1. #19441
    Quote Originally Posted by Molvonos View Post
    There's way too much opinion in your post painted as fact to take seriously.
    Counter it then. There is a reason in game design, a palette swap changed the perception of players for mobs, even if the design is the same.
    Cost effective, and it affects perception.
    Quote Originally Posted by Molvonos View Post
    No type of class is 'necessary'. You can tank as a warrior, guardian druid, vengeance demon hunter or blood death knight instead of a paladin.
    You either don't do any form of hardcore M+ or raiding. There are classes that are preferred, and classes that are not.
    Paladins, are not.
    Secondly, they are also a part of the unique offering of blood elf, which velfers want.
    Quote Originally Posted by Molvonos View Post
    To say they're redundant and inferior is utterly untrue.
    This is a statement, not a counter.
    What do you get playing a blood elf that you would not get playing a void elf?
    Paladin.
    Alliance has the best paladins, so, not a concern, and light doesnt mesh with void.
    Quote Originally Posted by Molvonos View Post
    If we're stating bias -- Blood Elf racials are superior to Void Elf racials.
    That's a cool story to tell until you realize the DPS difference is 0.99%, and that the void elves teleport ability provides significantly greater utility and mobility than arcane torrents niche use.
    There is also the much more practical cost reduction for mogs so...yeah.
    The superior argument doesn't work for anyone that can do basic math.
    Oh, and that 1% difference, shrinks further on any class than stacking crit...which ismost.
    Quote Originally Posted by Molvonos View Post
    If you're trying to talk on behalf of high elves, you're doing a pretty bad job of it.
    If you're trying to talk on behalf of void elves, you're doing a pretty bad job of it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Molvonos View Post
    If you're trying to talk on behalf of blood elves? You're doing a pretty bad job of it.
    If you're trying to talk on behalf of...
    Sorry, one should be enough to get the point across.
    Your entire post is nothing but assumptions and claims bereft of actual counter arguments.
    You havent addressed my points regarding theme.
    You came out of nowhere bringing up the trinity of the RPG as if it has anybearing on the context of this discussion
    Quote Originally Posted by Molvonos View Post
    So what exactly were you intending with this post?
    if you are asking this question then you are admiring a mirror.

    Question...whats the deal with your sig and who is Jonnusthegreat? Is it some dude who got in trouble or something?

  2. #19442
    If you want to play a High Elf, the Alliance and Horde are there for you.

  3. #19443
    Quote Originally Posted by shoc View Post
    If you want to play a High Elf, the Alliance and Horde are there for you.
    Essentially.
    I guess nightborne will soon get a night elf model.

    Anyways, I think no one will agree to anything, and this topic served its purpose.
    So...i am outtie Velfers
    Last edited by Broflake; 2020-06-02 at 06:02 AM.

  4. #19444
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    Same applies to you. If you want to claim that blood elves are "losing" something, you have to show what they are losing, and why do you think they're losing it.
    Blood elves are losing aesthetics that were unique to them. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to acknowledge this. Regardless, the skin tones have been shared now but it doesn't mean that their hair colors or styles need to be shared also. That is pretty much one of the only remaining features left for blood elves that distinguish them. Take that away from them (by giving it to void elves) and you essentially end up with an Alliance AR (based on a core horde race) having pretty much all of their parents race customizations PLUS their own unique void customizations. The skin color alone was a HUGE gain for void elves, leave the hair colors and styles that are unique to blood elves with the blood elves thanks.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Kyriani View Post
    In fairness I'd wouldn't say that Void Elves will have the Blood Elf theme, only the Void Elf theme and soon the High Elf theme.

    While Blood Elves still have the Blood Elf theme and soon the High Elf theme. I'm also holding out hope for the San'layn/Dark Ranger customization for those themes as well.

    Also... how does one "lose" a theme? I can see how one can "share" a theme, but I don't see Blood Elves "losing" anything.
    Sharing a theme results in the blood elves losing something that was unique to them. What was lost? One aspect that made blood elves unique. Are you saying more of what makes them unique should be shared (ie hair colors)? It's a subjective topic but you would be disingenuous if you think the blood elves have lost nothing with void elves getting their skin colors (their new skin colors too which were meant to be a unique new customization option for blood elves).

