View Poll Results: Are you motivated to fight your opponent

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  • Play Horde and want to crush Alliance

    248 24.68%
  • Play Alliance and want to crush Horde

    213 21.19%
  • Play Horde and have no motivation

    368 36.62%
  • Play Alliance and have no motivation

    176 17.51%
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  1. #821
    Elemental Lord Felfaadaern Darkterror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steampunkette View Post
    @Nathasil

    Chapter 1 of Before the Storm ends with Anduin telling Shaw to get his Best People to Silithus. Which is the PC.

    Chapter 3 of Before the Storm ends with Sylvanas talking to Gallywix and it's assumed that at some point -after- that she tells Nathanos to send the Horde PC down to Silithus.

    The Alliance PC gets to Silithus and starts murdering goblin miners to steal Azerite from their corpses before the Horde Player even talks to Nathanos.

    As to the "Spies versus Miners" argument: Spies are COMBATANTS according to the literal rules of warfare that exist. Miners would be civilian laborers. Attacking one of those two is a War Crime, while the other is part of fighting battles. I'll let you guess which one.
    Those are some thick tinted glasses you're wearing rofl.

    1. Goblins are attacking the very world we live on, picking at and exploiting a potentially fatal wound.
    2. Sylvanas's first reaction to Azerite is not "Oh no the world is dying let's save it!"
    3. Sylvanas's first reaction is "Let's make weapons and kill everyone in Stormwind!"
    4. The Alliance only finds out about Azerite when goblins start massing in Silithus. Given Goblin's reputation for creating dangerous weapons, and the obvious power in the new substance, OF COURSE they send scouts to find out more. Any ruler who failed to take this basic step would be negligent and irresponsible.
    5. Anduin's first reaction to Azerite is "I could heal everyone!"
    6. Alliance players are told to slow down the mining and do whatever is necessary to get samples.
    7. Horde players are told to speed up mining and kill any Alliance who come snooping around.
    8. You can rationalize till you're blue in the face, but the Alliance is hoping to save the world while Horde is hoping to conquer it. Again.

    "I Am Vengeance. I Am The Night. I Am Felfáádaern!"

  2. #822
    Quote Originally Posted by Nathasil View Post
    So what you are saying is, if i get into your backyard with a mining-pick and start digging...you will not mind and have no right to engage me in ANY way, but as soon as i start standing around doing absolutely nothing you suddenly gain the right to shoot me?
    lmao... trying to relate Silithus to ANYONE's backdoor. If you're a Qiraji, sure you can say this... I guess. But really this was a good laugh.

    Also, the lack of physical presence means it's first come first serve. The residents in teh area prior to the sword drop were neither alliance or horde and it doesn't matter much since they were all obliterated with the impact. So blank slate, first come first served counts.

  3. #823
    Herald of the Titans Amaterasu65's Avatar
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    Poor dead goblins. They got killed by the savage Alliance scum... They were only just mining secretly from the wound of the very world we try to protect so they can turn the ore into advanced weapons of war against the Alliance. And all that in contested territory.... What a horrible war crime! The Alliance are the aggressors!

    I'm sure Gallywix feels terribly bad that some of his slaves died. The Alliance is evil.

  4. #824
    Quote Originally Posted by Brewmaster Kolee View Post
    You can rationalize till you're blue in the face, but the Alliance is hoping to save the world while Horde is hoping to conquer it. Again.
    No one really knows anything about what's going on. Magni shows up has a bad feeling he can't confirm and tries whatever. Everyone who touches the Azerite sample's first thought is "this changes everything" and then they have their inner monologue on what they can do. It's fairly obvious that horde is almost always outgunned whenever the alliance actually makes a move in any force that is meaningful since Stormwind outnumbers literally every other nation in almost every field except tech (goblins and gnomes match up and beat everyone else with Draenei eeking out something weird whenever plot demands it).

    So the first thoughts can also be further examined into Sylvanas trying to control Kalimdor and keep Horde interests in mind... while Anduin's first thought goes into stopping the horde without even imagining anything... Both sort of vindicating the other's actions since it sets them on a course with opposing goals.

    Another thing I really can't stand is how we're immediately assuming the impact of the world soul on the planet. There's no real reason to assume anything either way, good or bad, for what it means for the planet. We just go from being told Azeroth is dying and go to 'save the planet' and there's no one to elaborate further except the gemstone dwarf who really doesn't know what's going on.

