1. #17601
    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post

    Also Blood elves don't consider themselves as High elves anymore. Alliance Thalassian elves do.
    Heritage quest says otherwise. They have preserved their culture and returned to their ways prior to the sunwell being destroyed. They certainly consider themselves high elves, their name is meant solely to represent the honoring of the dead. Not sure why this is even being stated given the nightborne quest and lorthemar stating "we value the ways of our people.".
    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post

    Can you tell me why we said farewell to the Alliance High King in thalassian ?
    Red herring that is entirely irrelevant given that blood elves also speak Thalassian. Seriously, what relevance does this have to anything?

    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    Is there an equivalent in the Horde where we say good bye to Vol'Jin or Saurfang in Common or Darnassian ?
    Again, entirely irrelevant.

    Blood elves are high elves. They have the culture, language, and everything else associated with them prior to the name change of WC3. Arguing otherwise is disingenuous. If anything, you should be saying that the high elves represent a change. Which is ironic that those who changed their name preserve the high elf ways, and those calling themselves high elves are leaving behind well...what was high elf in the first place.

  2. #17602
    Legendary! Obelisk Kai's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    The north of Ireland
    Posts
    6,075
    Quote Originally Posted by Thalassian Bob View Post
    Yeah, I think you're probably right regarding her fate as a mid-tier boss.

    I held out hope for Sylvanas for so long. For years, I was this guy!



    But, since Cataclysm, Blizz has walked Sylvanas further and further down the road of hypocrisy. The curse that she spent so long lamenting she began ever-increasingly inflicting upon others. One could argue that during the events of Cataclysm, those raised into undeath had the choice to live on in undeath or return to the grave, but by BfA, even that facade of agency was abandoned and she was transformed into the figure she dedicated her unlife to defeating.

    It's irritating to have those who derided Sylvanas from the get-go be vindicated now. =/ At least she got the chance to shit on Vereesa and Alleria and their double-standards in that dreaful Three Sisters comic before we finally put the old girl in the ground for good.
    Sometimes a bad egg is a bad egg and not everyone needs or deserves a redemption plotline. Sylvanas's plotline is at least cogent, a single minded focus on the preservation of her people and getting revenge on Arthas culminating in his death. Her pact with the Jailer following her suicide is clearly where she crossed the moral event horizon after all. Edge of Night depicted it was her own inevitable fate that began to gnaw at her, and even though the Val'kyr bought her some extra time they would inevitably be expended. Concern for her people slowly morphed into concern for herself, and every action taken ostensibly to 'defend the Horde' and 'defend the Forsaken' was actually aimed at increasing the number of casualties going into the maw so as to feed her powers.

    Perhaps the years long alliance with the Jailer darkened her further from where she began, or maybe she really was immune to redemption all along, but I feel her arc is mined out. The worst thing to do with any character is to keep them on past their sell by date simply because some don't want to let them go. Like those players who wanted the Lich King to survive wrath, oh we'd face him at the top of ICC and we'd beat him but with a flourish of his cape, a twirl of his moustache and a cackle of laughter he would flee into the night ready to challenge us again. That would have been a terrible disservice to the character, just as preserving Sylvanas a whit longer than necessary would be a similar tragedy. Her story is almost over and we must hope it is a good one.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Broflake View Post
    Heritage quest says otherwise. They have preserved their culture and returned to their ways prior to the sunwell being destroyed. They certainly consider themselves high elves, their name is meant solely to represent the honoring of the dead. Not sure why this is even being stated given the nightborne quest and lorthemar stating "we value the ways of our people.".
    You know I have seen this mentioned a few times. That Blood Elves don't like being referred to as high elves, or take offence at being called high elves. I am aware of no examples of such an occurrence happening. I am happy to be corrected of course, warcraft lore is vast so perhaps there are examples that have occurred, but it seems what has happened is that the idea that high elves are annoyed at being called blood elves (which i think has one example) has been taken by some players who assume that the opposite, blood elves being called high elves, is equally true.

    Frankly, as you demonstrate in your post, this doesn't seem to be the case. I think the Blood Elves regard the name as a part of their heritage, it doesn't deny that they are high elves considering what a huge part being a high elf is to blood elf identity, but blood elf identity is that patina of sorrow and remembrance overlaid on what was and in almost every regard, still is.