    The cards have been dealt, and the skin colors will now be shared, but that doesn't mean it is acceptable to continue taking blood elf aesthetics and giving them to void elves. Sure, give void elves more options, heck give every race and AR more options... but keep those options unique so that there is a level of immersion and pride within each race. Else we might as well scrap the race system and just make your player character a human who can have horns, tusks, fur, etcc...
    Blood elves are our high elves - Chris Metzen

  5. #19445
    Quote Originally Posted by Strippling View Post
    Else we might as well scrap the race system and just make your player character a human who can have horns, tusks, fur, etcc...
    You say that like it's a bad thing.

  6. #19446
    I am Murloc! Geisl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    California, USA
    Posts
    5,034
    Quote Originally Posted by Broflake View Post
    Essentially.
    I guess nightborne will soon get a night elf model.

    Anyways, I think no one will agree to anything, and this topic served its purpose.
    So...i am outtie Velfers
    I think the High Elf request shows that people should spend more time advocating for options they want instead of trying to deny any sorts of options from others.

    Aka, focus on yo self and what you want.

    Like me personally, I don't give a shit about what Blood Elves get or can do or how they're portrayed.

    Because I got my Alliance High Elves now I can focus on making further requests for how that can be improved and whatever the fuck happens to Horde races/Horde story I don't have to give a shit about.

    This is your typical player behavior btw, everyone focuses more on whatever aspect they want furthered in the game and aren't beholden to some 'balance standard' where they have to think of every other area of the game or what other players want.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Starla View Post
    With absolutely no proof or evidence you feel free to share this feeling? It's kind of sad because it just comes off as insensitivity to the people who love the races they play and have been given little attention.
    I think this post is coming off as being too passive-aggressive rather than Kyri's coming off an insensitive (doesn't at all honestly). Aren't you happy and glad you got your blue eyed blood elves? You spammed the twitter hashtag a lot for it.

    Everyone wins!

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Strippling View Post
    Else we might as well scrap the race system and just make your player character a human who can have horns, tusks, fur, etcc...
    This is kinda funny considering Horde are still campaigning for Nathanos/Derek Proudmoore style Undead. Basically proper human undead. I think it's clear that the vast majority are those that want more options than less.

    It's not as if the High Elf request itself was truly niche/minor (if it were Blizzard wouldn't have granted it the way they did).

  7. #19447
    Quote Originally Posted by shoc View Post
    You say that like it's a bad thing.
    Other MMO's are that way -------->

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Geisl View Post
    This is kinda funny considering Horde are still campaigning for Nathanos/Derek Proudmoore style Undead. Basically proper human undead. I think it's clear that the vast majority are those that want more options than less.

    It's not as if the High Elf request itself was truly niche/minor (if it were Blizzard wouldn't have granted it the way they did).
    I've barely seen threads asking for Nathanos style undead. They're a rare thing, so don't be no naive in thinking it's a customization asked for by "Horde".

    I never said the high elf request was niche. You yourself though said not even 2 weeks ago that "you don't want blood elves", now you're saying "I hope we get blood elf hair colors and styles". So, you didn't want the race but you want their customizations? You also argued with me constantly about how you wanted high elves cause of their "lore", now your advocating for void elf paladins which breaks the lore.

    I've accepted that void elves will have access to ALL of the blood elf skin tones, but I certainly don't feel they should have access to their hair options too.

    Also, you argued with Obelisk on many occasions that "void elves aren't high elves", now you're saying "yay alliance high elves will be playable". Obelisk even stated on several occasions that the high elf wayfarers in Telogrus Rift implied that high elves were joining the void elf ranks, but you and several others contended this and said "there's no proof, that's just your headcanon". Lo and behold, Taliesin makes a video saying the exact same thing and now y'all are like "high elves are joining the void elves so let's have those light skin and hair options". Again, congratulations on the win.. just don't be hypocritical.

