Lord of the Rings TV Series Purchased by Amazon

[Kumorii]

As others have said.
Finally things start to happen. Although there's lots of fighting which isn't required for things to get moving, but things are regardless.

At this point, if I look at it from the view of someone who doesn't know anything about LotR and the characters involved except very surface level; I think it would be satisfying for Halbrand to be Sauron.
Him saying he was driven from the lands by orcs and Adar saying he killed Sauron, which connects him being driven away from the southlands.
Halbrand having history with Adar and I think the reason why he asked if he remembers him is for him knowing he needs to kill him or not. Not killing him sells his cover more so than killing him to prevent him from talking. Them giving imagery of smithing when talking about his past, all of these are breadcrumbs to Halbrand.
At this point I would probably be disappointed if he isn't because regardless of my overall view on the show, these hints they are doing are actually quite subtle and well done, but if you pay attention you can see it.

Would also explain why Halbrand managed to get ahead of both Galadriel and Adar in the woods.
I would buy it if he ran on a path next to them and they showed he slowly caught up, but nah. He came from the opposite direction...and Galadriel disappearing for quite a bit of time after he tripped Adar when she was just right behind him didn't make much sense to me. No galadriel visible when they did the wide shots and she gets off the horse just in time to say stop. Felt a bit contrived.

Side note:
Adars speech to Halbrand during that moment made me think I've heard this kind of speech before. Couldn't put my finger on it until I remember that Homelander actually does a similar speech. Not saying it's a bad thing, I think getting inspiration from that show / comic is good tbh.

The way the show handle extras is still very bad. It's clear that no one really matters except the main cast. As long as extras dies no one really gives a shit. Them being ambushed and no one really caring for any of them, but then all of them focus on Bronwyn's condition, shown by the camera panning to extras to show their response to her pain is just there to enforce that she is a main character... breaks immersion for me. Have people tend to more wounded, have people worried about other things. They brought in one extra person and he died just so they could focus on Bronwyn more and simply to show how selfless she is. It's too obvious imo.
It feels very static and everything is just there for the main characters. Shows and movies generally are, but it detracts from the world building imo. It's clear it's a show when these things happen.
As @Orbyn mentions above. I don't mind them having a party, but that they don't even mention the people who fought in the battle and died and made a toast in their honor or something just screams "Eh, lets party, only extras died so who gives a shit, right?" to me.

Think the choreography is better here. Probably because it's more chaotic, so it's more about getting things done rather than flair and showing off X or Y characters skill (except Galadriel, because of course). Which is how I think fights should be made overall. So I liked it. When watching Arondir I noticed he actually used some capoeira moves. Which isn't actually used that often. And decided to google and he did in fact learn capoeira for his fight scenes. Which I appreciate, I think it suits elves tbh.

Galadriel, still a weak point. Her talking to Isildur about humility is just laughable. Especially funny because at the end Arondir says "They have waited long for their king", paraphrasing of course. Her response is "Not as long as the elves". Really showing some humility there. Ignore the fact these people have had a shit week with orcs and finally got some hope. Nah, elves waited longer. She instantly turns to violence as soon as Adar talks back... still waiting for that growth of this character.

Also I am not sure how that one dude knew what to do with the broken sword thing that led to the finale, was that mentioned or did the sword tell him? I was confused there, so maybe someone can let me know?

I'll respond to this quote talking about this bit. I think those who are branded by it gets a connection to it.
Arondir "hides" the sword-key from everyone, not even telling Bronwyn. But apparently Theon knows where it is, so he must know somehow. Same with the old guy, he is also branded by it and probably either hear voices or have "seen" what it is and what it's for. Theon didn't know what it was for though, so my guess it has some form of saurons consciousness in it, so it can decide on it's own. Similar to how the One Ring have a will of it's own, right.
This is speculation though and could just be poor writing and convenience.

Question I have is though is why did Arondir just give an axe to Theon? I get it that he wants people to believe it's gone, so I understand giving him a dummy object. Though I do find the plan to be a bit stupid considering literally anyone can just open the package and thinking no one will is pretty gullible. However, the sword is gone and he knows it's gone but doesn't seem worried about or even warns anyone? Not sure what Arondir is thinking here, he made damn sure that Galadriel get it back because of it's importance but now that it's gone for real, no concern really. Could be an editing issue and people just aren't aware it's gone. How the old guy got it though isn't shown...but I figured they would guard this object a bit more securely?

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And the plan for the orcs to dig tunnels across the lands so a sword-key can open the floodgates at a tower to fill them and direct to water to what I assume is gonna become mount doom is a bit to bombastic and contrived. Imagine making this specific plans a long time ago when building the flood gate / tower and making a sword-key for this contraption so one day you can do this. Now I'm just curious what lead up to this plan being hatched in the first place. I think it can be explained, so I'm not that annoyed by it, hopefully the show will explain it though. Otherwise I will be.



Episodes are getting better for the most part. I assume next episode will be of the same quality because it will be the same director.

[Mazza]

Did - in Tolkien tradition - the Numenor army get carried there by the eagles or something? I mean, that army sure got there fast and they somehow knew exactly where they had to go? Did I miss Halbrand knowing where the orcs were heading?

Other than that, this is the best episode so far. Happy to give this a 7, even a 7.5. Solid.

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Question I have is though is why did Arondir just give an axe to Theon? I get it that he wants people to believe it's gone, so I understand giving him a dummy object. Though I do find the plan to be a bit stupid considering literally anyone can just open the package and thinking no one will is pretty gullible. However, the sword is gone and he knows it's gone but doesn't seem worried about or even warns anyone? Not sure what Arondir is thinking here, he made damn sure that Galadriel get it back because of it's importance but now that it's gone for real, no concern really. Could be an editing issue and people just aren't aware it's gone. How the old guy got it though isn't shown...but I figured they would guard this object a bit more securely?

I think he didn't realise it wasn't the hilt and Adar always had the hatchet in there. If he knew, there would be a lot more urgency regarding the key being missing. You never see them open the package until Theo does. Also, you can hear Adar give that old guy a mission right before the Numenor army attacks. I think that he gave him the key then already and sent him off while distracting Galadriel and co.

[Kumorii]

I think he didn't realise it wasn't the hilt and Adar always had the hatchet in there. If he knew, there would be a lot more urgency regarding the key being missing.

When did it get swapped? (actually, he probably swapped it after getting it from the house, doesn't explain why no one is double checking the contents of the package though) Galadriel and Halbrand caught him.
If he didn't have it, they should raise alarm he didn't have it. If he did, they should double check it's the hilt. Still no alarm about it being switched.

If you gonna give the hilt to Theon to give to Numenor so they can toss it over the ship on their way home, It's quite important to make sure it's the right object.

Something got lost in the editorial process I'm sure, which feels like it happens quite often. Just a few short scenes under 1 minute in total of material would probably explain this "plot-twist" in a better way. They hade plenty of other scenes they could cut down from to make this work.

For this outcome to happen as shown, everyone have to be ridiculously stupid. Everyone knows it's an important object. Act like such.

[InfiniteCharger]

So basically, the whole point of the writing is to show how there was this big battle near the tower with Orcs but no Sauron yet, as he is still hidden, while the key to his plan is used to activate a switch. Because obviously in the actual lore only Sauron was making orcs and commanding them at this point. Which they obviously wrote that way so they can still keep with the idea that Sauron's whereabouts are a "mystery" leading up to the creation of the rings of power. That is even though Adar, who only exists to allow Sauron to remain a mystery, almost laid it out already. And at the same time the bad guys still get to accomplish their mission of causing the eruption of mount doom because the main heroes are complete idiots, which is a continuing theme of this series. Keeping in mind all of the contrivances that led to all of these story lines tying together in the events of this episode.

None of that would be a problem if the payoff was worth it, but nothing in this series comes off as Epic or grand in any way, which is what I would expect from a work set in the second age of Tolkien. And for me that just comes from the fact that live action cannot compete with video games in doing stories like this justice, without a lot of dedication, effort and talent to even make it come close to capturing that epic nature of high fantasy....... And this show just isn't doing it. And on top of that, they aren't even getting the basics right from writing, to acting, to costumes, to dialog and so forth to even make it a decent show just in general.

