Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Ielenia]

simple humans don't develop different racials and different byotipes just for giggles there is genetic nd biological differences in the race who can argable be called subraces, but they are just not the same thing

Racials are, for the most part, mostly cultural. And biotypes? Really? I know it was been said not to use real life examples by the mods, but look at our human race and all its different "biotypes". Again: the only reason kul'tirans look different than Stormwind humans was so they could look different.

they still gave then pretty decent reasons of why the difference exist, why there is another breed of humans within the same place

The only reasons Blizzard gave were cultural differences. No "weird, mystical, mysterious ancestry" whatsoever.

they are another breed/subrace of humans, thats why you can play normal kul'tirans with their racials, just the other kind

No, they are plain humans. They have a different look because they're playable, otherwise, they're just humans. You want to push this "sub-race" thing and yet you have zero evidence of that.

a new race of elves mutated by the void

Prove to me that a baby from two void elves is a void elf baby and not a blood elf baby. Unless you do, the void elves are as much as "new race" as man losing his arm is a "new race of human".

a race of werewolf cursed humans, just like kul'tirans,

"Worgen are not technically a race and thus cannot reproduce like one. The worgen curse is just a curse. Its origins are rooted in the druidic pack form that was later altered by the Scythe of Elune. The end result is worgen we see today, beings that can transmit their affliction to others via a single bite. In theory, if two worgen were to mate and produce an offspring, that offspring would not be a worgen. The child would merely possess the genetic material of his or her parents, like any other child sans the curse." From the developers' mouth. Not a race.

you can't play normal guilnean worgens on the worgen race

Again, you're talking about playable race, not race.

you are forcing the context in my other conversation, and playable race = actual race still

No, I'm not. You even used the sentence "you can't play as" meaning you're talking about "playable race" which is, once again, a "group within a race" not an actual race.

[Aldo Hawk]

Btw I'm liking the posters switching over to fair skinned void elves for their profile pics. It's gonna look real good seeing all those characters running around Stormwind/Alliance areas and grouping up with em

Do you want people to be happy playing as characters based on the lore they always wanted to partake in?

The audacity, you are a monster.

[DeicideUH]

Soon... (But with another eye color)

[Aldo Hawk]

Soon... (But with another eye color)

Damn, looks so cool dude, good job!

I think I'm gonna make some more High elves in the dressing room when they add the customizations in there and start sharing these here, let's get creative!

[FlubberPuddy]

Do you want people to be happy playing as characters based on the lore they always wanted to partake in?

The audacity, you are a monster.

Ya I'm so ruthless!! Look out world...of warcraft!

- - - Updated - - -

Damn, looks so cool dude, good job!

I think I'm gonna make some more High elves in the dressing room when they add the customizations in there and start sharing these here, let's get creative!

Same, I'm waiting for it to be on there so I can customize closer to what we'll get in Shadowlands.

[Syegfryed]

Racials are, for the most part, mostly cultural.

you can produce a different thing your body can do by culture, culture is behaviors of society, no physiology and biology

And biotypes? Really? I know it was been said not to use real life examples by the mods, but look at our human race and all its different "biotypes".

And even with us, we are not the same thing regardless, there is a difference between neighbor or cousins and people with 2 different places in the world

Again: the only reason kul'tirans look different than Stormwind humans was so they could look different.

but they do look different, and have lore reasons for, unlike elves

The only reasons Blizzard gave were cultural differences. No "weird, mystical, mysterious ancestry" whatsoever.

they gave actual evolution differences, they said living in a harsh land made then more adapted to it, that is not cultural only, that is biological.

And by weird mysterious ancestry like i said, their resemble with the drust is visible

No, they are plain humans. They have a different look because they're playable, otherwise, they're just humans. You want to push this "sub-race" thing and yet you have zero evidence of that.

the same humans would not be different with different racials, they are another breed of human, simple as that

Prove to me that a baby from two void elves is a void elf baby and not a blood elf baby. Unless you do, the void elves are as much as "new race" as man losing his arm is a "new race of human".

ah yes, the good old Appeal to Ignorance

From the developers' mouth. Not a race.

not "technically" just like undead, but they are different nevertheless, and are just not the same thing

Again, you're talking about playable race, not race.

which end being the same thing in wow, unless like i said, they indeed but the same race in the game, from different groups, with no difference whosoever

No, I'm not. You even used the sentence "you can't play as" meaning you're talking about "playable race" which is, once again, a "group within a race" not an actual race.

and im talking about race, if its not your play, then do not quote and try to debate me, if the points are different?

[FlubberPuddy]

snip

You have no actual point, that's what people are trying to point out.

There is no definite definition of what a 'race' is by Blizzard's standards, ergo you cannot say "In WoW this is a race and that is not a race" because there's no consistent definition by Blizzard.