    I'm an advocate for races maintaining unique aesthetics, it's what gives the whole race selection part of the game meaning and immersion. I personally don't want Nathanos style undead, as I agree that it kinda takes away from humans. I'd much rather dark ranger elf options, as they are a Horde feature and would be based of the Horde blood elf model. Likewise, Eredar for Horde? No thanks. Alteraci humans for Horde? No thanks. Moknathol? yes please. Same for san'layn and ogres.
    Blood elves are our high elves - Chris Metzen

  8. #19448
    Quote Originally Posted by Strippling View Post
    Other MMO's are that way -------->

    - - - Updated - - -



    I've barely seen threads asking for Nathanos style undead. They're a rare thing, so don't be no naive in thinking it's a customization asked for by "Horde".

    I never said the high elf request was niche. You yourself though said not even 2 weeks ago that "you don't want blood elves", now you're saying "I hope we get blood elf hair colors and styles". So, you didn't want the race but you want their customizations? You also argued with me constantly about how you wanted high elves cause of their "lore", now your advocating for void elf paladins which breaks the lore.

    I've accepted that void elves will have access to ALL of the blood elf skin tones, but I certainly don't feel they should have access to their hair options too.

    Also, you argued with Obelisk on many occasions that "void elves aren't high elves", now you're saying "yay alliance high elves will be playable". Obelisk even stated on several occasions that the high elf wayfarers in Telogrus Rift implied that high elves were joining the void elf ranks, but you and several others contended this and said "there's no proof, that's just your headcanon". Lo and behold, Taliesin makes a video saying the exact same thing and now y'all are like "high elves are joining the void elves so let's have those light skin and hair options". Again, congratulations on the win.. just don't be hypocritical.

    I'm an advocate for races maintaining unique aesthetics, it's what gives the whole race selection part of the game meaning and immersion. I personally don't want Nathanos style undead, as I agree that it kinda takes away from humans. I'd much rather dark ranger elf options, as they are a Horde feature and would be based of the Horde blood elf model. Likewise, Eredar for Horde? No thanks. Alteraci humans for Horde? No thanks. Moknathol? yes please. Same for san'layn and ogres.
    "Blood Elves are our High Elves"

    Still thinking that matters when it was said as a TBC hype gimmick and was obsolete when TBC launched. Not everything that is said on blizzcon or other kind of events are meant to be factual. Lot of what they say during these kind of events and promotions are just meant to be a hype factor. I guess 13 years of convincing evidence was finally enough to prove that citation wrong. Metzen himself didn't like the idea of Blood Elves in the Horde according to the Burning Crusade Behind the Scene(iirc the title) Makes you think how little stuff like those quotes matters.

    Just some more candy from 2012:
    "I'm trying to think of Horde races. I guess only blood elves feel like the odd man out for the Horde. I hope that we've engineered that into it as deftly as we could, but you know, it's the equivalent of a bunch of white chicks hanging out with goblin or tauren. It's weird. "

    What obelisk argued is non-canon yes, and Taliesin is wrong saying it is canon. It has not happened yet so as far as canon lore, no, Void Elves are still only former Blood Elves. It's a non-argueable fact. That it might happen in the future, like I and probably others have said, is a possibility. And the High Elf wayfarers in Telogrus only implies that they are interested in learning, and thats it. Not to mention the blue post about the change in customization says blood elf options for Void Elves.

    But, if they now make lore that shows the High Elf and Silvermoon Scholars can turn into Void Elves in a controlled matter like Alleria may explain the change in skin color for Void Elves. Someone tried to stir a discussion a couple of weeks ago when they said the new blue eyes for Void Elves was blizzard preparing for this event. That High Elves goes Void Elves. I don't think that was a "win" they wanted seeing Blizzard went all in on customization.

    Thalassian Elves are our High Elves btw. Since 2004.
    Last edited by Doffen; 2020-06-02 at 09:06 AM.
    Horde bad, smash monkey. Who is a good monkey? You are!

    Let loot be loot.

