Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Astranea]

I mean, it is clear Blizzard is trying to move the game forward in a completely new way. With choices such as Void Elves can be High Elves, or Dwarves being Wildhammer Dwarves.

Always on EU forum, from the same original thread as the above, Sub-race names & templates tied to the new customization options:

Customization screen mock-ups:

I would really love to see more of these, despite of not having different racials.

[Ielenia]

if they were exact the same they would look exact the same, not look like drusts being half-giants with 8ft

They're not "half-giants", and they are simply humans. The only reason why they look different is because Blizzard wanted to make some differentiation between them and the Stormwind humans. Remember that every single example of Kul'tiran characters in the lore until BfA were normal humans.

our current selection of playable races is exactly that, races, not groups, nothing changed yet

False. Zandalari are a group of trolls. Kul'tirans are a group of humans. Void elves are a group of thalassian elves. Gilneans are a group of humans.

if you are talking about groups, say groups, don't try to change the meaning of the word to fit your shenanigas

I'm not "changing" the meaning of any word. I'm simply using it in the context of this conversation. Playable race =/= actual race.

[Aldo Hawk]

They're not "half-giants", and they are simply humans. The only reason why they look different is because Blizzard wanted to make some differentiation between them and the Stormwind humans. Remember that every single example of Kul'tiran characters in the lore until BfA were normal humans.


False. Zandalari are a group of trolls. Kul'tirans are a group of humans. Void elves are a group of thalassian elves. Gilneans are a group of humans.


I'm not "changing" the meaning of any word. I'm simply using it in the context of this conversation. Playable race =/= actual race.

Look, Ielenia, Syegfryedo just tries to push this idea that every available race is a different actual race, like, in biological terms.

I know that just sounds nuts, but it is the approach he has been giving to it, so, when you mention 'race' and he also does, you two are referring to two different things. A conversation can't be had on those circumstances, and we all know who is in the right about the meaning of 'race' in wow, and no, it's not the dubious biologist.

Just look at how hard he tries for people to believe that Kul'tiran humans are a different race of Humans, like... He really tries. And he even disregard the fact that Gilnean are humans with druidic forms because that would mean they would not be a different 'biological' race and thus, he would have to concede the point. And, honestly, it's a point nobody should care to get conceded anyway, the concept of race in wow is not a scientific one, so it's just useless to try to argue around that.

[Sarallesta]

Always on EU forum, from the same original thread as the above, Sub-race names & templates tied to the new customization options

I think that is a nice idea honestly. I'm uncertain if on the NA forum someone has posted that, but it is pretty cool. Customisable sub-races of within that race.

[Ignaz]

Look, Ielenia, Syegfryedo just tries to push this idea that every available race is a different actual race, like, in biological terms.

I know that just sounds nuts, but it is the approach he has been giving to it, so, when you mention 'race' and he also does, you two are referring to two different things. A conversation can't be had on those circumstances, and we all know who is in the right about the meaning of 'race' in wow, and no, it's not the dubious biologist.

Just look at how hard he tries for people to believe that Kul'tiran humans are a different race of Humans, like... He really tries. And he even disregard the fact that Gilnean are humans with druidic forms because that would mean they would not be a different 'biological' race and thus, he would have to concede the point. And, honestly, it's a point nobody should care to get conceded anyway, the concept of race in wow is not a scientific one, so it's just useless to try to argue around that.

Totally agree. Blizzard doesn't even use the correct term. If we used the hierarchy of correct terms, we would be talking about ''playable species'' and among those species there would be ''groups'' called ''races''.

Actually, they use the term ''race'' to refer to any of the other two terms.

[FlubberPuddy]

Human and Kul Tiran hairstyles works well for females, but it is not that fitting for males. Night elves could provide better hairstyles, they share some of them with blood elves anyway.

I also wonder what's the problem some people have? So far, only skin tones were announced to be shared between belfs and velfs. It remains to be seen what's next is going to be shared between thalassians.