Thus all you're doing is actually ignoring the logic that there is no strict definition of race in WoW and instead coming up with your own, unsupported by Blizzard, definition of race and arguing 'this is how race is defined'.

You're literally headcanoning and people are pointing it out and you're still not getting it or genuinely ignoring it.

[Alixie]

Please do not shoot the messenger...

I could not help noticing this mockup on the EU forum:

I cant help but wonder why not just go full broke and list High Elves and Void Elves as separate races that share the same model but different customizations. Why half ass it with "High Elves that joined their void kin.." doesnt that just make them Void Elves? Name the base, "Elf" (like Dwarf and Troll are a collection of clans now), then pick Void or High. If you pick High Elf, then you're allowed to pick the Paladin class, and you spawn at the SW Emissary with a cheeky note from Vereesa that says, "Now that we've been formally recognized, lets continue helping the Alliance."

[Syegfryed]

You have no actual point, that's what people are trying to point out.

then don't waste time trying to "correct me" or point that i don't have point, is simple as that

because there's no consistent definition by Blizzard.

the consistency still lies how all playable races, excluding pandaren, are still fundamentally different of each other, not the exact same thing and we never ever, had the same actual race, with the exact same features being add as playable with no difference whatsoever in the game alter on

when they do that, like i said with the example of "making jungle troll playable" or "humans of alterac"(who are equal of all the high elf/blood elf dilemma) or any other like that as a stand alone race, then i would i agree completely with you, until that, nope, my point will not change.

You're literally headcanoning and people are pointing it out and you're still not getting it or genuinely ignoring it.

still sounds funny when coming from you, this topic

[willowfree]

then don't waste time trying to "correct me" or point that i don't have point, is simple as that



the consistency still lies how all playable races, excluding pandaren, are still fundamentally different of each other, not the exact same thing and we never ever, had the same actual race, with the exact same features being add as playable with no difference whatsoever in the game alter on

when they do that, like i said with the example of "making jungle troll playable" or "humans of alterac"(who are equal of all the high elf/blood elf dilemma) or any other like that as a stand alone race, then i would i agree completely with you, until that, nope, my point will not change.



still sounds funny when coming from you, this topic

Dunno what your all about and how far you guys discussion is going back but... All playable races are fundamentally different to each other and not the exact same thing? Mag'ar orcs are literally just orcs with brown skin color... You didn't see the uproar people are giving the high elves with the ''Just blood elves with blue eyes'' When they where added then. Pure hypocrisy if you ask me. It would be the same as if Blizzard where to make a different allied races for each of the dwarven clans as well. Or each for every troll tribe out there

Edit: And yes... Dark hammers and zandalari got their allied races. But they where at least allot more than just a different skin tone to them.. But Wildhammer dwarfs as well as the other troll tribes are now becoming normal troll and dwarf costumization options. Which Mag'ar should of been to the orcs as well, If the only difference is gonna be a different skin tone.

[Gaidax]

I cant help but wonder why not just go full broke and list High Elves and Void Elves as separate races that share the same model but different customizations. Why half ass it with "High Elves that joined their void kin.." doesnt that just make them Void Elves? Name the base, "Elf" (like Dwarf and Troll are a collection of clans now), then pick Void or High. If you pick High Elf, then you're allowed to pick the Paladin class, and you spawn at the SW Emissary with a cheeky note from Vereesa that says, "Now that we've been formally recognized, lets continue helping the Alliance."

Because if they slap this as part of Void Elves, they can quickly give people what they were asked for here for bajillion years, without having to crap out full blown Allied Race with its own racials and shit.

I really think it's fine. I am sure that eventually down the road they will add actual High Elves as a proper allied race with all the bells and whistles, but for now this is an ok quick fix that is not very unreasonable. After all it's not like Void Elves necessarily have to be emo-colored and tentacle haired.

[Aldo Hawk]

Because if they slap this as part of Void Elves, they can quickly give people what they were asked for here for bajillion years, without having to crap out full blown Allied Race with its own racials and shit.

I really think it's fine. I am sure that eventually down the road they will add actual High Elves as a proper allied race with all the bells and whistles, but for now this is an ok quick fix that is not very unreasonable. After all it's not like Void Elves necessarily have to be emo-colored and tentacle haired.

Yeah, that's exactly what I think, word by word.

The new iteration of Void elves just have some extra looks to them that don't have to necessarily be Voidy, and serve multiple purposes while leaving room for other things in the future.

I still hope a full fledged Allied race comes some day, and now with people running around with these new customizations in the Alliance, devs will see how much such thing is desired by players through direct metrics from the game, so I see it more possible than ever.

[Syegfryed]

Dunno what your all about and how far you guys discussion is going back but... All playable races are fundamentally different to each other and not the exact same thing? Mag'ar orcs are literally just orcs with brown skin color...

Like you own described, they are not the exact same thing, they are literally different in terms of skin color and race, since one got entirely corrupted with demon blood and the other evolved without it in another dimension

[Ielenia]

you can produce a different thing your body can do by culture, culture is behaviors of society, no physiology and biology

No, they are, for the most part, cultural. Let me demonstrate. Let's take Kul'tiran humans, for example:
• Brush It Off. Passive: Increase Versatility and regenerate a portion of damage taken.
• Child of the Sea. Passive: Hold your breath longer and swim faster.
• Haymaker. 2.5 min cooldown: Haul off and punch an enemy, stunning and knocking them back
• Jack of All Trades. Passive: Increases skill in every tradeskill.
• Rime of the Ancient Mariner. Passive: Reduces Frost and Nature damage taken.

All five of them are cultural-based. Brush It Off, and Child of the Sea? In a culture revolving around sea-faring, you expect to find that the people are hardier and have better swimming skills, which includes holding their breath for longer. Not because of "genetics", but because working with and in sea-faring ships helps improve one's toughness, and if you're in a sea-faring culture without knowing how to swim, you're shark bait. Haymaker? It's a punch. I don't think I need to explain this one. Jack of All Trades? Same thing. Rime of the Ancient Mariner? Again, in a culture revolving around sea-faring, you expect the people to be hardier against the elements.

And even with us, we are not the same thing regardless, there is a difference between neighbor or cousins and people with 2 different places in the world

And yet, they're all the same race. No "subrace" nonsense.

but they do look different, and have lore reasons for, unlike elves

No, they don't. The reason they look different is simply as way to make them look different from Stormwind humans. The lore reasons are for the racials. Because those exact five racials the Kul'tirans have could still be given to them if they looked exactly like Stormwind humans.

they gave actual evolution differences,

Learn how "evolution" actually works, and realize your grave mistake. "Evolution" of that scale does not happen in this short a span of time.

the same humans would not be different with different racials, they are another breed of human, simple as that

No, they are not a "different breed". They're humans, and they look different for playable differentiation's sake.

ah yes, the good old Appeal to Ignorance

... What? Do you even know what "appeal to ignorance" means? You are the one who wants to conclude that void elves are a different race than blood elves, then it's your burden to prove that. And what I wrote was exactly that: asking you to prove that. Especially since the other race of "mutated characters" we have, Gilneans, have been shown to not be an 'actual race' as the developers said their children are normal humans, without the curse.

So, in the light of that, it's your burden of proof that the "void-ification" is hereditary, which is a pre-requisite for the void elves to be considered an actual separate race.

not "technically" just like undead, but they are different nevertheless, and are just not the same thing

Yeah. Forsaken are not a race. And, by developers' mouth, neither are the Gilneans. They're not a different race from humans. They are humans, who were mutated by the Worgen curse. Worgens are not any more a "different race" from humans, than a human who lost his arm is a "different race" from humans.

which end being the same thing in wow,

No. No, it is not. Otherwise Kul'tirans and Lightforged Draenei would not exist.

and im talking about race, if its not your play, then do not quote and try to debate me, if the points are different?

You flip-flop between "actual race" and "playable race" when it suits you.

[elbleuet]

Like you own described, they are not the exact same thing, they are literally different in terms of skin color and race, since one got entirely corrupted with demon blood and the other evolved without it in another dimension

Still the same race.

Sooo we went from "you will never get fair skinned elves haha" to "anyways still no high elves for u guys lol"

This is endless.

[Vaedan]

Still the same race.

Sooo we went from "you will never get fair skinned elves haha" to "anyways still no high elves for u guys lol"

This is endless.

Don't forget "still you are not getting elf paladins".

It is also funny that very same people who repeated for 2 years "blood elves are high elves" went to opinion that void elves (which are in fact blood elves in the first place) are not high elves and that void elves have no right for thalassian stuff, despite being thalassian elves. There are some obvious double standards.

[willowfree]

Like you own described, they are not the exact same thing, they are literally different in terms of skin color and race, since one got entirely corrupted with demon blood and the other evolved without it in another dimension

Okey then... Does that same logic not apply to high elves then? They are literally different in terms of eye color and race. since one took in the fel to survive on after the fall of the sunwell, And the other survived without doing so further away from the sunwell's fall? Ergo not the exact same thing either then?

[Highelf]

Is there a dressing room with the new VE appearances anywhere?

[Doffen]

I really think it's fine. I am sure that eventually down the road they will add actual High Elves as a proper allied race with all the bells and whistles, but for now this is an ok quick fix that is not very unreasonable. After all it's not like Void Elves necessarily have to be emo-colored and tentacle haired.

An elf with bells and whistles? Sign me up!

"Don't give up hope" Start a Bellf(see what I did there) Megathread!

[DeicideUH]

Is there a dressing room with the new VE appearances anywhere?

No, as they are not in the alpha yet. There's only speculative images.