  9. #19449
    Quote Originally Posted by Doffen View Post
    "Blood Elves are our High Elves"

    Still thinking that matters when it was said as a TBC hype gimmick and was obsolete when TBC launched. Not everything that is said on blizzcon or other kind of events are meant to be factual. Lot of what they say during these kind of events and promotions are just meant to be a hype factor. I guess 13 years of convincing evidence was finally enough to prove that citation wrong. Metzen himself didn't like the idea of Blood Elves in the Horde according to the Burning Crusade Behind the Scene(iirc the title) Makes you think how little stuff like those quotes matters.

    Just some more candy from 2012:
    "I'm trying to think of Horde races. I guess only blood elves feel like the odd man out for the Horde. I hope that we've engineered that into it as deftly as we could, but you know, it's the equivalent of a bunch of white chicks hanging out with goblin or tauren. It's weird. "

    What obelisk argued is non-canon yes, and Taliesin is wrong saying it is canon. It has not happened yet so as far as canon lore, no, Void Elves are still only former Blood Elves. It's a non-argueable fact. That it might happen in the future, like I and probably others have said, is a possibility. And the High Elf wayfarers in Telogrus only implies that they are interested in learning, and thats it. Not to mention the blue post about the change in customization says blood elf options for Void Elves.

    But, if they now make lore that shows the High Elf and Silvermoon Scholars can turn into Void Elves in a controlled matter like Alleria may explain the change in skin color for Void Elves. Someone tried to stir a discussion a couple of weeks ago when they said the new blue eyes for Void Elves was blizzard preparing for this event. That High Elves goes Void Elves. I don't think that was a "win" they wanted seeing Blizzard went all in on customization.

    Thalassian Elves are our High Elves btw. Since 2004.
    Blood elves are our high elves. In fact, they are our main high elven society in the WoW universe. Sorry that this fact upsets you?

    Whether void elves are former blood elves or high elves doesn't really matter. The point I was making was that not even 2 weeks ago several posters in this thread argued against things that they now are backing.

    So far as the high elf race goes, there are three variants of the race being represented in game (blood elves, void elves, high elves), with blood elves being the main representation of the high elf race in WoW. Hence, blood elves are our high elves. It's quite simple.
    Blood elves are our high elves - Chris Metzen

  10. #19450
    Bloodsail Admiral Aldo Hawk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Location
    Silvermoon.
    Posts
    1,211
    Quote Originally Posted by Strippling View Post
    Blood elves are our high elves. In fact, they are our main high elven society in the WoW universe. Sorry that this fact upsets you?

    Whether void elves are former blood elves or high elves doesn't really matter. The point I was making was that not even 2 weeks ago several posters in this thread argued against things that they now are backing.

    So far as the high elf race goes, there are three variants of the race being represented in game (blood elves, void elves, high elves), with blood elves being the main representation of the high elf race in WoW. Hence, blood elves are our high elves. It's quite simple.
    Well, as I said, not bothering too much with this argument, I'm just answering to it by linking a previous explanation just so others can look at it since it has been clear you aren't open to acknowledge truth going against your way.

    This is a post I made explaining why what Strippling said about the Chris Metzen's phrase is wrong: https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...1#post52208550

  11. #19451
    Quote Originally Posted by Broflake View Post
    The blood elf theme has been pushed as being the high elf theme. The only thing that was ever missing was the blue eyes which was given to them. So it wasn't as if they gained that theme recently. They had it since TBC.
    The problem is the void elf change means they can play a void theme OR a high elf theme.

    So now, its a 2 to 1 situation.
    Simply because they don't bring anything design wise that is unique to themselves that separates them from those on the alliance. It is why MMOs almost never share races, not even skin colors, because aesthetics are such a powerful facet that it affects the way the game is perceived.

    So now, you have blood elves who...offer paladins. Which you can get thorugh zandalari/tauren as well. That's about it though, and Paladins aren't even a necessary or wanted class.
    Which velfers (because lets be real they never cared for high elves just the skins) also want.


    So...if a void elf gives me more than blood elves do? Why are blood elves even an option? Despite being the original option, they've become redundant and inferior.
    To be honest, because of all you mentioned, blood elves should never be added to the Horde in the first place. They did exactly what all anti-helfers are thinking high elves would do - they blurred the faction lines. As you say, blood elves do not belong to the Horde given their skins, given their aestetics, given them being centered around sophisticated culture, diplomacy and aristocracy. Horde was not centered around those traits, and it was never the main theme of the faction. On the other hand, Alliance was made on those principles. Now you can't blame people that they want to play high elves on the Alliance, when they fit in the faction and are even historicaly tied to the faction as well. Even night elves would fit in the Horde better for many reasons then blood elves.

