Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Frenchvince]

so you mean everything that makes a blood elf look blood elf.

So I mean everything that makes a high elf look like a high elf ...
We just want natural hair colors, not necessarily those of the blood elves, but with different shades, which will do the trick to make a high elf.
The other customization options (hairstyles, jewelry, beard, ect ...) will necessarily be different from the blood elves, they will receive them later like all allied races.

[ravenmoon]

A slap in the face to both blood elf and Horde players, whether you think so or not.

And how was blood elves going Horde a slap in the face to alliance fans? WCIII setup the blood elves leaving the Alliance. Coming into WoW the blood elves were no longer a part of the Alliance. There were remnants of the high elf race who were friendly with the Alliance, but as we see today, these remnants are no more prominent in the Alliance today than they were 15 years ago. The high elf race became the blood elves, who left the alliance, a few remnants remained with the Alliance but they have had a minor contribution to the Alliance story line. The only people who view blood elves as an iconic alliance race are those who can't get over the fact the 15+ years ago Blizzard decided to break the standard fantasy trope and move the high elf story in another direction. Those who think the remnants of that group who are still with the ALliance are iconic are also ignorant or stubborn. If high elves were so iconic to the Alliance then why have they never been playable? Blizzard clearly doesn't view them as an iconic alliance race. Their actions say so. Blizzard view the blood elves as the continuation of the high elven race (following WCIII), hence why their efforts have for the last decade have been put into blood elves. They've told stories of the fractured group who chose to stay with the Alliance, but they clearly aren't iconic. If you think they are iconic then that is simply a product of your head canon. IF they were so iconic to the Alliance then explain to me why they were never made a playable option to the Alliance? Seriously, explain that to me (without inputting your head canon).

Void elves were made playable as opposed to high elves. What does that tell you? Yet apparently they're iconic...? Blizzard have decided to give a light skinned variant to the void elves, but they are still void elves at the end of the day. Seriously, explain to me how high elves are an iconic alliance race if they have never been playable and have had less input than gnomes.

The "iconic" high elf race went a different direction, they became the blood elves. The blood elves left the Alliance prior to WoW, so them going Horde was never a "slap in the face to alliance fans". Night elves are the iconic alliance elf race. Furthermore, chronicles explains how the high elves always had a fickle relationship with the alliance, concreting the fact that they are not iconic.

ANd yes, there are a group of high elves who have remained loyal to the Alliance. But they are not an "iconic" feature of the Alliance, they are a minor addition. Hence why void elves are getting "high elf like" customizations, as opposed to an iconic alliance high elf playable race. The blood elves are our high elves.

So, when it comes to racial differentiation.. each playable race should have something unique to them. It's what makes the whole "character selection" process special. Else might as well just make humans and orcs with options to customize pointy ears, human skin colors, tusks, tails, etc... With void elves getting the blood elf skins, if they were to get their hair options too then the blood elves would lose that uniqueness. The only reason you don't see people arguing for "dwarf customizations" on Horde or "orcs on alliance" is because those races are "ugly". People want the pretty races, the statistics show us this... and blood elves are easily the "prettiest race" in the game, hence why the alliance have wanted this aesthestic since it came around in TBC.

So, if blizzard choose to give the hair options too then it's only fair that blood elves are compensated with something to make them unique from void elves. One thing that could be is dark ranger aesthetics. Though ultimately, in my opinion the blood elf hair options should remain with them. You can choose to disagree, but that doesn't invalidate my view on the matter.

I'm just saying we should stop viewing it like this, blizzard we re the ones clearly porting elves over the faction lines, and it's their right to do so. truth is neither belong to us or the factions, but where blizzard puts them, but slap in the face sentiments go both ways, and you should realise that alliance fans have felt the same way ou might be feeling now and have had to put up with it for much longer.

- - - Updated - - -

I really like your reasoning and how you present your arguments(yes I have said so before), but it all makes sense in the way you describe it.

Horde getting Blood Elves was controversial, even at blizzard. Metzen himself said it was weird. Then 20 months later they added a proper group of High Elves who loathed the Horde. 10 years later they added a group of Blood Elves joining the Alliance. And 12 years later they now add Blood Elf skin tones to Void Elves. It's been a long road for the "pale elves on the Alliance" group of people. But its here now. Together with increased customization.

It's just as controversial(no, not really) that Alliance now can be pale thalassian elves that it was controversial that Blood Elves joined the Horde. To the group of people who say now its a slap in the face, you still have your elves. No one is taking anything from you. They just give the other group more of the stuff they wanted. It just reeks entitlement all the way.

And for those who are now "hurt" by this, good riddance. They have been sailing on the confidence of blizzards words(their skewed interpretation that is) and being arrogant long enough. It's time to get down to earth.

Exactly, it surprises me how people can never see things from the other sides point of view.

Why do you think i've always ben okay with alliance getting high elf customisations,a nd i vehemently oppose those who want the night elven assets on the Nightborne to remain exclusively horde, though I understand the sentiment and where they are coing from - but it's not horde's to begin with, those alliance goons have equal right, well more right to it - seeing the night elf race has been on the alliance much longer - but the same annoyance night elf fans felt when the nightborne went horde is waht they woudl be feeling now, but they should let go and should know by now this happens, they got it fromt he alliance.. blizzard did the cross faction thing. They could have created a beatuiful new horde race given it cool architecture too, but no, they took the high elves, as blood elves and made it horde, and did the same with the night elves as nightborne and made it horde too. Void e lves could have been horde Lightforged, Broken or Eredar Man'ari - or a new race, like Nathrezim army of light - but they did that to the elves.

Do they honestly think alliance high elf and night elf fans are going to be okay with the coolest assets showing up on the horde only? Nicer models only exlusive to them, the prettier assets and cities in the present timeline all horde - ? Ofc not, so you will continue to see requests only for this, not for Zandalari trolls or Atal'dazar as gorgeous as it is, we all know it's troll and that's horde

[yana]

--- snip ---

because I actually like modern night elves as they are and don't want them to be nightborne or thalassians.
Go play those and be at peace if you want suramar so badly, i want more stuff like valsharah and the vault of the wardens not nightborne scraps

Mod Edit: In the future, don't quote a giant post for a 2-sentence reply, pare it down a bit.

[Ignaz]

if there is nothing conflicting with "real world shenanigans" there is no reason to not use then, in determinate subject.

if with "real world shenanigans" you mean the logic of the real world. It interferes by contradicting known scientific principles.

Still is, and while models do that in an extent, there is far worse "violations", that we can and should avoid

can and should sound like a dictatorship to me. If I want to request playable orcs for the alliance, I have every right to make the request. From there to Blizzard to do it, it's another story.
Also, that premise has already been violated and it would be hypocritical to sustain the rhetoric of faction identity for one situation but not for another (even when I believe that the introduction of Helves as a playable race for the alliance would further reaffirm the identity of each faction - you know , blue for the alliance and red for the horde)

there is no difference with the elves we are talking about

Observation denies your point

those logic and common sense, can use real world science

Not in a fantasy world, as multiple people have already shown you with multiple examples that you have not wanted to accept, even when they are fully verifiable

isn't a fallacy is "word of god", like i said, call retcon but its the truth and the canon now

The Pope or God could have said it, but that does not deny the fact that it is a fallacy

Fallacy

and their children didn't inherit, there is children with fel taint because they were also around the energies, its not something they born with

Proof (source)

we are just not in the same page.

Surely we are not. But that's the magic of debate

im not confusing, im saying they are related

At some point, the hairs of the ass are related to the eyelashes because they are parts of the body, which does not mean that they have a relevant relation.
Conditioning has nothing to do with our genes. Obviously, if you have a genetic disease; that will condition you and affect your performance, but it is a mistake to take these biological "phenomena" as a rule, since they are isolated cases epidemiologically speaking.
Normally, a normal human being (according to their proportion) is capable of having the same "proportional" performance as another normal human being, as long as they do the job correctly.

there is "diseases" called Bardet-Biedl syndrome and Prader-Willi and monogenic obesity, genes that cause predisposition to obesity

there are no genes that predispose you to obesity, the poor resolution in their combinations is what causes these conditioning diseases.
Bardet-Biedl syndrome (which causes organ failure) has a prevalence of less than 1/100000, and Prader-Willi syndrome (which causes hormonal imbalance) has a prevalence of 1 / 15,000 - 1 / 30,000. epidemiologically speaking, they are extremely abnormal cases (and those numbers are taken from places where it happens more frequently), that is why we cannot use it as an example to explain a normal situation.

there is no confusion, but its all related, something you are firmly denying it

I do not deny that there is a relation, but it is not relevant to the action as I explained above

[ravenmoon]

because I actually like modern night elves as they are and don't want them to be nightborne or thalassians.
Go play those and be at peace if you want suramar so badly, i want more stuff like valsharah and the vault of the wardens not nightborne scraps

Haha, who are you kidding, you're a well known horde supporter, you want so called modern night elves in trees and caves only, you attribute night elven civilization to only horde elves and are joining the crowd making excuses as to why night elves, "modern" night elves, who are quite the ancient race with a full kit of assets for urban and rural settings, can't use their racial urban set, but should only use the rural one.

You're not fooling me. I like all the sets associated with the night elves, I don't want night elf cities to be made of rural building architecture when I've seen how incredible they've designed their urban sets in Suramar and Zin'Azshari warbringers - forest homes for forest, each group and section of the night elves has a stiyle associated with it for it's location and those who live there.


When it comes to a city, you don't use village buildings or country/rural ones. And don't expect night elf fans to want something less than the best blizzard has designed for them, or do you think they are okay with the best night elf assets being exclusively horde so you can brag and feel superior over something that is taken from the other faction for you. The way I interpret the night elf scene is that if you truly love forest you want them pure and forest, not the place to be making homes - I can understand a few if you've got to live there or you are raising a family, but urbanising a forest - doesn't seem night elven forest lover. If you're not a forest lover, or not a druid, you wouldn't want to live in a forest or what your homes as forest, not to mention you can still like the forest for what it is, but also like other things too. Personally I love both forests, nature and city. What I hate about cities is not beautiful buildings, great buildings or elegant homes, but pollution, crime, greedy corporate types etc. I love having gardens and parks in cities but I know no forest lover who wants his forest turned into a city, and would rather have the large numbers of people that need to work and live together be in a city designed for that

You people have been doing that over high elves for ages, coming up with silly meaningless excuses why alliance elves can't get that appearance, all you wanted was to keep what was an alliance race and was very pretty exclusive to your faction when it wasn't from there to start with and was still on the opposing faction. Excuses like there are too few high elves yet, all the high elves are blood elves, high elves aren't on the alliance, the horde will lose it's population if blizzard did that. The alliance betrayed the high elves, the high elves were never really on the alliance.

And you're doing it with the night elves too - "night elves no longer live in such cities" " night elves are culturally changed that means they can't live in pretty cities, "night elves love harmony with nature, so living in a pretty city somehow measn they do not", "modern night elf architecture is different - so let's ignore Darnasus, and lets ignore the "modern" architecture that shows up in presudnering ics and rural settings too", "night elves hate the arcane and shun that lifestyle - so naturally means they can't live in beautiful cities they built"... bogus nonsense, all a pretext too - "horde has these lovely assets, alliance you can't have them" meanwhile alliance fans are like "you realise all those things belong to the night elves and high elves right

[Ardenaso]

because I actually like modern night elves as they are and don't want them to be nightborne or thalassians.
Go play those and be at peace if you want suramar so badly, i want more stuff like valsharah and the vault of the wardens not nightborne scraps

well you can still have those and your rights aren't gonna be taken away if they implement Shen'dralar themes to the Night Elves, never mind the fact that they already exist since Vanilla and joined the Alliance since Cataclysm - long before Nightborne were a thing

[yana]

Haha, who are you kidding, you're a well known horde supporter, you wan so called modern night elves in trees and caves only, you attribute night elven civilization to only horde elves and are joining the crowd making excuses as to why night elves, modern night elves, who are quite the ancient race with a full ki of assets for urban and rural settings, can't use their racial urban set, but should only use the rural one.

You're not fooling me. I like all the sets associated with the night elves, I don't want night elf cities to be made of rural building architecture when I've seen how incredible they've designed their urban sets in Suramar and Zin'Azshari warbringers - forest homes for forest, each group and section of the night elves has a stiyle associated with it for it's location and those who live there.


When it comes to a city, you don't use village buildings or country/rural ones. And don't expect night elf fans to want something less than the best blizzard has designed for them, or do you think they are okay with the best night elf assets being exclusively horde so you can brag and feel superior over something that is taken from the other faction for you.

You people have been doing that over high elves for ages, coming up with silly meaningless excuses why alliance elves can't get that appearance, all you wanted was to keep what was an alliance race and was very pretty exclusive to your faction when it wasn't from there to start with and was still on the opposing faction. Excuses like there are too few high elves yet, all the high elves are blood elves, high elves aren't on the alliance, the horde will lose it's population if blizzard did that. The alliance betrayed the high elves, the high elves were never really on the alliance.

And you're doing it with the night elves too - "night elves no longer live in such cities" " night elves are culturally changed that means they can't live in pretty cities, "night elves love harmony with nature, so living in a pretty city somehow measn they do not", "modern night elf architecture is different - so let's ignore Darnasus, and lets ignore the "modern" architecture that shows up in presudnering ics and rural settings too", "night elves hate the arcane and shun that lifestyle - so naturally means they can't live in beautiful cities they built"... bogus nonsense, all a pretext too - "horde has these lovely assets, alliance you can't have them" meanwhile alliance fans are like "you realise all those things belong to the night elves and high elves right

because caves and trees are places where they can live without destroying or removing large swats of wildland and forests??? wich is their core pathos as a society, to defend the world and to protect their forests and the wilds within their territory, creating a city like suramar that is just sterile complex of stone with some arcane made gardens for decoration or a zoo to trap wild animals and use them as a live exhibiition are anthethical to the darnassian kaldorei.
Tyrande would never aprove of a city that would require the unecessary destruction of the trees and groves they have gone to war to protect.That's your problem, you can't seem to grasp that THEY HAVE changed, their priorities and prespective are simply not the same as it was during the empire.
they as a people don't seem to care about extravagant constructions, it's all about balance with nature wich isn't exactly prone to destruction and mining to create pretty arches and domes.

[Mace]

because caves and trees are places where they can live without destroying or removing large swats of wildland and forests??? wich is their core pathos as a society, to defend the world and to protect their forests and the wilds within their territory, creating a city like suramar that is just sterile complex of stone with some arcane made gardens for decoration or a zoo to trap wild animals and use them as a live exhibiition are anthethical to the darnassian kaldorei.
Tyrande would never aprove of a city that would require the unecessary destruction of the trees and groves they have gone to war to protect.That's your problem, you can't seem to grasp that THEY HAVE changed, their priorities and prespective are simply not the same as it was during the empire.
they as a people don't seem to care about extravagant constructions, it's all about balance with nature wich isn't exactly prone to destruction and mining to create pretty arches and domes.

I suppose you could argue that using wood for homes is also against the forest, and they should use other things. Then argue that hunting aanimals is against the night elves, because it hurts animals. Night elves are not D.E.H.T.A, not even most druids.

But according to your argument, night elves would never permit or allow any habitation to take place, because of those reasons.

This is so DUMB - you do not understand this race at all, and you use certain aspects of them to make bad assertions and arguments.

I didn't see them hesistating when building Darnassus, Astrannar and other places - but you are just proving to me that this is what you think of night elves, and I'm here to tell you, this is not what night elves are. IF you want a pure forest race of people, look to other fantasies or what the Ardenweald has to offer. If you want a savage race, you have Worgen, trolls and races designed for that.

Don't just..

You know what, carry on. I refuse to waste my time on ridiculous red herrings and troll bait.

[ravenmoon]

because caves and trees are places where they can live without destroying or removing large swats of wildland and forests??? wich is their core pathos as a society, to defend the world and to protect their forests and the wilds within their territory, creating a city like suramar that is just sterile complex of stone with some arcane made gardens for decoration or a zoo to trap wild animals and use them as a live exhibiition are anthethical to the darnassian kaldorei.
Tyrande would never aprove of a city that would require the unecessary destruction of the trees and groves they have gone to war to protect.That's your problem, you can't seem to grasp that THEY HAVE changed, their priorities and prespective are simply not the same as it was during the empire.
they as a people don't seem to care about extravagant constructions, it's all about balance with nature wich isn't exactly prone to destruction and mining to create pretty arches and domes.

Sounds like another lame excuse for night elves not live in cities, and to force them all to live like some druids.

Not sure you are understanding night elves. Loving nature, and living in harmony doesn’t mean you don’t make homes to live in whether city or villages, nor does it mean you don’t eat meat and hunt game for food and clothes and use what nature provides whether leaves, stones , wood , marble or metal , just as it doesn’t mean you avoid using wood because you love trees and it might harm them.

Some druids might be like that, but not all, and not all night elves are druids.

You can have cities and eat meat and still love nature and living in harmony. What night elves won’t do is abuse nature – just like they won’t abuse magic, un-necessarily harm or destroy nature callously - they will make nature make room for them..

With druids it’s even better, because no tree needs to be sacrificed to make a city, they just move the tree somewhere else.

Secondly, there are lots of places that have open spaces for cities. You don’t have to clear a forest to make a city – so I’m not sure.

In fact because they have magic, both nature and arcane, their cities and habitations are likely able to be the most harmonised with nature, using magic to extract materials and shape the materials, using magic to ensure nothing is harmed and properly utilising natural materials.

But you have the wrong idea of night elves if you think they don’t utilise resources including nature, trees, animals - and you also err if you feel that building great cities is some ethical violation of the race.

- - - Updated - - -

I suppose you could argue that using wood for homes is also against the forest, and they should use other things. Then argue that hunting aanimals is against the night elves, because it hurts animals. Night elves are not D.E.H.T.A, not even most druids.

But according to your argument, night elves would never permit or allow any habitation to take place, because of those reasons.

This is so DUMB - you do not understand this race at all, and you use certain aspects of them to make bad assertions and arguments.

I didn't see them hesistating when building Darnassus, Astrannar and other places - but you are just proving to me that this is what you think of night elves, and I'm here to tell you, this is not what night elves are. IF you want a pure forest race of people, look to other fantasies or what the Ardenweald has to offer. If you want a savage race, you have Worgen, trolls and races designed for that.

Don't just..

You know what, carry on. I refuse to waste my time on ridiculous red herrings and troll bait.

Wish I could control myself and just stop, i know some of the points are so daft

[Syegfryed]

if with "real world shenanigans" you mean the logic of the real world. It interferes by contradicting known scientific principles.

things doesn't always contradict, in wow there still gravity and works like ours, people die by hungry, by hypothermia, etc

can and should sound like a dictatorship to me. If I want to request playable orcs for the alliance, I have every right to make the request. From there to Blizzard to do it, it's another story.

Its a game of a company that you have to pay to play, of couse is a dicatatorship, and you are free to request that, and we are free to be against that

Also, that premise has already been violated and it would be hypocritical to sustain the rhetoric of faction identity for one situation but not for another

not rly, one mistake isn't the open door to keep doing until things went to shit, "oh well he already killed someone, no problem in him doing a little more yes?"

Observation denies your point

not observation, canon lore and blizzard said there is no difference, everything else is made up

Not in a fantasy world, as multiple people have already shown you with multiple examples that you have not wanted to accept, even when they are fully verifiable

like i said gravity is still exist, others exist, there is no reason to not use then if there is nothing directly contradicting

The Pope or God could have said it, but that does not deny the fact that it is a fallacy

Fallacy

word of god is a term used to say when the autor of the story tells something, isn't a fallacy, is the absolute truth, be in retcons or with addition of more lore later, it can contradict past events, but its how things are

Proof (source)

those children were already born in quel'thalas the time they were using the crystals

At some point, the hairs of the ass are related to the eyelashes because they are parts of the body, which does not mean that they have a relevant relation.

maybe not in one determinate premise, and could be relevant in another, thats the thing

Conditioning has nothing to do with our genes.

and im saying there is, it will always have to do with then

Normally, a normal human being (according to their proportion) is capable of having the same "proportional" performance as another normal human being, as long as they do the job correctly.

Let alone all of this is possible because of his genetic code, yes

but there is sometimes, people that have better time in the conditioning, than others

there are no genes that predispose you to obesity, the poor resolution in their combinations is what causes these conditioning diseases.

when i said genes, i implies you knew i was talking about the entire thing, combinations, deletions, additions, is everything related, like i said we were not in the same page

epidemiologically speaking, they are extremely abnormal cases (and those numbers are taken from places where it happens more frequently), that is why we cannot use it as an example to explain a normal situation.

they are exaggerations to show the point isn't invalid, there is genes/combinations yada yada, that give you predisposition to something, and it can affect your conditioning

I do not deny that there is a relation, but it is not relevant to the action as I explained above

i think is relevant

[Ignaz]

things doesn't always contradict, in wow there still gravity and works like ours, people die by hungry, by hypothermia, etc

not even gravity works the same way in wow; That is why you can see animals the size of a bus flying only with a flapping of wings that due to their size would not proportionally apply the necessary force to lift that weight. I have not seen the first case of characters starving and I have seen NPCs that can be in an ice crown with outfits not suitable for extreme climates in that region, etc.

Its a game of a company that you have to pay to play, of couse is a dicatatorship, and you are free to request that, and we are free to be against that

It is not a dictatorship, precisely because we pay to play. If I don't like it, I simply file a complaint or stop paying my subscription.

You are free to be against a request, but you have no right to tell others that they cannot request something they want just because you don't want it

not rly, one mistake isn't the open door to keep doing until things went to shit, "oh well he already killed someone, no problem in him doing a little more yes?"

Congratulations, you use an analogy, in the form of a fallacy
If you consider a decision a mistake, it does not mean that it is a mistake. For that, there are consensus where a majority decides what is wrong and what is right based on common sense. That is why we are considered political animals (or animals with the ability to do politics, to be correct).
Example: As I told you before, I do not consider Helves' integration as a playable race for the alliance to be a violation of faction identity, but rather an affirmation of the difference between the factions; as it has been demonstrated throughout the different campaigns where you can find Helves on the side of the alliance and Belves on the side of the horde.
Also (and personally), I consider the Velves to be a whimsical Blizzard mistake.
Does that mean I'm right? nope. Only a consensus with common sense and logic could prove me right.

not observation, canon lore and blizzard said there is no difference, everything else is made up

Made up like the game itself.

like i said gravity is still exist, others exist, there is no reason to not use then if there is nothing directly contradicting

But there is a direct contradiction; that is the point. they even contradict their own narrative

word of god is a term used to say when the autor of the story tells something, isn't a fallacy, is the absolute truth, be in retcons or with addition of more lore later, it can contradict past events, but its how things are

I repeat. Whoever can say it, but if for the consensus of common sense it lacks logic and is used as an excuse, it is a fallacy.

those children were already born in quel'thalas the time they were using the crystals

Proof (source) that they do not inherit their skin color, but that they acquire it by radiation.

maybe not in one determinate premise, and could be relevant in another, thats the thing

Exactly. Therefore, for the premise we are using, it ends up being irrelevant to the point of absurdity. That's what i tried to explain to you

and im saying there is, it will always have to do with then

Prove it, then. And with reliable sources pls.

Let alone all of this is possible because of his genetic code, yes

but there is sometimes, people that have better time in the conditioning, than others

you are taking the genes as if they were stats. This is not how genes work, and if you think otherwise, try to prove it with reliable sources so that we can all understand your logic.

when i said genes, i implies you knew i was talking about the entire thing, combinations, deletions, additions, is everything related, like i said we were not in the same page

No. if you talk to me about cars I will understand that you talk about cars, not about the automotive industry.
In scientific language you cannot leave anything implicit.

they are exaggerations to show the point isn't invalid, there is genes/combinations yada yada, that give you predisposition to something, and it can affect your conditioning

Read again.

i think is relevant

So, explain to me how an individual from a study population of 100,000 people who suffers from a conditioning disease can be used as an example to compare a whole population of healthy humans.
Show me the power of your ''relevance''

[yana]

I suppose you could argue that using wood for homes is also against the forest, and they should use other things. Then argue that hunting aanimals is against the night elves, because it hurts animals. Night elves are not D.E.H.T.A, not even most druids.

But according to your argument, night elves would never permit or allow any habitation to take place, because of those reasons.

This is so DUMB - you do not understand this race at all, and you use certain aspects of them to make bad assertions and arguments.

I didn't see them hesistating when building Darnassus, Astrannar and other places - but you are just proving to me that this is what you think of night elves, and I'm here to tell you, this is not what night elves are. IF you want a pure forest race of people, look to other fantasies or what the Ardenweald has to offer. If you want a savage race, you have Worgen, trolls and races designed for that.

Don't just..

You know what, carry on. I refuse to waste my time on ridiculous red herrings and troll bait.

can you also start refusing to waste your time on headcanon that will never be seen as anything but headcanon by pretty much 99.9 % of the playerbase and most likel 100 % of the devs ? or maybe understand that you need to play a nightborne to achieve the nirvana of magical elfiness in purple you so desire to twist the kaldorei into?
and yeah. I cant wait for tyrande in ardenweald , ya know, THE face of race

[Varodoc]

Anyone planning to roleplay a high elf from Dalaran? Are the Silver Covenant still there after their base was replaced by the worgen in Legion?

[Aucald]

This thread is about High Elves primarily, not a debate about the history or culture of Night Elves. Let's return to the primary topic at hand and not derail this thread further.

[delus]

Anyone planning to roleplay a high elf from Dalaran? Are the Silver Covenant still there after their base was replaced by the worgen in Legion?

According to the three sisters comic which came after legion and the Suramar questline the answer appears to be yes.

- - - Updated - - -

I hadn't seen that post. Nice trolling though, great sport you are /thumbs up.

And in regards to "human undead skin options", I'd personally rather see dark ranger customization options. They could be given to the blood elves which then offer a level a fairness (the void elves having light skin and void options, and the blood elves having light skin and dark ranger options).

- - - Updated - - -



I never said impossible, i said highly unlikely. Though I must admit this development was a surprise. Your condescending tone is noted though.

- - - Updated - - -



I appreciate that you at least acknowledge the glaring would be issue if void elves get the blood elf hair options. If blizzard do choose to go down that route then it'd be a slap in the face to blood elves who'd essentially loose all their customizations to the void elves, while on top of that the void elves having their own unique custimizations that blood elves certainly wouldn't have (void customizations). I'm going to assume that jewelry and ear size options will also be given to void elves at some point. At that stage the blood elves would have lost all uniqueness yet the void elves would still have something unique (their void customizations). Furthermore, void elves (not high elves but void elves) would have more "high elf" like customization options then "void" customization options. Imagine giving nightborne druidic options to the extent that they had more "druidic or night elven" options than nightborne options. It'd completely defeat the concept and fundamental aspect of that race.

So, in order to prevent taking away everything unique from the blood elves, I feel a compromise would be to either A) not give void elves the blood elf hair options (that way they can be differentiated by their darker hair colors which fit the void theme), or B) give blood elves a suite of dark ranger options to provide something unique to them. Else the void elves would have the blood elf customizations PLUS their own unique void customizations.

Then give blood elves light customization options.

[ravenmoon]

can you also start refusing to waste your time on headcanon that will never be seen as anything but headcanon by pretty much 99.9 % of the playerbase and most likel 100 % of the devs ? or maybe understand that you need to play a nightborne to achieve the nirvana of magical elfiness in purple you so desire to twist the kaldorei into?
and yeah. I cant wait for tyrande in ardenweald , ya know, THE face of race

You are being unfair to him and me, just because you and most of the horde fan base on this topic on this forum don't agree, doesn't make it 99.9% of what the playerbase like or want, let alone the devs who actually make the stuff and have a much better grasp of the race than you would as a fan. Even amongst the devs it would vary based on what they worked on, a systems team guy wouldn't know as much as an arts guy unless he was curious and neither would know as much as a creative/lore guy. Even amongst the lore guys, knoweldge would vary.

As for fans, so far we are dealing with 3 main categories on this.
1. Those who really like night elves and elves on the alliance, like myself, mace, ardensao etc, these would want the best available stuff for night elves that is around or can be designed - they would prefer Zin'Azshari/Suramar type cities - than one full of rural buildings and forest home trees which they feel has its place in that setting, not for a city - but if they got the latter and it was pretty they'd accept it, but it would not have been their first choice.

2. Then there are those who really like the druidic nature theme of the night elves, - of those some appreciate that not all night elves are this, and woudln't mind if a night elf city was you know a night elf city (i.e. Suramar/Zin'Azshari etc), would probably like a more forest themed one, but okay, they're more interested in forest zones actually being forests. Then there are those of them who want night elves to only be what they like. Only nature/forest dream types - for their own reasons (maybe they like green peace and feel everyone in the world should be like that and think the night elves should wholly represnt that, or maybe they're just selfish types who only want what they want and don't care if others like other aspects of the night elves. They would oppose heavily anything that doesn't fit their mould - night elves must stay rural, savage and primitive - because they like that concept, there is no room for variation or diversity. I am even surprised they want a city, because it doesn't fit the theme they claim to like

3. Then there are horde fans, now a lot simply don't care about night elves, whether they get cool city like stuff or not, whatever to them, they area more focused on developing good stuff for the horde and leave the developers to developer the alliance as they see fit, and of them there are ones like you who actively don't want night elves gettting beautiful cities, not becasue you like the druidi aspect or feel that is what night elves should be now only, but becuase you hate more if night elves get impressive and powerful, or get really beautiful stuff like the horde nightborne have - you can't stand it. you aren't night elf or alliance fans, there is no reason why night elvs can't have rural and forest homes for rrual forest settings and amazing cities with temples for urban settings - both are quite possible, and actually is the case now, but you heavily oppose it with fake and poor arguments because your real motive is not wanting night elves to have what you feel is now horde stuff.

That last category is exactly the same type of fan that vehemently opposed playable high elves, made such a ruckus over something actually most players would welcome and just get on with, pulling all kinds of lame excuses.


There is a 4th category, but we weren't focusing on uninterested fans, that is the majority of the players, and they wouldn't care, they love pretty and cool things. You give night elves a cool city like Zin'Azshari or Suramar, GREAT, COL, they'd love it, made it forest homes and it looked nice, they'd like it too - they'd like whatever is cool, not care much about most things, and enjoy the interesting things and variations they experience while they play the game. It's a hobby, for fun, not life - they don't come on forums if they did it may have been once and it was a quick word sentence. These don't really care that void elves have high elf skins either - and you know what, it is these the devs have most in mind, while keeping a watchful eye on the fanatics.

Short Essay on the State
The devs are going to want to do something incredibly cool for night elves, because it is in their best interest to do so. Because some hordies will get jealous doesn't matter to them, they are fully aware, many of those very jealous hordies were alliance fans, that switched to play blood elves and loved them over the night elves precisely because they actually made a much better effort with them, they know they'd be pissed off for a short while, but actually would then start to like night elves a lot more instead of being jealous of them, realise ofc nothing is stopping them from liking both factions or having things on both factions they like, and doing great night elves would tempt these guys to re-roll toons, or pay for character transfers which mans staying subbed longer and spending more money in game.

It's the smart move, the right call, and it's win win across the board. Did elf core alliance fans hate when blood elves went horde and Nightborne too? Yes, for a short while, then they switched - most of you moaning on these were alliance fans anyway at first, you think the devs don't know - they need you horde to build the horde up and this is why the blood elves were made playable and very pretty - the horde doesn't own pretty elf, or developed elf - there was a reason to keep night elves subdued and less attractive back then, so they were mostly undeveloped, the Shen'dralar return was very subdued, you didn't even see them once cast a spell and no architectural changes were given to night elves - bare minimum, to honour the deep lore and state of night elves a book was commissioned instead - reading oooks is not the same as in game which they needed to swing horde. That need isn't there anymore, the horde greatly out numbers the alliance in the elder game they know this, the night elves no longer need to look worse or stay undeveloped, and that was why legion had such a great effort even if they chickened out of making them alliance when the call for their playability was accepted. Since then and the wide acclamation of Dazar'alor and Zuldazar, the horde interest and playability has gone up even higher. Void elves mostly eat out of human and night elf race numbers (some other races too) on existing main characters - they were given no assets , little story line in typical alliance nerf tradition.


I think, as 8.1 proved the days of night elf nerf and crappy are over, they will make night elves as attractive as they can - with waning interest in their game and product, they need to fire on all cylinders, besides the alliance could use some numbers too. They have a wealth of night elf lore to draw form, including the very Suramar, which is inspiration from their lore, and their is much more for a race most people want to see improved and better developed.

- - - Updated - - -

This thread is about High Elves primarily, not a debate about the history or culture of Night Elves. Let's return to the primary topic at hand and not derail this thread further.

ah so true, yana and co, please redirect all discussions on history and culture of Night elves to this topic:

Night Elves, Magic & the Arcane - Common Misconcetpions & Things You Didn't Consider


I tis why I copied Response 20039 over to that thread, so the conversation would continue there - note to Aucald - I shall also reply to future responses to any of my comments on night elves here directing them to that topic. Afterall, that's what it's there for.

[Syegfryed]

not even gravity works the same way in wow; That is why you can see animals the size of a bus flying only with a flapping of wings that due to their size would not proportionally apply the necessary force to lift that weight.

thats where magic enters, gravity still a thing, if you are flying and drop from your mount you die

I have not seen the first case of characters starving

Warlords video with Grom starving

and I have seen NPCs that can be in an ice crown with outfits not suitable for extreme climates in that region, etc.

they can hold up well, but there still examples of then dying by it, most in books, lord of the clans and frostwolf clan

It is not a dictatorship, precisely because we pay to play. If I don't like it, I simply file a complaint or stop paying my subscription.

but you ca't change, all decisions are made by then, you like or not

You are free to be against a request, but you have no right to tell others that they cannot request something they want just because you don't want it

i can say that, if i want so, but it will not stop people doing it

Congratulations, you use an analogy, in the form of a fallacy

not rly on my view

If you consider a decision a mistake, it does not mean that it is a mistake. For that, there are consensus where a majority decides what is wrong and what is right based on common sense. That is why we are considered political animals (or animals with the ability to do politics, to be correct).

Its not me who say is a mistake, im saying that damaging the Faction identity is a mistake(why use damage and violating if it was a good thing?) because they already said it was a mistake with pandarens, and never did again, Void elves were created precisely to try to not damage and violate faction identity, with they having different characteristics and a completely different and opposite theme

put all in the trash after all is done, to precisely violate even more, is a mistake

as it has been demonstrated throughout the different campaigns where you can find Helves on the side of the alliance and Belves on the side of the horde.

"faction identity" is more than just one is horde and the other is alliance, thats why with void elves their themes are different

Made up like the game itself.

only difference in "the game itself" was their eyes, and even that was severed in mop when they added a blood elf with blue eyes

I repeat. Whoever can say it, but if for the consensus of common sense it lacks logic and is used as an excuse, it is a fallacy.

its a retcon, not a fallacy

Proof (source) that they do not inherit their skin color, but that they acquire it by radiation.

we were talking about eye color, not skin color, and again, they were already born prior the use of fel crystals, you can't inherit something after you are born

Exactly. Therefore, for the premise we are using, it ends up being irrelevant to the point of absurdity. That's what i tried to explain to you

i think what we are using its relevant

Prove it, then. And with reliable sources pls.

do you want me to proof that everything is related with the gene code someway somehow?

you are taking the genes as if they were stats.

if thats how you see im sorry, buts not rly

So, explain to me how an individual from a study population of 100,000 people who suffers from a conditioning disease can be used as an example to compare a whole population of healthy humans.
Show me the power of your ''relevance''

its shows that genes can be related to conditioning, and we can use that to compare things in wow, precisely with the kul'tirans that we were talking about, to explain why they are different, but since we have ulfar quotes saying those kul'tirans are descendant from the drust we don't need that anymore

[Varodoc]

According to the three sisters comic which came after legion and the Suramar questline the answer appears to be yes.

- - - Updated - - -



Then give blood elves light customization options.

Nice. And do you know of any notable high elf who was actually born in Dalaran?

[FlubberPuddy]

Guys, the servers are on, but there's nothing new for void elves (except female purple eye was enabled this time). Blood elves got bug fixes and bracelets for females, but that's it.

For anyone interested in seeing some gallery with random customization:

Alliance:
Humans
Dwarves

Horde:
Undead
Tauren
Blood Elves

Thank you for this, so that seems to verify that Alliance HE will get purple eyes as an option yesss

Also the Human customization actually makes me happy to be a human character now.

[Varodoc]

Frankly I hope blood elves also get Dark Ranger customization options. I imagine it'd be very interesting to RP as a Dark Ranger who struggled between their loyalty to Sylvanas and their loyalty to Silvermoon, the home they gave their lives to defend.