Why are people bad at wow/raiding.

[Jastall]

Because most of the people playing anything are bad/mediocre at it.

Most Overwatch players are Quick Play shitters like yours truly.

Most Skyrim players play on Normal or Easy where you can only die if you are comatose.

Most League players either don't play ranked or are very low rank.

Most people who play Dark Souls don't get past the Capra Demon

I could go on all day. Most gamers aren't hardcore achievers who are set upon a goal and will do anything to achieve it. They just want to have fun playing a game. Same for WoW.

[Heavy Gains]

I refuse to group with anyone from Sargeras, Quelthalas, or Ragbaros because off the overwhelming number of terrible I've encountered from those servers.

[Alphatorg]

"It's really easy, you just have to download a bunch of mods (both for your spec and for raiding) and read a bunch of guides (both for your spec and for raiding), which all assume you're already very familiar with the game, your spec, and raiding!"

It only really assumes that you can make a simple google search. Which I don't think is a lot to ask these days. I also named Icy-Veins for the specific reason that it's very basic and doesn't assume any previous class knowledge.

[Onikaroshi]

People can play however they want, but please for the love of god, if you're on "I'll play Ice mage in FFXIV because its my sub" level, don't do or expect to do high level things.

[HeroicMythic]

The problem is the matching of suitable players. There is nothing wrong if top performance players team up and do a oneshot fast run and there is also nothing wrong if underperformance players team up and progress 3 hours. It is all about defining goals, expectations, and requirements.

[pkm]

I refuse to group with anyone from Sargeras, Quelthalas, or Ragbaros because off the overwhelming number of terrible I've encountered from those servers.

Interesting

Sargeras isn't part of the south American region though.

[Deleted]

Bad at WoW and bad at Raiding isn't the same. Just like good at raiding and good at WoW isn't the same.

Pretty much this. My gf only does pet battles and likes running around collecting things (mostly skimpy outfits gor her chars). She can kick my ass in a per battle but has no idea how to play her class.

We occasionaly run lfr together and even though she doesn’t often die her rotation and dps is attrocious but she doesn’t even know it because she doesn’t have a dps meter or any external addons. In her mind if she doesn’t die she’s done the boss well and I think there are many people who might think that way.

I’ve tried to get her to be better at raiding but she has no interest in it so I just let her play the game the way she finds the most fun to do so.

People bad at raiding might be good at other aspects of the game....or just bad all round in which case nvm :P

[kamuimac]

Pretty much this. My gf only does pet battles and likes running around collecting things (mostly skimpy outfits gor her chars). She can kick my ass in a per battle but has no idea how to play her class.

We occasionaly run lfr together and even though she doesn’t often die her rotation and dps is attrocious but she doesn’t even know it because she doesn’t have a dps meter or any external addons. In her mind if she doesn’t die she’s done the boss well and I think there are many people who might think that way.

I’ve tried to get her to be better at raiding but she has no interest in it so I just let her play the game the way she finds the most fun to do so.

People bad at raiding might be good at other aspects of the game....or just bad all round in which case nvm :P

and thats one over very core issues . most of people playing this game how no clue whatsoever that there are any numbers involved in that besides the one cascading on boss (if they didnt turn them off)

[Cassidin]

1) Lazy people: pugs are literally filled with lazy people. Not bad players, just lazy. They probably hope to be carried, that someone will fill their "gap" and just do the bare minimun.

You don't even need to go into raid pugs for that - just doing greater invasion bosses where there are mind control mechanics that are soooooooo easily avoided but still 75% of the raid just doesn't bother. Honestly if it wasn't for the fact I just want to get out of there fast I could have more fun trying to destroy the stupid idiots who just cant be bothered to turn away from an ability for all of 2 seconds and just let themselves be MCd. I mean like EVERY time... EVERY cast. There is no way I can begin to believe these people don't know what they are doing - they just cant be bothered to counter it and so become MCd for 5-10 seconds. The fight takes probably up to twice as long because half the raid are fighting each other etc.

Of course this doesn't matter - not on a greater invasion pinyata - but its the principle of it and yes, people are too lazy to do anything about it (tbh most are probably afk autoattacking and that explains them not moving!).

[Lochton]

1) Lazy people: pugs are literally filled with lazy people. Not bad players, just lazy. They probably hope to be carried, that someone will fill their "gap" and just do the bare minimun.

Commonly in LFR, these lazy people are on average either A; people not geared or B; Actual raiders believing they are better.

[Deleted]

Commonly in LFR, these lazy people are on average either A; people not geared or B; Actual raiders believing they are better.

Absolutely. It makes my blood boil when i see, on this forum, people advocating for the removal of LFR because this will make people be "better at raiding", and then, after three post, without shame, they say:" Pffft i afk in LFR the whole time who cares".

A nice lesson from the so called "pro raiders".

[Justbas]

Its cause the majority of the pugs don't care enough their all there expecting to nuke shit but aren't willing to put in the effort.

And when it goes south they are the vocal point of complaining that the carries aren't doing their best.
To many times lately I have seen the hunter that's 9th on dps raging on about people not doing their job correctly while the guy was dead after the first 20 seconds on Felhounds.

Its hilarious and sad at the same time.

And everyone that's complaining in this thread that looking up ''how to guides'' won't help cause you don't have a basic understanding of the game: Gtfo.
You're on the mmo-champ forums the leap to Icy-veins isn't that far.

Besides that the guides on icy-veins are as basic as can be they literally spoon feed you your class.

[Dinousek]

I perform pretty well in raids and 5-mans, but sometimes my FPS just gets me in trouble. I get about 2 to 22 fps at best in a raid, and of course when does the fps go to 2? When shit is hitting the fan, goop is on the floor , and I need to move, and moving my character is like swimming in slime and so I sometimes die. This is most noticeable with ground effects such as the final boss in BRH or for example, Argus. Argus rarely causes issue because I have the timing memorized and move out according to that.

The larger the raid/group, the worse my lag is. I need a new rig but cannot afford to even build one, much less buy one.

More than once I have been sidelined at the start of an expac because of Blizzard upgrades, or even sometimes after patches.

I do not think i am unique in this - I think a lot of players play the game with less than ideal computers. This is one of the unspoken reasons why some people have challenges with the game.

Having said that, i continue to play for the challenge and because I enjoy the game.

Just my 2 cents ( which is all i can afford).

[Deleted]

Honestly, bad players is what made me join a Mythic guild.. But then after 2 years I got "burned out" after 14 years of WOW, I still wish I could found a mythic guild who runs heroics sometimes... I just can't commit to a schedule of 2/3 nights a week but at the same I would like to be able to do one night of heroic content once it's on farm.

[Erous]

I'm not talking about people who flat out aren't interested in raiding. That's a concious choice. I'm talking about people who spend many hours per week doing raid content but are still terrible at it. Like the guy who once told me on mmo-champion that Coven was a horrible boss because RNG would wipe you and there was nothing you could do about it. Or that other guy (I think it was a rogue) who was complaining that he didn't get access to the groups he deserved and then someone dug up his logs where he died on basically every boss.

Sorry, but that's not being a horrible player. That's you being angry with someone over their opinion.

[alturic]

*snip*

Biggest reason? Because they can. What incentive is there for the random casual to get better? They don't care/don't have time to raid anything more than Normal. There's nothing preventing them from logging in, collecting their loot and logging off.

- - - Updated - - -

Honestly, bad players is what made me join a Mythic guild.. But then after 2 years I got "burned out" after 14 years of WOW, I still wish I could found a mythic guild who runs heroics sometimes... I just can't commit to a schedule of 2/3 nights a week but at the same I would like to be able to do one night of heroic content once it's on farm.

I don't know if I got burned out of raiding, I think I got burned out of raiding with gobs of shit players. I quit almost right after pre-nerf Rag, it got to the point I was drinking 3/4th of a bottle of vodka each raid night. People couldn't comprehend such simple mechanics (meteors, dreadflames) or how to play their class (multiple hunters on Beth), or just how to play the damn game (Rhyolith) that it wore me out.

It's weird because I used to tell people I never understood how you could "grow out of gaming", but that was pretty much the last time I picked up a game. I get the urge, and even came back a few times, to play but I login sit at the mailbox for 5 minutes and say "why bother". I think I would be playing Rift right now as it was the only game that ever came close to giving WoW a run for it's money to me, but the lack of players made that pretty much pointless too.

[Polarthief]

I know this has a high chance of degenerating into a troll thread, but it's a question I genuinely ask myself while pugging.

Unless you're in a very ambitious mythic guild wow is a very easy game, both in terms of theory and mechanics.

There's a lot of mechanics now, and your class has enough buttons thrown in that your average player is going to get flustered. If you find you're able to do your rotation course to optimally while not fucking up at all in heroic though, you can definitely do mythic.

WoW bosses have more and more mechanics every single expansion. It's just getting to be up much for some people. That or laziness.

This is coming from a 10/11M raider who could easily be 11/11M by now, but I like my dysfunctional family of mostly shitters who hold us back. *shrug*

I have a life outside of wow u know!!

Yeah, it's definitely the most cancerous, worst, excuse for being bad. You can easily have a life and be a top-tier raider if you choose. Many of our players work 40+ hour weeks and are still pulling purple parses on MYTHIC BOSSES. Not talking about Garothi either, I'm talking Coven and Aggramar.

That excuse just makes anyone look like an incompetent asshole when used to answer why they're not good at the game.

If you want to be good, it's going to take practice and effort. You can definitely do it if you give a shit but when you come up with the worst possible excuse+insult (yes, it is a shit-tier insult as well), you're just nothing but a shitty player.

[elaina]

(1) the game isn't as easy as you say it is.
(2) likely most people don't take the game as seriously as you do, and honestly I think it's unfair to shit talk them too much. If I'm a professional basketball player I'm not gonna roll down to the nearest park and tell everyone they suck at the game and should just quit. People have different priorities and it's stupid to assume everyone cares about wow as much as you, even if they play the game.
(3) expanding on that some, many people are utterly disinterested in doing anything involving the game that isn't playing the game itself. This means no weak auras, no class discord, no sims, and they're probably too ADD, lazy, or proud to ever be assed to watch a fatboss video. Or they claim they "can't learn that way" and can only learn by doing the encounter (which is bullshit) and would rather make the whole raid team suffer through their learning curve because they can't bother to learn basic concepts about the encounter ahead of time.

Oops that got ranty.

If there's one thing I've learned from my past in raid leading, it is to never take for granted your raiders know the most trivial details about an encounter.

(4) in pugs, you should never be surprised by this. Lots of people just want to get carried. But when everyone wants to get carried it's a shit show and nothing gets done.

[Grimreaper]

How has nobody said this. Keybinding. Most people click their shit. That makes them shit.

I've pulled, and seen others do, litteral world-record DPS on bosses whilst clicking every single ability. Every expansion since vanilla.

Keybinding doesnt make a poor player good, nor does it make a good player poor. It's just convenient. Most your abilities are on a plenty long GCD if you dont remember. It's just taunts, interrupts and such that actually benefit from keybinding.

[Swalload]

I know this has a high chance of degenerating into a troll thread, but it's a question I genuinely ask myself while pugging.

Unless you're in a very ambitious mythic guild wow is a very easy game, both in terms of theory and mechanics.

1 read up your spec on icy veins
2 DL a boss mod, if you're a healer maybe DL some raid frames
3 go to wago and DL the highest rated WA package for your class, maybe a raid WA package like those from Reloe (both optional)
4 during encounter look at the output of your boss mod every 15-20 seconds

Congrats! You're a good heroic raider now and you can probably join and compete in a triple digit mythic guild.

So how is it that so many people struggle in heroic? Even if you don't do any of the above steps "move out of shit" alone will be enough for the vast majority of hc encounters and I don't think it takes any kind of talent to step out of shit on a scripted timer that announces what's coming up minutes in advance.

Let's get the obvious explanations out of the way first:
-People don't know the encounters: I mostly do my pugging in 960/965 groups, you have to clear HC a couple of times for that ilvl
-People just don't care: again - 960/965 groups full of angry nerds who will likely kick you if you fail too badly and not having to look for another group is a strong incentive I guess
I also encounter this problem in some mythic guilds where by definition people are at least a bit ambitious and obviously know the encounters.

You basically answer part of the question right there. You list things that should be done to play better, now you know these people basically don't do that.
Another thing people rarely take into consideration is "play style". Literally the way people use their mouse and keyboard, how they move the camera, their character, keybinds, etc.
Go watch some shitty stream with like no viewer, random people playing very casually and shit, watch several of them, no one plays the same way, some people have straight up better playstyle than others, they move the camera to see the right thing and it allows them to position better and in the end perform better.
Now keep in mind, these are people who actually took the time to figure out how to stream and are willing to show themselves, they must have watched other streams and know they are not as good as the top players. They have fun streaming and they don't play as good but it's fine. Now imagine there's people who not only don't know how to stream, but straight up don't even know that streaming is a thing (well maybe they do now cuz sometimes it's shown on the battle.net client) but they most likely have never seen a streamer or a gameplay video, they have no idea how other people play, they simply don't know how far behind they are because they don't know any better.

These people come home from work, feed their kids, put them to bed, they're exhausted at 8pm, log on, join a pug, and 2 hours before the pull they already gave up on spending a single bit of energy. They're never gonna perform, it's impossible, their brain doesn't give a shit about playing well, the consequences of a video game makes zero difference in their life. Their free time doesn't include watching streamers or videos about the game, much less reading patch notes or guides about their classes, and you can 100% forget reading the journal to learn encounters or even worse... GETTING ADDONS!?!?!? aint nobody got time fo' dat!

It's true it doesn't take much to be a heroic raider, but the little bit that it takes is already way too far for a lot of people. Keep in mind the vast majority of WoW players don't even know that mmo-c exists. They just log on into the game, play some random whatever and log off without thinking more of it.

Just go in a regular mythic run (where you can find people who think they're in the big league cuz they stopped doing heroics last week) as a geared tank. People will literally ask you how you do 1m dps as a tank even during a triple pull and they'll think you hack when you use a speed set as a DK. Most people literally live in ignorance, in a level of ignorance so deep that they are ignorant about their own ignorance.