  3. #17603
    As an aside, I don't think Sylvanas will end up being a raid boss or even killed in Shadowlands. I think she's too popular for that. What I think might happen is that she'll end up taking the Jailer's place in the Maw, becoming some sort of "master over death" entity. In this way she could never be trapped in whatever "hell" she foresaw when she leapt from Icecrown because she would become the one responsible for sticking souls in those "hells".

    In this way Blizzard gets to keep using her (since she's popular) and avoid raid bossing yet another Horde faction leader. They could also then say "See? She's not Garrosh 2.0!". Obviously that's all pure speculation on my part.
    Last edited by Kyriani; 2020-05-21 at 04:22 PM.

  4. #17604
    Quote Originally Posted by Kyriani View Post
    As an aside, I don't think Sylvanas will end up being a raid boss or even killed in Shadowlands. I think she's too popular for that. What I think might happen is that she'll end up taking the Jailer's place in the Maw, becoming some sort of "master over death" entity. In this way she could never be trapped in whatever "hell" she foresaw when she leapt from Icecrown because she would become the one responsible for sticking souls in those "hells".

    In this way Blizzard gets to keep using her (since she's popular) and avoid raid bossing yet another Horde faction leader. They could also then say "See? She's not Garrosh 2.0!". Obviously that's all pure speculation on my part.
    I can see that, and I am sure many would be upset about it. I figured it would be the case given her "we will all be free" statement

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    You know I have seen this mentioned a few times. That Blood Elves don't like being referred to as high elves, or take offence at being called high elves. I am aware of no examples of such an occurrence happening. I am happy to be corrected of course, warcraft lore is vast so perhaps there are examples that have occurred, but it seems what has happened is that the idea that high elves are annoyed at being called blood elves (which i think has one example) has been taken by some players who assume that the opposite, blood elves being called high elves, is equally true.

    Frankly, as you demonstrate in your post, this doesn't seem to be the case. I think the Blood Elves regard the name as a part of their heritage, it doesn't deny that they are high elves considering what a huge part being a high elf is to blood elf identity, but blood elf identity is that patina of sorrow and remembrance overlaid on what was and in almost every regard, still is.
    As far as I know, there hasn't been a time where the blood elves were offended being called a high elf. It wouldn't make any sense for them to be offended unless someone insisted on calling them that despite knowing the significance of the blood elf title.
    I know there is one case in TBC where a high elf goes "im not a blood elf i wont suck the mana out of you" in a contemptuous way, but I think its mostly a way of making it clear of the difference in philosophies at the time. Of course, such a statement is no longer relevant since blood elves dont mana tap living things anymore

  5. #17605
    Mechagnome Thalassian Bob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Quel'Thalas/Albion
    Posts
    625
    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    Sometimes a bad egg is a bad egg and not everyone needs or deserves a redemption plotline. Sylvanas's plotline is at least cogent, a single minded focus on the preservation of her people and getting revenge on Arthas culminating in his death. Her pact with the Jailer following her suicide is clearly where she crossed the moral event horizon after all. Edge of Night depicted it was her own inevitable fate that began to gnaw at her, and even though the Val'kyr bought her some extra time they would inevitably be expended. Concern for her people slowly morphed into concern for herself, and every action taken ostensibly to 'defend the Horde' and 'defend the Forsaken' was actually aimed at increasing the number of casualties going into the maw so as to feed her powers.

    Perhaps the years long alliance with the Jailer darkened her further from where she began, or maybe she really was immune to redemption all along, but I feel her arc is mined out. The worst thing to do with any character is to keep them on past their sell by date simply because some don't want to let them go. Like those players who wanted the Lich King to survive wrath, oh we'd face him at the top of ICC and we'd beat him but with a flourish of his cape, a twirl of his moustache and a cackle of laughter he would flee into the night ready to challenge us again. That would have been a terrible disservice to the character, just as preserving Sylvanas a whit longer than necessary would be a similar tragedy. Her story is almost over and we must hope it is a good one.
    All salient points. Sylvanas' arc is fairly cohesive and believable. I suppose I just lament her not going down the path I would have taken her down (I would have made Genn the villain of BfA, forcing Sylvanas into an accidental anti-hero role, validating Vol'jin's choice and avoiding a repeat of the Garrosh arc. But hey ho!).

