Lord of the Rings TV Series Purchased by Amazon

[rogoth]

Are you this critical of the Jackson films? They were not 100% faithful to the books and the writers had to make the story more adaptable for the big screen. Christopher Tolkien hated the movies because he felt Jackson took the book and turned it into a Hollywood action movie for teenagers and left all of the beauty of the story out of it. The most important themes for Tolkien (his heavy references to Catholicism which I doubt you noticed because thematic elements are mostly ignored by people who can't picture a non-white elf) were overshadowed by the focus on the fighting rather than the actual journies and development of the characters themselves. Even some of the character's personalities (Boromir, for example) were changed for added drama.

Did any of that matter at the end of the day? No, because film adaptations of books are rarely fully faithful to everything in them. All that matters is if they're entertaining to watch and tell a good story. Middle Earth's second age spans thousands of years and has massive gaps in the lore that exists, so you have to take creative liberties if you want to fit all of that into a TV series and have some continuity between seasons and characters. I don't know why any of this is surprising to you. If you want a word-for-word retelling of a story with massive gaps then just read the books.

yes, because even as a child at the time, i still knew that there was a vast difference in what i was reading as part of my school work, and what i was watching in the form of these epic long movies, it's well documented that the films have some fairly egregious changes made to them in order to make the screenplay work and the overall story work for a film type setting, but here's the thing: the movies keep so much original lore and source material intact and pay homage to that source material in many different ways, some obvious and in your face, some more nuanced and niche, but the foundation is there and as someone who knows the works well i could and still do accept some of the changes years later as they are not all encompassing of the movies, they are not the focal point of the movies whereas with this steaming pile of shite show, everything they have changed is THE ENTIRE POINT of the show, trying to score brownie points with people like you who have zero moral compass and are more than happy to pervert previously established works using racist and sexist policies, using terms to describe critics that should only be used to describe some of the most heinous members of society thereby neutering the definitions of the words used because you use them so flippantly and without regards for anything, and frankly it's so mind blowing to me how idiotic you are presenting your viewpoint honestly believing yourself to be right when that's delusional.

[Xath]

Amazon said 25 million global views in the first 24 hours. The first two episodes were released in that 24 hour period. There is nothing breaking down the per episode counts. The article linked was from October 5th so only 6 episodes of Rings of Power were out at the time. Using 100 million that is 16.6 million average viewers per episode. We don't know when that number in the article was given only the date the article was published so it could be only 5 episodes which would put the average at 20 million an episode.

Stop calling people blind fan boy and other insults just because they don't have the same view of the show as you do. There have been popular and successful shows that you don't like in the past and there will be more in the future.

approaching can mean anything from 60 to 99 they hadn't crested 100 as of that article you should know this since you attempt to use tricks with language a lot rather unsuccessfully but still attempt.

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You can live in the fantasy world you've created for those that don't agree with you or you can accept what they tell you. The choice is yours. I also don't think I honestly have to tell you how a person can read only part of a book (or books).

You honestly do if you are claiming to like Tolkien

[rhorle]

You honestly do if you are claiming to like Tolkien

If a person doesn't read every page then they don't read every page. I skipped most of the second volume because at the time I found it a bit boring and hard to get through. I've never felt the need to revisit it despite growing as a reader

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approaching can mean anything from 60 to 99 they hadn't crested 100 as of that article you should know this since you attempt to use tricks with language a lot rather unsuccessfully but still attempt.

Okay? Of course they didn't crest 100 million at the time of the article. For one accusing me of language tricks you sure are trying to claim something I didn't say. I used 100 million for ease of calculations and it was the number the article used. The article says "closing on" and "cresting toward" which imply they are closer to the maximum rather then the minimum. Which again indicates you are using language tricks and it is pure projection from you.

[rogoth]

Not being truthful about their viewership numbers to investors would be a breach of fiduciary duty, and illegal. Stop talking nonsense conspiracy theories.

i would agree with you, except that's precisely what they have done multiple times, all through clever use of words and wording to obfuscate the truth, much like bobby kotick has done for decades now during the investor calls from actiblizz, every single company that has a major investor portfolio spins everything that happens as positively as they possibly can, and even when everything is a negative, they still spin it to make it sound less of an issue than it actually is in reality, this is not a new thing and it is why they can't be legally challenged because they have every possible loophole on tap to use when they need an out.

just as an aside, to a company the size of Amazon, nothing is illegal, it's just a cost/benefit analysis, if it's too costly to perform, they don't do it, if the cost is acceptable, they will more than happily do it, don't kid yourself that the laws of the land will stop them from doing anything if it's in their best interest to do it regardless, you're just being extremely naïve at that point.

[rhorle]

every single company that has a major investor portfolio spins everything that happens as positively as they possibly can, and even when everything is a negative, they still spin it to make it sound less of an issue than it actually is in reality

The nuance you are glossing over is that they report accurate numbers then spin it regardless of those numbers being positive or negative. Reporting inaccurate numbers will get even Amazon in hot water even if a fine is spare change to them.

[rogoth]

If a person doesn't read every page then they don't read every page. I skipped most of the second volume because at the time I found it a bit boring and hard to get through. I've never felt the need to revisit it despite growing as a reader

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Okay? Of course they didn't crest 100 million at the time of the article. For one accusing me of language tricks you sure are trying to claim something I didn't say. I used 100 million for ease of calculations and it was the number the article used. The article says "closing on" and "cresting toward" which imply they are closer to the maximum rather then the minimum. Which again indicates you are using language tricks and it is pure projection from you.

you cannot claim to have 'grown as a reader' and never gone back to read what you skipped, it's an impossible claim because it shows DIRECTLY that you HAVEN'T grown as a reader, because if you had you would have no issues going back, giving the thing you found hard another viewing and if you had actually grown as a reader you would easily be able to get through it and comprehend what was written and understand what the previous text was talking about more and be able to understand where the story was then leading to, as far as this statement is concerned, you THINK you have grown as a reader but you likely haven't, all you have done is engage with easier reading material and had few issues with said material and because of that you THINK you have grown because you found that easier material EASIER to read, that's not how 'growing as a reader' works, in order to actually grow as a reader you need to engage with HARDER material, so much so that it challenges you in both what you're reading from a content perspective, but also challenges you in a reading style perspective, the silmarillion is a perfect example of both hard content and hard reading style, because it uses the English language to the fullest to provide many topics that require the reader to have sufficient grasp of that language and how it is being presented to understand the concepts put forth all the while being able to keep up with the style of the writing and presentation and making it familiar to the reader, that's how improving your reading skill works, the fact you have now admitted to being unable to read the lord of the rings fully tells me all i need to know about you regarding this overarching topic, it tells me you were incapable of doing something i did as a 12 year old child, and are seemingly still unable to do to this day, you have lost your final shred of credibility talking about this topic in way shape or form, everything you say from now on is said in bad faith as you have no basis for reference.

[Sammonoske]

I hate this style of storytelling where a plot advances every other episode. If that continues onto season 2, I might not bother watching it until all the episodes are out. That way I can just skip to Elrond and Durin lol.

[rogoth]

I hate this style of storytelling where a plot advances every other episode. If that continues onto season 2, I might not bother watching it until all the episodes are out. That way I can just skip to Elrond and Durin lol.

got some bad news for you then, because all these clowns know is what they learned from their lord and master jj abrams, and this is the only thing that will happen as long as they remain in charge.

[rhorle]

you cannot claim to have 'grown as a reader' and never gone back to read what you skipped

Growing as a reader is not a set path. There are no rules or regulations. I can read similar works and still grow with out having to read a specific one. Congrats at being able to read at an advance level as a 12 year. Maybe work on formatting next?

[Xath]

Growing as a reader is not a set path. There are no rules or regulations. I can read similar works and still grow with out having to read a specific one. Congrats at being able to read at an advance level as a 12 year. Maybe work on formatting next?

There are no set rules and regulations however you can't claim to be a fan of an author when you haven't even fully read their most famous work let alone the work that RoP is currently massively contradicting. Also it's not advanced to read LoTR at 12. That's middle school age we were stuck reading awful awful stuff like The Jungle by then. I wish I was reading LoTR instead of that of course I had long since read LoTR at that age.

[rhorle]

There are no set rules and regulations however you can't claim to be a fan of an author when you haven't even fully read their most famous work let alone the work that RoP is currently massively contradicting. Also it's not advanced to read LoTR at 12. That's middle school age we were stuck reading awful awful stuff like The Jungle by then. I wish I was reading LoTR instead of that of course I had long since read LoTR at that age.

There are no rules for being a fan either. All you are doing is gate keeping because you don't like someone who has a different view of a subject then yourself. Hence why you are also attacking the use of wiki's and other sources of factual information. Congrats at reading not advanced stuff before 12 yet still not understanding what "I didn't finish the entire thing" meant. Lmao.

[Xath]

There are no rules for being a fan either. All you are doing is gate keeping because you don't like someone who has a different view of a subject then yourself. Hence why you are also attacking the use of wiki's and other sources of factual information. Congrats at reading not advanced stuff before 12 yet still not understanding what "I didn't finish the entire thing" meant. Lmao.

It meant you aren't a fan of the author yet are trying to claim you are. It was perfectly understandable.

[rhorle]

It meant you aren't a fan of the author yet are trying to claim you are. It was perfectly understandable.

You can be a fan of the author without being a fan of reading their works. I've never claimed I've fully read his books. I've had other books that have interested me more since. If what I said was perfectly understandable why did you claim to not know what it means? Usually people don't admit to acting in bad faith that easily.

Also how the hell do you read most of Lord of The Rings rofl

[Lorgar Aurelian]

you cannot claim to have 'grown as a reader' and never gone back to read what you skipped, it's an impossible claim because it shows DIRECTLY that you HAVEN'T grown as a reader.

This really isn’t how any thing works.

I had trouble reading of mice and men as a kid but when I grew as a reader I didn’t go back to it in some ego driven act of one upping a book I moved on to better and more complex story’s instead and never looked bad because why would I.

[rogoth]

This really isn’t how any thing works.

I had trouble reading of mice and men as a kid but when I grew as a reader I didn’t go back to it in some ego driven act of one upping a book I moved on to better and more complex story’s instead and never looked bad because why would I.

i'm sorry but i fail to see what any of that has to do with the price of cheese.

[downnola]

yes, because even as a child at the time, i still knew that there was a vast difference in what i was reading as part of my school work, and what i was watching in the form of these epic long movies, it's well documented that the films have some fairly egregious changes made to them in order to make the screenplay work and the overall story work for a film type setting, but here's the thing: the movies keep so much original lore and source material intact and pay homage to that source material in many different ways, some obvious and in your face, some more nuanced and niche, but the foundation is there and as someone who knows the works well i could and still do accept some of the changes years later as they are not all encompassing of the movies, they are not the focal point of the movies whereas with this steaming pile of shite show, everything they have changed is THE ENTIRE POINT of the show, trying to score brownie points with people like you who have zero moral compass and are more than happy to pervert previously established works using racist and sexist policies, using terms to describe critics that should only be used to describe some of the most heinous members of society thereby neutering the definitions of the words used because you use them so flippantly and without regards for anything, and frankly it's so mind blowing to me how idiotic you are presenting your viewpoint honestly believing yourself to be right when that's delusional.

How gracious of you to accept some "fairly egregious changes" to the lore you claim to care so much about for the sake of adaptability. Unless of course, it means casting a black actor as an elf/dwarf or making Gladriel a lead with room to actually develop as a functional character in the story. That's where we draw the line. We can't have the "woke activists" coming to ruin lil bro's favorite childhood movies. A real crime against humanity if there ever was one.



Imagine spending enough time continuously throwing a fit over the casting of a black elf and female lead in a fantasy show to accumulate 144 posts in just this thread alone. It's not like you're bringing anything new to the table with any of your posts, either. It's the same boring drivel that anyone could easily hear from a random reactionary podcast or Youtube channel when a studio has the audacity to cast a female lead and black actors in a fantasy film. You don't even have the self-awareness to realize that you sound like you're reading from a script. Find a random criticism of Galadriel and replace her name with Rey Skywalker or Carol Danvers and it's functionally the same criticism you can find in the Marvel and Star Wars threads. Bad acting and writing and they're generally dislikable characters as a whole. Sound about right? Yet, you can never actually state in your own words what any of that means.

That's what I tried to point out pages ago and you happily proved my point by trying to use nameless movie critics as justification for your supposed arguments. You couldn't even name these critics while making your fallacious dogshit arguments and told me to look them up on my own. That's not how any of this works. You're required to substantiate your opinions if you want to be taken seriously. Asking others to do the heavy lifting for you is just evidence that you can't actually think or make these arguments for yourself. You're just speaking in someone else's voice and doing so all in the name of bigotry. The best part is I barely had to do anything at all to get you to admit that being faithful to the story isn't your main interest here. But I'm the one with an agenda or rigid worldview? It's the woke activists making this political? Rogoth, my brother in Christ, look in the fucking mirror for once.

[rogoth]

How gracious of you to accept some "fairly egregious changes" to the lore you claim to care so much about for the sake of adaptability. Unless of course, it means casting a black actor as an elf/dwarf or making Gladriel a lead with room to actually develop as a functional character in the story. That's where we draw the line. We can't have the "woke activists" coming to ruin lil bro's favorite childhood movies. A real crime against humanity if there ever was one.



Imagine spending enough time continuously throwing a fit over the casting of a black elf and female lead in a fantasy show to accumulate 144 posts in just this thread alone. It's not like you're bringing anything new to the table with any of your posts, either. It's the same boring drivel that anyone could easily hear from a random reactionary podcast or Youtube channel when a studio has the audacity to cast a female lead and black actors in a fantasy film. You don't even have the self-awareness to realize that you sound like you're reading from a script. Find a random criticism of Galadriel and replace her name with Rey Skywalker or Carol Danvers it's functionally the same criticism you can find in the Marvel and Star Wars threads. Bad acting and writing and they're generally dislikable characters as a whole. Sound about right? Yet, you can never actually state in your own words what any of that means.

That's what I tried to point out pages ago and you happily proved my point by trying to use nameless movie critics as justification for your supposed arguments. You couldn't even name these critics while making your fallacious dogshit arguments and told me to look them up on my own. That's not how any of this works. You're required to substantiate your opinions if you want to be taken seriously. Asking others to do the heavy lifting for you is just evidence that you can't actually think or make these arguments for yourself. You're just speaking in someone else's voice and doing so all in the name of bigotry. The best part is I barely had to do anything at all to get you to admit that being faithful to the story isn't your main interest here. But I'm the one with an agenda or rigid worldview? It's the woke activists making this political? Rogoth, my brother in Christ, look in the fucking mirror for once.

you're the one who brought up race, you're the one who asked a question that i answered in full that not only destroyed what little pathetic attempt you made to get a rise out of the person you were initially responding to, but it also undermines everything you are trying to argue, furthermore, i said i was accepting of the changes made for the movie trilogy because the changes weren't front and center the only things the movies were using as their foundation, unlike this entire dogshit show which is BUILT UPON the changes they have made, most of which are not only egregious, but factually wrong, they directly contradict established lore written in the books these clowns don't have legal rights to use, and attempt to rewrite said lore in order to make their pathetic and frankly amateurish story work (which it can't even do that correctly), so no, it's got nothing to do with 'the sake of adaptability' here, these are activists first, pushing 'the message' as often as allowed and 'artists' a far distant second and i use the term artists in the loosest and most lax way possible to escribe these failed writers as evidenced by the fact they had been screen writers for a decade and everything they wrote was thrown out and discarded as unsuitable or not up to standard, that should tell you something but apparently that sort of obvious red flag is brushed aside when dealing with sycophants like you who only view things one way and any others are 'patently evil' according to the latest media description of fans who criticise the show in any capacity.

secondly, i wouldn't know about 'Rey skywalker' as i never watched past the first film that was made in this new star wars era, i haven't watched 'carol danvers' aka captain marvel, as acted by the one and only brie larsen who caused such a shitstorm in hollywood due to her bigoted and woke fiasco it required the head honcho of marvel mr kevin feige himself to run damage control to prevent things getting too out of hand, you know you messed up when the guy who sits at the head of the high table comes down to rectify the mess you made, so outside of that well publicised mess i have no frame of reference for her character either, so stop trying to put words in my mouth and try to lump me in with anyone who did criticise those productions, as for you thinking you even had a point to make in the first place, i have already named a few of the people who have criticised this show who are professionals in their field and who have shredded this show from the ground up, but apparently you lack the reading comprehension skills needed to find those named individuals in all my posts that you seem to want to post a counter for, for some unknown reason, and you then have the audacity to claim i don't add anything to the conversation?, are you living in opposite world or something because directly talking about things that are wrong with the show, breaking down why those things are wrong, and providing supplementary evidence from others to back up my point is exactly what i have done in this thread from the start, so unless you have some new technique that i'm not aware of that supersedes what i have been doing i would just love to know what that new world technique is so that i can employ it to make people like you understand when you're wrong.

thirdly, i'm not required to do shit, seeing as i have already done it countless times already, it's not my fault nor is it my problem if you lack critical information because you're too lazy to bother researching things before commenting, that's a 'you' issue and has nothing whatsoever to do with me, if YOU want to be taken seriously then try at least come with a point that has even a remotely viable foundation instead of ad hominem failures like this above.

lastly, everything in this show 'reflects what the world looks like today', meaning that by that very fucking definition it's a woke activist riddled political mess masquerading as something it's very obviously not, but i shouldn't poke fun too much at americans because of the bubble you live in, you are no longer able to recognise criticism and instead view it as being attacked personally, you are no longer able to make a show or movie without pandering to minorities which is in itself racist and bigoted, trying to score brownie points with said minorities in the hopes you get good PR, only in america does this sycophantism exist and it's bleeding out into the wider world which i find abhorrent, i have a lot of friends who are members of these minorities that corporate america is so desperately trying to pander to, and when i asked them about hollywood and the like trying to weaponise their minority status they said to me they hated it and felt like they were being belittled just so companies can make a cash grab and feel legitimised doing it, so yes, you do have an agenda and rigid world view when you can't even see the fucking forest for the trees.

[Syegfryed]

"if you are fine with the changes form the trilogy and you are not fine with the changes in the series, you are a hypocrite" is the most bs argument people can make in favor of the shit show, as it treats things as binary, both have changes therefore they are the same is a weak fallacy, when this is far from the truth.

Changes from the source material are not inherently bad, they can be necessary, they can be shit and some rare cases they can even be better, in the show the changes were garbage in a whole different level of the trilogy, the comparison is not even fair.

And this isn't even about the change in the cast/races or whatever, its the changes in the Lore, awful changes.

On that note, we are in what, episode 7, did anybody saw another Black elf or Elendil or whatever is his name is the ONLY one? i think i saw two dwarves besides Desa but im not sure either, if they are going to do anyway, they could have done a bit more.

[Xath]

How gracious of you to accept some "fairly egregious changes" to the lore you claim to care so much about for the sake of adaptability. Unless of course, it means casting a black actor as an elf/dwarf or making Gladriel a lead with room to actually develop as a functional character in the story. That's where we draw the line. We can't have the "woke activists" coming to ruin lil bro's favorite childhood movies. A real crime against humanity if there ever was one.



Imagine spending enough time continuously throwing a fit over the casting of a black elf and female lead in a fantasy show to accumulate 144 posts in just this thread alone. It's not like you're bringing anything new to the table with any of your posts, either. It's the same boring drivel that anyone could easily hear from a random reactionary podcast or Youtube channel when a studio has the audacity to cast a female lead and black actors in a fantasy film. You don't even have the self-awareness to realize that you sound like you're reading from a script. Find a random criticism of Galadriel and replace her name with Rey Skywalker or Carol Danvers and it's functionally the same criticism you can find in the Marvel and Star Wars threads. Bad acting and writing and they're generally dislikable characters as a whole. Sound about right? Yet, you can never actually state in your own words what any of that means.

That's what I tried to point out pages ago and you happily proved my point by trying to use nameless movie critics as justification for your supposed arguments. You couldn't even name these critics while making your fallacious dogshit arguments and told me to look them up on my own. That's not how any of this works. You're required to substantiate your opinions if you want to be taken seriously. Asking others to do the heavy lifting for you is just evidence that you can't actually think or make these arguments for yourself. You're just speaking in someone else's voice and doing so all in the name of bigotry. The best part is I barely had to do anything at all to get you to admit that being faithful to the story isn't your main interest here. But I'm the one with an agenda or rigid worldview? It's the woke activists making this political? Rogoth, my brother in Christ, look in the fucking mirror for once.

You might want to try actually reading my posts I know it's hard but I believe in you. You can do it. What I have said is that race is used as a shield to get people like you to defend massive changes that absolutely destroy canon because you haven't read the books and don't care about them. The primary example being the lack of any tragedy with regards to Tar Miriel. The massive condensing of time periods does an absolute dis-serivce to the story. The horrific treatment of Celeborn is also up there.

[downnola]

snip

This post is too much of a mess for me to make sense of. I don't usually go after people's grammar and writing skills because mine is far from perfect. But if you're going to make it a habit of attacking people's intelligence as means to try to win an argument, the least you can do is learn how to form coherent, complete sentences. I'm not being petty. It's seriously hard to read all that shit. I normally wouldn't even mention it but just look at your post history. This is how you respond to anyone who disagrees with your ramblings. You're just not equipped to have this discussion. It's a waste of time.

There isn't much I care to say in response to any of that beyond what I've already said in other posts. I've said what I've had to say and don't see a point going any further when you routinely make shit up out of thin air like this:

they directly contradict established lore written in the books these clowns don't have legal rights to use

What? They purchased the rights directly from the Tolkien estate to make this series and they had veto power over the writing if they felt the writers were deviating too far from the themes in Tolkien's work. They specifically gave them their blessing to create and add things to the story. Come on man, what are we even talking about here? You're absolutely clueless about this series, aren't you?

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You might want to try actually reading my posts I know it's hard but I believe in you. You can do it. What I have said is that race is used as a shield to get people like you to defend massive changes that absolutely destroy canon because you haven't read the books and don't care about them. The primary example being the lack of any tragedy with regards to Tar Miriel. The massive condensing of time periods does an absolute dis-serivce to the story. The horrific treatment of Celeborn is also up there.

If you're fine with Peter Jackson reducing the major themes of Lord of the Rings down to a trio of Hollywood action films then I see no reason to take your pearl-clutching about the changes in Rings of Power seriously. That's a cover for why you really dislike the series and you know it. Seriously, if you really just cared about the lore you'd leave it at that. It's your complete lack of transparency that started this discussion. We're talking about a series that has barely started. None us know what the final product will be. we haven't even seen a full season yet.


You're also not the only person to read the books. Grow up.