    I remember that when Blizzard announced Blood elves on the Horde, majority of the Horde players were not happy with that. It took a while before they got used to elves on their faction, and there are still players who does not like them. I believe that if Blizzard decided to not add elves to the horde during TBC, almost nobody would want them on the red side now and there would be very little threads dedicated to the horde elves, on the contraty of the alliance high elves, which are non-ending request.

    I don't say Horde can't have access to high culture and fancy races. In fact, there are races which fits Horde pretty well and are build around those principles - Zandalari Trolls and even WoD ogres (while they are not really fancy, they had developed empire ruled by mages).

    Also, there are still many themes blood elves have and void elves will not have. Void elves abandoned Sunwell, it is no longer a thing for them. Sun, fire, light are all thematics which will be unique to blood elves. They will have to share something with void elves, but it was clear that they are going to share the minute void elves were announced as playable alliance allied race.
    Last edited by Vaedan; 2020-06-02 at 11:01 AM.

  12. #19452
    Quote Originally Posted by Aldo Hawk View Post
    Well, as I said, not bothering too much with this argument, I'm just answering to it by linking a previous explanation just so others can look at it since it has been clear you aren't open to acknowledge truth going against your way.

    This is a post I made explaining why what Strippling said about the Chris Metzen's phrase is wrong: https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...1#post52208550
    I never responded to your original response because you weighed your personal opinion on the matter too much. It's a simple statement.. "blood elves are our high elves". No amount of mental gymnastics changes the fact that they are the MAIN representation of the high elf race in WoW. Again, you can post 3 paragraphs or copy paste your 3 paragraph post, doesn't change the simplicity of the statement. Blood elves are the main representation of the high elf race in WoW, that is a factual statement and one that cannot be genuinely disputed. It's why Metzen stated what he did.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Vaedan View Post
    To be honest, because of all you mentioned, blood elves should never be added to the Horde in the first place. They did exactly what all anti-helfers are thinking high elves would do - they blurred the faction lines. As you say, blood elves do not belong to the Horde given their skins, given their aestetics, given them being centered around sophisticated culture, diplomacy and aristocracy. Horde was not centered around those traits, and it was never the main theme of the faction. On the other hand, Alliance was made on those principles. Now you can't blame people that they want to play high elves on the Alliance, when they fit in the faction and are even historicaly tied to the faction as well. Even night elves would fit in the Horde better for many reasons then blood elves.

    I remember that when Blizzard announced Blood elves on the Horde, majority of the Horde players were not happy with that. It took a while before they got used to elves on their faction, and there are still players who does not like them. I believe that if Blizzard decided to not add elves to the horde during TBC, almost nobody would want them on the red side now and there would be very little threads dedicated to the horde elves, on the contraty of the alliance high elves, which are non-ending request.

    I don't say Horde can't have access to high culture and fancy races. In fact, there are races which fits Horde pretty well and are build around those principles - Zandalari Trolls and even WoD ogres (while they are not really fancy, they had developed empire ruled by mages).

    Also, there are still many themes blood elves have and void elves will not have. Void elves abandoned Sunwell, it is no longer a thing for them. Sun, fire, light are all thematics which will be unique to blood elves. They will have to share something with void elves, but it was clear that they are going to share the minute void elves were announced as playable alliance allied race.
    In WCIII the high/blood elves did not have a good relationship with humans. In chronicles we learn that their relationship with humans was one of convenience and they weren't particularly fond of their alliance with humans. As soon as they could they rescinded their allegiance to the Alliance.

    Just because you feel blood elves never should have been added to the Horde does not make that notion correct. Given that their relationship with humans was fickle and given the actions of the humans toward them in WCIII, it wasn't unreasonable that they ended up joining the Horde. Some people cry "buh buh, the orcs attacked them why would they join them??". Well, the night elves attacked humans in WCIII yet they both ended up in the same faction.

    The alliance never had "claim" on the high elf race. Before WoW was even around the high elves (now known as blood elves) were no longer part of the Alliance, and if anything had a valid reason to wage war on the Alliance if they decided to do so. Arthas destroyed their city and Anduin claimed the Alliance as responsible for Arthas. Furthermore, Garithos attempted to execute them. Blood elves on the Horde made so much more sense than on the Alliance.

    The high elf race has been more represented with the Horde than the Alliance throughout the warcraft franchises lifetime.

    Also, in regards to the bold, tell that to the players asking for the "light infused" class (ie paladin) for void elves.
    Blood elves are our high elves - Chris Metzen

  13. #19453
    Bloodsail Admiral Aldo Hawk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Location
    Silvermoon.
    Posts
    1,211
    Quote Originally Posted by Strippling View Post
    I never responded to your original response because you weighed your personal opinion on the matter too much. It's a simple statement.. "blood elves are our high elves". No amount of mental gymnastics changes the fact that they are the MAIN representation of the high elf race in WoW. Again, you can post 3 paragraphs or copy paste your 3 paragraph post, doesn't change the simplicity of the statement. Blood elves are the main representation of the high elf race in WoW, that is a factual statement and one that cannot be genuinely disputed. It's why Metzen stated what he did.
    Yeah well all you have is to label my explanation as mental gymnastic when it is obviously a very simple explanation that faces your out of context use of the phrase and bury it on the ground where it belongs.

    I mean, you can see in the post that Chris mentions other fantasy worlds in a non specific manner, so yeah, my take on it is much more informed than yours that is just the parroting of one phrase and leaving it as a husked slogan of what it was to fit a new meaning inside it.

    'I think nobody has abused High elves to this degree' <--- Mentioning other fantasy worlds, AKA High elf as the broad term in fantasy.

    AKA High elves in wow are different than in other fantasy worlds and AKA Blood elves and High elves exist at the same time so even if the phrase means what you push for it meaning it actually would just be wrong, so yeah well.

    So excuse me if I don't stop by five mere seconds at your spiteful answers and take them seriously when it's obvious that this has become long ago just narrative pushing from your and other's part.

    I think at this point the mere fact that developers are introducing ways to actually play High elves should be a gargantuan 'I told you so' in the face of many people here, like you, Snoflake, and Obeskik Kairos.

  14. #19454
    Quote Originally Posted by Strippling View Post
    I never responded to your original response because you weighed your personal opinion on the matter too much. It's a simple statement.. "blood elves are our high elves". No amount of mental gymnastics changes the fact that they are the MAIN representation of the high elf race in WoW. Again, you can post 3 paragraphs or copy paste your 3 paragraph post, doesn't change the simplicity of the statement. Blood elves are the main representation of the high elf race in WoW, that is a factual statement and one that cannot be genuinely disputed. It's why Metzen stated what he did.

    - - - Updated - - -



    In WCIII the high/blood elves did not have a good relationship with humans. In chronicles we learn that their relationship with humans was one of convenience and they weren't particularly fond of their alliance with humans. As soon as they could they rescinded their allegiance to the Alliance.

    Just because you feel blood elves never should have been added to the Horde does not make that notion correct. Given that their relationship with humans was fickle and given the actions of the humans toward them in WCIII, it wasn't unreasonable that they ended up joining the Horde. Some people cry "buh buh, the orcs attacked them why would they join them??". Well, the night elves attacked humans in WCIII yet they both ended up in the same faction.

    The alliance never had "claim" on the high elf race. Before WoW was even around the high elves (now known as blood elves) were no longer part of the Alliance, and if anything had a valid reason to wage war on the Alliance if they decided to do so. Arthas destroyed their city and Anduin claimed the Alliance as responsible for Arthas. Furthermore, Garithos attempted to execute them. Blood elves on the Horde made so much more sense than on the Alliance.

    The high elf race has been more represented with the Horde than the Alliance throughout the warcraft franchises lifetime.

    Also, in regards to the bold, tell that to the players asking for the "light infused" class (ie paladin) for void elves.
    If you read what I wrote, I comment that blood elves does not belong to the Horde visually and thematicly and that they blurr the faction line in giving Horde features which are defining points of the Alliance. I do not say that they are wrong addition lorewise, but even that there are few BUTs:
    - you say humans attempted genocide. It was actually ONE human (Garithos), not the nation of humans as whole. On the other hand, ORCS commited genocide on elves and burned their forest during Second War.
    - Trolls are nemesis of thalassians. Elves hate trolls very much. If you say that Darkspear are different trolls to those who elves hate, then I say stormwindian humans are different to those who followed Garithos. If the elves can move past centuries long hatred, then I see no reason why should they bear hatred towards humans.
    - in WC3, night elves were actually pretty friendly towards blood elves. This grudge they have towards each other is purely WoW thing.

    I never said blood elves had great relations with humans at the end of WC3. Based on WC3, it was clear that elves have issue with humans, but there are plenty of ways of what to do with this, blood elves joining Horde was not the only solution, but I don't deny that it was lore that made it happen. If anything, WC set up blood elves more as morally grey characters, which could still easily end up in the Alliance. We all know that the main reason why blood elves went to the Horde was gameplay. Blizzard needed a race with ties to Outland and which can give paladins to the Horde, and one with ties to the Outland and which can give shamans to the Alliance.

    My point is that blood elves definitely changed the Horde. In my view, they damaged the Horde identity since they lack any defining point of the Horde, and are more relatable as Alliance race. You say Alliance never had a claim on the high elf race... well, perhaps not. But still elves are more natural on the Alliance than on the Horde, which before TBC had even lesser claim on the elf race than the Alliance, which actually had some history and lore tied to the elves.

    As for velf paladins... I would accept them only as a "void knight" class skin if that ever happens, I would be much more happy to see void elf and nightborne demon hunters tbh. Even Ion said it does not make sense to have void elf paladin few years ago, and while everything can change, this is not likely the case.

    For alliance elf paladin fantasy, night elves make much more interesting option. I can easily relate to night elves seeking retribution for Burning of Teldrassil, harnessing power of Black Moon.
    Last edited by Vaedan; 2020-06-02 at 12:59 PM.

  15. #19455
    Bloodsail Admiral elbleuet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Quel'Danil Lodge
    Posts
    1,009
    Arthas acted on behalf of the Scourge (you know... an evil faction). And when he did this, he was undead and no longer human.

    So claiming the Alliance is responsible is pure nonsense.

    The elves lost their homeland, but the Alliance lost Arthas, Terenas, Uther, Antonidas but also 2 major kingdoms.

    And yes. High elves are an iconic Alliance race. That's precisely why Blizzard gave us your thalassian model, but also the possibility to unlock high elf costumizations.
    "If you want to play alongside High and Void elves, the Alliance is waiting for you"

  16. #19456
    Quote Originally Posted by Starla View Post
    With absolutely no proof or evidence you feel free to share this feeling? It's kind of sad because it just comes off as insensitivity to the people who love the races they play and have been given little attention.

    Also I wasn't addressing you but another person.
    I wasn't trying to be insensitive, I was trying to inspire hope

    The only "evidence" I have, if you can even call it that (I wouldn't), is that it seems rather odd to me that Blizzard would focus on a single allied race for such attention, when the other three of the initial batch are also in dire need of additional options, and the method Blizzard is using for Void Elves (simply inheriting existing stuff rather than having new stuff made) is a much quicker and easier thing to do compared to making entirely new assets. In a lot of cases (but not every case), it's as simple a matter as copy/pasting some files into a folder and maybe adding some entries to an index.

    I also have another "feeling/instinct/prediction" (whatever you want to call it) that one reason this might be happening for Void Elves (and why it may happen for other allied races) is that more time has become available with the cancellation of Blizzcon. I expected Shadowlands to launch before Blizzcon of this year. With its cancellation, it's no longer a deadline for Blizzard nor do the artists need to take time away from Shadowlands development to make things to show off at Blizzcon. While I do not work for Blizzard, I do have some background in game development, and I'd guess that Blizzcon's cancellation has gained Blizzard at least a month of additional dev time for Shadowlands even without having to move up the release date.

    I realize that's all assumption and opinion on my part. I fully admit that. But I felt that sharing my thoughts with you might have offered you some comfort and maybe inspire some hope for you. I apologize if they did the opposite.
    Last edited by Kyriani; 2020-06-03 at 02:29 AM.

  17. #19457
    Bloodsail Admiral Ardenaso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Location
    Philippines
    Posts
    1,158
    Quote Originally Posted by Rathwell View Post
    I don't know the lore all that well, so I'll start this question by first explaining my understanding of events that lead me to the question in the first place:

    So, as far as I understand, the High Elves were dependent on the Sunwell throughout the RTS games until Arthas destroyed it. Then, the High Elves (soon renamed the Blood Elves) went through withdrawal due to some sort of a magic addiction that they now struggled to sate. They started to feed on alternate forms of magic, occasionally the fel, leading to corruptions such as their green eyes and things of that nature. They drained mana from living things, like those mana wyrms.

    So here's my question...

    What about the High Elves that never joined the Blood Elves of Quel'thalas? The High Elves that remained with the Alliance? The Silver Covenant, the Quel'danis Lodge, all the random High Elves wayfarers we see. Were they not equally affected by the destruction of the Sunwell?

    The Blood Elves found alternate forms of magic to feed on, but does this then apply to the High Elves of the Alliance too? Were there those green demonic pillars hidden somewhere that they fed on, like the green pylons in Silvermoon City? If not, how did they sate the hunger?
    You should delete your post and ask here instead. This is the High Elf megathread and this is where you ask all things High Elf. Don't make the same mistake as I did before

    - - - Updated - - -

    Anyway, the High Elves also hoarded mana crystals away from the Blood Elves which greatly contributed to their exile
    Lightbound Orcs > High Elves https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...ace-suggestion

    Blizzard should realize that Alteraci Humans will fulfill the Young Adult Dystopia Anarchy fantasy for Warcraft

  18. #19458
    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    Arthas acted on behalf of the Scourge (you know... an evil faction). And when he did this, he was undead and no longer human.

    So claiming the Alliance is responsible is pure nonsense.

    The elves lost their homeland, but the Alliance lost Arthas, Terenas, Uther, Antonidas but also 2 major kingdoms.

    And yes. High elves are an iconic Alliance race. That's precisely why Blizzard gave us your thalassian model, but also the possibility to unlock high elf costumizations.
    This. Claiming Alliance was responsible for Arthas is truly nonsense. What Anduin meant is that Alliance also born evil and non tolerant characters like Arthas and Daelin and thus is also part of the cycle of hatred. The fact that most of the shit Arthas has done was under the Scourge banner is undisputable, and thus Alliance is no longer responsible for that. It is like saying Horde is responsible for Legion's Invasion, since it was caused by Gul'dan, which used to be part of the Horde.

  19. #19459
    Quote Originally Posted by elbleuet View Post
    Arthas acted on behalf of the Scourge (you know... an evil faction). And when he did this, he was undead and no longer human.
    It's so weird when people try to blame the Alliance for Arthas' actions.

    Arthas never led the Alliance in his campaign against the other races. It wasn't an Alliance army that invaded Quel'thalas or sacked Dalaran. The Alliance was actually the first victim of Arthas, with it being betrayed from within and having its forces killed and scattered. The almost entirety of the Scourge campaign in WC3:RoC is Arthas destroying every Alliance force or nation in his path.

    Garithos at least was leading a warband of Alliance troops, so you can blame the Alliance for following his lead and granting him troops. That's not the case of Arthas. Even the campaign in Northrend, before he returned to attack everyone, was unsanctioned.
    Whatever...

  20. #19460
    Bloodsail Admiral Ardenaso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Location
    Philippines
    Posts
    1,158
    I just realized this: I haven't seen any reaction from the High Elf NPCs about Kael'thas' betrayal and death
    Lightbound Orcs > High Elves https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...ace-suggestion

    Blizzard should realize that Alteraci Humans will fulfill the Young Adult Dystopia Anarchy fantasy for Warcraft

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •