Lord of the Rings TV Series Purchased by Amazon

[tikcol]

https://lotr.fandom.com/wiki/Amroth

This guy?

At dawn of the following morning, the storm dissipated. However, when Amroth awoke, he saw that the ship was already far from its port. Full of despair, Amroth screamed Nimrodel's name, threw himself into the water below and drowned.

I swear some of these posters do some random google searches for the topics being discussed like "lotr elf swim" and copy/paste the first thing they find into this board without any regard or knowledge about what they're doing

[Gumble]

Hey, it could be worse.

You could have had a couple of untrained magic users decimate the a huge army of Orcs with magic they were never taught or had the ability to use, die in the process, and then be magically revived because someone felt bad, utterly removing any stakes or logic from the show from that point on.

/goes off to grumble about WoT..............

[rhorle]

This guy?

“The mariners with their Elvish sight for a long time could see him battling with the waves, until the rising sun gleamed through the clouds and far off lit his bright hair like a spark of gold. No eyes of Elves or Men ever saw him again in Middle- earth.”

If you take the text from the source it implies that he swam until no one could see him anymore and then drowned because he was never seen from again. It implies that elves are capable of swimming and won't drown as soon as the depth is greater than their height. I'm not even sure what you are trying to argue because the point isn't that elves can't drown but that elves can swim.

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I swear some of these posters do some random google searches for the topics being discussed like "lotr elf swim" and copy paste the first thing they see here without any regard or knowledge about what they're doing

Lmao. Are you that eager to insult people that don't agree with your view point? Here is the text that implies he had the ability to swim far enough to go out of sight of watchers: “The mariners with their Elvish sight for a long time could see him battling with the waves, until the rising sun gleamed through the clouds and far off lit his bright hair like a spark of gold. No eyes of Elves or Men ever saw him again in Middle- earth.”

[Myradin]

A dude that swam out of sight range and then drowned doesnt exactly give me confidence in their ability to cross oceans.

[Triceron]

“The mariners with their Elvish sight for a long time could see him battling with the waves, until the rising sun gleamed through the clouds and far off lit his bright hair like a spark of gold. No eyes of Elves or Men ever saw him again in Middle- earth.”

If you take the text from the source it implies that he swam until no one could see him anymore and then drowned because he was never seen from again. It implies that elves are capable of swimming and won't drown as soon as the depth is greater than their height. I'm not even sure what you are trying to argue because the point isn't that elves can't drown but that elves can swim.

The Elf drowns in the sea. I don't know how you can cherry pick the first half to support some inane scenario where Galadriel doing the same would make sense, while ignoring the fact that Elves are still prone to death by their environments and are unable to swim across the sea on their own.

Sorry, but your example is self-defeating if you're trying to illustrate how well Elves can swim and bring up a story where one of the most physically fit Elves ever described ends up drowning in the open sea.

[rhorle]

The Elf drowns in the sea.

That was never in question. The only one cherry picking here is yourself so you can go off on a rant about the Galadriel scene again. The context of my post, and the discussion being had, was about the ability for elves to swim. A poster claimed that they couldn't and nothing in Tolkien's work indicated they could. The ability to swim is not just the ability to never drown. It is ignorant to even try and make that argument. The best swimmer in the real world can still drown. Does that mean no human can swim well? Lmao.

Learn how to understand context:

There is no reference of Tolkien elves knowing how to swim. An early draft of the Silmarillion featured mermaids teaching one half-elf to swim, while a pure elf failed to learn. Elves often sit, stand and walk near water, yet there is no reference of any elf ever swimming in thousands of pages of stories.

TLDR: Tolkien elves can't swim.

[Triceron]

Hey, it could be worse.

You could have had a couple of untrained magic users decimate the a huge army of Orcs with magic they were never taught or had the ability to use, die in the process, and then be magically revived because someone felt bad, utterly removing any stakes or logic from the show from that point on.

/goes off to grumble about WoT..............

Well that happened in the WoT finale. We're still 5 episodes away so....

[bledgor]

Well that happened in the WoT finale. We're still 5 episodes away so....

Listen I want to believe it won't get that bad, let me live with that lie for a few weeks more.

[DarkAmbient]

Following Tolkien lore/logic she would have to be roughly 4000-5000 years old, as she lived ~1400 years in the age of the trees (remember that in the year of the trees they tracked time different than later ages, at a scale of roughly 10 to 1), ~600 years in the 1st age, and then we have the 2nd age lasting ~3500 years.

Considering we have Isildur alive, a man who lived ~200 years, and his and many others actions lead to the end of the 2nd age with the defeat of Sauron, we can roughly tell we are at the end of the 2nd age, putting her at least in the 4000 if not 5000 range.

Now the show is doing whatever the fuck they want, so in theory she can be 100's of years old, cause they don't give a single fuck about lore. Galadriel SHOULD be wise/knowledge still at this point, as she is one of the eldest of the eldar, older than even high king Gil-Galad, but again Amazon is doing their own lore independent show so who knows.

I fucked up there with not taking into account the Valarian years. The Rings of Power were forged in SA 1500 so according to that she should be somewhere between 2000 and 3500 solar years old. But Isildur was born over 1700 years after the forging of the rings, and yet he's already alive. Like you said, they don't give a fuck.

[bledgor]

I fucked up there with not taking into account the Valarian years. The Rings of Power were forged in SA 1500 so according to that she should be somewhere between 2000 and 3500 solar years old. But Isildur was born over 1700 years after the forging of the rings, and yet he's already alive. Like you said, they don't give a fuck.

Then you have things like politician Elrond, who in a few short years I am supposed to believe becomes the 2nd hand man of Gil-Galad leading the forces of Elves and man against Sauron? Not to mention he shortly after the war marries Celebrian, who isn't even born yet (unless Galadriel just you know is an utter cunt and doesn't care about her child or husband).

They also fucked up his story by saying he wasn't invited to the meeting because it was for nobles, like mother fucking he is a descendant of Finwe, the first high king of the Noldor. This also makes him related somewhat distantly with Galadriel. Like you want to say he wasn't invited because he was half-elven or because of what Feanor did, still bad but at least some logic exists, but they once again took the worst path.

[rhorle]

They also fucked up his story by saying he wasn't invited to the meeting because it was for nobles, like mother fucking he is a descendant of Finwe, the first high king of the Noldor.

He wasn't invited to the council because he was not yet an elf-lord. So it wasn't about simply being a noble but being a "high enough" noble. Like excluding a prince in a meeting of Kings. Was it ever said that he was an elf-lord prior to founding Rivendell? As that happened after Eregion was destroyed which has yet to happen on the show.

Even if Tolkien did already consider him an elf-lord it is a small enough change to better show case a rise to greater political status for a character arc. It really isn't a big deal at all.

[Dhrizzle]

Cool, she still remains one of the eldest of the elves, and unless the plan is to make her COMPLETELY different at the end of the show compared to the beginning she should at least show SOME wisdom, but in the show she basically has none. By your logic Gil-Galad would be roughly 25-27 LY old, the mortal equivalent of 20 yet he has more wisdom and is high king.

Not my logic, assuming you're following the same scjeme i am then it is Tolkien's logic. Also where are you getting that Gil-galad is wiser? Galadriel might be going about it wrong but she is aware of the need to seek out and confront evil.

You guys ignore other elves exist and how they behave when you try to point out anything Galadriel related.

Or maybe it makes more sense to compare Galadriel to her peers like Fëanor and his sons? Their upbringing and heritage is close to Galadriels and their behaviour caused massive problems for the world (or "they were brats" as you would probably say.)

Not to mention I also used numbers from the lore, which are the years Tolkien described. My numbers are also still back by what is in the Silmarillion, at the start of the 2nd age Galadriel was 2000 years old roughly, so minimally she was one of the eldest Eldar. Stop making bullshit excuses for Amazons bad adaptation. They don't need your help they are already buying a ton of it.

*shrug* and my numbers are backed by Tolkien's writing in Nature of Middle-earth. You're not saying I'm wrong you're saying that Tolkien's writings are wildly inconsistent with one another.

Also saying "mortal equivalent" is such bullshit,

Take it up with Tolkien not me, it's his phrase.

Elves are considering mature enough to marry at 50 mortal years (Elven age of .5 years old using the numbers). They don't age/act like they need 100 more years to grow into an equivalent stage as humans.

Citation very much needed for that as it is contradictory to pretty much everything in NoM-e.

Not to mention she has already lived through the fall of the trees, the kinslaying, oath of Faenor, journey to middle earth and so much at this point to deny she would have obtained at LEAST SOME WISDOM, but the show displays none of that.

First up it really isn't worth getting this mad about. Secondly it's not a lack of wisdom, it's poor judgement due to grief. And before you try saying that only brats are allowed emotions try to remember that Tolkien's Elves can literally die from being too sad.

This isn't even touching the lack of her being married or a mother at this point.

We don't know what her marital status is as that hasn't been shown.

[Triceron]

We don't know what her marital status is as that hasn't been shown.

We don't know, yet we do know.

[rhorle]

...Tolkien's writings are wildly inconsistent with one another.

I think this is a good thing to remember when discussing the stuff that isn't a full story. There are some things they he kept revising or changing which could lead to the inconsistencies. I remember reading that one of the reasons why he originally wrote The Hobbit was because his kids kept contradicting him on the Oral version of the story at bed time.

Also didn't he want to re-write the lore to make it so Arda was always round from the start but never actually released a revised edition to incorporate that?

[Fight4Fun]

A story, that even 1kkk$ can't buy you talent and skillz

[Dhrizzle]

I think this is a good thing to remember when discussing the stuff that isn't a full story. There are some things they he kept revising or changing which could lead to the inconsistencies. I remember reading that one of the reasons why he originally wrote The Hobbit was because his kids kept contradicting him on the Oral version of the story at bed time.

Also didn't he want to re-write the lore to make it so Arda was always round from the start but never actually released a revised edition to incorporate that?

Yes, also the Sun and Moon were going to have always existed with no Lamps, one version of Galadriel's story has her meeting Celeborn (then Teleporno) in Aman, and he seemed to favour Orcs being bred from Men.

[Syegfryed]

So, there still people defending this shitshow still? i took a break from all this nonsense and check some shorts/reviews in youtube and oh my god, how they can make everything WORSE

They done so dirt with the hobbits, how can you be so bad at writing that you have to constantly contradict yourself in it, one scene you have those fuckers say no one o out of the trail, that they help each other and its their nature, and the other you have then saying if someone have a slightest problem he is left behind, and make fun of those that died.

Im pretty sure they though this would be funny, but its demented.


the Last episode is prob one of the worst, we found out Not-sauron is actually not-aragorn, what a fucking rip-off from the movies.

- The writers think orcs are fucking vampires, that burn in the sun, except, when they don't, tons of scenes with arms and legs exposed
- The orcs put the elf fuckers to work on the day, instead of night, because its how they get that cool shot in the begining.
- the eves start a bitch ass fight over a fucking tree, when they are planning to escape, cause killing that tree is way too far, did they played night elves here in wow or something?
- Galadriel being insufferable and the worst ever
- not-Aragorn stealing shit in front of the queen and everyone else and no one pay attention
-people notice how galadriel is an elf with the hair covering the ears, later when she have her ears exposed, no one notice

and we can keep going on and on, and i genuinely don't know how you can pretend this is not pure garbage.

Oh, and, we did notice, the orcs? all white, the "evil southlanders who sided with Morgoth?" wink wink

[Kumorii]

Oh, and, we did notice, the orcs? all white, the "evil southlanders who sided with Morgoth?" wink wink

I thought it was kind of on the nose in the trailer already.

[Syegfryed]

Did you watch the newest episode? Are you going to keep watching?

Nope, just watched the first one, and it was a dumbster fire, i let other people took the bullet for me now and say what happens, and, some short scenes on social media

But, im going to watch friday with like 6 friends at the bar so we will discuss it, pretty much like we put bad movies on to laugh or asses off, like we did with the batman with nipples

[Triceron]

Nope, just watched the first one, and it was a dumbster fire, i let other people took the bullet for me now and say what happens, and, some short scenes on social media

But, im going to watch friday with like 6 friends at the bar so we will discuss it, pretty much like we put bad movies on to laugh or asses off, like we did with the batman with nipples

Oh man, get ready for the cringiest slow-mo horse-riding scene ever