  5. #825
    The Unstoppable Force Friendlyimmolation's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brewmaster Kolee View Post
    Those are some thick tinted glasses you're wearing rofl.

    1. Goblins are attacking the very world we live on, picking at and exploiting a potentially fatal wound.
    2. Sylvanas's first reaction to Azerite is not "Oh no the world is dying let's save it!"
    3. Sylvanas's first reaction is "Let's make weapons and kill everyone in Stormwind!"
    4. The Alliance only finds out about Azerite when goblins start massing in Silithus. Given Goblin's reputation for creating dangerous weapons, and the obvious power in the new substance, OF COURSE they send scouts to find out more. Any ruler who failed to take this basic step would be negligent and irresponsible.
    5. Anduin's first reaction to Azerite is "I could heal everyone!"
    6. Alliance players are told to slow down the mining and do whatever is necessary to get samples.
    7. Horde players are told to speed up mining and kill any Alliance who come snooping around.
    8. You can rationalize till you're blue in the face, but the Alliance is hoping to save the world while Horde is hoping to conquer it. Again.
    For all this talk of thick glasses you prove yourself to peddle your own interpretation as fact once more.

    Sylvanas doesn't want Azeroth to die, and sends people to the wound, you'd know this if you read the book other than being upset Sylvanas isn't Anduin.


    Also I love how people always spin up and constantly feel the urge to say "its ok when the Alliance does it" to every action. Killing some Goblins? Self Defense!!11
    Quote Originally Posted by WoWKnight65 View Post
    That's same excuse from you and so many others on this website and your right some of threads do bully high elf fans to a point where they might end up losing their minds to a point of a mass shooting.
    Holy shit lol

  6. #826
    Lich King

    Banshee Queen

    whats the difference?

  7. #827
    The Unstoppable Force Friendlyimmolation's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hisholyness View Post
    Lich King

    Banshee Queen

    whats the difference?
    Do you actually want the differences? Or are you just pretending they don't exist because it's easier for you?
    Quote Originally Posted by WoWKnight65 View Post
    That's same excuse from you and so many others on this website and your right some of threads do bully high elf fans to a point where they might end up losing their minds to a point of a mass shooting.
    Holy shit lol

  8. #828
    Quote Originally Posted by Friendlyimmolation View Post
    For all this talk of thick glasses you prove yourself to peddle your own interpretation as fact once more.

    Sylvanas doesn't want Azeroth to die, and sends people to the wound, you'd know this if you read the book other than being upset Sylvanas isn't Anduin.
    to be fair, Sylvanas was portrayed more like she didn't want to openly go against the group discussion and was among the minority that didn't immediately jump on the bandwagon for world dying, save the world.

    Honestly, if the author wasn't so blatant about the subject I would have assumed there would be more political maneuvering to coerce one or more parties into acting a certain way about this. Like having the Alliance pressure the horde into backing off by getting all druid and priest orders on teh whole healing thing and flipping them against the Warchief if they don't cease mining operations... while the alliance does the catch up work on their own program... also drop that whole gnome/goblin love arc that wasn't needed.

  9. #829
    Quote Originally Posted by mickybrighteyes View Post
    to be fair, Sylvanas was portrayed more like she didn't want to openly go against the group discussion and was among the minority that didn't immediately jump on the bandwagon for world dying, save the world.

    Honestly, if the author wasn't so blatant about the subject I would have assumed there would be more political maneuvering to coerce one or more parties into acting a certain way about this. Like having the Alliance pressure the horde into backing off by getting all druid and priest orders on teh whole healing thing and flipping them against the Warchief if they don't cease mining operations... while the alliance does the catch up work on their own program... also drop that whole gnome/goblin love arc that wasn't needed.
    Why is this woman a head writer again?

  10. #830
    Quote Originally Posted by element zero View Post
    Why is this woman a head writer again?
    Because no one respectable is willing to touch the train wreck of WoW's story.

    "Hello applicant! Please write a story of conflict that never resolves. No winner, no loser. Also, make sure to drive the conflict via flimsy misunderstandings and pissing contests. Oh, and every so often have a Work Together In Spite of Our Differences moment, followed by learning exactly nothing from it."
    Quote Originally Posted by Alex86el View Post
    "Orc want, orc take." and "Orc dissagrees, orc kill you to win argument."
    Quote Originally Posted by Toho View Post
    The Horde is basically the guy that gets mad that the guy that they just beat the crap out of had the audacity to bleed on them.
    Why no, people don't just like Sylvie for T&A: https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...ery-Cinematic/

  11. #831
    Quote Originally Posted by Feanoro View Post
    Because no one respectable is willing to touch the train wreck of WoW's story.

    "Hello applicant! Please write a story of conflict that never resolves. No winner, no loser. Also, make sure to drive the conflict via flimsy misunderstandings and pissing contests. Oh, and every so often have a Work Together In Spite of Our Differences moment, followed by learning exactly nothing from it."
    You just have no imagination

  12. #832
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Friendlyimmolation View Post
    For all this talk of thick glasses you prove yourself to peddle your own interpretation as fact once more.

    Sylvanas doesn't want Azeroth to die, and sends people to the wound, you'd know this if you read the book other than being upset Sylvanas isn't Anduin.


    Also I love how people always spin up and constantly feel the urge to say "its ok when the Alliance does it" to every action. Killing some Goblins? Self Defense!!11
    Hamuul and Magni ask her to remove the goblins that are digging and hurting Azeroth. She does not do this because getting Azerite so she can kill all humans in storm wind and turning them into Forsaken means more to her than saving Azeroth.

    It makes zero sense with her character but then again this book is kind of shit.

  13. #833
    Elemental Lord Felfaadaern Darkterror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Friendlyimmolation View Post
    For all this talk of thick glasses you prove yourself to peddle your own interpretation as fact once more.

    Sylvanas doesn't want Azeroth to die, and sends people to the wound, you'd know this if you read the book other than being upset Sylvanas isn't Anduin.


    Also I love how people always spin up and constantly feel the urge to say "its ok when the Alliance does it" to every action. Killing some Goblins? Self Defense!!11
    I read the book. Did you? Sylvanas wants to kill all the humans in Stormwind and turn them into Forsaken. Her first thought upon seeing Azerite isn't about healing the planet; it's about creating weapons to further her military goals. And yes, stopping goblins who are picking at wounds in the world we all depend on IS self defense. I'd have fought them on my Tauren druid if that was an option in game play, for attacking the Earth Mother.

    "I Am Vengeance. I Am The Night. I Am Felfáádaern!"

  14. #834
    Orcboi NatePsy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brewmaster Kolee View Post
    I read the book. Did you? Sylvanas wants to kill all the humans in Stormwind and turn them into Forsaken. Her first thought upon seeing Azerite isn't about healing the planet; it's about creating weapons to further her military goals. And yes, stopping goblins who are picking at wounds in the world we all depend on IS self defense. I'd have fought them on my Tauren druid if that was an option in game play, for attacking the Earth Mother.
    Totally agree with all of this post. I find it highly annoying how my hero has to do Sylvanas' bidding rather than straight up tell her "Cut the shit, the world is dying."

  15. #835
    Quote Originally Posted by Brewmaster Kolee View Post
    I read the book. Did you? Sylvanas wants to kill all the humans in Stormwind and turn them into Forsaken. Her first thought upon seeing Azerite isn't about healing the planet; it's about creating weapons to further her military goals. And yes, stopping goblins who are picking at wounds in the world we all depend on IS self defense. I'd have fought them on my Tauren druid if that was an option in game play, for attacking the Earth Mother.
    um.. no... picking a fight with someone because you believe something isn't self defense. that's like saying Daelin was acting in self defense when he took a trip to Kalimdor and started killing Trolls and trying to kill orcs.

    Again, the whole thing about Azerite and the wound is an incredibly forced story that was never fully confirmed beyond Magni's bad feeling. While it may be the literal wound in the planet and Azerite is the life blood... he runs around with no real proof beyond his word and being magically enhanced and taking a long nap isn't exactly reason enough to listen to someone.

    Edit: it seems the main reason druids would already feel a certain way is due to how the druids that were set up in the region got wiped out more so than the whole stone man showing up and saying something.
    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by NatePsy View Post
    Totally agree with all of this post. I find it highly annoying how my hero has to do Sylvanas' bidding rather than straight up tell her "Cut the shit, the world is dying."
    thing is that we don't know what effect that would have since world souls aren't required for life to exist (source: other worlds lack them and support life... hell Draenor supports life and it's shattered)

    edit2:

    realistically, neither party should take Magni's words at face value.... Sylvanas should be hesitant on groudns that he WAS the most powerful individual in the alliance hierarchy for the eastern kingdoms (no real king in stormwind and gnomes were in his city) and she still has some beef with the alliance as a whole. Anduin... ok maybe he is the type to immediately trust Magni because of who each of them are.... but still the first thought should have been "Who, What," instead of straight to STAHP
    Last edited by mickybrighteyes; 2018-07-14 at 10:34 AM.

  16. #836
    Elemental Lord Felfaadaern Darkterror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mickybrighteyes View Post
    Again, the whole thing about Azerite and the wound is an incredibly forced story that was never fully confirmed beyond Magni's bad feeling.
    Yeah, no real evidence... OTHER THAN A GIANT F-ING SWORD STICKING IN THE PLANET AND AZERITE (why did they name it that anyway?) OOZING FROM THE SAME SPOT. Probably just a coincidence.

    Quote Originally Posted by mickybrighteyes View Post
    While it may be the literal wound in the planet and Azerite is the life blood... he runs around with no real proof beyond his word and being magically enhanced and taking a long nap isn't exactly reason enough to listen to someone.
    Well the nap, and the fact that he was performing a Titan ritual for communing with the earth, that he's now made out of solid diamond, that we've seen him access secret Titan facilities, and that he's demonstrated an ability to communicate with world souls and other Titans. Just that.

    Quote Originally Posted by mickybrighteyes View Post
    Edit: it seems the main reason druids would already feel a certain way is due to how the druids that were set up in the region got wiped out more so than the whole stone man showing up and saying something.
    The reason my Tauren druid feels a certain way is that he was raised to "Walk with the Earth Mother", not pick at her wound after she's been stabbed by Sargeras. And because goblins are greedy little bastards that care more about gold than respecting nature and preserving quality of life for future generations.

    Quote Originally Posted by mickybrighteyes View Post
    realistically, neither party should take Magni's words at face value....
    If Magni's wrong - and we've no reason to believe he is - the consequence of listening to him would be that we spend time working together to clean up Silithus instead of killing each other. Oh the shame...

    IF on the other hand Magni is right - and all evidence suggests he is - and we ignore him, the consequences could be disastrous for all.
    Last edited by Felfaadaern Darkterror; 2018-07-14 at 10:53 AM.

    "I Am Vengeance. I Am The Night. I Am Felfáádaern!"

  17. #837
    Quote Originally Posted by Brewmaster Kolee View Post
    Yeah, no real evidence... OTHER THAN A GIANT F-ING SWORD STICKING IN THE PLANET AND AZERITE (why did they name it that anyway?) OOZING FROM THE SAME SPOT. Probably just a coincidence.
    you have the sword, you have a material rising to the surface. Yes you are correct. They call it azerite because whatever... That does not mean that it is literally the blood of the planet and the planet is going to die... furthermore there is no indication that the planet's death would mean anything in this fashion. We have literally traveled to and existed on dead worlds in this setting... actually the dead world was a fair bit nicer than the only other world with a living world soul that we've seen. So really you have evidence of an impact and a new material, that's it. Then you have one person's story that they can't really verify.
    Quote Originally Posted by Brewmaster Kolee View Post
    Well the nap, and the fact that he was performing a Titan ritual for communing with the earth, that he's now made out of solid diamond, that we've seen him access secret Titan facilities, and that he's demonstrated an ability to communicate with world souls and other Titans. Just that.
    accessing titan facilities isn't unique to him, though bronzebeards do seem to share this trait. Titan tech has been accessed by other folk as well...and as our characters have also spoken with titans and their keepers I'm not sure it's much of an indicator of anything grand except to showcase he hears voices. Given how people gifted with communicating with other powers has gone for... say orcs and some wizards... you'd think everyone would be a little more hesitant to just call it good....
    Quote Originally Posted by Brewmaster Kolee View Post
    The reason my Tauren druid feels a certain way is that he was raised to "Walk with the Earth Mother", not pick at her wound after she's been stabbed by Sargeras. And because goblins are greedy little bastards that care more about gold than respecting nature and preserving quality of life for future generations.
    I think you're jumping too quickly onto a bandwagon, but that's just me. I can't handle such short sighted behavior since we've seen worlds burn because some dude heard voices from a being that exists beyond what we understand.... That's basically how we got every legion invasion... and these void issues... and the scourge..... it's like that precursor to EVERY major wow lore event... Magically enhanced person heard something from beyond! it only worked out once so far, and that's because medivh felt bad about screwing it up the first time.