Yes even Night Elf hairstyles would go well being shared as well!

The problem some people have is that High Elf fans were vindicated in their request by receiving some skin tones shared between belfs and velfs. Thus they're still trying to cope/be petty about it and making hysterical statements like 'you just want to port everything about blood elf to Alliance!!' when that's not true at all.

For instance no one is seriously asking for green eyes, the most iconic thing about Blood Elves, or to brandish around a golden Silvermoon phoenix necklace.

Then they're so pedantic and saying 'give em an inch and they'll ask for a mile!' as if no other players of the game have literally been doing this every time Blizzard has given players whatever it is that they wanted.

You can already see it with the Fire Mages changes for instance, players are 'still asking for more'. In the PoV of these pedants one would assume 'omg these players are so ungrateful, Blizzard is already making a good change to their class and they want more?! Disrespectful!!'

It's very silly, super super silly.

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I think that is a nice idea honestly. I'm uncertain if on the NA forum someone has posted that, but it is pretty cool. Customisable sub-races of within that race.

It's how picking 'races' should be! Very cool idea.

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Came across another vid by SoulSoBreezy last night



While he makes the all too easy wisecracks at getting Alliance High Elves, he also supports same hair colors and even the Paladin class as long as some story reason for it existed.

[Vaedan]

Yes even Night Elf hairstyles would go well being shared as well!

The problem some people have is that High Elf fans were vindicated in their request by receiving some skin tones shared between belfs and velfs. Thus they're still trying to cope/be petty about it and making hysterical statements like 'you just want to port everything about blood elf to Alliance!!' when that's not true at all.

For instance no one is seriously asking for green eyes, the most iconic thing about Blood Elves, or to brandish around a golden Silvermoon phoenix necklace.

Then they're so pedantic and saying 'give em an inch and they'll ask for a mile!' as if no other players of the game have literally been doing this every time Blizzard has given players whatever it is that they wanted.

You can already see it with the Fire Mages changes for instance, players are 'still asking for more'. In the PoV of these pedants one would assume 'omg these players are so ungrateful, Blizzard is already making a good change to their class and they want more?! Disrespectful!!'

It's very silly, super super silly.

I think it's natural that players are asking for more. There will always be many things that can be added to appease someone. It is up to Blizzard to decide what they actually want to add to their game.

I understood these debates before Blizz decided to add fair skin tones to void elves. For some, it was kind of personal quest to deny that this will happen. I can understand that some people are angry about it, but claiming that blood elves are getting nothing and all the unique stuff is given to void elves is clearly delusional, since we have seen new options belfs are getting - new beards, new skin and eye colours, pretty unique jewellery, new hairstyles... and only thing which was confirmed to be shared with void elves are skin tones.

There are also more things to character customization which are in play that can't be shared, like faction specific transmogs and titles. You will not get Silvermoon City tabard (even in blue-gold variant) on the Alliance and you can't bear title "of Silvermoon", not to mention there is still specific heritage armor of Sin'dorei. All those things count. You will not be really able to make ren'dorei/quel'dorei spellbreaker look on the alliance.

I am pretty sure void elves will get more stuff, hairstyles and hair colour are most likely, since it is probably easiest customization to implement. I'm also sure blood elves will get loads of other options, we just have to wait and see. I believe there will be a fraction of customization which will be shared between belfs and velfs, and each race will have it's own distinctive customization. That is the most logical way to highlight thalassian heritage of both races, and maintain their unique thematics.

[FlubberPuddy]

I think it's natural that players are asking for more. There will always be many things that can be added to appease someone. It is up to Blizzard to decide what they actually want to add to their game.

I understood these debates before Blizz decided to add fair skin tones to void elves. For some, it was kind of personal quest to deny that this will happen. I can understand that some people are angry about it, but claiming that blood elves are getting nothing and all the unique stuff is given to void elves is clearly delusional, since we have seen new options belfs are getting - new beards, new skin and eye colours, pretty unique jewellery, new hairstyles... and only thing which was confirmed to be shared with void elves are skin tones.

Yup, it is natural! Detractors just act like it isn't because it's personally going against their wishes. And as we can see with how you point out all the unique things Blood Elves are getting, the detractors are instead much more focused on what's coming to Void Elves or what has the potential to come to Void Elves.

It again highlights how their main focus is denying others options rather than keeping the focus on what they want to get for their customization options.

There are also more things to character customization which are in play that can't be shared, like faction specific transmogs and titles. You will not get Silvermoon City tabard (even in blue-gold variant) on the Alliance and you can't bear title "of Silvermoon", not to mention there is still specific heritage armor of Sin'dorei. All those things count. You will not be really able to make ren'dorei/quel'dorei spellbreaker look on the alliance.

You're correct here, there's a lot of specifically Blood Elf things/Horde things that are unique to Horde Blood Elves. But what the High Elf request has shown is that there are players among Blood Elves that literally believe Blood Elves aren't Blood Elves and that they're High Elves (in title, not race) which is why so many of them do not seem to care about what makes a Blood Elf, a Blood Elf, but rather how they can keep the aesthetic of a 'High Elf' unique to themselves.

Something they utterly failed to do of course with the unveiling of High Elf options to both sides.

I am pretty sure void elves will get more stuff, hairstyles and hair colour are most likely, since it is probably easiest customization to implement. I'm also sure blood elves will get loads of other options, we just have to wait and see. I believe there will be a fraction of customization which will be shared between belfs and velfs, and each race will have it's own distinctive customization. That is the most logical way to highlight thalassian heritage of both races, and maintain their unique thematics.

Yeah, agreed. Especially since in regards to Void Elves they're not techinically supposed to be getting customization options at all atm since the focus was original races for Shadowlands launch. So that we're getting the skin tones early is a bonus already.

Wait and see is definitely the name of the game, but of course what detractors are bemoaning right now is that they 'lost' against the High Elf request, despite getting blue eyes on Blood Elves. Because their focus was always ensuring Alliance never got to play human-skin elves.

[Syegfryed]

Well you are right in that it's your problem.

Blizzard doesn't agree,

when blizzard add another allied race, as the same race of one that is already playable, with no difference whatsoever, like my troll example, then you can say blizzard dissagre

That's the whole point of increased customizations they're implementing. So people can have multiple troll tribes in one race option, or multiple dwarf or orc clans, or in the case of elves - different groups.

but not as another race, and like i said, that is great, my only problem is they changing racials and other shenanigans

They're not "half-giants", and they are simply humans.

simple humans don't develop different racials and different byotipes just for giggles there is genetic nd biological differences in the race who can argable be called subraces, but they are just not the same thing

The only reason why they look different is because Blizzard wanted to make some differentiation between them and the Stormwind humans.

they still gave then pretty decent reasons of why the difference exist, why there is another breed of humans within the same place

False. Zandalari are a group of trolls.

Zandalar is one race of trolls, the progenitors of other races and completely different from the others

Kul'tirans are a group of humans.

they are another breed/subrace of humans, thats why you can play normal kul'tirans with their racials, just the other kind

Void elves are a group of thalassian elves.

a new race of elves mutated by the void

Gilneans are a group of humans.

a race of werewolf cursed humans, just like kul'tirans, you can't play normal guilnean worgens on the worgen race

I'm simply using it in the context of this conversation. Playable race =/= actual race.

you are forcing the context in my other conversation, and playable race = actual race still

[DeicideUH]

There are also more things to character customization which are in play that can't be shared, like faction specific transmogs and titles. You will not get Silvermoon City tabard (even in blue-gold variant) on the Alliance and you can't bear title "of Silvermoon", not to mention there is still specific heritage armor of Sin'dorei. All those things count. You will not be really able to make ren'dorei/quel'dorei spellbreaker look on the alliance.

