can have.

  19. #16079
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharby View Post
    That's the entire problem with being against this. There will never be a point in time where such a simple request isn't possible unless the game officially dies.
    I was brought here because I made a High Elf post and I was just told to post them here. I kinda like it here though so whenever I have High Elf questions I just ask here
    Last edited by Ardenaso; 2020-04-28 at 02:02 PM.
    The Alliance gets the Horde's most popular race. The Horde should get the Alliance's most popular race in return. Alteraci Humans for the Horde!

    I make Warcraft 3 Reforged HD custom models and I'm also an HD model reviewer.

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    Legendary! Obelisk Kai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pennem View Post
    Everytime you make these sorts of statements it's as if to say, "they aren't going to please every high elf fan so they may as well not make effort towards appeasing the high elf fans they can."

    And Blizzard has shown time and again they're willing to go ahead and give people more of what they want despite it not being able to satisfy every single player in existence. They look at the critique and when the time comes to be able to rectify it, they'll be able to do what they can with the requests in mind.
    They gave you the model, it was a recognisable elf. They made an effort. Your community spurns that effort. They can safely say they tried. They also knew enough to know the compromise wouldn't be popular with the most hardcore. I think they can live with that . After all, a Warcraft decision that didn't please everyone and left some people upset? It must be Wednesday...

    Quote Originally Posted by Pennem View Post
    The response Danuser gave on Wildhammer is an example of this. He literally said they're not gonna not do Wildhammer just because they don't have the resources/time to explain in-game and give your Wildhammer Dwarf a proper starting experience stating you are one.
    Yes but allowing an Alliance Dwarf to roleplay as a member of another tribe who are physically indistinguishable from most other Alliance Dwarves and who are also a part of the Alliance is a lot different than giving lore inconsistent options to one race so they can mimic the appearance of a race from the other faction and attempt to pretend to be something they aren't. Again with the forced equivalencies and assumptions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pennem View Post
    That's exactly the kind of thing others are talking about here. If they can do a bit more to legitimize the High Elves on Alliance that'll be great. Just like the players who wish for Dark Ranger skins and Red Eyes to come to Blood Elves, there will be a portion of players who are disappointed their ideas for extra customization options didn't get in. But that's not stopping Blizzard from adding a slew of options to Blood Elves and other races.

    They're not just going, "you know guys, there's people that want to play a Dark Ranger Blood Elf with Red Eyes but honestly that skin option and eye color doesn't make sense so since we can't please all the Blood Elf fans let's just not do these increased customizations at all!"
    No sign of dark ranger type skins on Blood Elves yet though. I think it shouldn't happen because it is inconsistent with a Blood Elf origin of course.
    But it's an interesting point. If Blood Elves don't get a Dark Ranger skin by the end of this, despite being 'requested', it will be a sign that certain options are off limits because they do actually go against lore. Maybe the canary in the coalmine so to speak.
    After all, if they don't give Dark Ranger skins as part of Blood Elf customisation then the only real reason they wouldn't do it is the lore. And your own request not only cuts across existing lore but goes against the logic of of creating Void Elves in the first place. We may not have to wait for the allied race customisation pass then to determine the likelihood of your request. If the core races options are limited to those that make sense for that core race, then your own prospects for success become considerably bleaker.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pennem View Post
    Seeing as most of the increased customizations are based in long-time player requests for fans of the race, I'm doubtful they'll go that route. As essentially every void elf fan keeps reverberating about wanting to 'look like Alleria'.

    Also just because Void is their specific theme doesn't mean that's the only thing they need to focus on. Light is the theme of Blood Elves but how many are agitating for Farstrider tats? Blood Elves are being shown to be getting body jewelry <-- nothing to do with the Light. Gnomes are also getting lots of gem-based jewelry, that's not strictly engineering related.

    The purpose is to give variety that's pretty much what Ion said.
    Yet Moorgard was also asked to comment on the proposed changes to see if any violated lore, and none did. That he was asked strongly implies they want the new customisation options to be fully consistent with the race and that this IS a consideration.

    If the high elf allied race issue has taught us anything it is that 'long term player requests' only count if they don't cross certain red lines. High Elves as an allied race crossed a red line, so Void Elves were created in their stead.

    Your mistake is always to assume that there are no other considerations. Void Elves were differentiated from Blood/High Elves for a reason. The customisations you seek on a Void Elf crash against the same rationale that created Void Elves in the first place. They also destroy the thematic and aesthetic differentiation between Void Elves and Blood Elves.

    And the theme of the Blood Elves is to be traditional high elves. Farstrider tattoos would be a part of that package as that is part of the heritage of the race, just as being light aligned is a part of the package. In contrast the Void Elves are defined by the void. Skin tone? Void influenced. Tentacles? Void caused. Origin story? Nuked by the void. Even the name is Void Elves. This is why I keep going back to the distinction between Core and Allied races. Core races have a lot more leeway in their origins than allied races. Allied races have tightly defined origins that are impossible to wriggle around.



    Quote Originally Posted by Pennem View Post
    Yeah this too. Night Elves aren't only getting skin colors/eye colors/hair colors that stick to 'purple/green/pink shades'

    They're getting options of blue eyes, blonde hair, and proper dark elf skin colors as well as very light-pink almost human tone skin colors.

    It's breaking the doors open on the range of looks any particular race can have.
    https://www.wowhead.com/news=311980/...luding-tattoos

    Eye colour is only a relevant topic on Blood/high elves, due to the lore that their eye colour reflects ambient magic. Other race eye colour isn't a point of comparison.

    Wowhead lists three new datamined skin tones. One is a very light purple/pink. One is grey-purple. One is a grey-blue. All seem to fall within the Night Elf tone range which, I hasten to add, is a non human tone range. Non human tone ranges aren't limited by what humans express through skin colours and are more flexible. As it stands though, nothing out of the ordinary.

    Hair colours datamined include black, an autumnal orange (very evocative of trees in autumn and extremely night elven as a consequence) and bright purple (which doesn't look out of place compared to some of their other, garish hair colours).

    None of these seem to exist outside the Night Elf aesthetic. All of them go with the grain of what Night Elves are. Were other options datamined that wowhead forgot to include? Or are wowhead only listing the options they feel confident about?

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