1. #3561
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    Quote Originally Posted by BaumanKing View Post
    This series is currently being review-bombed by racists and russkies. Don't fall for this manipulation.
    And this is why people don't take you fucking clowns seriously and the whole world is starting to roll their eyes at this kind of bullshit response. This is the same dumbass excuse every time some piss ass woke show gets ratioed by the same audience it should be trying to attract by being entertaining.

    People love Arcane despite all of it's progressive themes. I've been watching The Expanse and that show is diverse but still has a great cast of characters and women who are badass. Both shows have great writing and interesting themes that make them entertaining without being preachy bullshit.

    Stop using the istaphobe excuse as a fucking shield for mediocrity being criticised. It's a piss ass excuse for a Tolkien adaptation and does nothing well, shilling for it isn't going to make you friends with IRLs version of Dr Evil.

  2. #3562
    Quote Originally Posted by ArminVanburkek View Post
    So are people raging basically about the racial diversity of the show or what?
    Some are, as always. Plenty are downvoting because of accuracy, acting, writing and story.
    To give a perspective, House of the Dragon haven't been review bombed because of diversity, there sure are criticisms about it, but people like the show. No reason why they would be treated differently except quality being the main drive.
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  3. #3563
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii View Post
    Some are, as always. Plenty are downvoting because of accuracy, acting, writing and story.
    To give a perspective, House of the Dragon haven't been review bombed because of diversity, there sure are criticisms about it, but people like the show. No reason why they would be treated differently except quality being the main drive.
    It's almost like if you make a halfway decent story with interesting characters, people can look past any potential race swapping silliness that really doesn't have an impact on a lot of shows, and actually judge it for what it is. House of the Dragon isn't mind blowing or anything, but it does everything well enough to be a decent show and people are fine with the creative liberties that were made so far. Of course, that could change as more episodes release.

    Also, anything to do with Tolkien is going to get an absurd amount of scrutiny from the purists. Fans of the films also would hold anything else to the high bar that Peter Jackson set with the trilogy, because even the Hobbit gets railed on for being bad.

  4. #3564
    Quote Originally Posted by s_bushido View Post
    They specifically showed a Balrog in that earlier trailer. No idea if that's supposed to be the same one that ultimately destroyed Khazad-dum, or just a red herring (like the cultist chick herself that they implied was summoning it in the first place...which everyone immediately assumed was supposed to be Annatar).
    That's a fair point, I suppose. I forgot about the trailer. I guess the Balrog storyline is too juicy for them not to include, even if it doesn't fit the chronology quite perfectly. Or maybe it does, and we see a lot bigger time spans than we think, who knows.

  5. #3565
    Merely a Setback PACOX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daedius View Post
    Watched the first two episodes, honestly thought it was decent.

    Is the "Stranger" Gandalf (was speaking to the bugs) or Sauron (the crater he was in looked like Sauron's Eye)?
    I'm hoping it's one of the the other wizards.

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  6. #3566
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii View Post
    Some are, as always. Plenty are downvoting because of accuracy, acting, writing and story.
    To give a perspective, House of the Dragon haven't been review bombed because of diversity, there sure are criticisms about it, but people like the show. No reason why they would be treated differently except quality being the main drive.
    They are getting treated differently because one was review bombed. Its not that people dislike it is the issue. Wheel of Time was disliked but wasnt review bombed. I can assume the sites problem saw a mass influx of traffic to their sites coming to downvote. I don't get the feeling Wheel of Time saw that much influx when people were upset about that show who's complaints were very similar I may add :P
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  7. #3567
    The Insane draynay's Avatar
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    Are we allowed to talk about the show? It seems ok, hard to tell after only a couple of episodes. I certainly don't feel compelled to go review or rate it right away. Almost seems like a person would need some kind of agenda to rush into such actions.
    /s

  8. #3568
    The problem with racial diversity in this kind of shows is usually more related to cultures than it is to race.

    Something like presenting an isolated small community on a medieval setting as if it was a melting pot from a big city from our 21st century makes it less believable and if the show has a serious tone, it makes it less likeable. Is not a problem with race because that small community doesn't have to be a bunch of white people, they could as well be a bunch of black people, asian people or anything you want as long as they all have similar racial traits and the same made-up culture within that setting.

    I don't mind diversity as long as it is presented in a way that makes sense both within the setting of the world and the tone of the show.
    Let's imagine that we have two cities.
    One is a popular trade port that is close to the border with some other kindgom and it has a lot of sea trade from more kingdoms.
    The other city is some boring place at the north, far from any border, basically just trades with other cities from the same kingdom.

    Presenting a racially diverse society on the first city is totally fine, because it's easy to justify and understand that after centuries trading with diverse countries, immigration happened, people mixed up and the culture from that city is diverse. Trying to do the same thing with the second city will have a negative effect because it won't be believable. Or you can simply have a very different tone in your show up to the point that the world setting is not taken seriously because the show is about the romance & drama between characters.

    Anyway, good writing and good acting can do wonders even with forced diversity. It's usually the lack of the first two what makes people pay more attention to things like race and how much sense it makes in that setting.
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  9. #3569
    Titan Orby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by draynay View Post
    Are we allowed to talk about the show? It seems ok, hard to tell after only a couple of episodes. I certainly don't feel compelled to go review or rate it right away. Almost seems like a person would need some kind of agenda to rush into such actions.
    See that's always been my way of thinking, unless the site has a review episode by episode format (as IMDB does), but you shouldn't be able to rate the whole season until the season is finished, it makes sense... at least in my opinion
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  10. #3570
    Quote Originally Posted by Orby View Post
    They are getting treated differently because one was review bombed. Its not that people dislike it is the issue. Wheel of Time was disliked but wasnt review bombed. I can assume the sites problem saw a mass influx of traffic to their sites coming to downvote. I don't get the feeling Wheel of Time saw that much influx when people were upset about that show who's complaints were very similar I may add :P
    What I meant is, why is the review bombers treating the show differently when both have been criticized for the same thing?
    If diversity and BLACK PEOPLE were the problem and main drive for a review bomb, then surely HotD would be susceptible for it as well. But it wasn't, even though it received the same critique.
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  11. #3571
    Quote Originally Posted by draynay View Post
    Are we allowed to talk about the show?
    I wish they would. Woke up today to several more pages of race/diversity bullshit. I mean I get it, but there's no point going on about it and the mods have already given warnings. Just shut the fuck up about it. There's a risk of this thread being closed and that would suck.

    Anyway... seems like some people are suggesting that Halbrand is Annatar, and that there might even be some romance between him and Galadriel. There's even a hint of it in the writing, when the king speaks about her to Elrond: "She might have inadvertently kept alive the very evil she sought to defeat" I really hope not though.

  12. #3572
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii View Post
    What I meant is, why is the review bombers treating the show differently when both have been criticized for the same thing?
    If diversity and BLACK PEOPLE were the problem and main drive for a review bomb, then surely HotD would be susceptible for it as well. But it wasn't, even though it received the same critique.
    I think there are many reasons,

    House of the Dragon was made with George RR Martin and close to the end of Season 8, so that familiarity is fresh and in the show keeps with continuity, also after season 8 I would assume a lot of fans were dead low on expectations.

    With Rings of Power it mostly has to do with lead up and time between franchises, there are no familiarity with the source material, that worried alot of fans, say what you want about Hobbit, it had that familiarity with Lot. Also its not being made with help from people who helped make the movies which may put people off where as House of the dragon was made by basically the same team. I can also feel that Lord of the Rings like star Wars has a very gate keepy toxic fanbase who cling onto the past of how things were done then, let's not forget that the original movie was 20+ years ago. With House of the Draogn it's been like only 5 years since Season 8?

    There are so many reasons I havent included because its never just one. there's also cos the fandom is racist as fuck, but that's the obvious go to. Let's not forget that the lead up to the show featured grifter channels constantly posting Galadriel, the black elf and the black dwarf in the thumbnail, so they knew what their main focus was on.
    Last edited by Orby; 2022-09-04 at 09:20 AM.
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  13. #3573
    Quote Originally Posted by DarkAmbient View Post
    There's even a hint of it in the writing, when the king speaks about her to Elrond: "She might have inadvertently kept alive the very evil she sought to defeat"
    He said that because she's consumed by her need for vengeance...not because of some man she hadn't even met yet. It's possible the theory about him is true, but I don't see any reason to ship them just because of what Gil Galad said.

  14. #3574
    Quote Originally Posted by s_bushido View Post
    He said that because she's consumed by her need for vengeance...not because of some man she hadn't even met yet. It's possible the theory about him is true, but I don't see any reason to ship them just because of what Gil Galad said.
    People aren't shipping them/guessing his identity based 100% on that line. It's just a possible hint, which is something that writers occasionally do. I would be surprised if he is Annatar, because it would have been quite a clumsy and obvious introduction.

  15. #3575
    Quote Originally Posted by Demonic-inessa View Post
    Well seems to be important too many People

    Woke Vs Traditional Familie

    We will not surrender to forced inclusivity or abomination like self-identified disability people

    It’s a war.

    Racial upheaval and cultural clash

    Amazon Woke Ideology is tryinf to put a Bear,Lion and a Monkey into the same Cage.

    It doesn’t work.

    Simple as that, proof it works.

    Oh see everybody is talking about race and woke infused agenda on ring on powers
    Come back and try again at making your idiotic point when you’ve learned to spell.

  16. #3576
    Quote Originally Posted by DarkAmbient View Post
    People aren't shipping them/guessing his identity based 100% on that line. It's just a possible hint, which is something that writers occasionally do. I would be surprised if he is Annatar, because it would have been quite a clumsy and obvious introduction.
    eh, people ship basically any two characters who spend more than a couple minutes on screen together.

    But the idea that Sauron would try to seduce Galadriel isn't a terrible one. "...enemies closer" and all that.

  17. #3577
    I am Murloc! Ihavewaffles's Avatar
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    My brother was not kind to this show lol..

    Said they were too giddy that they got their hands on the show, so the story didn't have a good flow, they acted like a tribute band, had to display their excitement, a 100 things were happening at once, should have taken their time lije 1st movie hanged around in the shire..
    He didn't care for space jesus meteorite man talking to fire flies thingy

    That the elven company should have been their own episodes, 2-3, unlike the fellowship for the ring, u didn't get to know any of the elves, name-less..

    The dwarves were too much n it was too nice khazad-dum, wanted more like Erebor before smaug..

  18. #3578
    Quote Originally Posted by Demonic-inessa View Post
    Well seems to be important too many People

    Woke Vs Traditional Familie

    We will not surrender to forced inclusivity or abomination like self-identified disability people

    It’s a war.

    Racial upheaval and cultural clash

    Amazon Woke Ideology is tryinf to put a Bear,Lion and a Monkey into the same Cage.

    It doesn’t work.

    Simple as that, proof it works.

    Oh see everybody is talking about race and woke infused agenda on ring on powers
    And there we have it. All pretense that this is about freedom of speech, quality, censorship, right out of the window. Full-on right-win nutjob. You go on fight your war, then. Let's see how many of you show up. It'll be fun to watch.

  19. #3579
    Confusing story. Usually 2 episodes are released to "conclude" a beginning. Adrift was just..adrift.

    How come HoDragons didn't try to appeal to all "cultures"?

    Didn't Elrond marry Galadriel's daughter? I thought she be much older compared to him.
    Last edited by jdbond; 2022-09-04 at 10:25 AM.

  20. #3580
    Quote Originally Posted by Orby View Post
    There are so many reasons I havent included because its never just one. there's also cos the fandom is racist as fuck, but that's the obvious go to. Let's not forget that the lead up to the show featured grifter channels constantly posting Galadriel, the black elf and the black dwarf in the thumbnail, so they knew what their main focus was on.
    If you followed all the Amazon sponsored media surrounding the launch of the series for the past couple months... they're the ones that were constantly bringing up diversity/representation/etc. It's only natural to respond to what the showrunners are saying about the show. Furthermore, when your main message is heavily identity politics when advertising a show instead of what actually should matter in a show, that's generally a sign that they're not confident in their product. The current game plan that Disney/Amazon/etc. like to play is to get ahead of a release (sometimes months in advance) and say that their shows will get hate because of racism/bigotry/etc., and when their shows get released and are terrible even without considering identity politics they just deflect to what they said prior. Again, it's a marketing tactic that gets eaten up by low information news consumers, and it's not reflective of reality.

    The so-called 'grifters' tended to pretty much call attention to what Amazon and the showrunners were calling attention to, can't really blame them for that. If you actually listened to what the so-called 'grifters' were saying, the general concern was that the show runners are likely focusing on all the wrong things and that the story/show will likely be terrible, not "this show will be terrible because it has representation regardless of the story/presentation!" Couple of them had inside access to the details of the first season content and were warning about what was to come... and they were 100% on the mark so far, down to the tiny details in each episode.

    Anyways, the show feels like it's a step above CW shows with an elevated budget in most cases. The writing is still awful, especially Galadriel being pretty insufferable and overpowered as hell, but much of the characterization and dialogue across the board is just poor. Furthermore, the writing is littered with the writers trying to sound auspicious and thought-provoking, when it's just nonsensical ramblings, non sequitur statements, or just circular logic. I've heard it described as the not-Hobbits being like community theatre, and that's pretty accurate. Elves just come off as cosplaying humans versus what Peter Jackson executed and how Tolkien describes elves and their presence. Only thing that comes off good is some of the background views and occasionally the attention to detail with props. This isn't even going into the issues concerning lore deviations and timeline issues, editing, structure, etc.

    While I could go into individual scenes to go point-by-point, the overall point is that the show is shaping up to be pretty underwhelming at best. If the show was completely divorced from the Tolkien lore, it'd be just a generic fantasy show that would probably not garner much attention given its quality thus far. If this is the best Amazon can put forward with a billion dollar budget for introducing a flagship series, there's bound to be some panicking.
    Last edited by exochaft; 2022-09-04 at 10:33 AM.
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