Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Theodarzna]

I believe that many of them understand how popular High Elves are over Blood Elves and don't want to see that become a reality. Nothing is lost by additions. Especially not a deeply entrenched Alliance race like High Elves.

As said in other threads by another brilliant poster:
I already did the math, and even if 25% of all eligible Blood Elf characters at max level were faction changed to High Elves, the end result would actually be a reduction of faction imbalance, not an increase. To be fair, it'd shift the numbers in favor of the Alliance, but instead of a 3.8% gap in favor of the Horde, it'd be a 3.3% gap in favor of the Alliance, for a 0.5% reduction in faction imbalance.

And that's only assuming that the absurd number of 25% were to actually happen when in reality the number of eligible Blood Elves which would be faction changed to High Elves is likely far smaller than that. At the end of the day, approximately 30% of eligible Blood Elves would have to faction change in order to have a detrimental effect on population numbers (Well, at least in terms of hard numbers. As Ion himself has already said, that's no longer a concern as far as Blizzard is concerned, so it's pointless to talk about that).

The funny thing about that argument, though? Is that they're effectively convincing Blizzard that they should do it. After all, every single faction change is $30 for Blizzard. If 25% of eligible Blood Elves were to actually faction change to High Elves? That'd result in a $7,401,780 profit for Blizzard. And all to reduce the degree of imbalance between the numbers of the factions? Sounds like a Win-Win for Blizzard, to me.

So its a win-win for Blizzard and reduces faction imbalance.

[Blazindragon1737]

I think you forgot to list the Classes that they can be. Also I suggest you make an Imgur for all this concept art so you don't lose any of it and so you can have what you feel is most important or whats newest on the front page

[Theodarzna]

I think you forgot to list the Classes that they can be. Also I suggest you make an Imgur for all this concept art so you don't lose any of it and so you can have what you feel is most important or whats newest on the front page

Classes are likely to be constricted, I would be suprised if its a flat Warrior, Hunter, Rogue, Monk, Mage and Priest.... though I'd love either Paladin, Druid or Shaman.

[FlubberPuddy]

Classes are likely to be constricted, I would be suprised if its a flat Warrior, Hunter, Rogue, Monk, Mage and Priest.... though I'd love either Paladin, Druid or Shaman.

Monk needs to leave and be replaced with Paladin

[sammygm]

Again, Paladins are a must. High Elves are part of an Alliance which created the first Azerothian Paladins and already had members join The Order of the Silver Hand before the third war. Priest, mage, rogue, and hunter are obvious choices. Shamans are possible through Wildhammer Dwarves. Druids and Warlocks wouldn't really fit in I believe. Druidism isn't something they're known for, and for Warlocks, I doubt they want to go the same route as Kael'thas. As for Death Knights I'm not too sure about.

[FlubberPuddy]

Warrior is given too. Warrior and Hunter are given for every race, Blizzard has made them "baseline" when they added Gnome Hunters explaining it so. If you look at every race and class options since then, all have Warriors and Hunters, even all of the allied races.

So I wouldn't really call Warrior/Hunter as options. Definitely feel mage/priest/paladin/rogue at bare minimum. If High elves could have those 6 classes and no more, I would be completely content with that.

More could be opened up later, but I think those 6 should be at release

[Traycor]

I think you forgot to list the Classes that they can be.

We've been debating classes. So far we haven't reached a consensus that I was satisfied with. Probably I should just list class possibilities with the appropriate background.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Again, Paladins are a must. High Elves are part of an Alliance which created the first Azerothian Paladins and already had members join The Order of the Silver Hand before the third war. Priest, mage, rogue, and hunter are obvious choices. Shamans are possible through Wildhammer Dwarves. Druids and Warlocks wouldn't really fit in I believe. Druidism isn't something they're known for, and for Warlocks, I doubt they want to go the same route as Kael'thas. As for Death Knights I'm not too sure about.

The only known high elf who apprenticed under Uther became a blood knight and is now obviously a blood elf. Being a paladin was never a part of high elves.

[Blazindragon1737]

We've been debating classes. So far we haven't reached a consensus that I was satisfied with. Probably I should just list class possibilities with the appropriate background.

Ahh I see. Well here's what classes i think each group can offer

Death-Hunter High Elves: Hunter, Rogue, Warrior
Highvale High Elves: Druid, Hunter, Rogue, Warrior
Illidari: Demon Hunter (Ineligible for Heritage Armor)
Outland Expedition High Elves: Hunter, Mage, Priest, Rogue, Warrior
Silver Covenant: Deathknight (Ineligible for Heritage Armor), Hunter, Mage, Warrior
Slivermoon Remnant: Hunter, Mage, Monk, Paladin, Priest, Rogue, Warrior

The two classes I really don't think they should be able to be is Shaman and Warlock. The Demonhunter and Deathknight are kind of pushing it too but they make sense and would fit well

[sammygm]

The only known high elf who apprenticed under Uther became a blood knight and is now obviously a blood elf. Being a paladin was never a part of high elves.

Doesn't matter if he's now a Blood Knight, what matters is that he was a Paladin as a High Elf under the Silver Hand. www.wowhead.com/npc=35575/champion-isimode and http://www.wowhead.com/npc=50160/rulen-lightsreap are also Paladins. Considering these High Elves would now have spent a lot of time amongst Humans, it'd only makes sense for High Elves to be Paladins.

[Traycor]

High Elf Class Options


Iconic Classes:

Mage
High Elves first trained the humans in magic, and the alliance between Dalaran and the High Elves remains strong to this day. This is perhaps the most iconic High Elf class available. It should be noted that Highvale elves no longer practice arcane magic.

Priest
High Elves and humans share the same religion. The close connection of High Elves to the Light has made their healing skills invaluable to the Alliance for many years and across many great wars.

Hunter (Ranger)
Archers and scouts. Many of these Rangers were sent to support the Alliance in the Second War. High Elves often look to Ranger-Generals for guidance and leadership.

Rogue (Ranger)
The stalker that fights with twin blades and leaps from the leafy shadows. These Rangers have been the advance scouts of the High Elves for many years. Their protection has prevented many losses and allowed the High Elves to stay one step ahead of threats to their people.


Appropriate Classes:

Paladin
High Elves were part of the alliance that created the first Azerothian Paladins. Their members joined the Order of the Silver hand before the Third War.

Warrior
High Elven swordsmen have protected their people with distinction for generations. Their traditions have been passed down to the High Elf exiles, bringing thousands of years of technique.

Monk
The calm and tranquility of the Pandarens was vital in helping the High Elf exiles deal with their lingering addiction. Today, High Elf monks are expected at every settlement to lead their people in meditation.


Proposed New Class:

Shaman
High Elves have never been shamans and we have no examples of this in lore. However, if a lore reason was given, such as training with Wildhammer shamans, it could be a possibility as something new. This would create an extra layer of distinction between High Elves and Blood Elves.


Unlikely Classes:

Druid
This theme is strongly 'Night Elf'. While it could certainly be appropriate for High Elves, and many High Elves have displayed limited nature magic in lore, it likely creates too much design/theme overlap with Night Elves.

Death Knight
The story of the Death Knights does not seem to work with High Elves and their particular themes. However, High Elves were killed by the Lich King in mass and would certainly qualify to be Death Knights. The real question would be if these Death Knights would join the Alliance or the Horde.

Prohibited Classes:

Demon Hunter
Much like the Blood Elves, Demon Hunters took on fel energies to gain their powers. This is the antithesis of who the High Elves are and what they stand for. The Demon Hunter class should be reserved for Blood Elves.

Warlock
We do have an example of a High Elf warlock that is a trainer in the Silver Covenant. However, it makes no sense that a spellcaster that practices fel magic is not a Blood Elf already. It also contradicts every theme of the High Elves. This one NPC trainer would be an exception that players could not duplicate.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Doesn't matter if he's now a Blood Knight, what matters is that he was a Paladin as a High Elf under the Silver Hand. www.wowhead.com/npc=35575/champion-isimode and http://www.wowhead.com/npc=50160/rulen-lightsreap are also Paladins. Considering these High Elves would now have spent a lot of time amongst Humans, it'd only makes sense for High Elves to be Paladins.

If you're going for a "it makes sense storywise" then this entire debate wouldn't be here anyways. If the OP is trying to make High elves different from blood elves, they won't have the class that pretty much defines the Sin'dorei.

[Traycor]

If you're going for a "it makes sense storywise" then this entire debate wouldn't be here anyways.

High Elves make complete sense from a story perspective because they are already part of the Alliance.

If the OP is trying to make High elves different from blood elves, they won't have the class that pretty much defines the Sin'dorei.

As for paladins... I'm on the fence. On the one hand, we have examples and it makes complete sense for High Elves to be paladins. They've been living among humans that are paladins, so it then makes even more sense.

However, the Blood Knights are a very iconic part of Blood Elf society and story. It really defines them imo far more than a group like the Farstriders. If Paladins were dropped, I think it should be traded for something like Shaman, which would create an even greater difference.

My last question would be, do we even need to make a difference on this issue vs Blood Elves? Even if we have High Elf paladins (an Alliance iconic class), the Blood Elves will still have 3 class options at least that High Elves do not, and maybe more. Death Knight, Demon Hunter, and Warlock are all Blood Elf classes. That's already a big difference as is.

So like I said, I'm on the fence with Paladins. It's a tough one.

[FlubberPuddy]

If you're going for a "it makes sense storywise" then this entire debate wouldn't be here anyways. If the OP is trying to make High elves different from blood elves, they won't have the class that pretty much defines the Sin'dorei.

Dark Irons dwarves get Paladins even though it's not defining for them (shaman/mages are). A class like Paladin doesn't need to be defined by the race to have it. There's more than enough High Elf Paladins to allow it. High Elves used to have a Royal Guard who were known as "Proud Defenders" and ended up joining the Blood Knights as they saw it as "Justice" to use M'uru when all Blood Elves thought the Light had forsaken them.

Proud, Defenders, Justice. Sounds like Paladin themes to me Plus Blood Knights are a Paladin-only order and it is said MOST of the Royal Guard joined them. It's also outlined that other classes joined the Blood Knights too, Priests and Warriors. All 3 (Priest, Warriors, and Royal Guard) are denoted separately.

I take that to mean the High Elven Royal Guard were in-fact Paladins.

Plus it's also said that a few were members of the Silver Hand, not just 1.

https://wow.gamepedia.com/Paladin_races

Blood Elves were once high elves allied with the humans like the dwarves. Like the two others, high elves also believed in the Holy Light. A few were members of the Silver Hand, such as Mehlar Dawnblade, while others belonged to the high elven Royal Guard.

Most members of the Blood Knights were once part of the Royal Guard--proud defenders of high elven society who came to believe that the Light had failed them in their hour of greatest need. They see their appropriation of the captive naaru's powers as well-deserved justice.

The Blood Knight order attracted elves of many walks of life. Among them were former priests and priestesses who had turned away from the Light following the Third War, like Liadrin had. Others were former members of the Royal Guard, proud defenders of Quel'Thalas. Warriors and war heroes also joined the order, embracing their new-found powers.

[Blazindragon1737]

High Elf Class Options

Possible Classes:

Shaman
High Elves have never been shamans and we have no examples of this in lore. However, if a lore reason was given, such as training with Wildhammer shamans, it could be a possibility as something new. This would create an extra layer of distinction between High Elves and Blood Elves.

Unlikely Classes:

Druid
This theme is strongly 'Night Elf'. While it could certainly be appropriate for High Elves, and many High Elves have displayed limited nature magic in lore, it likely creates too much design/theme overlap with Night Elves.

The Highvale High Elves are known to have Druids among their ranks and on a side note WoWwiki says High Elves can be Druids. I have never heard of an Elven Shaman ever though so I think that should be under Unlikely

Also I forgot about the Fel eyes thing with Demonhunters haha my bad. I'm kinda glad that there are no more High Elf Warlocks to be honest as it makes it so Blood Elves will have something they don't but the same could be said if High Elves get Druids

[Traycor]

The Highvale High Elves are known to have Druids among their ranks and on a side note WoWwiki says High Elves can be Druids. I have never heard of an Elven Shaman ever though so I think that should be under Unlikely

I believe the Druid thing was a reference to the WCII manual and was never used in any lore. In my opinion it was retconned away as early as WCIII when proper druid lore was introduced. Do you have any examples of Highvale druids?

There are no High Elf Shamans. It's a change that we've been debating in this thread. Probably the name, "Possible Classes" should be changed. Maybe "Proposed New Class" or something like that.

[Combatbutler]

The Highvale High Elves are known to have Druids among their ranks and on a side note WoWwiki says High Elves can be Druids. I have never heard of an Elven Shaman ever though so I think that should be under Unlikely

There are no druids among the High elves in the hinterlands and the high elves never had druids to begin with, it was the magister that created the runestones, as usual wowwiki uses very outdated lore.

Also I forgot about the Fel eyes thing with Demonhunters haha my bad. I'm kinda glad that there are no more High Elf Warlocks to be honest as it makes it so Blood Elves will have something they don't but the same could be said if High Elves get Druids

Well unlike druids there is actually a high elf warlock.

[Deleted]

Just as a reminder as this is a concept thread:

When Blizz is designing a race they won't think about: "How can we possibly make that race inferior so people will not play it"(Even though some seem to hope and advocate for it) , but "How can we make that race really awsome".

In terms of classes, a Druid class is allways more work than other classes because of their forms, and since we allready got a lot of new druid races, I'd say yet another one is rather unlikely.
Shamans and Paladins however seem to be perfectly viable and I can see Blizz trying to open up more Shaman classes for the Alliance, especially when Zandalai might become Paladins aswell.

In terms of Lore and justification: Blizz can and will pretty much justify everything if they want a certain class for a certain race. Kul Tiran Druids are one example of many. Dark Iron Shaman/Paladins another and so on.
Classes are no longer tied to their riginal races or lore and seem to be more wide spreat. Druids are no longer only the teachings of Cenarius and Shamans could be different from the orcish ancestral/ elemental cult aswell.

For High Elves using Ward Stones as magical catalysts rather than totems make perfect sense. And fire and frost magic is something that is not exclusive to shamans either. High Elves even could know some nature magic. So it suits perfectly.

Personally I'd even go that far that I would make Shamans their defining class next to Hunters. For a bit more fresh air in the concept.

[Traycor]

Personally I'd even go that far that I would make Shamans their defining class next to Hunters. For a bit more fresh air in the concept.

Thematically it would fit better than Draenei shamans. They still seem awkward every time I see one.

- - - Updated - - -

Plus it's also said that a few were members of the Silver Hand, not just 1.

https://wow.gamepedia.com/Paladin_races

We don't have lots of them though. I'm wondering if I should move Paladin from "Iconic Classes" to "Appropriate Classes".

[DeicideUH]

We don't have lots of them though. I'm wondering if I should move Paladin from "Iconic Classes" to "Appropriate Classes".

I feel you should.
I think paladin should be a class available for them. There are a few high elf paladins in-game, after all.
But it's not something you instantly relate to them like hunters or mages.