    Quote Originally Posted by Kyriani View Post
    As an aside, I don't think Sylvanas will end up being a raid boss or even killed in Shadowlands. I think she's too popular for that. What I think might happen is that she'll end up taking the Jailer's place in the Maw, becoming some sort of "master over death" entity. In this way she could never be trapped in whatever "hell" she foresaw when she leapt from Icecrown because she would become the one responsible for sticking souls in those "hells".

    In this way Blizzard gets to keep using her (since she's popular) and avoid raid bossing yet another Horde faction leader. They could also then say "See? She's not Garrosh 2.0!". Obviously that's all pure speculation on my part.
    That sounds very plausible. Especially with all the merch they've been pumping out of her recently! Time will tell, I suppose.

  6. #17606
    Stood in the Fire Odintdk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    457
    Quote Originally Posted by Broflake View Post
    Of course, such a statement is no longer relevant since blood elves dont mana tap living things anymore
    While I agree with the rest of your post, I just want to comment on the bolded part. As far as I know they primarily mana tapped into magical/elemental "creatures", infact even ingame if you go to their starting areas, and target these mana Wyrms (or whatever they're called), you'd see the tag "Elemental" on them, as opposed to beast or whatever else they might be labeled as.

    Ofcourse I'm not entirely sure the elementals of Azeroth can or cannot be called living things in the traditional sense of it, I'd have to dig back and re-read the elementals part of chronicles.

  7. #17607
    Legendary! Obelisk Kai's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    The north of Ireland
    Posts
    6,075
    Quote Originally Posted by Broflake View Post
    As far as I know, there hasn't been a time where the blood elves were offended being called a high elf. It wouldn't make any sense for them to be offended unless someone insisted on calling them that despite knowing the significance of the blood elf title.
    I know there is one case in TBC where a high elf goes "im not a blood elf i wont suck the mana out of you" in a contemptuous way, but I think its mostly a way of making it clear of the difference in philosophies at the time. Of course, such a statement is no longer relevant since blood elves dont mana tap living things anymore
    Indeed. One elf in one location was objecting to being seen as a Blood Elf. (On a side note it is funny she had to make that statement, what with the high elf exiles being such a major and important part of the Alliance after all. After all, why would she rush to assure the Alliance player she wasn't a Blood Elf given that the Alliance is apparently chock full of high elves).

    And as the big differentiating factor does she cite eye colour? Does she cite allegiance? Nope, she cites the philosophical divergence over mana tapping which was resolved a few months afterwards.

    I wonder what she would say now in an updated Terrokkar forest. That is if she is still there and hasn't gone home or anything like that.

  8. #17608
    Quote Originally Posted by Odintdk View Post
    While I agree with the rest of your post, I just want to comment on the bolded part. As far as I know they primarily mana tapped into magical/elemental "creatures", infact even ingame if you go to their starting areas, and target these mana Wyrms (or whatever they're called), you'd see the tag "Elemental" on them, as opposed to beast or whatever else they might be labeled as.

    Ofcourse I'm not entirely sure the elementals of Azeroth can or cannot be called living things in the traditional sense of it, I'd have to dig back and re-read the elementals part of chronicles.
    They consider them living beings, since when you're doing the quest the quest giver laments them mana tapping these creatures because they have a respect for nature. So, even when they were mana tapping living things they did so out of necessity rather than desire.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    Indeed. One elf in one location was objecting to being seen as a Blood Elf. (On a side note it is funny she had to make that statement, what with the high elf exiles being such a major and important part of the Alliance after all. After all, why would she rush to assure the Alliance player she wasn't a Blood Elf given that the Alliance is apparently chock full of high elves).

    And as the big differentiating factor does she cite eye colour? Does she cite allegiance? Nope, she cites the philosophical divergence over mana tapping which was resolved a few months afterwards.

    I wonder what she would say now in an updated Terrokkar forest. That is if she is still there and hasn't gone home or anything like that.
    Probably something like "I desire reunification of our people" since Auric was in the same camp as her

  9. #17609
    Legendary! Obelisk Kai's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    The north of Ireland
    Posts
    6,075
    Quote Originally Posted by Broflake View Post
    Probably something like "I desire reunification of our people" since Auric was in the same camp as her
    I am sure she would be welcomed back to Silvermoon whenever she wanted so long as she pledged to serve Silvermoon and it's allies, but I figure she wouldn't want to turn her back on those she spent the past twenty years with.

