I ate too many prunes

[VyersReaver]

I know it might be hard for you to grasp, but some people actually enjoy complex gameplay. It's fine if you don't, but it's a valid complaint for people who enjoy competitive gaming, because complexity is a part of that.

Blizzard took a step into right direction with the introduction of active honor talents, so that the ability bloat doesn't affect casuals/pve players, but there is a number of players who actually want a bit more.

That said, I'm fine with what it is now, but as someone who used to play arena on high level few expansions ago, I can actually understand the OP.

Complexity =/= number of buttons on your bars (some of which never get pressed).

[Checkt]

You said that the minority is always loudest, a statement I belive is complete bullshit. But feel free to back it up with some actual number.

Sorry, I've been living life.....but uh......do you really think the majority of WoW players use forums? Or any game and their forums for that matter? No, they don't. Forum users are a minority of the gamer base.

And, just like with online reputation, most people who take the time to use something like that, are the ones who had a bad experience. People on forums only think they're right and everyone agrees because they live in the bubble of the forums. The reality is when something truly matters, and enough people truly feel strongly about it, it gets changed, IE old raids becoming unsoloable.

[Aggrophobic]

Sorry, I've been living life.....but uh......do you really think the majority of WoW players use forums? Or any game and their forums for that matter? No, they don't. Forum users are a minority of the gamer base.

And, just like with online reputation, most people who take the time to use something like that, are the ones who had a bad experience. People on forums only think they're right and everyone agrees because they live in the bubble of the forums. The reality is when something truly matters, and enough people truly feel strongly about it, it gets changed, IE old raids becoming unsoloable.

Hardly true. Flying being removed is a good example. But never mind that, what actually speaks the loudest is when people simply lose intrest and leave. Something that has been a trend since Cata.

[KOUNTERPARTS]

@FelPlague

Why is it every time you show up to a thread, argument and flaming ensues?

[FelPlague]

While i would agree with you, the op has said he shadowsteps, so he is a rogue. Vast majority of rogue talents are unfortunately passives.

Assassin has like 3 new actives max (that dont replace old abilities)
Outlaw 3 or 4
Sub has just 1 i think

That is assuming the actives are even viable for pvp

Pve and PVP talents, max you could choose.
in assasination if you select all active talents you get 6 max
outlaw 6 max
sub (legit only 1 row with 2 talents in the normal tree that is not a 'replace" then a third being replace, holy shit) 4 max

6,6,4

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@FelPlague

Why is it every time you show up to a thread, argument and flaming ensues?

i mean there is a fine line between argument and debating.
and flaming ensues cause people frustrate eachother when they dont agree.

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Yep. I went from 70+ binds in MoP to somewhere around 30 in WoD and beyond. Catering to the lowest denominator is Activision-Blizzard's MO.

you mean the largest denominator.
very few people play wow for the idea of having more keybindings then you have keys on your keyboard.
wow has allways been the "easier version" of mmo's, it was made to be for those who wished to move out of the more hardcore MMO's, to move people into the mmo genre who were not "i play 19 hours a day and if i die then i lose all my progress"

why do you think so many people play moba's? FPS?
two of the largest gaming genres these days, fortnite, cod, battlefield, Lol, dota, hots, Pubg.
all games with very, very, very few keybindings.
(move is obvious) aim around with mouse. a button to shoot, a button to reload a button to zoom in, a button to get in and out of vehicles, a button to jump. etc changing per game

dota, hots, league, huge moba games (smite, forgot that) literally 4 fucking buttons by default, yes there is also moving and such, aswell as hotkeys for special charecters or items on league or dota.
but you still have MAX 8 keybinds.
Hell even look at guild wars two that literally limits you to nothing more or nothing less then like i think its... 12? keybindings?

and here you are saying 70 binds was HEALTHY and GOOD for the game.

[Checkt]

Hardly true. Flying being removed is a good example. But never mind that, what actually speaks the loudest is when people simply lose intrest and leave. Something that has been a trend since Cata.

Because most people understand why flying is gated, that's why it's hasn't burnt to the ground.

And being the most active SUBSCRIPTION MMO (before someone hits me with that ACHTHUALLY LoL)by a long shot doesn't matter, only that subs have decreased since Cata. Nevermind that different forms of gaming, and gaming trends in general have changed since then...it must be because everyone hates the game. Yes....yes....that's it.

[Kazuchika]

This forum has 560k users of which 19K are considered active. So unless that is kinda everyone who still plays WoW...it is a minority here https://www.mmo-champion.com/forum.php (at the bottom)

Or do you invoke the "silent majority" now? In which case it really gets hard with numbers. Oh no...it gets really easy...you just pretend the people who play think the same way as every guy who ever complained about something.

Which is funny because out of that 19k you see the same like 13 people in every thread trolling horribly like rat boy

[Powerogue]

It seems to vary so much class to class. Outlaw rogue I feel comfortable keybind-wise but tank DH I just can't fit all the abilities on keybinds I can comfortably access. I think the lowest ability count I've played was beast mastery hunter, that was just boring.

On some level this is probably necessary as different people have different ideas of what's "enough keybinds." With some people way above me to the point they can't even fit them on the keyboard anymore and resort to cramming buttons on their mouse!

[Deleted]

I'm sorry I didn't mean to offend you. I didn't know you had such a high rating. You must be very skilled. Sorry pleasee come back to me

Implying 2.4k rating is even slightly difficult.

[melodramocracy]

You're missing the point completely OP. Less is more (if you chant this in a candle lit room, it's quite relaxing).

The goal is eventually to have even fewer buttons than D3. Kapow (attack), Missed Me Bitch (defend), and Owies (heal) are all any game like this actually needs.

[Ealyssa]

Sweet. Hope so.

Would love to sit on my couch in my games room with my PS4 or XB1 controller and chill with some WoW.

You allready can. With a magic device called an HDMI cable and a wow addon. Ask your nearest dark art sorcerer.

[FelPlague]

You allready can. With a magic device called an HDMI cable and a wow addon. Ask your nearest dark art sorcerer.

cant do serious raiding though, as there is too much to put onto a controller.
actuallty to be fair you could prob put affliction or beast master onto a controller.

[Carnedge]

Still too many buttons in my opinion. I don't like abilities that don't really do anything or I can't press without being in some super niche situation.

[ChronoSul]

Honestly you have a lot of useless shit on your bars that's not even needed. How long has it been since you banished a demon? 10 years? lmao

Banish also works on elementals So heroic/Mythic Aggramar

[kaintk]

my 10 bar are full of useable thing to click, you should stop playing only arena pvp in a mostly pve game ? lol

[Usagi Senshi]

Always amazed me that people want more useless ability bloat in their bars. I was practically begging Blizzard for condensed abilities for my shaman, paladin, and monk for years. More shit to press on CD does not equate to more skill and deeper gameplay at all.

[Deleted]

OP is right, the "class fantasy" pruning didnt work out so well for some classes, bzzd stated themselves to have pruned too much, and promised to restore some pruned abilities and rework some artefact abilities to baseline/talent.

[Vallin]

Wow is inching ever closer to console.

I mean, to be fair, there are some MMO's that play great on a console. And both PS4 and Xbox One allow you to plug a mouse and keyboard into them.

[RoKPaNda]

Yep. I went from 70+ binds in MoP to somewhere around 30 in WoD and beyond. Catering to the lowest denominator is Activision-Blizzard's MO.

What the fuck are you doing that requires 70 binds? Were you binding literally worthless spells and talents that you had no reason to use let alone ever bind? Or are you making separate macros for everything where you could be using conditionals in the same macro? Or what?

I've been playing since Vanilla. In Vanilla I PvPed, I did cutting edge PvE, I did both tanking and DPS (Prot warr (obviously), Fury warrior, and rogue) and I never had anywhere near that many binds. After Vanilla I didn't PvP much but I kept raiding right up to Cataclysm, took a break from raiding until WoD, still raiding today. Haven't had more than 24 keybinds/buttons for any role in that time.

[TheWorkingTitle]

What the fuck are you doing that requires 70 binds? Were you binding literally worthless spells and talents that you had no reason to use let alone ever bind? Or are you making separate macros for everything where you could be using conditionals in the same macro? Or what?

I've been playing since Vanilla. In Vanilla I PvPed, I did cutting edge PvE, I did both tanking and DPS (Prot warr (obviously), Fury warrior, and rogue) and I never had anywhere near that many binds. After Vanilla I didn't PvP much but I kept raiding right up to Cataclysm, took a break from raiding until WoD, still raiding today. Haven't had more than 24 keybinds/buttons for any role in that time.

Flying mount, ground mount, engineering boots, engineering gloves, mirror image, cone of cold, pvp trinket, deep freeze, spellsteal, ice barrier, ring of frost, blizzard, ice lance, combustion, evocation, invisibility, polymorph, ice block, blink, frostfire bolt, frostbolt, alter time, blazing speed, slow fall, counterspell, fireball, fireblast, pyroblast, frost nova, arcane explosion, dragon’s breath, flamestrike, timewarp, berserking, mana gem, refreshment table, frostjaw, goblin glider, presence of mind, conjure food, mage armor, molten armor, frost armor, arcane intellect, portals, teleports = 55+ and I'm probably forgetting some

plus that's not even counting toys and other items that have been removed from everyday combat and rbg/arena macros

Sounds like you weren't getting nearly as much out of your characters as I was. No spell was EVER worthless.