Lord of the Rings TV Series Purchased by Amazon

[rhorle]

Great the point was there aren't 10 million more out there like you claimed.

You said the Nielsen ratings gives us 11 million over 4 days. We also know 25 million viewed the show in the first 24 hours. 25-11=14. There are at least 14 million views unaccounted for with the Nielsen ratings. So either way you are still wrong.

[DarkAmbient]

Please let's not have pages more tedious pointscoring about the fucking viewing figures...

[Hansworst]

Please let's not have pages more tedious pointscoring about the fucking viewing figures...

This. Thank you in advance.

[PACOX]

Did - in Tolkien tradition - the Numenor army get carried there by the eagles or something? I mean, that army sure got there fast and they somehow knew exactly where they had to go? Did I miss Halbrand knowing where the orcs were heading?

Sailing never made logical sense in LOTR. It's one out that the showrunners get. Space and time just break on the water.

- - - Updated - - -

Things happening = good. The writing = bad. Galadriel the Wise didn't think to unwrap the object to see if it was the hilt. Neither did Arondir, nor did he notice it was now suspiciously axe-shaped. Totally-Not-Sauron didn't check it because he wanted the ploy to work. (Oh and did you notice his weapon of choice was a spear, the same weapon he - I mean Sauron - was holding during the brief flashback at the start of the show).

You could say it was magic that kept anyone from opening any one of the packages because that's how magic works in Middle Earth. It can be as much as occasional sparks and flames as it can be influencing the minds of others ie the rings.

[rhorle]

Did - in Tolkien tradition - the Numenor army get carried there by the eagles or something? I mean, that army sure got there fast and they somehow knew exactly where they had to go? Did I miss Halbrand knowing where the orcs were heading?

In a previous episode Halbrand guessed that the orcs were heading towards Ostirith/Tower and surrounding villages based on the direction they were traveling when he fled.

[Kumorii]

You could say it was magic that kept anyone from opening any one of the packages because that's how magic works in Middle Earth. It can be as much as occasional sparks and flames as it can be influencing the minds of others ie the rings.

You could tell the influence of the ring. Jackson showed it and characters acted it.
This idea of solving things by just labeling it as "magic" is just bad. Something doesn't make sense or is told in a bad way? Magic.

[PACOX]

You could tell the influence of the ring. Jackson showed it and characters acted it.
This idea of solving things by just labeling it as "magic" is just bad. Something doesn't make sense or is told in a bad way? Magic.

How could it not be the hilt influencing people to not check any of the bundles. Sauron puts a lot of power into his artifacts. If the rings can influence vast areas over great distances, surely the hilt can momentarily influence people in a relatively smaller area.

It could just be bad writing. I'm just saying magic in LOTR has always been wishy washy and a convenient 'out' when things aren't properly explained.

[kenn9530]

The show was advertised as being true to the source material was it not? Is critiquing it because it didn’t do as it said, on such an enormous level, not warrant in your eyes?

For one they dont have the rights as far as im aware for all the source material, just what the films were allowed to do so it was not advertised as an exact adaptation at all, tolkien also didnt write a story in the time RoP is active so noone but tolkien can actually say if its not something he would of done or not anyway and it doesnt mean it isnt still following the story of LOTR, hardcore fans are the absolute worst because if something is even a fraction away from what they believe something should be they just wont like it, while most normal fans that like the films wont care and still like the show.

- - - Updated - - -

Did - in Tolkien tradition - the Numenor army get carried there by the eagles or something? I mean, that army sure got there fast and they somehow knew exactly where they had to go? Did I miss Halbrand knowing where the orcs were heading?

Other than that, this is the best episode so far. Happy to give this a 7, even a 7.5. Solid.

The southlands aka mordor only has a few access points anyway so if you have a general direction you will know where they would be headed pretty easily. Even more so if you are needing to get an army there with access.

[Kumorii]

How could it not be the hilt influencing people to not check any of the bundles. Sauron puts a lot of power into his artifacts. If the rings can influence vast areas over great distances, surely the hilt can momentarily influence people in a relatively smaller area.

It could just be bad writing. I'm just saying magic in LOTR has always been wishy washy and a convenient 'out' when things aren't properly explained.

It can be. Showrunners didn't care to make a case for it... they just straight up ignored it until the final minute. Even the characters seemed to have forgot about it.

The hilt was never shown or referenced from the moment Arondir said "He has it, you can't let him get away with it" to Galadriel starting the chase.
There's nothing from this moment to the reveal of the axe and the scene following it indicating anyone ever got influenced by it. No one looked at it, they didn't even show them bringing it back. Nothing was shown of it being passed around, it wasn't even shown to be guarded or handed back to Arondir.

If you want to explain it away with the hilt influencing them you have to SHOW the hilt influencing people. Not just ignore it and then hope people just think "magic lol".
Have someone grab the package and maybe try and open it up but then be reluctant to it and decide not to. Then you have some grounds in assuming there is an power at play. That would actually be interesting to see. So why not show it?

Most shows actually shows how things happen but if we just gonna explain everything with magic off screen then what's the point in even having a series? It's usually the how's that are interesting to watch. I want to see how Adar swapped it out fooling them. I want to see the old man stealing the hilt (if that's what happened) etc etc.

Sauron can just appear at the start of next episode ring in hand and Southlands turned into Mordor, most men enslaved and key characters turned into ring-wraiths and if anyone askes why or how this happened? Well, off-screen and some magic! Fucking viewers, make up the story yourself!

[DarkAmbient]

I wonder why the army of torch-bearing orcs chose not to burn the wooden doors and straw roofs of the village they were attacking. Seems like a schoolboy error.

[rhorle]

I wonder why the army of torch-bearing orcs chose not to burn the wooden doors and straw roofs of the village they were attacking. Seems like a schoolboy error.

Isn't it because they wanted them alive to find where the hilt was hidden?

- - - Updated - - -

You could tell the influence of the ring. Jackson showed it and characters acted it.
This idea of solving things by just labeling it as "magic" is just bad. Something doesn't make sense or is told in a bad way? Magic.

Did you not watch the scene of Theo talking about how he felt a power when he had it? It shows there is "magic" in the hilt that we've already seen displayed previously as well. Adar also smirks/glances in the barn scene to hint that he had a secret plan all along. Could it have been checked? Sure, but it's not like it is that unreasonable that they might not be "perfect" or that the power of the hilt helped influence it.

[DarkAmbient]

Ah right. Yes, that must be why they were attacking and killing villagers, because they wanted them alive.

[Triceron]

tolkien also didnt write a story in the time RoP is active so noone but tolkien can actually say if its not something he would of done or not anyway

We actually know enough that he would have never wanted to adapt any of his material to the big screen, certainly not in a revisionist compressed timeline that would suit a TV series. He sold the rights for them and otherwise had no direct interest in how faithful the adaptations were to his original work.

This show is literally standing on its own legs regardless of what Tolkien would have done.

[rhorle]

Ah right. Yes, that must be why they were attacking and killing villagers, because they wanted them alive.

Adar wanted some of them alive. Burning the entire building down wouldn't allow them to use lives as a way to compel Arondir (or Theo) of telling them the hiding place.

- - - Updated - - -

We actually know enough that he would have never wanted to adapt any of his material to the big screen, certainly not in a revisionist compressed timeline that would suit a TV series. He sold the rights for them and otherwise had no direct interest in how faithful the adaptations were to his original work.

That is a contradiction. He didn't want his work adapted yet still sold the rights which allowed adaptations. Letter 210 doesn't imply he is against adaptations but against what he would find to be a poor one. He also states that it is hard for an author to see their work changed so his response may be overly harsh and that isn't his true intent. Trying to claim what Tolkien would think of this adaptation is silly. He isn't alive to render judgement.

[kenn9530]

We actually know enough that he would have never wanted to adapt any of his material to the big screen, certainly not in a revisionist compressed timeline that would suit a TV series. He sold the rights for them and otherwise had no direct interest in how faithful the adaptations were to his original work.

This show is literally standing on its own legs regardless of what Tolkien would have done.

How do you know what he would want he is dead, as time passes ppl change and if it didnt get adapted to the big screen then LOTRs would of fell into obscurity because without the films the books would never of sold as many since it struggled to sell 50 million over many decades, the films are what made the series a large success, the books on thier own did good but not great, you can also say it may of never of sold that many without the films as the films came out in 2001 and the book sales didnt reach 50 mill until 2003.

Book writers know there has to be changes when it gets put on tv/films so if he didnt want it to be that way he wouldnt of sold the rights in the first place. Its impossible to do a book series faithfully unless the series is going to go on as long as supernatural then you might be able to fit everything in but other than that its not going to happen.

[Daedius]

Seriously bugs me how they never bothered to check the hilt after catching Adar right away, so damn obvious...

[fakaroonie]

I seriously don't like the slow-mo scenes that are supposed to make you feel something.

Remember Haldir's death in Helm's Deep? Yeah it was slow-mo, but goddamn it had an effect. Human lady getting arrowed and living? Why the slow-mo? It's just... it's like they're trying to be cringe on purpose.

[Triceron]

How do you know what he would want he is dead,

Just look up his interviews and the comments his son has made in retrospect. Tolkien was adamant that his work was unadaptable as a movie. And considering he is dead, that is an opinion that dies with him.

I mean it's not like this was not known.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midd...ch%20proposals.

Tolkien watched films,[1] but always had a mistrust of the medium[2] and of his books' suitability for dramatization.[3] He had received fanmail on the matter, some proposing to adapt the works to film and some encouraging him to refuse such proposals.[3] Tolkien and his publishers, Allen and Unwin, were willing to play along with film proposals, on condition of having a veto on creative decisions or relinquishing those for a sufficient sum of money.[4]

Basically he either gets last say on creative decisions, or give it up entirely for a lot of money. He wouldn't have supported a rewrite in the way Rings of Power's story has been presented. It would be his way, or the highway.

Like, you're right that book writers acknowledge there have to be changes. And his plan would have either been to have control to veto any changes he didn't like, or else give up that entire right for lots of money and just not support it at all. He wouldn't involve himself in a major reimagining of his own work like you seem to suggest could happen if he were alive today. The opposite is true, and we even see that living out in how Christopher Tolkien was so protective of his father's work, even outright saying he hated the PJ movies. At that point they didn't have the film rights at all so CT had no power over the creative decisions of the PJ movies.

[kenn9530]

Just look up his interviews and the comments his son has made in retrospect. Tolkien was adamant that his work was unadaptable as a movie. And considering he is dead, that is an opinion that dies with him.

I mean it's not like this was not known.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midd...ch%20proposals.

He allowed the rights to be sold to make a movie so what he says is that he wasnt against it being made into a film/tv series but the reality is you cant make a faithfull version of it no matter what from the book, so no matter how good a tv series or movie is fans cant really complain its not tolkien enough because its simply impossible.

[SuperKarateDeathCar]

womp womp, It's gonna be extra cloudy today with a chance of fireballs.