  10. #17610
    Quote Originally Posted by Obelisk Kai View Post
    I am sure she would be welcomed back to Silvermoon whenever she wanted so long as she pledged to serve Silvermoon and it's allies, but I figure she wouldn't want to turn her back on those she spent the past twenty years with.
    I would not be surprised if she took a Valeera approach. Identified as a blood elf but stayed neutral

  11. #17611
    Legendary! Obelisk Kai's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    The north of Ireland
    Posts
    6,075
    Quote Originally Posted by Thalassian Bob View Post
    All salient points. Sylvanas' arc is fairly cohesive and believable. I suppose I just lament her not going down the path I would have taken her down (I would have made Genn the villain of BfA, forcing Sylvanas into an accidental anti-hero role, validating Vol'jin's choice and avoiding a repeat of the Garrosh arc. But hey ho!).
    Ironically part of the reason I thought Sylvanas would be a good leader of the Horde was that they wouldn't want to repeat the entire Garrosh arc with her so I gave her the benefit of the doubt during Legion. My main was even a Sylvanas loyalist (although my alt was a Saurfang devotee so I got the best of both worlds).

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Broflake View Post
    I would not be surprised if she took a Valeera approach. Identified as a blood elf but stayed neutral
    Possibly, but I think it's likelier she'll still be calling herself a high elf and associating with her buddies from the Draenor expedition.

    Still, would be interesting to ask her in a hundred years when they're all dead if she still feels the connection (assuming of course she isn't dead herself at that point).

  12. #17612
    Quote Originally Posted by ravenmoon View Post
    presumably because the priest is using magic, however there were lots of portrayals of them didnt have glowy eyes as well,
    Peasant had glowing eyes too. The only units with pupils were sorceress and high elf citizen female. However, sorceress was initially planned to be human so I think it might be an oversight.

    I guess it's because I think of them differently, more like humans possessing great magical ability and acumen, but not a magical creature inherently like a view the night elf...now that's just my view of it. As elves, devolved from night elves, they are elves, but they are not quite the same or quite as powerfully constituted as the original elf, they lost alot naturally in the exile, which is why they are very similar to humans, coming off as idealised versions of them .
    They haven't devolved. They evolved. Remember that Dath'remar had exact night elven form before creation of the Sunwell. Only at that moment he transformed.
    They generated their own magic, the love for it is in their elven DNA, but they are not filled internally with arcane power on a genetic level like the night elf, so they glow magically only when suffused with the Sunwell or in its absence another magical source like fel Crystal's or the light side of the new sunwell. I personally think of it that way, besides eyes you cant see irises in just look weird on normal human or very near human people - purple people dont strike me as normal people category.
    This is your personal aesthetic choice. I highly disagree but this is also personal.
    Draenei have no record of a massive hole in their planet with lifeblood capped, and that lifeblood actively remaking and rebuilding one of its sentient in heightened arcane magical beings, whose racial signature is magical affinity .
    Eredar lore is less developed than night elf one. Which of course makes it really interesting. You need to read between the verses.

    Argus had rivers that were magically glowing in the night and the buildings were decorated by argunite crystals. You can see on Argus that everything( homes, golems, security systems) was powered by titan's blood. There is no mention of a pool of argunite because eredar could have simply mined it, as its deposites aren't that far below the ground.

    As for their magical affinity, keep in mind that naaru have given them Ata'mal Crystal and shards of T'uure because of their potential. It doesn't require a lot of mental gymnastics to find out that they had potential because of titan's blood on their planet. Later on, Sargeras chooses eredar to be his champions because of their arcane power. They are the only mortal race that had this honour. According to Xal'atath, Sargeras didn't want to give such power to night elves, which shows that eredar were simply superior to them.
    The Naaru, light beings, used Ata'mal Crystal's to enlighten the Draenei, and they gifted and intelligent grew in many areas, not just magic, to a better level than the elves, I guess they are much older and were at it a lot longer than the elves have been. But nothing about being born of the arcane, that is the elves' origin story, not the Draenei, not the orcs, not the humans, not the trolls etc, just the elves.
    Actually orcs and humans are born of the arcane. This is the reason of their plot armor.
    I not all undead did.
    The mindless ones didn't.