  18. #838
    Elemental Lord Felfaadaern Darkterror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mickybrighteyes View Post
    you have the sword, you have a material rising to the surface. Yes you are correct. They call it azerite because whatever... That does not mean that it is literally the blood of the planet and the planet is going to die... furthermore there is no indication that the planet's death would mean anything in this fashion. We have literally traveled to and existed on dead worlds in this setting... actually the dead world was a fair bit nicer than the only other world with a living world soul that we've seen. So really you have evidence of an impact and a new material, that's it. Then you have one person's story that they can't really verify.
    accessing titan facilities isn't unique to him, though bronzebeards do seem to share this trait. Titan tech has been accessed by other folk as well...and as our characters have also spoken with titans and their keepers I'm not sure it's much of an indicator of anything grand except to showcase he hears voices. Given how people gifted with communicating with other powers has gone for... say orcs and some wizards... you'd think everyone would be a little more hesitant to just call it good....


    I think you're jumping too quickly onto a bandwagon, but that's just me. I can't handle such short sighted behavior since we've seen worlds burn because some dude heard voices from a being that exists beyond what we understand.... That's basically how we got every legion invasion... and these void issues... and the scourge..... it's like that precursor to EVERY major wow lore event... Magically enhanced person heard something from beyond! it only worked out once so far, and that's because medivh felt bad about screwing it up the first time.
    Such short sighted behavior? Like "Let's hold off on the war until we see what's up with this giant sword sticking out of the planet"? And hey stop picking at it until we know what damage you might be doing!"?

    "Azerite is the name given to the crystallized blood of Azeroth. When Sargeras stabbed the world with his sword, it caused her to bleed her life essence all over the world. The Alliance and the Horde are now fighting over it.[1]"

    "The attack also caused Azerite, the blood of Azeroth, to spill forth."
    Last edited by Felfaadaern Darkterror; 2018-07-14 at 11:07 AM.

    "I Am Vengeance. I Am The Night. I Am Felfáádaern!"

  19. #839
    Quote Originally Posted by Brewmaster Kolee View Post
    Such short sighted behavior? Like "Let's hold off on the war until we see what's up with this giant sword sticking out of the planet"? And hey stop picking at it until we know what damage you might be doing!"?
    see... the whole thing with the sword in teh wound and azeroth dying bit. that whole jump skip and lack of evidence.

    do you assume every rock that falls from the sky is a threat to the planet if a new material pops up in the crater? Maybe if someone who does a couple cool tricks tells you it will change the face of of the planet? Most sane people would want to get a second opinion... you know... instead of jumping to conclusions because someone said a doomsday plot.

    edit:

    keep in mind that the immediate discussion on both sides was that the other faction would fuck something up. Horde expecting the alliance to break the peace and the alliance thinking the horde would do just that. What was anduin's second thought? that he couldn't have Sylvanas or the horde getting it. Seems he wasn't planning to just heal the world because of this resource either. spin it however you want but those were also his words before fully understanding what was taking place.
    Last edited by mickybrighteyes; 2018-07-14 at 11:08 AM.

  20. #840
    Elemental Lord Felfaadaern Darkterror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mickybrighteyes View Post
    see... the whole thing with the sword in teh wound and azeroth dying bit. that whole jump skip and lack of evidence.

    do you assume every rock that falls from the sky is a threat to the planet if a new material pops up in the crater? Maybe if someone who does a couple cool tricks tells you it will change the face of of the planet? Most sane people would want to get a second opinion... you know... instead of jumping to conclusions because someone said a doomsday plot.

    edit:

    keep in mind that the immediate discussion on both sides was that the other faction would fuck something up. Horde expecting the alliance to break the peace and the alliance thinking the horde would do just that. What was anduin's second thought? that he couldn't have Sylvanas or the horde getting it. Seems he wasn't planning to just heal the world because of this resource either. spin it however you want but those were also his words before fully understanding what was taking place.
    Most sane people would say "Hey that's a huge sword, and it was stabbed in there by the super villain who's been trying to kill us for generations, so maybe we should be careful and avoid messing with it until the shamans and druids and priests have all looked it over."

    "I Am Vengeance. I Am The Night. I Am Felfáádaern!"

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