For me, the definition of generic fantasy is something where this is no investment in the lore, world building, characters and settings to make something that stands out and is distinct with a very memorable story, characters and events. And many times a lot of that also depends on visual effects which also requires similar investment along with all those other things to stand out.

[DarkAmbient]

Things happening = good. The writing = bad. Galadriel the Wise didn't think to unwrap the object to see if it was the hilt. Neither did Arondir, nor did he notice it was now suspiciously axe-shaped. Totally-Not-Sauron didn't check it because he wanted the ploy to work. (Oh and did you notice his weapon of choice was a spear, the same weapon he - I mean Sauron - was holding during the brief flashback at the start of the show).

A suspiciously large number of Rohirrim and horses (charging in daylight even though it was night when Adar heard them approaching) considering the size and number of boats they arrived in.

Halbrand being proclaimed Lord and King because he's carrying a pouch with a marking on it.

Almost at the end of the season and the hobbits' existence has so far been utterly pointless.

Galadriel actually falling for Totally-Not-Sauron. I'm looking forward to seeing how she and everyone else in the village survive a devastating pyroclastic flow.

[Soikona]

The only thing that is bias is giving it a low rating purely on hating something because in your opinion its not tolkien, hes dead we dont know what he would want only what you seem to think.

The proof of the show being good is clear in all evidence so you cant deny most ppl think its a good show.

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The show was advertised as being true to the source material was it not? Is critiquing it because it didn’t do as it said, on such an enormous level, not warrant in your eyes?

[Joszef Kiprich]

Props to the person who guessed what Adar was. Turns out there was more to his name than I figured.

Sometimes I have a moment of clarity.

So since Adar means father in Sindar, could he be the first Elf turned into Orc by Morgoth?

[Kumorii]

Forgot to mention the orcs vampirism inconsistencies. Adar clearly showed us how much it burns them, yet they never do even if legs and hands / arms are in the sunlight unless they want to pay attention to it.

Seems like a silly detail to add when you're not gonna care about it.

[rhorle]

Great the point was there aren't 10 million more out there like you claimed.

You said the Nielsen ratings gives us 11 million over 4 days. We also know 25 million viewed the show in the first 24 hours. 25-11=14. There are at least 14 million views unaccounted for with the Nielsen ratings. So either way you are still wrong.

[DarkAmbient]

Please let's not have pages more tedious pointscoring about the fucking viewing figures...

[Joszef Kiprich]

Please let's not have pages more tedious pointscoring about the fucking viewing figures...

This. Thank you in advance.

[PACOX]

Did - in Tolkien tradition - the Numenor army get carried there by the eagles or something? I mean, that army sure got there fast and they somehow knew exactly where they had to go? Did I miss Halbrand knowing where the orcs were heading?

Sailing never made logical sense in LOTR. It's one out that the showrunners get. Space and time just break on the water.

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Things happening = good. The writing = bad. Galadriel the Wise didn't think to unwrap the object to see if it was the hilt. Neither did Arondir, nor did he notice it was now suspiciously axe-shaped. Totally-Not-Sauron didn't check it because he wanted the ploy to work. (Oh and did you notice his weapon of choice was a spear, the same weapon he - I mean Sauron - was holding during the brief flashback at the start of the show).

You could say it was magic that kept anyone from opening any one of the packages because that's how magic works in Middle Earth. It can be as much as occasional sparks and flames as it can be influencing the minds of others ie the rings.

[rhorle]

Did - in Tolkien tradition - the Numenor army get carried there by the eagles or something? I mean, that army sure got there fast and they somehow knew exactly where they had to go? Did I miss Halbrand knowing where the orcs were heading?

In a previous episode Halbrand guessed that the orcs were heading towards Ostirith/Tower and surrounding villages based on the direction they were traveling when he fled.

[Kumorii]

You could say it was magic that kept anyone from opening any one of the packages because that's how magic works in Middle Earth. It can be as much as occasional sparks and flames as it can be influencing the minds of others ie the rings.

You could tell the influence of the ring. Jackson showed it and characters acted it.
This idea of solving things by just labeling it as "magic" is just bad. Something doesn't make sense or is told in a bad way? Magic.