    Night elves are connected to the well of eternity directly, they have this inner power from it as a racial trait whether they use arcane magic like the Moonguard night elves or highborne other abstained for 10k years like most of the Darnassians.
    It's why they didnt lose the glow when the well imploded and still have it despite the Well not being used to cast magical spells. Nit the same as high elves who without the Sunwell, it's all gone.
    Do you have any source for that? I think it is your headcanon.
    https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...lopment-thread
    Quote Originally Posted by Nevcairiel View Post
    If you are suggesting to take my Night Elfs Shadowmeld away, then please find some pike to run yourself through, tyvm.

  13. #17613
    Bloodsail Admiral elbleuet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Quel'Danil Lodge
    Posts
    1,013
    Quote Originally Posted by Broflake View Post
    Heritage quest says otherwise. They have preserved their culture and returned to their ways prior to the sunwell being destroyed. They certainly consider themselves high elves, their name is meant solely to represent the honoring of the dead. Not sure why this is even being stated given the nightborne quest and lorthemar stating "we value the ways of our people.".
    That does not contradict with what I stated above.

    And :

    They certainly consider themselves high elves,
    This is your headcanon, nothing more.

    Red herring that is entirely irrelevant given that blood elves also speak Thalassian. Seriously, what relevance does this have to anything?
    We say farewell to the High King in Thalassian. Thus, High elves are an Alliance core race.

    Again, entirely irrelevant.
    "I have no argument so I'll say this is irrelevant."

    Blood elves are high elves. They have the culture, language, and everything else associated with them prior to the name change of WC3. Arguing otherwise is disingenuous. If anything, you should be saying that the high elves represent a change. Which is ironic that those who changed their name preserve the high elf ways, and those calling themselves high elves are leaving behind well...what was high elf in the first place.
    Again, that does not contradict with what I said above.
    Blood elves are still fel corrupted elves.
    "If you want to play alongside High and Void elves, the Alliance is waiting for you"

  14. #17614
    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    That does not contradict with what I stated above.
    Sure it does, because they have not rejected what they are, they simply acknowledge a terrible genocide happened to them.

    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    This is your headcanon, nothing more.
    I mean...lorthemar stating they are preserving their ways, and their ways are of WC3 and earlier, which is the ways of the high elves,. then its safe to say they consider themselves high elves in everything except name.
    Do you have information that says otherwise?
    You cannot claim headcanon without lore directly contradicting my statement mate.

    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    We say farewell to the High King in Thalassian. Thus, High elves are an Alliance core race.
    I mean...Anduin says goodbye to Saurfang in ogrimmar, I guess humans are a Horde core race?
    Secondly., a core race is a race that is playable.
    High elves aren't a core race for the alliance, but they are for the Horde.


    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    "I have no argument so I'll say this is irrelevant."
    My calling it a red herring without relevance is a logical refutation. I am sorry you disagree, but someone saying bye in thalassian means literally nothing in relevance.


    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    Again, that does not contradict with what I said above.
    Except it does. Don't shake your head refusing, that's like refusing Kevin Bacon is in footloose.
    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    Blood elves are still fel corrupted elves.
    What?

    https://wow.gamepedia.com/Felblood_elf

    That's a fel corrupted elf.
    Blood elves aren't felblood.

    Let alone
    https://www.wowhead.com/quest=24564/...n-of-queldelar

    Your statement of them being fel corrupted is headcanon which is...not a surprise from you.

    Devs state they aren't corrupted.
    The game says they aren't corrupted.
    Blood elves AND high elves are both hooked up to the Sunwell, so to claim blood elves are corrupted would be to claim high elves are corrupted.
    In fact, they should have green eyes too since OUtland is BATHED in fel energy.

    Now I know you won't accept these facts, so I'll just ignore more of those dishonest claims.

  15. #17615
    Bloodsail Admiral elbleuet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Quel'Danil Lodge
    Posts
    1,013
    Quote Originally Posted by Broflake View Post
    Sure it does, because they have not rejected what they are, they simply acknowledge a terrible genocide happened to them.


    I mean...lorthemar stating they are preserving their ways, and their ways are of WC3 and earlier, which is the ways of the high elves,. then its safe to say they consider themselves high elves in everything except name.
    Do you have information that says otherwise?
    Still not contradicting with what I said above, but nice try. High elves, or Quel'Dorei, are blue-eyed, untouched Alliance elves. Blood elves are green/yellow eyed, Horde elves. Where's the difficulty for you here ?


    I mean...Anduin says goodbye to Saurfang in ogrimmar, I guess humans are a Horde core race?
    Irrelevant comparison. Where's my song in common/dwarven/darnassian to say farewell to a Horde leader ?

    Secondly., a core race is a race that is playable.
    No.

    Wildhammer have always been a core Alliance race since WII. They will be finally unlocked in 2020.

    High elves aren't a core race for the alliance, but they are for the Horde.
    Still called Blood elves, aka Sin'dorei, aka fel/light corrupted elves.

    My calling it a red herring without relevance is a logical refutation. I am sorry you disagree, but someone saying bye in thalassian means literally nothing in relevance.
    It does.


    That's a fel corrupted elf.
    Blood elves aren't felblood.
    Both are fel corrupted. One is just more fel corrupted than the other.


    Blood elves AND high elves are both hooked up to the Sunwell, so to claim blood elves are corrupted would be to claim high elves are corrupted.
    In fact, they should have green eyes too since OUtland is BATHED in fel energy.
    Then where are my blue-eyed blood elves ?
    "If you want to play alongside High and Void elves, the Alliance is waiting for you"

  16. #17616
    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    Still not contradicting with what I said above, but nice try. High elves, or Quel'Dorei, are blue-eyed, untouched Alliance elves. Blood elves are green/yellow eyed, Horde elves. Where's the difficulty for you here ?
    Well, let us correct a few misconceptions.
    1. The high elves were present in Outland. Outland is covered in fel energy. Per the devs, fel energy turns high elves/blood elves eyes green. So, the reason high elves in Outland don't have green eyes, is purely for aesthetic purposes. After all, if just being around fel energy = green eyes for those in silvermoon, then being in Outland which is saturated in it, should give all elves green eyes. It doesnt though, so its clearly an aesthetic.
    2. Blood elves have numerous blue eyed NPC's. To deny this is the same as denying gravity exists or that the earth is round.
    3. High elves are not unified in allegiance as in Vanilla, you have high elves who work with the Horde. Being a high elf =/= alliance aligned as indicated in WotLK with Dalaran high elves.

    So...you're wrong in what high elves are, how they look, and why they look the way they do.
    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post

    Irrelevant comparison. Where's my song in common/dwarven/darnassian to say farewell to a Horde leader ?
    It is the exact same thing dude. "Someone of another race spoke in this language saying farewell to someone on the other side! THIS MAKES THEM A CORE RACE!".
    It is completely flimsy, and the fact that you're trying to use what language it was spoken in, is only indicative of how flimsy the argument is.


    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post

    No.
    Yes

    https://us.battle.net/support/en/article/184544
    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    Wildhammer have always been a core Alliance race since WII. They will be finally unlocked in 2020.
    Wildhammer dwarves, are literally just dwarves. They are not a distinct sub-group of dwarf the way night elves are a distinct sub-group from high elves.
    They've always been playable, the means of showing it just have not been available until now due to the coding WoW uses.

    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    Still called Blood elves, aka Sin'dorei, aka fel/light corrupted elves.
    I mean...
    devs say you're wrong.
    Game says you're wrong.
    If you're saying light corrupted, jokes on you, high elves are connected to the sunwell. So...that means high elves and blood elves are the same, and that the race is playable on the Horde, and you shot your entire argument in the foot.


    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    It does.
    You're in denial at this point elb.



    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    Both are fel corrupted. One is just more fel corrupted than the other.
    Devs say you're wrong. Take it up with them.



    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    Then where are my blue-eyed blood elves ?
    Under the DK option.
    Which means the high elf aesthetic is also taken by the blood elf one.
    Which means there is no place for high elves.


    All right, I'll definitely not reply to what is a bad faith argument. After all, you've chosen to literally ignore the actual information from the game, lore, and the devs.
    Last edited by Broflake; 2020-05-21 at 07:44 PM.

