Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Darththeo]

The game director of WoW. As in the guy at the top of the food chain as far as WoW is concerned. So...

At this time, it doesn't mean that much overall ... even in the expansion. For all we know, a year from now they decide to make a quick allied race to add for each faction as they haven't worked on one significantly enough.

We can only state that High Elves are not coming at this time and nothing else.

[protip]

Does anyone think that Ion got to be game director by not listening to the dev team? Because I feel like that's what some people are implying here...

[RangerDaz]

I think some people forget how big corporations work.

It's not just one person that decides everything, it is usually a team or many different teams.
Things change all the time. Corporations need to constantly adapt or they die.

Just because Ion stated that High Elves aren't coming live now, doesn't mean they won't in the future. Even he admitted this.
Blizzard probably has already planned everything for BfA, and probably for the story they want to tell, introducing High Elves in that story structure might not feel right for them at this moment. It is an understandable argument.

Ion's response only made clear that his personal opinion is against high elves in the alliance. Everyone has the right to have a personal opinion about it, even him. however as he is one of the spokesmen of Blizzard, he should be more neutral in these polarizing issues, because his personal ideas might be associated with Blizzard's ideas. Spokesmen of companies need to be careful on what they say so their personal feelings don't get mixed with the corporation's estrategy.

[protip]

I think some people forget how big corporations work.

It's not just one person that decides everything, it is usually a team or many different teams.
Things change all the time. Corporations need to constantly adapt or they die.

Yes, absolutely. Choosing the right ways to change is what separates success from failure.

Just because Ion stated that High Elves aren't coming live now, doesn't mean they won't in the future. Even he admitted this.
Blizzard probably has already planned everything for BfA, and probably for the story they want to tell, introducing High Elves in that story structure might not feel right for them at this moment. It is an understandable argument.

Not fitting the story for BfA is one idea, but the reasons he gave for not adding them are independent of story developments. Maybe that will change, but your suggestion here is really just conjecture that contradicts his words.

Ion's response only made clear that his personal opinion is against high elves in the alliance. Everyone has the right to have a personal opinion about it, even him. however as he is one of the spokesmen of Blizzard, he should be more neutral in these polarizing issues, because his personal ideas might be associated with Blizzard's ideas. Spokesmen of companies need to be careful on what they say so their personal feelings don't get mixed with the corporation's estrategy.

I don't agree with your interpretation of this. You're right that he was acting as a spokesman for Blizzard, but that means that his words are representative of the company he was speaking for. He didn't come out and apologize afterwards, no one from Blizzard came out to undercut his points, and his words don't contradict the actions of Blizzard as a company up to this point. I see no reason to doubt that he was expressing the prevailing opinion of the development team as a whole.

[Tartys]

Everything is an allied race 2018

This Allied Races thing has gotten out of hand...

[Darththeo]

This Allied Races thing has gotten out of hand...

Pretty much what I think that they intended.

[Obelisk Kai]

Does anyone think that Ion got to be game director by not listening to the dev team? Because I feel like that's what some people are implying here...

The pro High Elf community has leapt to the usual response of assuming Ion is the sole person against High Elves and all they have to do is wait for him to move on and that the next game director will be more amenable to their demands.

It's scapegoating. And it's daft. Ion didn't rule out High Elves by himself. Nor did he create Void Elves single handedly. The position he articulated last week likely represents the consensus within Blizzard on this topic.

[RangerDaz]

Yes, absolutely. Choosing the right ways to change is what separates success from failure.



Not fitting the story for BfA is one idea, but the reasons he gave for not adding them are independent of story developments. Maybe that will change, but your suggestion here is really just conjecture that contradicts his words.



I don't agree with your interpretation of this. You're right that he was acting as a spokesman for Blizzard, but that means that his words are representative of the company he was speaking for. He didn't come out and apologize afterwards, no one from Blizzard came out to undercut his points, and his words don't contradict the actions of Blizzard as a company up to this point. I see no reason to doubt that he was expressing the prevailing opinion of the development team as a whole.

Yes, i agree with you in many things you say, but some not so much.

First, Blizzard doesn't have a tradition when one of the spokesmen says something, someone else goes public and undermines his statements. This never happened before (i think?) and im sure blizzard wouldn't do it as well with Ion's comments. If i was a director of Blizzard and in favor of High Elves, i would still suport my collegue and be quiet until another opportunity in the future appears to speak about it without undermining him. So it is natural no one at Blizzard hasn't gone against what he said with an official statement (at least for now).

Second Ion didn't even care for all the arguments that have been discussed in the last months from both sides and dismissed them with the same arguments he said months ago, also arguments than even go against what World of Warcraft has ingame (for example the relevance of the high elves in freeing suramar). As this is a very polarizing issue with big groups on both sides, a spokesman of a company should try to calm down everyone with a diplomatic way to not lose costumers. He did the opposite, and by doing the way he did, it clearly showed his own preference, as he didn't even hide it. He said in a way that was not diplomatic at all which even ignited a bigger flame fest between both sides. That is why i believe he made a mistake as a spokesman of the company.

[dope_danny]

i'm genuinely surprised by the back and forth when it seems pretty obvious. The horde is overwhelmingly made up of blood elf players. Give them the alliance option and every one that takes it will diminish horde numbers and in doing so destabilise multiple servers for their whole warplots/island expedition faction warfare deal.

Its kind of sad but blood elves are probably the only thing padding up multiple horde side on servers as it is. Give them the option to leave when the horde are looking their most nazi regime since the garrosh days and we all know a not significant number will take it to be the 'good guys'.

[Ithekro]

Question, because I don't follow all that much that happens at Blizzcon over the years. When hasn't Blizzard been more supportive in public for the Horde? When are they supportive of the Alliance visually in public? I ask because most memorable moments and general feedback from Blizzard seems to be Horde related. Probably because that is more brand-able and easier to recognize than the Alliance. The last time I remember anything like that was the celebrity commercials from years ago. When we got the Night Elf Mohawk grenades for a bit.

[FlubberPuddy]

So I'm sort of more convinced that Ion didn't look at the feedback that was being discussed and encouraged by CMs with his statement that focused on Blood Elves. That line about em "if you want the....majestic elf" I mean, let's honestly look at where @Traycor 's concepts started and what the general consensus has been from the HE discussion threads, and even was a topic most recently here about maybe 10 pages or so back:

The Ranger aesthetic. A more "Wild" look. Emphasizing the "country elf".

None of those scream "Majestic" imo. Maybe you could argue- the Ranger general bit but that's definitely still more military than nobility themed.

Anyways just adding something I didn't even realize for a bit.

[Garfurion]

i'm genuinely surprised by the back and forth when it seems pretty obvious. The horde is overwhelmingly made up of blood elf players. Give them the alliance option and every one that takes it will diminish horde numbers and in doing so destabilise multiple servers for their whole warplots/island expedition faction warfare deal.

Why is that argument only seen as relevant in relation to Blood Elves?

Night-Elves are the 2nd most popular Alliance race yet no one is worried that:

* Nightborne cause an imbalance because Alliance players will switch to Horde because Nightborne allow for a more traditional "Drow/Dark-Elf" experience than Night-Elves.

* Zandalari cause an imbalance since they are basically Night-Elvish Trolls who can transform into Dinosaurs while Night Elves have old-fashioned forms whose themes they have to share will 3 other races.

Horde also is getting defacto "Holy Elves" for free with yellow eyes while Alliance looses an allied race slot for Lightforged and Night-Elves are stuck with lore-wise incorrect eye-color options.

Horde is already more popular at 110 (52% vs 48% I believe) and they are getting more eye-candy options while Alliance is getting:
- Obese Humans
- Mentally unstable emo-elves (probably the most hated playable race at the moment)
- Dwarves on fire (Dark Iron may look cool but Dwarves are one of the least popular race already).

I think with the current Allied races/customization options we can expect the faction imbalance to only increase in favor of the Horde. Maybe that is compensation for the story but Ion already indicated that Horde is not "THE" evil faction and that Alliance will do plenty of bad stuff as well.

[Gurluas]

So I'm sort of more convinced that Ion didn't look at the feedback that was being discussed and encouraged by CMs with his statement that focused on Blood Elves. That line about em "if you want the....majestic elf" I mean, let's honestly look at where @Traycor 's concepts started and what the general consensus has been from the HE discussion threads, and even was a topic most recently here about maybe 10 pages or so back:

The Ranger aesthetic. A more "Wild" look. Emphasizing the "country elf".

None of those scream "Majestic" imo. Maybe you could argue- the Ranger general bit but that's definitely still more military than nobility themed.

Anyways just adding something I didn't even realize for a bit.

Exactly my thought, he just repeated the Blizzcon answer without even remotely addressing the feedback.

[Magnagarde]

Horde is already more popular at 110 (52% vs 48% I believe) and they are getting more eye-candy options while Alliance is getting:
- Obese Humans
- Mentally unstable emo-elves (probably the most hated playable race at the moment)
- Dwarves on fire (Dark Iron may look cool but Dwarves are one of the least popular race already).

Fishmen from Pandaria are a prospect to be added to this list. Oh boy.

- - - Updated - - -

This Allied Races thing has gotten out of hand...

Pretty much this.

What was originally supposed to be Wildhammer dwarves, Grimtotem tauren and Mag'har orcs resulted in tuskarr, jinyu, hozen, vulpera, sethrak and other ridiculous things being requested, on top of equally ridiculous additions such as obese humans, void elves and the nightborne.

[FlubberPuddy]

Exactly my thought, he just repeated the Blizzcon answer without even remotely addressing the feedback.

There's clearly some plan for Silver Covenant that they want to leave open. In fact, for those saying the High Elves numbers should be dwindling. They in fact added more High Elf NPCs through the Arathi Warfront and that Frostfencer on the Island expedition team, which aren't even aligned with the Silver Covenant.

So Blizzard again saying one thing but doing another. They've added much High Elf NPCs to the game in BFA rather than dwindling down their focus. These separate High Elves is kind of bolstering the High Elf members on Alliance.

To me, I want to wait a bit more and see, what is going to happen in BFA with Vereesa in regards to the Windrunner Reunion. What will happen to the Silver Covenant? If anything.

I think that will help show more so what's the direction of High Elves on Alliance, whether they get further developed separately from Void Elves or not.

Although it's funny people asking for the death of Vereesa and Silver Covenant I remember people for some inane reasons thinking it was going to happen at Teldrassil Burning, which was ridiculous notion in and of itself. Now people have moved on to saying hopefully they all have to turn into Void Elves. Which breaks the very core theme of what Alliance High Elves are in the first place. They're the group of elves that decided NOT to depend on magic as much.

I want to say this suggestion of them having to become Void Elves is as ridiculous as the whole Vereesa and SC dying at Teldrassil, but we'll have to wait for more of the BFA story to see what happens (if anything).

[ercarp]

Plate armor design. Might have overdesigned it a bit.

[RangerDaz]

Plate armor design. Might have overdesigned it a bit.

Looks cool Ercarp!

However it has some Nighbornish feeling though...
Maybe its the colors?

[Obelisk Kai]

Exactly my thought, he just repeated the Blizzcon answer without even remotely addressing the feedback.

And he had an obligation to go over it? What more beyond the no and the rationale behind it was required?

It was a Q and A. Time was at a premium. There were questions to be answered after the High Elf one.

The fact he repeated the Blizzcon answer just shows that the arguments put forward by the pro High Elf community weren't as convincing or as decisive as they thought.

[baskev]

This is another biased response, please, don't play that game, it's totally destructive to think this is any kind of faction war.

It's not.

Asking for High Elves is asking for something the alliance already has in his lore, nothing more, nothing less.

Lol do not play the game? Please that is your response.

And it its not a faction war?!?! you do know you burn down a tree and kill/destroy everything night elf ( so pretty much everything they got) .

And biased...what is biased about facts? How many orcs and horde where the in the last raids in the last 3 expansions?
How much of your wishlist for allied races did you get? how much story focus did you get? How much info/questing was done for your allied races? how much for ours?
How much effort is put into your new druid forms??? ours are just copy of a current artifact skin. And our new bear and cat form look so much alike. Its like a before and after liposuction poster.

Have in lore...yes. Will ever get ingame...nope ( sadly)

[Deleted]

Yes, i agree with you in many things you say, but some not so much.

First, Blizzard doesn't have a tradition when one of the spokesmen says something, someone else goes public and undermines his statements. This never happened before (i think?) and im sure blizzard wouldn't do it as well with Ion's comments. If i was a director of Blizzard and in favor of High Elves, i would still suport my collegue and be quiet until another opportunity in the future appears to speak about it without undermining him. So it is natural no one at Blizzard hasn't gone against what he said with an official statement (at least for now).

Second Ion didn't even care for all the arguments that have been discussed in the last months from both sides and dismissed them with the same arguments he said months ago, also arguments than even go against what World of Warcraft has ingame (for example the relevance of the high elves in freeing suramar). As this is a very polarizing issue with big groups on both sides, a spokesman of a company should try to calm down everyone with a diplomatic way to not lose costumers. He did the opposite, and by doing the way he did, it clearly showed his own preference, as he didn't even hide it. He said in a way that was not diplomatic at all which even ignited a bigger flame fest between both sides. That is why i believe he made a mistake as a spokesman of the company.

I think this is some severe hyperbole. I cant believe topics like what playable avatars you can make in a mmo game are so ridiculously important to people that it requires a freaking diplomatic resolution to appease them.

This whole topic is just perplexing to me. I would like High elves as well, as they are a classic alliance race to me, just like I think Forest trolls and ogres should be playable on horde. But come on, people are taking this... way too seriously.