Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Frenchvince]

Except for the fact that the warpaint Alleria wears, is a hallmark to the time where the blood elves called themselves high elves.
They've chosen to preserve their traditions, per the heritage armor quest, so why would they not continue it?
Let alone the fact that the reason they wear red is to honor the dead, but clearly have no qualms wearing other colors when they aren't showing pride in loyalty to their people. Their red isn't for the Horde after all

The argument remains the same, the identity of the factions.
Alleria has an appearance that represents the high-elf farstrider, so it's going to be difficult now to allow the horde players to have the same thing.
I don't think Blizzard agrees that the horde will end up with full of Alleria's clones.

- - - Updated - - -

Stiven mentions what he has done here is to cross human eyes with the Blood Elf model, and to show what looks like the Undead glowing eyes don't work as well.

This image is a thought experiment and is not accurate.

I just share, nothing more.
But if you want a comment, it could very well be the result of the update for eyes like those of Vereesa.

[Strippling]

The argument remains the same, the identity of the factions.
Alleria has an appearance that represents the high-elf farstrider, so it's going to be difficult now to allow the horde players to have the same thing.
I don't think Blizzard agrees that the horde will end up with full of Alleria's clones.

Alleria is one elf... a void elf to be precise.

The farstriders are our "high-elf farstriders", they're the very elven rangers we played in the RTS series. Any alliance aligned high elf ranger is fashioned after the blood elf farstriders. Alleria's appearance is unique in the same sense that most racial leaders bear unique customizations.. that doesn't change the fact that the farstriders (a blood elf group) are well and active, they prefer dwelling in the forests and they are still very much the same rangers they've always been.

The Farstriders are an elite group of blood elf rangers active in Quel'Thalas.

Intimately bound to the wildlands,and with a deep respect for the law, the rangers that compose the Farstriders' ranks remain noble, traditional, and valiant protectors of blood elf society.

While many of their brethren focus on magical supremacy and the wonders of the arcane, the Farstriders retain some of their forebears' connection to nature, feeling at home in the forests and finding allies in the wilderness - while Silvermoon has many political divisions, in nature the Farstriders find allies that do not know deceit. Intimately bound to the wildlands, the Farstriders are experts at their craft and know the forests of Quel'Thalas like no others, outclassing even their ancient enemy the Amani in terms of woodsmanship and stealth.

Farstriders are the elven rangers we saw in the RTS series. They prefer dwelling away from the city and in the woods, they have a connection to nature. Apart from night elves they are your typical woodland elf. I find it odd that pro's resort to this notion that alliance high elves are the representation of "woodland ranger elves", when the farstriders are far greater in number, are more active forest dwelling rangers, and what few alliance high elf rangers there are have only modeled themselves after the farstriders. That theme is not unique to alliance aligned high elves, it's intrinsically part of blood elven culture and is merely copied by the alliance aligned high elves.

[delus]

They literally are the exact same people and in some cases, have the same eye color. Blizzard hasn't been doing anything of the like.
The culture is also the same.
Vereesa literally calls herself ranger general.

Haven't seen Steelweaver since WOD. Wonder if he still has blue eyes now. Maybe he's dead.

[Obelisk Kai]

I just share, nothing more.
But if you want a comment, it could very well be the result of the update for eyes like those of Vereesa.

No, it's not an update. It's Stiven manipulating files to show something he felt was interesting. That's all there is to it.

- - - Updated - - -

Haven't seen Steelweaver since WOD. Wonder if he still has blue eyes now. Maybe he's dead.

He could very well be. Casualties happen in war time or conflict and some groups are far less able to absorb losses than others. But he did exist, and his eye colour wasn't a mistake.

[Frenchvince]

Alleria is one elf... a void elf to be precise.

The farstriders are our "high-elf farstriders", they're the very elven rangers we played in the RTS series. Any alliance aligned high elf ranger is fashioned after the blood elf farstriders. Alleria's appearance is unique in the same sense that most racial leaders bear unique customizations.. that doesn't change the fact that the farstriders (a blood elf group) are well and active, they prefer dwelling in the forests and they are still very much the same rangers they've always been.

The Farstriders are an elite group of blood elf rangers active in Quel'Thalas.

Intimately bound to the wildlands,and with a deep respect for the law, the rangers that compose the Farstriders' ranks remain noble, traditional, and valiant protectors of blood elf society.

While many of their brethren focus on magical supremacy and the wonders of the arcane, the Farstriders retain some of their forebears' connection to nature, feeling at home in the forests and finding allies in the wilderness - while Silvermoon has many political divisions, in nature the Farstriders find allies that do not know deceit. Intimately bound to the wildlands, the Farstriders are experts at their craft and know the forests of Quel'Thalas like no others, outclassing even their ancient enemy the Amani in terms of woodsmanship and stealth.

Farstriders are the elven rangers we saw in the RTS series. They prefer dwelling away from the city and in the woods, they have a connection to nature. Apart from night elves they are your typical woodland elf. I find it odd that pro's resort to this notion that alliance high elves are the representation of "woodland ranger elves", when the farstriders are far greater in number, are more active forest dwelling rangers, and what few alliance high elf rangers there are have only modeled themselves after the farstriders. That theme is not unique to alliance aligned high elves, it's intrinsically part of blood elven culture and is merely copied by the alliance aligned high elves.

Yes, Alleria is an elf ... an empty elf to be precise, with a unique appearance that represents the high-elf farstrider.

The only farstriders worthy of the name in the horde are the dark rangers, they are often on missions related to their specialty.

The blood elves became specialists in light and blood golems.

- - - Updated - - -

No, it's not an update. It's Stiven manipulating files to show something he felt was interesting. That's all there is to it.

You know how to read ?
I said "it could".

This photo is especially a big bait for anti HE. LOL

[Obelisk Kai]

Nah mate, because in aesthetic terms beyond in game representation of their models, Nightborne and Night Elves are no more different than Dark skinned humans and light skinned humans. They are a magically affected ethnicity at most. Their one "critical" biological change was reversed, what *now* makes them critically different beyond *ear shape.*?

Ear shape. Skin tone. Musculature. Stance. These are the biological differences between Nightborne and Night Elves. Yet these are exacerbated by their wildly different theme and aesthetic, with the Night Elves being the wood elves of the franchise with their arboreal, druidic lifestyle and the Nightborne really being a second, truer take on the dark elf fantasy with a city based, arcane orientated existence.

Your whole argument that a lore based, major biological difference is "needed" for AR is just not accurate. Maghar Orcs are biologically, just orcs not exposed to fel, HMT are a tribe of Tauren blessed with antlers. These are almost negligible "biological differences". Mechagnomes have no biological differences because they are mechanically augmented.

This is you still trying to argue there's a "lore reason" behind allied races being such, when it's just a gameplay mechanic based on aesthetics.

Mag'har Orcs are uncorrupted Orcs with a far more pronounced clan structure. Azeroth Orcs not only turned green as a result of the fel, but their tenure is a great, socially levelling horde and then in the internment camps has heavily degraded their ancient clan structure which the Mag'har have preserved.

Highmountain Tauren were blessed by Cenarius. A small change admittedly, but it is enough, there is something there to build an allied race off of.

Mechagnomes augmentations ARE biological differences, as they have replaced limbs and eyes with mechanical attachments. The differences don't have to be genetic, they merely have to exist. Void Elves aren't genetically different from Blood/high elves, their condition is the result of being bombarded by void energies.
If some high elves lopped off their legs, arms and eyes then that would pass the diversity test and allow the creation of a new allied race.

Which is irrelevant, as always, to the request for High Elves, because Void Elves simply do not have the specific background people want from HE's -which they could have and we wouldn't be having this whole conversation- Thing that you have been told multiple times yet you keep not understanding.

At the moment there is nothing that contradicts the idea that Void Elves can turn other elves into Void Elves if those elves so wish it. In fact, quite the opposite, what evidence there is strongly suggests they can. Hypothetically, were this possibility to be canonically confirmed, say in the upcoming Shadows Rising novel, what would your argument be then? If that confirmation comes, then the test you've just set will have been met, you can play a Void Elf as a high exile who elected to become a Void Elf.
Nevertheless, Moorgard's recent interview made clear that the background of your avatar is entirely up to you so long as it doesn't break the lore. A Dwarf player who wishes to roleplay as a Wildhammer Dwarf doesn't need explicit confirmation they are a Wildhammer. A Troll player who wishes to roleplay a Revantusk doesn't need explicit confirmation they are a Revantusk. And a Void Elf player who wishes to roleplay they were a former Silver Covenant elf who, perhaps, got miffed the Kirin Tor handed their base over to the Worgen, and who has now elected to become a Void Elf...well they can do that too.

Which is just not true because the level of "biological differentiation" for AR is not consistent at all, the only thing consistent is that aesthetically they had to look a lot more different from their "parent race" if they crossed faction (VE and NB)

The whole "every AR has a biological reason to be so" argument is just full of holes because it's wildly inconsistent. Some are clearly just segregated by lore like Maghar and HMT, some are barely magically afflicted ethnicities like Dark Iron, LFD, VE and NB, others are actual new races like Vulpera, Mechagnomes are literally just mechanically enhanced gnomes, and Zandalari is just a naturally occurring ethnicity of Troll. There's just not a consistent litmus test all AR pass; at best is a (2 out of 3 scenario)

The argument regarding differentiation clearly applies to those races that otherwise very closely linked. Vulpera and Goblins don't need to prove their differentiation because it is self evident. Void Elves and Blood/high elves are differentiated by a combination of biological, thematic and aesthetic factors. But High Elven exiles aren't differentiated at all. Same culture, same aesthetic, same race and, thanks to the Sunwell, even the same destiny.

[Strippling]

The only farstriders worthy of the name in the horde are the dark rangers, they are often on missions related to their specialty.

And who determined that the farstriders are not worthy of that name? You? Please explain how the fastriders are not worthy of being called such?

The blood elves became specialists in light and blood golems.

That's your opinion and it's wrong in this case. Firstly, have a look at the blood elf racials and tell me where their specialty to the light is. All I see is arcane based racials (every single one of them by the way). Secondly, blood elf magisters say hi. Thirdly, the farstriders are still very much active as of recent. They even accompanied Lor'thermar at Nazjatar. The light is a part of blood elf culture, but it is certainly not the defining factor on who they are. They are equally defined by their arcane culture and their woodland culture. We have blood knights (light), magisters (arcane) and farstriders (naturistic) who are all cultural aspects of the blood elves (ie our high elves of WoW).

[Obelisk Kai]

You know how to read ?
I said "it could".

This photo is especially a big bait for anti HE. LOL

I do know how to read, thank you. However you neglected to contextualise the image when you posted it. Pointing out that this is not offiical, and is something Stiven did as a thought experiment, will ensure anyone who looks at the image not leap to the conclusion that this is any way accurate of something coming down the pipeline.

[Frenchvince]

I do know how to read, thank you. However you neglected to contextualise the image when you posted it. Pointing out that this is not offiical, and is something Stiven did as a thought experiment, will ensure anyone who looks at the image not leap to the conclusion that this is any way accurate of something coming down the pipeline.

We have the right to share without commenting, right?
Even if it's an experience, it's still good to see.
A bit like the photo I shared, which shows the change of position for HE.

[Strippling]

Now all we need is Paladins for Void Elves

I forgot to reply to this, but here is what Ion Hazzikostas and Alex Afrasiabi said during a Forbes interview:

Newman: If I’m a druid, which doesn’t often get new races, is there going to be a playable allied race for me to choose on both factions?

Alex Afrasiabi: Yeah. We’ve seen Highmountain Tauren of course.

Hazzikostas: Not currently on the Alliance, no. Because for Void Elves, Lightforged Draenei, and Dark Iron Dwarves, none of those, again—asking the question, does it make sense for any of them? Are they in touch with those primal forces and restoration and shapeshifting? The answer’s no.

Newman: Shadow bear!

Afrasiabi: Void bear?

Hazzikostas: Not quite buying it. I don’t think they’d be too welcome in the Moonglade.

Newman: Are there other examples like that, where there are classes that just don’t make any sense at all with the selections available at launch?

Afrasiabi: Paladin for Void Elves, because that’s weird.

Hazzikostas: Exactly. But on the Alliance side, Dark Iron Dwarves can be paladins when those come around. We’re not approaching it from a perspective of, every box needs to be ticked and we’ll shoehorn something in if it doesn’t feel like a natural fit.

[Frenchvince]

And who determined that the farstriders are not worthy of that name? You? Please explain how the fastriders are not worthy of being called such?



That's your opinion and it's wrong in this case. Firstly, have a look at the blood elf racials and tell me where their specialty to the light is. All I see is arcane based racials (every single one of them by the way). Secondly, blood elf magisters say hi. Thirdly, the farstriders are still very much active as of recent. They even accompanied Lor'thermar at Nazjatar. The light is a part of blood elf culture, but it is certainly not the defining factor on who they are. They are equally defined by their arcane culture and their woodland culture. We have blood knights (light), magisters (arcane) and farstriders (naturistic) who are all cultural aspects of the blood elves (ie our high elves of WoW).

Well listen, I play BFA on the horde and alliance side, and that's the feeling I have regarding the blood elves.

Everyone sees their gaming experience differently.

[Strippling]

Well listen, I play BFA on the horde and alliance side, and that's the feeling I have regarding the blood elves.

Everyone sees their gaming experience differently.

You're right about that. I play horde and alliance, and when I'm playing my alliance characters I often forget that there are alliance aligned high elves as I barely see them around (and on the rare occasion I have seen them it's normally associated with Dalaran). I do however see plenty of humans, dwarves, night elves, gnomes, worgen, draenei and all the ARs too. That's my gaming experience.

[Obelisk Kai]

We have the right to share without commenting, right?
Even if it's an experience, it's still good to see.
A bit like the photo I shared, which shows the change of position for HE.

Not saying you can't do what you like. But that applies to everyone. Particularly as you are using it to argue a contest point. Pointing out that the image is a composite, rather than a reflection of what is truly in the works, is therefore a fair comment.

[Frenchvince]

You're right about that. I play horde and alliance, and when I'm playing my alliance characters I often forget that there are alliance aligned high elves as I barely see them around (and on the rare occasion I have seen them it's normally associated with Dalaran). I do however see plenty of humans, dwarves, night elves, gnomes, worgen, draenei and all the ARs too. That's my gaming experience.

For me, the dark rangers were shown as the elite farstrider of the horde during BFA, with real missions made for them.

[Obelisk Kai]

I forgot to reply to this, but here is what Ion Hazzikostas and Alex Afrasiabi said during a Forbes interview:

Newman: If I’m a druid, which doesn’t often get new races, is there going to be a playable allied race for me to choose on both factions?

Alex Afrasiabi: Yeah. We’ve seen Highmountain Tauren of course.

Hazzikostas: Not currently on the Alliance, no. Because for Void Elves, Lightforged Draenei, and Dark Iron Dwarves, none of those, again—asking the question, does it make sense for any of them? Are they in touch with those primal forces and restoration and shapeshifting? The answer’s no.

Newman: Shadow bear!

Afrasiabi: Void bear?

Hazzikostas: Not quite buying it. I don’t think they’d be too welcome in the Moonglade.

Newman: Are there other examples like that, where there are classes that just don’t make any sense at all with the selections available at launch?

Afrasiabi: Paladin for Void Elves, because that’s weird.

Hazzikostas: Exactly. But on the Alliance side, Dark Iron Dwarves can be paladins when those come around. We’re not approaching it from a perspective of, every box needs to be ticked and we’ll shoehorn something in if it doesn’t feel like a natural fit.

Hmm, I'd forgotten about that interview. Do you happen to have the link?

[elbleuet]

The thing is... Blue-eyed thalassian elves are an Alliance feature and so are the war paints.

Just look at Lor'Themar despite being a ranger, he's spending most of his time confortably in Silvermoon, doing nothing.
He's absolutely not depicted as the original farstrider the way Alleria is.
Nowadays, blood elves tend to feel more comfortable in their luxurious palace than in hunting the wilds.

and btw :

The farstriders are our "high-elf farstriders", they're the very elven rangers we played in the RTS series. Any alliance aligned high elf ranger is fashioned after the blood elf farstriders. .

I'm sorry, but the blood elves were fashioned after the High elves, not after. High elves being the original, uncorrupted thalassian elves.

[Obelisk Kai]

For me, the dark rangers were shown as the elite farstrider of the horde during BFA, with real missions made for them.

Not everything is subjective. The Farstriders exist in Silvermoon. They have their own hall. Halduron Brightwing is the Ranger-General of the Farstriders of Silvermoon. They form one part of the political tripod that underpins Blood Elven society alongside the Magisters and the Blood Knights. The Farstriders even joined the Unseen Path in Legion.

The Dark Rangers were clearly Sylvanas' attempt to create a unit of undead archers that approximated the Farstriders, but they are not Farstriders.

[Strippling]

Hmm, I'd forgotten about that interview. Do you happen to have the link?

Of course, here it is.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/hnewman.../#767e47536cdc

[Frenchvince]

Not saying you can't do what you like. But that applies to everyone. Particularly as you are using it to argue a contest point. Pointing out that the image is a composite, rather than a reflection of what is truly in the works, is therefore a fair comment.

I am sure that Stiven wants to be the first to dataminate high-elf eyes, that's why it's interesting to follow him.
Even if he does small experiments, it is always interesting to see.

[Strippling]

For me, the dark rangers were shown as the elite farstrider of the horde during BFA, with real missions made for them.

Each to their own I suppose.