  17. #17617
    Quote Originally Posted by Broflake View Post
    I don't see the relevance in this question.
    If the devs state "you're not from Kul Tiras just because you pick a Kul Tiran", then that is it on the matter until they say otherwise. Games are limited according to coding.
    I didn't address the rest of your post, its just bad faith on your part.
    You don't see the "relevance" of my question so you are dodging it. I would say it's a pattern.
    Last edited by ddi2; 2020-05-21 at 07:57 PM.

  18. #17618
    Quote Originally Posted by ddi2 View Post
    I don't actually remember that Blizzard even told anywhere that Blood Elves and High Elves are the same thing.
    Blizzard nope, and ingame they have shown it.

    But game director sadly said otherwise....so depends if he is true to his worth.

  19. #17619
    Bloodsail Admiral elbleuet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Quel'Danil Lodge
    Posts
    1,013
    Quote Originally Posted by Broflake View Post
    1. The high elves were present in Outland. Outland is covered in fel energy. Per the devs, fel energy turns high elves/blood elves eyes green. So, the reason high elves in Outland don't have green eyes, is purely for aesthetic purposes. After all, if just being around fel energy = green eyes for those in silvermoon, then being in Outland which is saturated in it, should give all elves green eyes. It doesnt though, so its clearly an aesthetic.

    Then why Outland Night elves don't have green eyes ? Your fooling yourself with your own headcanons.
    High elves kept their pure eyes because they chose nobility over survival (everything was good except sucking other living creatures).

    Blood elves have numerous blue eyed NPC's. To deny this is the same as denying gravity exists or that the earth is round.
    Bugs for the vast majority (confirmed by the devs). The Alliance also have Alliance blood elves in Telogrus Rift. And Anduin's best spy is a blood elf too.
    3. High elves are not unified in allegiance as in Vanilla, you have high elves who work with the Horde. Being a high elf =/= alliance aligned as indicated in WotLK with Dalaran high elves.
    Same for the blood elves. Actually, it's even worse with the blood elves. A lot of them are neutral, others are evil. Some are Alliance. Valeera even chose to betray her people to help the Alliance High king.

    It is the exact same thing dude. "Someone of another race spoke in this language saying farewell to someone on the other side! THIS MAKES THEM A CORE RACE!".
    It is completely flimsy, and the fact that you're trying to use what language it was spoken in, is only indicative of how flimsy the argument is.
    The thing is, Blizzard wrote this song in Thalassian whereas they had plenty other Alliance languages to do so. Still not getting it ?


    Wildhammer dwarves, are literally just dwarves. They are not a distinct sub-group of dwarf the way night elves are a distinct sub-group from high elves.
    They've always been playable, the means of showing it just have not been available until now due to the coding WoW uses.
    No. Wildhammer dwarves are still not playable.


    If you're saying light corrupted, jokes on you, high elves are connected to the sunwell. So...that means high elves and blood elves are the same, and that the race is playable on the Horde, and you shot your entire argument in the foot.
    Yes, blood elves and high elves are the same. I did not deny it.

    Blood elves are just fel corrupted Horde elves whereas the High elves are untouched Alliance elves. That's the difference.


    Under the DK option.
    Which means the high elf aesthetic is also taken by the blood elf one.
    Which means there is no place for high elves.
    You seem to be lacking of arguments at this point. You're not getting blue-eyed blood elves anytime soon and that's a good thing.
    So I'm asking you : where are my blue-eyed blood elves ?
    "If you want to play alongside High and Void elves, the Alliance is waiting for you"

  20. #17620
    Quote Originally Posted by Kyriani View Post
    As an aside, I don't think Sylvanas will end up being a raid boss or even killed in Shadowlands. I think she's too popular for that. What I think might happen is that she'll end up taking the Jailer's place in the Maw, becoming some sort of "master over death" entity. In this way she could never be trapped in whatever "hell" she foresaw when she leapt from Icecrown because she would become the one responsible for sticking souls in those "hells".

    In this way Blizzard gets to keep using her (since she's popular) and avoid raid bossing yet another Horde faction leader. They could also then say "See? She's not Garrosh 2.0!". Obviously that's all pure speculation on my part.
    As a Sylvanas fan still to this day, I just want them retcon all the retcons they stupidly chose to do.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •