Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[DeicideUH]

You mean... WILDHAMMAAAAAAAHHHH!!!

[Ardenaso]

You mean... WILDHAMMAAAAAAAHHHH!!!

IT'S HAMMA TAAAAAAAEEEEEEMMMMM!!!! *screeeeeeeeeee*

the dream is now true

[Sarallesta]

Does anyone know if there will be new hairstyles to the new skin colours or are we gonna have to use hair with tentacles for them?

I don't know, would love to see more hair styles and colours for the Void Elves, as well as non-tenticle hair styles as well. Otherwise if the answer is no, then it is time Blizzard gave the Alliance as a seperate playable race

[Frenchvince]

A little Nordic this look but I think it is perfect for a wildhammer. <3

[Mace]

If the elves feel part of both factions, then they are no longer key to the identity of either faction, which they shouldn't be but have become. They were originally envision/designed to be their own faction (night elf) but now both groups have the depth and scope for it - the alliance is really a human thing and the orcs a horde thing, dwarves compliment humans well, and trolls compliment orcs well

Elves fit better on the alliance ofc, but they are still distinctive enough especially night elves to be their own, if like pandaren, they are common to both, they cease to dominate the identity of the factions, which they currently do due to the large volume of fans ( I wouldn't be surprised if you add Elf numbers, they'd roughly be the same of all other alliance races also roughly the same as all other horde races)


If most Thalassian elf characters were running around in Silvermoon and most Night ones running around in Suramar can you imagine how more horde like orgrimmar would fel and more human alliance and its activities will feel.

Personally I feel that blizzard should not stop there, but as they develop stories for the two factions they should as well for the elves - keep them separate to what you put up for horde and alliance, , their combined playebase is roughly equal to all the other alliance race as well as all the other horde races.

And the elves should share across faction rather than be separated via faction - if you separate via faction, then players will still predominantly associate them with faction, but if you share them by type i.e. Thalassian elves in one location/theme, and night ones in another location at themes, then they would feel a bit more different.


Shadowlands Customisation Changes are a Good Step Forward - and may heal the faction identities

It's good void elves are sharing blood elf skins, it would be good if highborne customisations for night elves have the thin NElf frame used in Highborne. It would be good if Suramar is a shared by Night elf and Nightborne alike and good if Silvermoon/Quel'thalas was shared by all Thalassians.

such moves having them identifiable at least in model terms and sharing a home - I think would restore the horde and alliance identities that have been suffocating under the elven wave of popularity. If common to both sides, they cease to dominate them as much.


Sharing Elven Cities Will Also Help
It will lessen the elven identity on the horde is a valid and necessary one and it does so without any losses to the horde (although I think it's about time the horde got some genuine losses - rather than managing to always save the stuff they jeopardise last minute. Sharing wise, blood elves and Nightborne would still have access to those cities too and I think elves and the identity of the factions will be better for this.


Proposal: Switch from 2 faction hub to 4 one. Horde , alliance, night elf, Thalassian elf.

Fix Silvermoon, make it central Thalassian hub, use Suramar for the night elf hub

Story Development
Note you are not changing the factions they are affliated with, you're just making them now start functioning more with regards to their own affairs. The idea is blizzard gives no longer just writes horde /alliance and legendary character stories, but also writes one for the Elves too - they're like a pseudo faction - and there are many reasons why this is not only a good thing, but would further separate their muddying of the alliance and horde identities all without changing anything about their faction.


The sate of the elves is can be full of intrigue and actually there is enough with existing lore to easily drive new things forward. between them, having one of each type on either faction but then having the types also with themselves is like a double mix - in Quel'thalas you would have dynamics between opposing high and blood elves with void elves, in Suramar there would be issues as well between kaldorei, Quel'dorei, Shal'dorei - whether there is peaceful corporation or forced one. That could also be explored to. I've long held the view that the night ones have a strong case for peaceful corporation, as their differences are more along the lines of philosophies, arcane followers vs nature followers, divine followers vs pragmatists. They do share the common bond of the kaldorei pre-sundering era and all their factions whether city based (highborne/Nightborne) or rural based (druids/priests) have all endured far from ideal and often tough existence in the last 10k years their people would rather restore than destroy, given how many elven lives are lost. This leads to a corporation between the two that is not linked to faction separation, Nightborne are still quite friendly with Blood elves, Night elves with worgen/humans possibly void elves and high elves via their Highborne - but in Suramar they work together and they have responsibility on keeping their visitor guests in check and away from hostilities.

The Thalassians on the other hand are more politically divided as well as principled, on politics its affiliation based, which makes living together interesting but also only possible if not doing so would result in a war that could destroy the Sunwell - for example if the alliance tried to take Silvermoon, and nearly succeeded but the the Sunwell was going to go boom, and the elves decided it was too great a risk they'd rather endure living together than have a global war devastate Quel'thalas (afterall both sides wanted unity not destruction), then this could force them to declare armistice and sanctuary in Quel'thalas, with void and high elves as alliance representatives, and blood elves, fel elf(Illidari) and San'layn/Darkfallen as horde ones, with the elves themselves determining who from other races in their factions can visit. There is a strict code of no elf on elf killing or fighting. strictly prohibited on pain of exile, and no faction fighting too, foreigners engaging in conflict will face a death penalty. This state of affairs is interesting, you have now a war of ideals and politics, as high and blood elves try to win each other in persuasive arguments and discussions, with an intriguing underbelly of subterfuge, spying, espionage, assassinations that also happen for while some actively try to heal the divide, others seek to use this opportunity to eliminate the other side.

Then there is the void elves and the dangerous magic versus safe magic - on the dangerous magic side are void elves and fel elves on the safe magic side are high elves and blood elves - The first pair exist in fringes and outskirts, void elves are in void dimensions mostly while fel elves are chasing demons - yet there are always tensions when either walk in the city, especially near the sunwell - both void and fel are highly corruptible - and yet both void and fel are the most powerful weapons the world would have lost the wars against the Legion and void old gods without.

Bottom line is there is enough material. And maybe such an approach would serve the game well. You do really kinda feel, the horde and alliance have lost their way a bit, while the alliance is still overwhelmingly human storywise, their elf population is just as large, the downslide is other fan favourites like elves are undervalued and it's a lot to ignore for such a large alliance player share and drawing focus to the elves as an alliance defining group which it isn't, that status is undesirable to everyone.. On the horde side, the blood elves are so overwhelmingly numerous, it's like the horde is more blood elven than it is orcish, if they continue to only show up in horde affairs and made to feel horde, then the horde becomes more blood elf because most players are blood elves. So what you want to do is minimise horde affairs and activities when you show them up. However you can't just leave it at that, you need to give engaging stories and paths of their own, plus separate them location wise if most of their activity leads to and stems from Silvermoon and most of their players can get their easily to (give them a racial heath - they're a magic race) then although in the same faction, you generate a sense of this is elves not horde.

And so they won't consume the identity of the

[Sangris]

So basically now that you have High Elves, that is still not enough and now you want Silvermoon and Suramar, too. What's it gonna be after that?

[Mace]

How does it restore faction identity to have them on both sides? And they've been on both sides since the end of Legion. Does that mean it's been restored for 2-3 years now?

It's in the first statement, being common to both makes them feel less a part of either - especially if you take the steps I suggested , like develop an Elven storyline too dparate from the horde and alliance ones, and make their capitals centres for their players

[valky94]

So basically now that you have High Elves, that is still not enough and now you want Silvermoon and Suramar, too. What's it gonna be after that?

i swear these HElf stans, blizzard gives them the finger and they want the whole body

[Maljinwo]

Oh is it already time for Mace's regularly scheduled Elfposting?

[Sangris]

i swear these HElf stans, blizzard gives them the finger and they want the whole body

I bet they'll only stop once Blood Elves (and to a lesser degree, Nightborne) have been completely removed from the Horde and made playable on the Alliance. And even then they'd probably find something to bitch about.

[elbleuet]

If you were playing belf SP, sure.

That's some next level mental gymnastics you're trying to do there. Void elves are still void elves. You still can't be Paladins, you have velfs racials, no blond hair.

The actual HIGH ELVES are horde now.

I'm sure you helfers are over the moon despite all the lore crap that was spouted in this thread. But that doesnt' change the fact that what you wanted is now on the Red Side, even more enforced now that belves got blue eyes.

Yeah buddy. Enjoy your "High elves" while we enjoy ours

And most of us don't want blond haired blood elves. Blue/white/light pink is much cooler. High elves really need to distinguish themselves from their Horde counterparts.

[valky94]

I bet they'll only stop once Blood Elves (and to a lesser degree, Nightborne) have been completely removed from the Horde and made playable on the Alliance. And even then they'd probably find something to bitch about.

at that point blizzard will probably give forsaken undead elf skins, and then they will want that for alliance too

[matrix123mko]

So basically now that you have High Elves, that is still not enough and now you want Silvermoon and Suramar, too. What's it gonna be after that?

I am afraid they will be going to conquer Pandaria next.

[Saltysquidoon]

Proposal: Switch from 2 faction hub to 4 one. Horde , alliance, night elf, Thalassian elf.

Fix Silvermoon, make it central Thalassian hub, use Suramar for the night elf hub

Here we go, another "Highborne are a massive part of nelf culture guys plz believe me" post, disguised as a blood elf post, disguised as a faction identity post.

We're going deep cover lads.

[Aldo Hawk]

No Bronzebeard racial makes sense for Wildhammer dwarves, nor do their voiceovers.

Stoneform: Learned by tapping into earthen heritage thanks to a ritual discovered with archeology knowledge. Wildhammers may be able to learn it aswell but that's a moot point since they don't really care about archeology in their culture, it would be like saying that an high elf can learn voidform by learning how to tap into void energies.

Explorer - Archeology bonus : see previous point

Frost Resistance: Wildhammers live on hills and not on frosty peaks, they should have nature resistance instead with all the storm hammers they like to throw around and their shamanistic attitude.

Might of the Mountain: They are hill dwarves.

Blizzard just went the easy route with them and that's it.
Wildhammers should have racials all about their storm hammers, something about pets because of their gryphon mastery (think Orc Command or Mag'har bonuses) and nature resistance.

Orcs and Trolls are more lucky in this regard, their racials are very generic (Berserking, Blood fury and so on) and can fit any tribe/clans.

"High Elves" just being a skin choice are exactly like what is happening with Wildhammer dwarves, an easy and lazy way out but sufficent enough to allow people to roleplay their characters like they want.

It's exactly what I think, and I hope Blizzard reconsider the addition of more Allied races based on this.

You can much easier "roleplay a Wildhammer Dwarf with the Bronzebeard Dwarves, than you can roleplay a High Elf as a Void Elf, simply because the whole Void concept is antithetical to High Elves, and you can't ignore it, especially with racials like Spatial Rift.

The Dwarf racials aren't great, but don't interfere in your "roleplaying".

Ideally Wildhammer Dwarves should be its own Allied Race as well, but at least the compromise there is acceptable.

For High Elves it isn't.

Yeah, both potential Allied races have their problems by just being these aesthetic options, I really think they just thought they could work on it at the same time they did customizations, new customizations are the big characteristic of Shadowlands, like Allied races were for BfA, so it's kinda normal that they try to do that, but obviously it just ends up as half-assed, but surely enough if you at least seek for the bare minimum.

Wildhammer Dwarves have different physical conditions, they are taller than Bronzebeards, maybe not exactly at the middle of humans and Bronzebeards, but taller anyways.

Allied races are just ideal, and criticism about it being too simple is just missing the point, since Allied races were the response to the request from players to have more playable options, and they are not adressing it by the customization side of it, which was another part of the request about these.

Shortly: Allied races are the ideal ground between customizations to add roleplaying possibilities and new races for that purpose, and they are taking steps back by not continuing adding these.

Also I don't see a 1000-page-long thread about Wildhammer Dwarves on the forum, so who cares.

And I think Wildhammers are just being treated too badly because of this, as if they were just tattooed Dwarves, when it isn't the case. But yeah, it just looked too simple, and the discussion about High elves show that players have some sense of Blizzard being too austere about new additions, and endorsing such mentality is just nuts.

I still think these two should be added as Allied races, regardless of these new customizations they just added.

[elbleuet]

I bet they'll only stop once Blood Elves (and to a lesser degree, Nightborne) have been completely removed from the Horde and made playable on the Alliance. And even then they'd probably find something to bitch about.

Nah. We just want to get the Sunwell corrupted, and Silvermoon to be renamed Voidmoon and the blood elves exiled to Suramar. Is that too much to ask ?

[Edoll]

Blizzard should just remove racials.

[Unholyground]

They could allow the elven races to become the first races that are truly neutral to each other in those cities, it solves a ton of issues. Just make them sanctuary and then give each faction 1 new main city. I vote for a rebuilt Undercity to fit the modern look of the Forsaken and allow the denizens of lordaeron who wish to see their undead loved ones visit whenever they like, as well as a rebuilt Gilneas where they will repay the hospitality and debt to the night elves by rebuilding it for both of their communities together.

[ddi2]

But the way he said it does not make it sound like that. The way he and blizzard has said it so far. Makes them sound like 1 race. Or better said :something we only want the looks for.

He always said that High Elves are 'kinda' Blood Elves or 'pretty much' Blood Elves which inherently implies that they are different. He flat out said that High Elves are not planned to be playable, that High Elves don't have major settlements, etc. I just don't get how you see him talking about them as if they are one and the same despite all that. Like, honestly, I don't.

Again if he really ment they are 2 sepperate races or taken our wish for real ( not granted it). He could have said they would look to similar as blood elves. Or we do not think its a right idea etc etc...not : the horde is there for you.

But he pretty much said that. He basically said that the looks of High Elves are already taken by Horde. If you want that looks, go play Horde.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

no one was talking about groups, i was talking with others about races, not a single time the term group, was brought up, him, quoted me arguing for the sake of argue, he keep doing this a lot

But you are the one that keeps saying "that race was already playable" when it's entirely irrelevant to the point. High Elves exist as another political entity, another group.

nothing in the game say that is irrelevant, per see, we only have different races playable, not groups as their full fledged stand alone thing,

Which doesn't make sense from an in universe perspective where several races are present in both factions (thalassian elves, kul tiran, humans, pandaren) and it makes it clear it's a gameplay choice that evidently doesn't reflect in universe politics.

The whole point that "X race can be on only one faction" doesn't reflect the actual nuance of the setting, were not only individuals, but entire organizations exist on both factions.

- - - Updated - - -

Its like you read, but you ignore it.
Void elves have void theme and blood/high elf theme.
Blood elves have blood elf theme, and no other theme.
So yeah, what do they get in return?
This is simply math.
1+? = 2
Blood elves need the 1

Honestly this is just the most inaccurate way to even thinking about what a theme is, dear lord. It makes no sense.

It's just ludicrous how "blood elf theme" and "void theme" are even comparable.

Light worship, Fel usage, Arcane reliance, Wilds marksman; these are ALL different themes each of one comparable to Void Study. The sheer arrogance to pretend that the "void theme" of void elves is even comparable to ALL the blood elven themes combined is just delusional.

Void Elves literally have one theme; they use void, while Blood Elves can go from pious light worshipers with golden eyes to demon hunters.

Trying to define "theme" as "but these to get to be blue and pink and these just pink so it's 2 themes on one side and 1 on the other" is outrageously silly. Especially if there's is literally no addressing why Void Elves get to be pink, it would literally still be just Void Theme with them.

I am 100% into the idea of adding Dark Ranger customization to Blood Elves, but the sheer misunderstanding of what a "theme" actually is, is utterly frustrating.

Just say aesthetics, that's what you mean, and learn what a theme actually is FFS.