[PACOX]

You could tell the influence of the ring. Jackson showed it and characters acted it.
This idea of solving things by just labeling it as "magic" is just bad. Something doesn't make sense or is told in a bad way? Magic.

How could it not be the hilt influencing people to not check any of the bundles. Sauron puts a lot of power into his artifacts. If the rings can influence vast areas over great distances, surely the hilt can momentarily influence people in a relatively smaller area.

It could just be bad writing. I'm just saying magic in LOTR has always been wishy washy and a convenient 'out' when things aren't properly explained.

[kenn9530]

The show was advertised as being true to the source material was it not? Is critiquing it because it didn’t do as it said, on such an enormous level, not warrant in your eyes?

For one they dont have the rights as far as im aware for all the source material, just what the films were allowed to do so it was not advertised as an exact adaptation at all, tolkien also didnt write a story in the time RoP is active so noone but tolkien can actually say if its not something he would of done or not anyway and it doesnt mean it isnt still following the story of LOTR, hardcore fans are the absolute worst because if something is even a fraction away from what they believe something should be they just wont like it, while most normal fans that like the films wont care and still like the show.

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Did - in Tolkien tradition - the Numenor army get carried there by the eagles or something? I mean, that army sure got there fast and they somehow knew exactly where they had to go? Did I miss Halbrand knowing where the orcs were heading?

Other than that, this is the best episode so far. Happy to give this a 7, even a 7.5. Solid.

The southlands aka mordor only has a few access points anyway so if you have a general direction you will know where they would be headed pretty easily. Even more so if you are needing to get an army there with access.

[Kumorii]

How could it not be the hilt influencing people to not check any of the bundles. Sauron puts a lot of power into his artifacts. If the rings can influence vast areas over great distances, surely the hilt can momentarily influence people in a relatively smaller area.

It could just be bad writing. I'm just saying magic in LOTR has always been wishy washy and a convenient 'out' when things aren't properly explained.

It can be. Showrunners didn't care to make a case for it... they just straight up ignored it until the final minute. Even the characters seemed to have forgot about it.

The hilt was never shown or referenced from the moment Arondir said "He has it, you can't let him get away with it" to Galadriel starting the chase.
There's nothing from this moment to the reveal of the axe and the scene following it indicating anyone ever got influenced by it. No one looked at it, they didn't even show them bringing it back. Nothing was shown of it being passed around, it wasn't even shown to be guarded or handed back to Arondir.

If you want to explain it away with the hilt influencing them you have to SHOW the hilt influencing people. Not just ignore it and then hope people just think "magic lol".
Have someone grab the package and maybe try and open it up but then be reluctant to it and decide not to. Then you have some grounds in assuming there is an power at play. That would actually be interesting to see. So why not show it?

Most shows actually shows how things happen but if we just gonna explain everything with magic off screen then what's the point in even having a series? It's usually the how's that are interesting to watch. I want to see how Adar swapped it out fooling them. I want to see the old man stealing the hilt (if that's what happened) etc etc.

Sauron can just appear at the start of next episode ring in hand and Southlands turned into Mordor, most men enslaved and key characters turned into ring-wraiths and if anyone askes why or how this happened? Well, off-screen and some magic! Fucking viewers, make up the story yourself!

[DarkAmbient]

I wonder why the army of torch-bearing orcs chose not to burn the wooden doors and straw roofs of the village they were attacking. Seems like a schoolboy error.

[rhorle]

I wonder why the army of torch-bearing orcs chose not to burn the wooden doors and straw roofs of the village they were attacking. Seems like a schoolboy error.

Isn't it because they wanted them alive to find where the hilt was hidden?

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You could tell the influence of the ring. Jackson showed it and characters acted it.
This idea of solving things by just labeling it as "magic" is just bad. Something doesn't make sense or is told in a bad way? Magic.

Did you not watch the scene of Theo talking about how he felt a power when he had it? It shows there is "magic" in the hilt that we've already seen displayed previously as well. Adar also smirks/glances in the barn scene to hint that he had a secret plan all along. Could it have been checked? Sure, but it's not like it is that unreasonable that they might not be "perfect" or that the power of the hilt helped influence it.

[DarkAmbient]

Ah right. Yes, that must be why they were attacking and killing villagers, because they wanted them alive.