I really wish we got a ren'dorei tabard with the actual ren'dorei symbol (the inverted fenix that looks like a helmet), thought. I find it strange that the actual tabard does not have it.

I am pretty sure void elves will get more stuff, hairstyles and hair colour are most likely, since it is probably easiest customization to implement. I'm also sure blood elves will get loads of other options, we just have to wait and see. I believe there will be a fraction of customization which will be shared between belfs and velfs, and each race will have it's own distinctive customization. That is the most logical way to highlight thalassian heritage of both races, and maintain their unique thematics.

We will probably get at least hair colors. But, aside from ear length, I think Blizzard shouldn't copy anything more from blood elves. The hair styles and colors should be unique, even if the colors end up similar, it shouldn't be just the same.

I also hope both races get tatoos. Blood elves should get runic designs in red, orange, gold and green, void elves could get celtic-like twisting and coiling lines in void, blue, violet and magenta. Tattoos would alleviate a LOT the "problem" of same skins.

[Deathrange]

I'm all for Darkfallen aesthetics for the Blood Elves!

Please yes! That would be amazing.

[Florena]

I'd love that, that or undead/dark ranger aesthetics. WOuld be something cool to give to blood elves that would n't carry over to void elves.

I don't mind VEs getting the opportunity to look like high elves but blood elves should still have some unique stuff to themselves too.

[Highelf]

I think that is a nice idea honestly. I'm uncertain if on the NA forum someone has posted that, but it is pretty cool. Customisable sub-races of within that race.

How that is set up on EU is exactly how I originally thought Blizzard was going to do and how they were going to handle Sub races, but they went the allied races route.

[Doffen]

I'm all for Darkfallen aesthetics for the Blood Elves!

I want these. Think that customization with Venthyr transmog and hangin out with the vampire elves.

Would make my day.

[Gaexion Ramza Beoulve]

I'm all for Darkfallen aesthetics for the Blood Elves!

This is the worst post ever made.

[Ignaz]

when blizzard add another allied race, as the same race of one that is already playable, with no difference whatsoever, like my troll example, then you can say blizzard dissagre



but not as another race, and like i said, that is great, my only problem is they changing racials and other shenanigans



simple humans don't develop different racials and different byotipes just for giggles there is genetic nd biological differences in the race who can argable be called subraces, but they are just not the same thing


they still gave then pretty decent reasons of why the difference exist, why there is another breed of humans within the same place



Zandalar is one race of trolls, the progenitors of other races and completely different from the others


they are another breed/subrace of humans, thats why you can play normal kul'tirans with their racials, just the other kind


a new race of elves mutated by the void


a race of werewolf cursed humans, just like kul'tirans, you can't play normal guilnean worgens on the worgen race



you are forcing the context in my other conversation, and playable race = actual race still

This discussion is meaningless. Blizzard is not interested in any biological or genetic principles.

If we were guided by the term race, we would also use the different skin colors and facial aspects that we have in the different playable races as racial marks.

for example: black humans and white humans. And now, with the addition of more features like Asian and African-American facial features (in real life, they are different races of the same species: humans)

But in wow they all become part of a ''group'' called ''race'' (Stormwind Humans).

[FlubberPuddy]

This discussion is meaningless. Blizzard is not interested in any biological or genetic principles.

If we were guided by the term race, we would also use the different skin colors and facial aspects that we have in the different playable races as racial marks.

for example: black humans and white humans. And now, with the addition of more features like Asian and African-American facial features (in real life, they are different races of the same species: humans)

But in wow they all become part of a ''group'' called ''race'' (Stormwind Humans).

Exactly this post, it's why I've said my piece and left it at that, calling it his own personal problem and not one that Blizzard agrees with/cares for.

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This is the worst post ever made.

You're in the faction where pretty elves make up its majority. Should be pretty used to suggestions like that one by now.

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Btw I'm liking the posters switching over to fair skinned void elves for their profile pics. It's gonna look real good seeing all those characters running around Stormwind/Alliance areas and grouping up with em

[Frenchvince]

Btw I'm liking the posters switching over to fair skinned void elves for their profile pics. It's gonna look real good seeing all those characters running around Stormwind/Alliance areas and grouping up with em

I can't wait for the wowhead dressing room to be updated with the new velf skins to do my transmo tests !

[Aldo Hawk]

This discussion is meaningless. Blizzard is not interested in any biological or genetic principles.

If we were guided by the term race, we would also use the different skin colors and facial aspects that we have in the different playable races as racial marks.

for example: black humans and white humans. And now, with the addition of more features like Asian and African-American facial features (in real life, they are different races of the same species: humans)

But in wow they all become part of a ''group'' called ''race'' (Stormwind Humans).

Yeah, it's exactly this.

In fact, the only place in Warcraft where I have seen the word 'species' being used this way in a constant manner was in the movie, and oh boy, the movie has some artistic liberties regarding nomenclatures. In spanish for example, they called fel, fel, instead of calling that magic by the name it was given in that language more than two decades ago and what has been used in any spanish translation on any warcraft related product.

In Warcraft, the term species and race is the exact same (obviously, take this with a grain of salt, it's more about these having mixed meanings with eachother than anything), thing that in the real world with our scientifical paradigm simply makes no sense.

Also, there's already an entry on wowpedia talking about this exact same thing: https://wow.gamepedia.com/Race

'In World of Warcraft, Blizzard interchanges the terms species and race, giving them roughly the same meaning.[1]

Unfortunately, Blizzard is not always consistent on how they use the terms. Sometimes they use the term '"race" when they mean the biological definition of "species".'

And, in fact, the very word 'race' regarding Warcraft's logos is also used wrong in some circumstances, like when we can select a human from Stormwind or from Kul'tiras, which are just different models but the exact same, they only change culture and thus the classes and the 'racials'.

To think the word 'race' is this somewhat rigid, always accurate term when talking about Warcraft, is simply wrong.

[Ielenia]

simple humans don't develop different racials and different byotipes just for giggles there is genetic nd biological differences in the race who can argable be called subraces, but they are just not the same thing

Racials are, for the most part, mostly cultural. And biotypes? Really? I know it was been said not to use real life examples by the mods, but look at our human race and all its different "biotypes". Again: the only reason kul'tirans look different than Stormwind humans was so they could look different.

they still gave then pretty decent reasons of why the difference exist, why there is another breed of humans within the same place

The only reasons Blizzard gave were cultural differences. No "weird, mystical, mysterious ancestry" whatsoever.

they are another breed/subrace of humans, thats why you can play normal kul'tirans with their racials, just the other kind

No, they are plain humans. They have a different look because they're playable, otherwise, they're just humans. You want to push this "sub-race" thing and yet you have zero evidence of that.

a new race of elves mutated by the void

Prove to me that a baby from two void elves is a void elf baby and not a blood elf baby. Unless you do, the void elves are as much as "new race" as man losing his arm is a "new race of human".

a race of werewolf cursed humans, just like kul'tirans,

"Worgen are not technically a race and thus cannot reproduce like one. The worgen curse is just a curse. Its origins are rooted in the druidic pack form that was later altered by the Scythe of Elune. The end result is worgen we see today, beings that can transmit their affliction to others via a single bite. In theory, if two worgen were to mate and produce an offspring, that offspring would not be a worgen. The child would merely possess the genetic material of his or her parents, like any other child sans the curse." From the developers' mouth. Not a race.

you can't play normal guilnean worgens on the worgen race

Again, you're talking about playable race, not race.

you are forcing the context in my other conversation, and playable race = actual race still

No, I'm not. You even used the sentence "you can't play as" meaning you're talking about "playable race" which is, once again, a "group within a race" not an actual race.